Crusader Kings 2

[Sam Eskenazi]

I got it on release day, had to decide between GamersGate or Steam. So glad I chose the former, meant I could actually play it before 18:00 my time!

I've been enjoying it immensly, especially have played the first Crusader Kings, being able to see all the improvements.

Started as the Duke of Leinster (meant count of dublin, but he's the son, so he inhereits both right away) and have worked my way to Kingdom of Ireland, Wales, Scotland, 1 Duchy in England, 3 in Iberia and 2 in Africa.

4th best military might in the world!

Sam,

 

[Dandark]

That looks awesome, I hope it has a demo as I really need to check this out.

It most certainly does.

http://www.fileplanet.com/224596/220000/fileinfo/Crusader-Kings-II-Demo

Is one spot I found it. Not sure why it's not on Steam, but I'm sure it will be at some point soon.

Thanks for the link, im downloading now.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

You sure about that? I dont know if I suck or if im putting the difficulty high, but I have been locked in decade long power struggles (that I have occasionally lost) with one faction in numerous Total War titles.

Well, I did specify that you can crank the difficulty level to give yourself something of a challenge, but the higher difficulty levels in TW don't result in a smarter AI or more interesting game play, you just take massive diplomacy penalties for no reason, and the enemy troops get huge combat bonuses, so now their spear levies are fighting like dismounted knights. It's not a particularly compelling way to implement a difficulty spike. The same is true of Civilization, where higher difficulty just means the AI is cheating its ass off. The result is a game that, while it may be mechanically challenging, it feels hollow and artificial.

And I'm not hacking on TW or Civ either, I love both those series intensely. I just appreciate CK2's ability to create a more organic challenge.

 

[Fat Hippo]

Alright, I've picked it up, and yeah, it's fun. I started as Munster in Ireland in 1066 or thereabouts, and by 1110, I've managed to unite the Kingdom of Ireland. Booyah! Now it's on to Wales. Maybe England too, though it actually belongs to Norway now.

Also, Mercenaries are awesome. Mercenaries: for all your unfriendly neighbor disputes.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?684

Some good AARs on the forums, there, for people who like that sort of thing.

Also, Mercenaries are awesome. Mercenaries: for all your unfriendly neighbor disputes.

I almost find mercenaries a little *too* indispensable when fighting at the Earl/Duke level, since actually having enough levies left over to crack open a siege after winning a field battle is rare. That said, I've read a few guides that underscore repeatedly how essential building up your holdings is, which is absurdly expensive, and having mercenaries funneling away your gold non stop would make that next to impossible.

The old guns or butter debate. But yeah, if you're a smaller duchy or earl and you fear incursion, it's good to keep a "float" of about 100 gold in case you need some last second mercenary intervention.

Maybe England too, though it actually belongs to Norway now.

Interesting. England threw off Norway in my game, and then a series of civil wars, and is now completely united. I WANT to unite Wales and declare myself a King, but I'm more than a little afraid of what England will do about that now that they're completely unoccupied. It's a little terrifying having a neighbor 10 times your size.

 

[Fat Hippo]

I almost find mercenaries a little *too* indispensable when fighting at the Earl/Duke level, since actually having enough levies left over to crack open a siege after winning a field battle is rare. That said, I've read a few guides that underscore repeatedly how essential building up your holdings is, which is absurdly expensive, and having mercenaries funneling away your gold non stop would make that next to impossible.

The old guns or butter debate. But yeah, if you're a smaller duchy or earl and you fear incursion, it's good to keep a "float" of about 100 gold in case you need some last second mercenary intervention.

Interesting. England threw off Norway in my game, and then a series of civil wars, and is now completely united. I WANT to unite Wales and declare myself a King, but I'm more than a little afraid of what England will do about that now that they're completely unoccupied. It's a little terrifying having a neighbor 10 times your size.

That's true, in these low-level conflicts of 1-2 province duchies fighting each other, it basically boils down to being able to afford mercenaries or not. If you have a casus belli on someone, and the money for cheap mercenaries + 5 months of wages, so about 90 gold, you WILL win, if he can't field his own. He may have 500 troops, you have 2'000. He simply can't win.

Now that I've taken Ireland, I've been investing a lot in economic buildings, to get my taxes up. It's a good feeling, going from 1 gold monthly income to 14.

One of the things I love most about these games is how history diverges, like the example of whether England can hold its own or not against Norway. Stuff like this can totally change how the later game develops.

 

[Octorok]

I gotta love how everybody says "Oh, Hearts of Iron 3 was too complex for my tastes, but Crusader Kings II/Victoria II is a piece of cake". Are you people mad?!

My brain must be wired up poorly, because I look at the supply system of HoI3 and think "Yup. Crystal clear." and yet I earlier looked at Crusader Kings II and thought "Holy Hell, it's like if my iPod headphones could manifest themselves as game mechanics."

