Day One DLC. Whats the point?

[Amnestic]

lololololololol well ooooooooooonce the code expires then yes i'll be right but i must go back to the store and see what the date said on the case since either i must have misread the expire date or box i saw is different from the one you did.
oh and no excuse unless someone waits until the game drops in price(like i do) then the DLC's make up for the price. fyi $70 game with DLC's included goes to say $30 without the DLC's but DLC's cost 15-20 or more then its back up to about $50 or more if they released more DLC's. DLC's are just a scam unless its used to make an already COMPELETE game more fun and interesting. like the grey warden keep DLC will give you more history on the grey wardens...hmmm i think any history on the faction you are playing as should already be IN the game and not an addon

Well I have my copy of Dragon Age: Origins for the PC right here. Bought it on release day as memory serves. On the back of the box it says *One time use code available with full retail version. Expires April 30, 2010.

And how do you know they won't make another batch of codes which expire later?

As for your complaints, did you whine about...say, Mass Effect 1's DLC? I mean, it had the Batarians. The Batarians are pretty important in regards to human history in Mass Effect. Why didn't they put that in the game?

Oh right, because they hadn't made it. Just like they hadn't made the Warden's Keep DLC when the game went gold. Haruhi's Skirt I shouldn't be repeating points from the article that's been linked twice in this thread already.

How do you know it wasn't part of the base game? The developers told you so? They say a lot of things, things that can often be outright lies. I'm not interested in ranting about the lies developers have made over the years to sell games. If you don't realize that developers have been telling lies for years, you're just a sad, sad puppet. They shoehorn all kinds of limitations on us in the name of the war against piracy(the lot of good that does) and other such nonsense and suddenly we're supposed to trust that this zero-day DLC wasn't some form of money grab because they said so?

Spoiler

 

[TPiddy]

I am in the camp that if it's on the disc already you should definitely NOT have to pay for it. If it didn't make it onto the disc and it's available day 1, who cares.

But you greedy fucks who want to charge me to unlock something that's ALREADY ON THE DISC, you can just fuck off.

 

[Master_Fubar23]

lololololololol well ooooooooooonce the code expires then yes i'll be right but i must go back to the store and see what the date said on the case since either i must have misread the expire date or box i saw is different from the one you did.
oh and no excuse unless someone waits until the game drops in price(like i do) then the DLC's make up for the price. fyi $70 game with DLC's included goes to say $30 without the DLC's but DLC's cost 15-20 or more then its back up to about $50 or more if they released more DLC's. DLC's are just a scam unless its used to make an already COMPELETE game more fun and interesting. like the grey warden keep DLC will give you more history on the grey wardens...hmmm i think any history on the faction you are playing as should already be IN the game and not an addon

Well I have my copy of Dragon Age: Origins for the PC right here. Bought it on release day as memory serves. On the back of the box it says *One time use code available with full retail version. Expires April 30, 2010.

And how do you know they won't make another batch of codes which expire later?

As for your complaints, did you whine about...say, Mass Effect 1's DLC? I mean, it had the Batarians. The Batarians are pretty important in regards to human history in Mass Effect. Why didn't they put that in the game?

Oh right, because they hadn't made it. Just like they hadn't made the Warden's Keep DLC when the game went gold. Haruhi's Skirt I shouldn't be repeating points from the article that's been linked twice in this thread already.

How do you know it wasn't part of the base game? The developers told you so? They say a lot of things, things that can often be outright lies. I'm not interested in ranting about the lies developers have made over the years to sell games. If you don't realize that developers have been telling lies for years, you're just a sad, sad puppet. They shoehorn all kinds of limitations on us in the name of the war against piracy(the lot of good that does) and other such nonsense and suddenly we're supposed to trust that this zero-day DLC wasn't some form of money grab because they said so?

