college/university good, or bad?

[hurfdurp]

With the impossibility of failure these days, you have people working on airplanes among other things, who probably shouldn't be. It's kind of creepy, it's not really the best person for the job that's the priority. I wish I could skip it all but my future career is already riddled with instability so I can't really chance it.

 

[Lombax302]

speaking as a college student, i am slightly biased toward colleges, but i also understand what you are saying. i think that if an education is possible go for it, but i also agree that it isn't the end of the world if you don't. plus, whether we like it or not, we need people in jobs that don't require degrees or masters, without them the basis of our economy, society, whatever you want to call it would fail.

 

[shootthebandit]

With the impossibility of failure these days, you have people working on airplanes among other things, who probably shouldn't be.

oi, what are you trying to imply?

 

[bak00777]

i dont rly like it. ive been here 1month so far, i never thought that whole "college isnt for me" thing was true, but im starting to think it is.

 

[RyQ_TMC]

i also agree about people going to uni simply because they have to or because they are not ready to leave education. At my school most people were going to uni simply because they wanted ANY degree now in my opinion you need to know what you want to do when you go to university

To add to that - where I come from, going to uni is sort of like social status. If your parents have degrees, you have to go into uni as well, otherwise it's perceived like going down in social hierarchy. So you end up with a lot of people who spend 5 years doing bugger all at courses they're not really interested in, and then going into something completely unrelated.

My own sister got an MBA, and now she's a TV journalist. And she got the job thanks to a few months of radio journalism she'd done just after high school.

So yeah, a lot of people who go to uni don't really need that. The problem, in my opinion at least, lies in the rat race mentality. Sure, you don't actually know what you want to do, but then there are those studies quoted by ThePeaceFrog, so you get pressed into doing a degree anyway.

also it is a bad thing that everyone has the opertunity to go to university, because not everyone needs to go. if anyone can obtain a degree then you will need to spend a few years at uni to become a bin man or a cleaner. i think the vast amount of degrees is pointless (except the traditional degrees: science and law etc) i just think there needs to be more options in advanced hands-on training rather than simply going to an establishment of higher education

I think this kind of problem is by-and-large corrected by the job market itself. Most companies would rather hire someone with a year of practical experience as a bin man, rather than a doctorate in scoupidiology. Also, binmen with a degree from Harvard would have a much easier time getting a job than those who graduated from Bunghole University (est. 2009). At this moment, it's really mostly the unis and colleges providing for an existing demand, rather than supply creating that demand.

 

[thiosk]

Sure, folks who got C's and D's get to "uni." They just tend to go to the University of Duhhhhh. If what you want is a vocation, then going to a 4 year liberal arts university is indeed probably a waste of time; though here in the united states folks have pushed away from vocational schools, and we have instead a boatload of Communications majors.

 

[olicon]

Im 20 year old and im in a well paid manager job just under £500 a week. And ive only being there a mounth and i went to college and studied animal care and i never went to uni!.

So i think it proves if you work for it or get lucky. But degrees do help.

That's a pretty well paid job. And you will probably double that in a decade.
But it won't measure up to me when I land by 200 PER HOUR. Of course I'd start out in the negative, but that's how investment goes. The main issue is--will I be doing what I like compared to you?

Not every vocation needs higher level education. And not everyone has to want to do it. Sure, lawyers gets paid more and do need a Tertiary degree--but I that doesn't mean it's something I want to do.

Another thing that I find to be helpful with universities is as they say, "you see more standing on the shoulder of a giant". If I want to learn about air craft design and system control, I will be surrounded by hundreds of like-minded individuals, a few dozens of which are experts on the topic, and a few other dozens experts in closely related field. That is a luxury that you simply do not get outside of academia. I would also have access to a few thousand books, as well as papers on the topic. What would you have? Your mentor, and maybe a few colleagues.
And if you really want to get into the nitty gritty of things, you simply don't learn the theory behind things all that much as an apprentice. Your mentor might tell you why you're doing something in a particular situation--but it's much harder to dig deeper into why that situation arises to begin with.

There are definitely advantages with hands-on learning, but not knowing the theory behind it can be a real limiting factor if you're into design. But if you already know what you want to do in life, then by all means go for it! Satisfaction is the keyword, and if you have a chance to get into a field that you like, then seize it as quickly as possible.
You can always come back to college after a while--and if you're doing a good job, your company would be the one who paid for it too.

 

[Julianking93]

Meh. In all honesty, while i'm going to college, I don't really see the point to it past it being something to do.

Besides, the career I want to get into doesn't require a degree, so there's that factor. It is interesting and fun to study different things that the colleges have to offer but as for going into a particular career, no I don't think it will help me considering what I want to do.

Plus, I've actually already got a good job as a web designer for an advertising agency.

