Can/should digital download distributers ensure their games work (patch as required)?

[MeChaNiZ3D]

The maker of the game should ensure it can be run on modern systems. The provider of the game should make sure the systems it runs on are advertised clearly and if it does not run on modern systems, that should be made especially clear. Ideally games would be kept compatible for a reasonable amount of time, but that's not really anyone's responsibility.

 

[Michael Law]

There is a fix for Jade Empire
http://kickerblog.wordpress.com/2010/03/03/how-to-play-jade-empire-in-windows-7/
Try that out and if it doesn't work I think I might know another

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

Gaben call me, im full of ideas

That's operating under the assumption he gives a crap, when all evidence points to the contrary.

you dont talk no shit about my Gaben

what gives you the impression he doesnt care for the well being of his customers?


im sure like i said, if this system was implemented he could give the patchers a cut adequate to the number of expected copies sold, maybe get in touch with the original developers of the game as well, and come to some sort of arrangement, the sales of old games shouldnt be underestimated

 

[Ubiquitous Duck]

Not necessarily.

I think PCs are too diverse and, more importantly, I don't think this is the job of the supplier to ensure this.

I think it is more the responsibility of the maker of the product.

Quality control and assurance should be departments of the developer and much less to be done on the supplier end. It's really in Steam's own interest to do some, but developers shouldn't be left out of this.

It shouldn't be up to Steam to have to test another company's product extensively.

Again, it would benefit Steam's image to do it, but I imagine they are annoyed with developers once they start getting backlashes on things they didn't have any hand in making.

Steam does what they can but in the end there will always be problems. It's the nature of software. You can't fix every bug or glitch.

What each user is running on their PC is always going to be a crap shoot. Maybe it's a problem with the antivirus, maybe it';s a firewall conflict. The devs and steam can't test for every possible hardware/software configuration. This has always been a problem with gaming.

OS's will always be a tricky business since the devs can't be expected to still patch software that they wrote a decade ago. THat said. most games will have issues on Windows 7/8 but 7 at least has an XP mode. Heck many games were never designed to work on 64-bit systems.

With any luck this will be exactly the sort of thing Steam OS fixes. Until then. If you have an issue go through the channels.

I also really don't get what all these game-breaking issues are that people keep bringing up.

I play a lot of games and I rarely ever have had game-breaking issues and they have always had workarounds and fixes done online, by willing enthusiasts. They are offered free and are at the end of a google search. Not that hard.

I've never had a game just shelved because I physically can't play it.

 

[Ubiquitous Duck]

Not necessarily.

I think PCs are too diverse and, more importantly, I don't think this is the job of the supplier to ensure this.

I think it is more the responsibility of the maker of the product.

Quality control and assurance should be departments of the developer and much less to be done on the supplier end. It's really in Steam's own interest to do some, but developers shouldn't be left out of this.

It shouldn't be up to Steam to have to test another company's product extensively.

Again, it would benefit Steam's image to do it, but I imagine they are annoyed with developers once they start getting backlashes on things they didn't have any hand in making.

Steam does what they can but in the end there will always be problems. It's the nature of software. You can't fix every bug or glitch.

What each user is running on their PC is always going to be a crap shoot. Maybe it's a problem with the antivirus, maybe it';s a firewall conflict. The devs and steam can't test for every possible hardware/software configuration. This has always been a problem with gaming.

OS's will always be a tricky business since the devs can't be expected to still patch software that they wrote a decade ago. THat said. most games will have issues on Windows 7/8 but 7 at least has an XP mode. Heck many games were never designed to work on 64-bit systems.

With any luck this will be exactly the sort of thing Steam OS fixes. Until then. If you have an issue go through the channels.

I also really don't get what all these game-breaking issues are that people keep bringing up.

I play a lot of games and I rarely ever have had game-breaking issues and they have always had workarounds and fixes done online, by willing enthusiasts. They are offered free and are at the end of a google search. Not that hard.

I've never had a game just shelved because I physically can't play it.

Well here's one I actually experienced on Steam. 'Trapped Dead' The game is a Real Time Tactical deal.. with Zombies. Actually quite good when it works. It rarely works. Oh the strategy is solid buut it suffers from major flaws. the biggest which being sometimes the person you're controlling willjust freeze. as in will not respond to clicks or anything which in a Real Time Tactical game usually means they're a sitting duck. There are no known fixes to this and while they do plague many of the players, there are a few who never experience it.