Spoiler

well thats wonderful...you got the game on the first day. how do i know they wont? cuz they wont since that will make them not gain as much... duuuuuuh?also why bother having an expire date if they'll just make a new batch of codes for everyone...hmmm... oh but sorry i forget there are some idiots that cant think past two seconds. lol or aparently read a sentence. i didnt whine about mass effect 1 and in fact we're about on the same page there. mass effect from great and didnt NEED anything else nor was it lacking but they made DLC's for it to expand on the core game. which those DLC's came much later then the first damn day the game was released. now goin back to the cant think past two seconds. go ahead and believe everything the people that are selling you a product says, of course they wont lie to you and they'll give you 1000% of there best to try to make the buyers happy no matter what. they dont care about money at ALL... ya right. when the devs say that an ingame item that was in the core game was removed becuz it was BUGGED ie items going missing then instead of fixing their fuck up their going to have people pay to fix thier screw up. great job on defending the DLC's *thumbs up to ya*

 

[Amnestic]

Thor's Hammer, don't they teach paragraphing anymore?

well thats wonderful...you got the game on the first day. how do i know they wont? cuz they wont since that will make them not gain as much... duuuuuuh?also why bother having an expire date if they'll just make a new batch of codes for everyone...hmmm... oh but sorry i forget there are some idiots that cant think past two seconds.

You don't 'know' anything. You suspect it because...well I'm going to go with "You're paranoid." since that seems the only reasonable explanation. Who knows why the put an expire date on the codes? Might be to stop resale of them for all I know. You'd have to ask a Bioware person, of which I am not one. Maybe you should head over to the Bioware forums and inquire.

lol or aparently read a sentence. i didnt whine about mass effect 1 and in fact we're about on the same page there. mass effect from great and didnt NEED anything else nor was it lacking but they made DLC's for it to expand on the core game. which those DLC's came much later then the first damn day the game was released. now goin back to the cant think past two seconds.

You berate me for being unable to read a sentence, or 'think past two seconds', but you've demonstrated that you haven't even bothered reading the post by Virgil (which, again, has been linked twice in this thread) about the dates when games go Gold. Once again, I shouldn't have to be repeating points that were already made less than a page ago.

go ahead and believe everything the people that are selling you a product says, of course they wont lie to you and they'll give you 1000% of there best to try to make the buyers happy no matter what.

Bioware earn a certain amount of brand loyalty from continued exceptional quality. I have no reason to doubt them beyond paranoid fantasies that they're out to get me.

they dont care about money at ALL... ya right.

Of course they do. They're a business. I'm not exactly sure why you would bring this up. It's not remotely relevant. That's why they're selling you Mass Effect 2 and not giving you it for free.

when the devs say that an ingame item that was in the core game was removed becuz it was BUGGED ie items going missing then instead of fixing their fuck up their going to have people pay to fix thier screw up. great job on defending the DLC's *thumbs up to ya*

Which item would that be, exactly?

Please learn sentence structure and paragraphing before your next post. Lack of capital letters, proper punctuation, spelling and understanding what the enter key was for made reading your post a chore.

 

[Woodsey]

There isn't one as far as I can tell - The Saboteur one is the most ridiculous I've seen.

Why not just include an option in the menu to turn nipples on/off?

That was a way to get around controversy; the DLC can only be downloaded to accounts which say they are for people over 18, so by putting it as DLC, they can reasonably say they aren't selling nudity to minors. Nevermind that most smart minors (myself included) put the wrong birthdate in the account screen, but no plan is perfect.

As always, the answer is money. How do you make more money on something? Release something with the game that should have been ready (and is actually inside the game for some of them.)

The answer is not always money. Sometimes the developers create something that ultimately doesn't make sense or looks out of place in the final game so they cut it out of the finished version and then decided to sell it as DLC rather then just throwing it away completely. I think all of peoples complaints about DLC are largely baseless unless we are talking about EA style DLC where they use games like The Sims to suck as much money from the consumers as possible.

There's no excuse for Day-1 DLC though. If it's readily available on launch, it should be in the game. Hell, you can just add an 'extras' menu and put it there if it doesn't fit. I enjoy DLC to an extent, but on Day one it's unacceptable.

At the risk of stealing Amnestic's thunder, please read this. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.154083#3719305]

Oh right, guess I'm one of those clever "minors" as well then.

 

[TheTygerfire]

There isn't one as far as I can tell - The Saboteur one is the most ridiculous I've seen.

Why not just include an option in the menu to turn nipples on/off?