Nonetheless, I'm pleased with the purchase. EU3 never sat quite right with me, whereas this fills the "Medieval Era" niche perfectly for me.

It's the first game in a long, long time where I was forced to break out a pen and paper to help me keep track. I found that was an easier way of visualising the various family trees, relationships, claims on territories etc.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

It's the first game in a long, long time where I was forced to break out a pen and paper to help me keep track. I found that was an easier way of visualising the various family trees, relationships, claims on territories etc.

The claims really get me. So far I've just married people off willy nilly, just looking for the best prestige marriage available, or the best collection of stats available, without thinking about the ramifications of what I've been doing. Lord knows how many far flung cousins now have tertiary claims on my titles. It's actually kind of terrifying.

 

[Sam Eskenazi]

Marry your daughters matrillianiary and keep them around. Allows you to breed more people of your dynasty. Encourage them to breed, and have the children educated with someone who has the "Content" trait, so the kids will get it to.

Then, give them a single Dukedom and 1 county! (I've actually modded it slightly so the "Same Dynasty" bonus is +25 instead of +5, meaning that my kinsmen are actually more trsutworthy and don't want to eat my spine for my crown!)

 

[Dandark]

Meh. I just tried it and my biggest problem was that I loaded it up, looked at the map and went "Crap. Now what do I do" then got bored and quit. IM hoping I can get into it some other time but I have no idea how to play it.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Marry your daughters matrillianiary and keep them around. Allows you to breed more people of your dynasty. Encourage them to breed, and have the children educated with someone who has the "Content" trait, so the kids will get it to.

Heh...I tried that in a previous game. Sadly the daughters in question were all ambitious and proud. You can imagine what happened as a result of that.

Meh. I just tried it and my biggest problem was that I loaded it up, looked at the map and went "Crap. Now what do I do" then got bored and quit. IM hoping I can get into it some other time but I have no idea how to play it.

The tutorial isn't particularly gripping, and is unfortunately a little buggy in spots. There's a PDF manual online that you can get the same information from. If it helps, my initial reaction to the demo was virtually identical to yours, and I turned it off on the first tutorial bug thinking "I guess this isn't my cup of tea".

Really, my advice would be to start very small, as an Earl or Count, to get a handle on things. Most people recommend Ireland as a starting nation, and I concur.

I didn't really start warming to it until the first time things went completely haywire. After that I was pretty absorbed.

 

[Octorok]

So I have downloaded but can't play it quite yet, busy with something else. I did however try the first tutorial quick and was instantly bored out of my skull.

It may just be that I dislike stratedgy game tutorials, is it possible for me to just begin a new game and figure it out or is the game to complex therefore requring I get through the tutorial?

Judging by your comment, I'm going to hazard a guess that you aren't that familiar with Paradox games' interfaces.

Tutorials for these games are notoriously unhelpful, given that they basically dump a small novel's worth of textual information on you and expect you to memorise it.

I'd recommend doing the "Basic" tutorial list anyway. They're not as bad as previous titles, and you'll probably need them for a grasp on the game's mechanics. You can probably clear them in under an hour, with a decent understanding of what the game does and how it works on a rather basic level.

From there, start up a game and just experiment. It's going to be a tough difficulty curve, but the goal of your first few games isn't really to win, but more to get used to the game's interface and mechanics, and to teach you how to play and get the most out of the game's depth.

 

[SckizoBoy]

Well, I did specify that you can crank the difficulty level to give yourself something of a challenge, but the higher difficulty levels in TW don't result in a smarter AI or more interesting game play, you just take massive diplomacy penalties for no reason, and the enemy troops get huge combat bonuses, so now their spear levies are fighting like dismounted knights.

Much as I love the TW titles, that's so true... for ETW I found the only difference between the difficulty settings was the income... '

Bizarrely, the I finished the hard campaign (August 1808) of NTW faster than the easy one (February 1810)... and I haven't the faintest idea how... *snrk*

Well... demo downloaded, be back in a few hours...

 

[Soviet Steve]

I was thinking of getting it but the forums indicates that it has the familiar "France conquers the entire world, every time" problem of EUIII so I wont be getting it until the fans have fixed it, which if I'm lucky should be within the next 5-6 years.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

I was thinking of getting it but the forums indicates that it has the familiar "France conquers the entire world, every time" problem of EUIII so I wont be getting it until the fans have fixed it, which if I'm lucky should be within the next 5-6 years.

I just zoomed out in my game, to see how France is doing. I've been zoomed in on Wales for the past 100 years carefully monitoring my tiny dynasty.

France is gone.

France is now Aragon.

Frankly, I'm speechless. Now I wish I'd been paying attention, because I'm DYING to know how THAT happened.