Most people I know have this or some other game breaking bug with the game. Other bugs include things like graphics corruption, sudden crashes to desktop, never ending loading screens, etc. Bugs can be considered Game breaking when they occur with great frequency or, occur in such a way that they prevent game progress. Like a key mob not spawning, or an item not dropping. One game I remember was Mob Rule. gave you a mission to take over and sell one of your enemies structure (I think it was a distillery) but the joke was sometimes the AI would never actually build a distillery. Thusly you could never capture it, thusly could never progress so you had to restart the mission and hope the AI wouldn't glitch out again.

As I said, I really just haven't come across these kind of bugs before, but they obviously affect some people - just no experience myself, so wondering on the frequency/numbers affected.

I guess the question is then, who do you blame when you found these games to be bugged? Do you bring your heat to Steam or the developer?

 

[snekadid]

Wow, so it still isn't compatible? My girlfriend had a CD copy of that game, and it also didn't work on a newer OS. She also had to install a bunch of unofficial patches to get it to work. You'd think that would have been important before reselling it, but I guess if they can con people out of money with little extra effort, then they will.

Ok, lets clear something up.

1: Steam cannot use the unofficial patch because it is a fan made file. You must use the unofficial patch.

2: VtM barely works without the unofficial patch, but it isn't the devs fault really. They went under while trying to fix it. Troika doesn't exist anymore so they can't make the fixes that the patch, which you can use and is spoken of widely on the forums, does well.

3: There is a warning on the steam page.

4: It's a really good game once patched, there is no good reason for anyone to stop selling it and thus deprive others from experiencing it.

5: what does your girlfriend's CD have to do with digital distribution?

 

[AnthrSolidSnake]

Wow, so it still isn't compatible? My girlfriend had a CD copy of that game, and it also didn't work on a newer OS. She also had to install a bunch of unofficial patches to get it to work. You'd think that would have been important before reselling it, but I guess if they can con people out of money with little extra effort, then they will.

Ok, lets clear something up.

1: Steam cannot use the unofficial patch because it is a fan made file. You must use the unofficial patch.

2: VtM barely works without the unofficial patch, but it isn't the devs fault really. They went under while trying to fix it. Troika doesn't exist anymore so they can't make the fixes that the patch, which you can use and is spoken of widely on the forums, does well.

3: There is a warning on the steam page.

4: It's a really good game once patched, there is no good reason for anyone to stop selling it and thus deprive others from experiencing it.

5: what does your girlfriend's CD have to do with digital distribution?

Whoa, why are you getting snippy with me? All I said was that I was surprised that an older game that my girlfriend had on CD still hasn't been fixed when it was put on Steam.

I'm very confused. My post was mostly just surprise and an innocent question. You reply like I said something offensive.

 

[snekadid]

Wow, so it still isn't compatible? My girlfriend had a CD copy of that game, and it also didn't work on a newer OS. She also had to install a bunch of unofficial patches to get it to work. You'd think that would have been important before reselling it, but I guess if they can con people out of money with little extra effort, then they will.

Ok, lets clear something up.

1: Steam cannot use the unofficial patch because it is a fan made file. You must use the unofficial patch.

2: VtM barely works without the unofficial patch, but it isn't the devs fault really. They went under while trying to fix it. Troika doesn't exist anymore so they can't make the fixes that the patch, which you can use and is spoken of widely on the forums, does well.

3: There is a warning on the steam page.

4: It's a really good game once patched, there is no good reason for anyone to stop selling it and thus deprive others from experiencing it.

5: what does your girlfriend's CD have to do with digital distribution?

Whoa, why are you getting snippy with me? All I said was that I was surprised that an older game that my girlfriend had on CD still hasn't been fixed when it was put on Steam.

I'm very confused. My post was mostly just surprise and an innocent question. You reply like I said something offensive.

I'm really not, at least not directly at you, your post just had most of the same misinformation that is being spread by the other posts and so made a better target for quoting.