 

[shootthebandit]

Another thing that I find to be helpful with universities is as they say, "you see more standing on the shoulder of a giant". If I want to learn about air craft design and system control, I will be surrounded by hundreds of like-minded individuals, a few dozens of which are experts on the topic, and a few other dozens experts in closely related field. That is a luxury that you simply do not get outside of academia. I would also have access to a few thousand books, as well as papers on the topic. What would you have? Your mentor, and maybe a few colleagues.
And if you really want to get into the nitty gritty of things, you simply don't learn the theory behind things all that much as an apprentice. Your mentor might tell you why you're doing something in a particular situation--but it's much harder to dig deeper into why that situation arises to begin with.

There are definitely advantages with hands-on learning, but not knowing the theory behind it can be a real limiting factor if you're into design.

my apprenticeship is actually very heavily based on theory, i will be doing 8 months of theory before doing a further year of hands-on training. i will be doing such things as aerodynamics, physics, electronics etc etc

 

[shootthebandit]

i'm surprised you manged to get an apprenticeship in a skilled engineering discipline without an incorporated collage component being part of it tbh.

i have doubts if i would happy with such set up even if it was my dream job.
seems to me you won't be getting any recognised transferable qualifications.

i did a 6 sex year electrical engineering apprenticeship and 2 years of part time collage studying theory was mandatory and everything else was basically part of collage level vocational qualifications and tested as such.

we have to do 8 months of theory and a further year of (supervised) hands-on training before we are allowed to work with aircraft

 

[shootthebandit]

Another thing that I find to be helpful with universities is as they say, "you see more standing on the shoulder of a giant". If I want to learn about air craft design and system control, I will be surrounded by hundreds of like-minded individuals, a few dozens of which are experts on the topic, and a few other dozens experts in closely related field. That is a luxury that you simply do not get outside of academia. I would also have access to a few thousand books, as well as papers on the topic. What would you have? Your mentor, and maybe a few colleagues.
And if you really want to get into the nitty gritty of things, you simply don't learn the theory behind things all that much as an apprentice. Your mentor might tell you why you're doing something in a particular situation--but it's much harder to dig deeper into why that situation arises to begin with.

There are definitely advantages with hands-on learning, but not knowing the theory behind it can be a real limiting factor if you're into design.

my apprenticeship is actually very heavily based on theory, i will be doing 8 months of theory before doing a further year of hands-on training. i will be doing such things as aerodynamics, physics, electronics etc etc

so in effect you are actually going to college just not in a college.

i wouldnt say it was that advanced, its basic theory but its related to the job i will be doing, so the physics will be based entirely on aircraft at a basic level.

 

[Phoenixmgs_v1legacy]

I think college for the most part is bullshit and a waste of time. I went and got a Bachelor's but I spent more time taking classes take weren't a part of my major, all the electives and gen ed stuff. And, I don't think I've ever learned anything important by writing a paper in any class. I took so many college classes where I learned the same things I learned in high school like physics, english, pre-calculus, etc. The biggest problem with American education is that you re-learn so many things it's ridiculous. If you could just learn something once and move on, that would be great.

There's so many things you don't need to learn that you are forced to learn. Outside of learning to read and grammar, English class is really not required. I don't care about analyzing books and poems and I never will, and I'll never need it at my job. You don't need geometry, I'm never in my life going to have to prove that 2 triangles are congruent in real life.

If you could just take classes and learn what you want after high school, that would be great. Basically, go to a trade school to learn how to do a job instead of going to college and wasting you time on gen ed and electives.

 

[Booze Zombie]

I figure all you really need is a good solid foundation (English and maths skills) and maybe an A level to get you through life.
That's why I'm going through college right now, myself.

It's a good jump point and you do learn good stuff in college.

 

[shootthebandit]

I figure all you really need is a good solid foundation (English and maths skills) and maybe an A level to get you through life.
That's why I'm going through college right now, myself.

It's a good jump point and you do learn good stuff in college.

yeah, i got A-levels before i applied for my apprenticeship

BTW i wrote college in the OP for the benefit of our american freinds, i agree (six form) college is important

 

[shootthebandit]

i think you either underestimate the course or overestimate what is taught in collage

most engineering apprenticeships in my experiance require collage level theory (and maybe practical) and collage level vocational training and testing.

i seem to remember them telling us it would be "basic" too then after we were done they also said "hey if you pay X amount of cash you can go do 11 more modules on day release and you'll get your degree..."

thanks for the warning, they did tell us it would be "basic" but thats probably not to put you off. i suppose it should be easier as you are in the work place so you have something practical and visual to help you understand the theory rather than just a book and not too mention all of your collegues who can help all of which i suppose would make it 1000 times easier

 

[C95J]

I think it can be very useful, but it depends on what job you want to do.

I think I plan to go to uni...