It was so that kids couldn't rent the game just to see tits, you had to buy it new or else the code wouldn't work. It's actually a pretty smart way of not neutering the product "for the children".

 

[Jesus Phish]

Day one dlc's are fine. They let the team continue to work on the game after it's been sent off for pressing, printing and all that lovely stuff that takes so much time that the guys who work on the game have nothing to do with.

In the case of day one dlc's that come free with games, I see that as a way to reduce the preowned games market and encourage people to buy new games. Take Dragon Age. The Stone Prisoner is valued at about as much as you'd save buying a second hand copy. If you buy the second hand copy and then want the dlc, you've to go pay for it online (buying points which will usually cost you more considering how theyre priced).

 

[Soviet Heavy]

but charging for day one DLC is wrong

 

[JEBWrench]

How do you know it wasn't part of the base game? The developers told you so? They say a lot of things, things that can often be outright lies. I'm not interested in ranting about the lies developers have made over the years to sell games. If you don't realize that developers have been telling lies for years, you're just a sad, sad puppet. They shoehorn all kinds of limitations on us in the name of the war against piracy(the lot of good that does) and other such nonsense and suddenly we're supposed to trust that this zero-day DLC wasn't some form of money grab because they said so?

By virtue of being additional content, it's not the base game.

If I buy a ham sandwich, and ask for extra mayo, the extra mayo is not part of the base sandwich.

Regardless of whether or not they were skimping on the mayo to begin with.

It absolutely should be free though, because it should be part of the base game. We shouldn't have to pay extra money because the developers didn't feel like spending an extra couple months polishing and completing their game. Day-one DLC is almost always something that WAS intended to be in the game to begin with. There's a difference between that and DLC developed after release specifically for the purpose of expanding the game.

Publishers. Publishers don't like pushing back release dates by months if they can avoid it.

As for whether or not certain pieces of DLC are or are not intended to be with the original base game, I have no idea; I don't buy DLC to begin with.

I just don't have a problem with the Publishers wanting money from people willing to part from it.

 

[JEBWrench]

Sorry - double-post.

 

[LordZ]

By virtue of being additional content, it's not the base game.

If I buy a ham sandwich, and ask for extra mayo, the extra mayo is not part of the base sandwich.

Regardless of whether or not they were skimping on the mayo to begin with.

Going with the ham sandwich comparison, would you be pissed if you bought a ham sandwich and saw the person scrape off mayo from it after it was done(but before handing it to you) and then said you'd have to pay more if you wanted more mayo? How do you know that isn't what happened with these games? Unless you're one of the developers who worked on the game, you don't know and, if you are one of them, you're probably lying out of your ass.

Bioware earn a certain amount of brand loyalty from continued exceptional quality. I have no reason to doubt them beyond paranoid fantasies that they're out to get me.

I used to trust Bioware too. Then they sold out to the soulless bastards called EA. Whether you want to believe it or not, EA has a say in what goes on with any Bioware game. Also, if you're too ignorant to realize that money is a motivating factor in pretty much 90% (the other 10% being to cover their own asses; so, I guess it's still basically 100% about money) of the lies corporations spew then I don't want to talk to you, ever.

 

[JEBWrench]

Going with the ham sandwich comparison, would you be pissed if you bought a ham sandwich and saw the person scrape off mayo from it after it was done(but before handing it to you) and then said you'd have to pay more if you wanted more mayo? How do you know that isn't what happened with these games? Unless you're one of the developers who worked on the game, you don't know and, if you are one of them, you're probably lying out of your ass.

To be honest, I can't say for certain that the publishers haven't specifically yanked out necessary content from any of the games.

Going back to the aforementioned sandwich, if I saw them remove said mayo, yes, it would be severely aggrevating. But if it were known that mayo cost extra, that's not a problem to me.

If it were all of a sudden, nope, no mayo, and by the way, it'll cost ya, that's where a problem arises.

And the resolution of that problem would be for me not to buy the mayo, and they don't get their money. Since it's entirely their choice to charge for it.

 

[LordZ]

If it were all of a sudden, nope, no mayo, and by the way, it'll cost ya, that's where a problem arises.