 

[Something Amyss]

you dont talk no shit about my Gaben

I'll talk shit about anyone's Gaben.

what gives you the impression he doesnt care for the well being of his customers?

half a decade on Steam? Broken games? A "no refund" policy? A bunch of empty bloviating about service in light of a lack of any quality assurance?

Basically, reality?

 

[Ubiquitous Duck]

As I said, I really just haven't come across these kind of bugs before, but they obviously affect some people - just no experience myself, so wondering on the frequency/numbers affected.

I guess the question is then, who do you blame when you found these games to be bugged? Do you bring your heat to Steam or the developer?

The developer of course. See Steam tests the games on a machine within the specs posted by the developer. If it runs on it, well then fine. But just as you have not encountered such bugs, steam might also miss them. They may also occur in specific situations that steam didn't replicate.

No I rest the blame on the developer. I will forgive glitches mind you, after all it is impossible to make 100% glitch free software. WHat I don't forgive is when the devs simply shrug their shoulders and say. Tough luck when more than half their consumers experience game breaking bugs.

There are caveats of course. Old games get a bit more leeway because the games are quite literally running on systems the devs couldn't have imagined.

Sure, I just thought I'd aim your remarks back at the OP's original question & the title of this thread.

I agree to be honest. I don't see why Steam should have to troubleshoot games on behalf of the developer, to ensure that the product is good for the buyers.

I see that it would be a benefit for them to do so, so they don't get people saying Steam sold them faulty product, but I think the onus for this should be on the developer.

As I said in a previous post, quality assurance and testing should almost entirely be the responsibility of the developer side; Steam is just selling the end product.

 

[SquidVicious]

I repurchased Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines back in 2009 because I had lost my physical copy of the game I got back in 2004. I was definitely miffed when I couldn't get it to run, and I was even more miffed when I saw that the ONLY site that housed the unofficial patch had a download cap of like 30 kb/s. Eventually I found an easy fix by just making it so my computer was only operating on 2 GB of RAM and the game started up no problem. Certainly a good way to experience the game as it came out, but the unofficial mod and the clan quest mod really do bring the best shine to the game.

I really wish GOG would get the rights to sell this game though because they would sell it with the patch already installed and nobody would be having these problems.

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

you dont talk no shit about my Gaben

I'll talk shit about anyone's Gaben.

what gives you the impression he doesnt care for the well being of his customers?

half a decade on Steam? Broken games? A "no refund" policy? A bunch of empty bloviating about service in light of a lack of any quality assurance?

Basically, reality?

sales? new features being constantly added?, support to the fan community and the people who develop tools for the fan community? (valve pays both the creators of TF2 content and the people who make the tools they use) and how about owning the biggest, best and most influential digital distribtion platform around?

yeah theres a reason wy nobody is jumping into origin or uPlay and why both Sony and Microsoft are taking notes from what valve is doing


face it bro, Gabe Newell is easily one of the most pro-customers personalities in the vidya gaem business

 

[DementedSheep]

Well my first reaction is that they shouldn't be selling broken games but some are really good games and simple enough to fix. Steam should at least put a warning on it and instructions for the fix since this a well know thing with vtm:b. They should also be putting warnings when specific system don't work with games. It would nice if they could add the patch to vtm:b but I don't they actually can since it is fanmade and the devs can't patch because they are sunk. I don't know if they can legally mess with files most games to fix them if they are broken and they are a distributor so I don't really expect them to doing that.
They definitely should be refunding you broken games though without you having to twist there arm for it. I don't know how it works overseas but here you can't sign away your right to a refund and it is the responsibility of the distributor to refund you and then take it up with manufacturer.

 

[Something Amyss]

sales?

You mean those temporary price reductions which usually aren't significantly better than Amazon's sales but get people to become first time users, the hardest thing for an online service?

How's that altruistic?

new features being constantly added?

Bit hyperbolic.

support to the fan community and the people who develop tools for the fan community?

And any of this makes up for lack of quality control...How?

and how about owning the biggest, best and most influential digital distribtion platform around?

You personally liking them and them having a monopoly doesn't mean they care about their users. That's absurd.

yeah theres a reason wy nobody is jumping into origin or uPlay and why both Sony and Microsoft are taking notes from what valve is doing

Oddly enough, people did jump into origin and uPlay. You can't complain about exclusive games, either, since that was a "note" they took from Valve.

face it bro, Gabe Newell is easily one of the most pro-customers personalities in the vidya gaem business

If so, you'd think you'd be able to provide a solid case for it, bro. But you didn't. Your argument comes down to "I like it/it's popular" and....Not much else.

Sorry, bro.

 

[BeerTent]

It's an industry standard that products will eventually lose support. Much like the company I work for, our products go through three phases.

Full support, we're still producing that product.

Discontinued, where we still support, but are no longer selling that product.

End of life, where we know there's not a single one of those products left within warranty. The customer is on their own.

To say something that is very clearly End Of Life in this case, and say the developer should continue to support it is silly. You bought a game that was produced over 7 years ago. The system requirements state that it does not work on 64 bit OS's, and does not state that Win Vista/7/8 is supported. Did you really expect the game to function 100% as intended without 3rd party support?

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

You mean those temporary price reductions which usually aren't significantly better than Amazon's sales but get people to become first time users, the hardest thing for an online service?

How's that altruistic?

its kind of hard to argue they are temporary when theres one sale at every second on steam

im not saying its all altruistic (altough to a certain extent they seem to be sometimes), Valve is a business, im not saying they arent, but its a business that still cares for their customers, because making money and customer satisfaction are not mutually exclusive

they could always go origin style and barely have any sales



oh, and i believe it was valve the first one to start the trend of having deep discounts for digital games, so your point of amazing is kind of moot since they opened the gates

Bit hyperbolic.

more like a bit true

steam has big picture mode, trading, community hubs, workshop, community market, in-home streaming and family sharing

and these are features i personally saw being implemented in my 3 years with the service, thats more than 2 new features per year, and they are game changing stuff, trading and market alone for instance, have allowd me to get a metric ton of games

And any of this makes up for lack of quality control...How?

and whos talking about quality control? so just because steam is lacking in quality control (after for the longest time being accused of making it hard for indies to get into the store) does that mean valve cant have a good relationship with its fanbase?

is like you literally found absolutely nothing bad to talk about Valve relationship with its fanbase and just changed the topic

You personally liking them and them having a monopoly doesn't mean they care about their users. That's absurd.

heres the funny thing, if Valve has a monopoly, it was founded almost exclusively on a quality service

valve doesnt force any developer to use steamworks, in fact many games on steam are DRM-free

valve has gone on record saying they encourage developers to reléase their games on as many platforms as possible

many, many games that are avaliable on steam are also avaliable in other digital distribution platforms, such as uPlay, Origin and GoG


customers have options, developers have options, but they keep going back to steam because they like it

Oddly enough, people did jump into origin and uPlay. You can't complain about exclusive games, either, since that was a "note" they took from Valve.

and yet none of those services have as many players as steam

valve has said before that they arent completely sure it was the best move to forcé people to use steam to play HL2, to keep arguing over that 10 years later is ridiculous, whats true is that nowadays Valve games use steam because they need it, valve games now use stuff like VAC, workshop, trading, etc, those features need steam to work

If so, you'd think you'd be able to provide a solid case for it, bro. But you didn't. Your argument comes down to "I like it/it's popular" and....Not much else.

Sorry, bro.

ok bro ill make it easy for ya

if people dont like steam, if steam offers a subpar service to its customers, why games that are released on both gog and steam, always sell more on steam?


i mean they have the chance to play the game completely free of DRM, instead of using the Evil? DRM platform Steam


could it be? do these people enjoy steam features like archivements, trading cards, workshop and more? who knows



now let me make myself perfectly clear, i dont think our lord and saviour Gaben is a saint (unless the vatican finally responds to all my e-mails) or that steam is perfect, there are problems, like you said, no reliable refunds and steam is starting to need some serious curation

but to imply they are anti-customer? thats ridiculous have you looked around at the rest of the industry?

 

[Gigano]

Well yes and no.

It's inherently obvious to any digital distributors that many of their customers will be running a newer version of Windows. Thus, if a piece of software doesn't work on a newer version of Windows, they should either fix it, or very clearly inform about it.

There's no problem in selling something that only work on particular older or uncommon OS, so long as you clearly inform about it only working on particular older or uncommon OS.