And the resolution of that problem would be for me not to buy the mayo, and they don't get their money. Since it's entirely their choice to charge for it.

Personally, I'd rather buy my sandwich from someone who doesn't skimp on the mayo, regardless of whether it was scraped off or never added to begin with. I'd only buy from them if there was absolutely no way I could buy a better ham sandwich. I'd do it, even if I had to make the sandwich myself.

Oh right, we were talking about a game. Yeah, it remains true when applied to the game. I'd rather buy games where the developers didn't skimp and actually seem to care about the entertainment value in their own product. You know, instead of just whether people will buy it or not.

 

[Master_Fubar23]

text wall.

well sorry i didn't know my writing was being graded lol. anywho its not being paranoid its called having common sense which it seems isn't so common. like u said bioware is a company so like every other company alive they want profits. so having a code that will no longer work after a certain date makes sure people have an incentive to buy the game while the code works or use more money when it expires. there is no other reasons in having an expire date for a code.hey, why don't you email bioware or EA and see if they will extend the expire date for the codes. oh wait you won't and you'll probably say something along the lines of "why? i bought it first day" or "you do it" or "sorry i just don't care enough". take your pick i don't care which since its not paranoia when someone can simply use past exp to see whats going to happen in another situation. now before you reply go to orannis62's post and click on the link to another page. it will explain what i meant about the bugged item. oh and try to come up with something better then i have poor spelling, sentence structure, etc and try to actually come up with something to defend your argument for a change... oh wait thats impossible. enjoy oh and i never said nor thought "someone was out to get me" as you put it but a lack of intelligence will lead someone to that kind of conclusion so its ok *gives ya a pat on the back* also how is it not relavent that a company wants money. yes their selling mass effect 2...duh but the WHOLE TOPIC of this thread was about first day DLC's so going back to what i said before. there is no reason why someone must pay for a day one DLC. if it was able to make it with the launch date of the game then it should be included with the game as if it was apart of it not as an extra. although since companys WANT MONEY they will make people pay as much money as they can spend.

 

[Master_Fubar23]

By virtue of being additional content, it's not the base game.

If I buy a ham sandwich, and ask for extra mayo, the extra mayo is not part of the base sandwich.

Regardless of whether or not they were skimping on the mayo to begin with.

Going with the ham sandwich comparison, would you be pissed if you bought a ham sandwich and saw the person scrape off mayo from it after it was done(but before handing it to you) and then said you'd have to pay more if you wanted more mayo? How do you know that isn't what happened with these games? Unless you're one of the developers who worked on the game, you don't know and, if you are one of them, you're probably lying out of your ass.

Bioware earn a certain amount of brand loyalty from continued exceptional quality. I have no reason to doubt them beyond paranoid fantasies that they're out to get me.

I used to trust Bioware too. Then they sold out to the soulless bastards called EA. Whether you want to believe it or not, EA has a say in what goes on with any Bioware game. Also, if you're too ignorant to realize that money is a motivating factor in pretty much 90% (the other 10% being to cover their own asses; so, I guess it's still basically 100% about money) of the lies corporations spew then I don't want to talk to you, ever.

agreed

 

[JEBWrench]

Personally, I'd rather buy my sandwich from someone who doesn't skimp on the mayo, regardless of whether it was scraped off or never added to begin with. I'd only buy from them if there was absolutely no way I could buy a better ham sandwich. I'd do it, even if I had to make the sandwich myself.

Oh right, we were talking about a game. Yeah, it remains true when applied to the game. I'd rather buy games where the developers didn't skimp and actually seem to care about the entertainment value in their own product. You know, instead of just whether people will buy it or not.

I think we're basically agreeing here in a very roundabout way.

More or less what I'm getting at - D1DLC is fine, nobody's making anyone buy it.

 

[LordZ]

What I'm trying to point out is that the morons are buying it. This leads developers to think they can further butcher their games. This leaves less games for those of us with a sense of taste or those who simply refuse to bend over for every game out there.

You need look no further than the current sales figures for Mass Effect 2 to see what I'm saying is true. I wonder how long it'll be before we have to buy games one level at a time.