DC Comics Wants You To Draw Naked Female Suicide
- Thread starter Thunderous Cacophony
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This doesn't really bother me. To be honest the Batwoman marriage thing doesn't bother me either, it seems they don't have a problem with the lesbian part, just the marriage part. Seeing how most comic marriages negatively affect the story lines maybe they are right.
DC has no idea what it's doing. And if someone sends in several pictures of all other DC characters killing themself naked, or at least many of them, but specificly excludes Quinn, my reaction wil be that of my ribcage bursting open and losing all hope for this species.
Or maybe it's a joke about Harley Quinn also sharing a name with a porn-actress and the whole thing's just a really sick joke. (Thankyou, Wikipedia)
Or maybe it's a joke about Harley Quinn also sharing a name with a porn-actress and the whole thing's just a really sick joke. (Thankyou, Wikipedia)
If the damn blacks wanted to start complaining over all the fucked up systematic racism this is up in society, they should have done it years ago.Dead Century said:
or better
If the damn slaves really wanted to be free, they should´ve started to protest for themselves and a bit more early.
so the logical conclusion seems to be:
its too late. now there are even scientific mental illnesses which prove our power and prove that its gaga for a slave to want to be free or not to do slave-work.
ah too late. so we NEED to continue on our road of shittiness because you, the minority we oppressed, ridiculed and excluded for years and aged just tried to open the mouth about all our shittiness.
what makes you think complaining 10 years earlier had solved?
1.no? if you want to kill yourself, you know you´ll be found. so better have a bit on. ist just a shame thing even in that despair.Sgt. Sykes said:
2.the problem behind the crazy=suicidal/off the bat-trope in combination with the HUGE stigma in our society towards mentally ill people might be not apparent for mentally healthy people, but it is there.
really, there are too much people who have their only knwoledg about that stuff out of media. and harley was never so dark-gritty<-shitty, she had always humour. that last one doent have.
an alternative idea:
4: harley has tons of electronics& one two big bombs in gift form as a ball attached on a string with glowing lights and that on her feet(like a bungee jumper) and jumps with that and a clearly grinning face down in a pond in the open where everybody can see-she will go with a blast. -or something like that clearly over the top dark-but humour-y
also cut the crap nakedness. she was classy before the redesign..
5. she swings away in the last seconds and kicks out of the panel, breaking the 4th wall into the next panel where she sees herself sitting on a chair, looking gloomy and sad(like last 2 episodes of evangelion-like)from the head of gloomy harley are dots which connect to panes 1-4, indicating that this happens in her head
6. she takes an inflatable hammer and hammers herself, effectively waking herself from self pity and despair.
she shakes herself and makes herself clear, that failure and giving up is never an answer for harley
(and down under the last panel the number of the suicide-help or something)
its so out of role for her.
I was once at the point of a suicide attempt. believe me, before you try this, you brood about that for ages (it feels that way, at least) okay, thats not 100% correct, some suicides are (often under the influence of drugs, especially! alcohol) impulse reactions.
But usually you think about that. you plan that. And depending on your character and state of despair, you choose.
i think people will wear undies at least.
well, I found a little exerp 6 people naked, 5 people wore clothes-one fully, the reast underwear. in the other cases (19) no information was given. victims ~50/50 m/f (http://www.medline.ru/public/sudm/a2/art3-2-2.phtml)
so, nakedness is not necessary. give her her costume, its undies anyway
and if you look at that in the light of the 52-miss-design its just a sad thing. one of the last cool classy characters who were not designt with a horny male audience in mind with contorsion, goth-whore* clothing (she wears fucking UNDIES. her costumes are undies. what the gfuck? in a few years from a cool full body authentic harlekin-costume into a psycho-hooker/whore* in undies. typical verschlimmbesserung (disimprovement)
spoiler:excess rants, also a link on the idea that rape is something that HAS to happen to female characters in fantasy/writing and an example on how to make a good comic about rape&sexual harassment and the effect it has on the victim.
* i like whores. I know some which i like, very nice people. so its no jab at them (well, 2 of them usually wear more and more classier clothing for work then the new harley.)its a jab on the fact that one of the last resonably clothed supervillainesses was again and sadly predictably degraded into a harlot-lookalike because of what again?
[polemic²]
maybe they thought:
fuck women, they dont buy enough so we dont care, they dont need a diverse cast of female characters which they could relate to or have as help/role model/comedic fun if the shit we write to tingle our male audience happens to them in real life.
who cares, we want hot ass hookers whoo might re traumatize the few of our fem. reader we did not drive of with out fuckery yet.
if she gets her own series, she has to please the male gaze because it wont sell if she were clothed and there were no dumb immature and insensitive crap in panel 4 to shock without value.
mayby we pack a rape scene into it and to weight that out..Oh, wait, I have the BEST idea evar:
a hot lesbian love scene with poison ivy-for all the cranky old feminist who are pissed because we want to sellhorny stuff great art to horny teens in their 30 years old and ignore just abput the rest who dont want their fun to be spolileed with that shit.
but lets fire this annoying women (Gail) and people who want really progressive stuff like gay marriages instead of raunchy sexualisation of lesbianism. It doesnt matter anyway(mark millar said something like that..)
We dont want critic, we want to sell the stuff we know and our 30 year old teens know. tits and sex and crap. We are so an progressive club here. why arent we taken serious?
[/polemic²]
they could at least print it on the front, like a trigger warning. but that would reduce the shock(which is reduced anyway because of the ubiquity of rape in this kind of media.)
less polemic, but polemic enough:
I was once at the point of a suicide attempt. believe me, before you try this, you brood about that for ages (it feels that way, at least) okay, thats not 100% correct, some suicides are (often under the influence of drugs, especially! alcohol) impulse reactions.
But usually you think about that. you plan that. And depending on your character and state of despair, you choose.
i think people will wear undies at least.
well, I found a little exerp 6 people naked, 5 people wore clothes-one fully, the reast underwear. in the other cases (19) no information was given. victims ~50/50 m/f (http://www.medline.ru/public/sudm/a2/art3-2-2.phtml)
so, nakedness is not necessary. give her her costume, its undies anyway
and if you look at that in the light of the 52-miss-design its just a sad thing. one of the last cool classy characters who were not designt with a horny male audience in mind with contorsion, goth-whore* clothing (she wears fucking UNDIES. her costumes are undies. what the gfuck? in a few years from a cool full body authentic harlekin-costume into a psycho-hooker/whore* in undies. typical verschlimmbesserung (disimprovement)
spoiler:excess rants, also a link on the idea that rape is something that HAS to happen to female characters in fantasy/writing and an example on how to make a good comic about rape&sexual harassment and the effect it has on the victim.
* i like whores. I know some which i like, very nice people. so its no jab at them (well, 2 of them usually wear more and more classier clothing for work then the new harley.)its a jab on the fact that one of the last resonably clothed supervillainesses was again and sadly predictably degraded into a harlot-lookalike because of what again?
[polemic²]
maybe they thought:
fuck women, they dont buy enough so we dont care, they dont need a diverse cast of female characters which they could relate to or have as help/role model/comedic fun if the shit we write to tingle our male audience happens to them in real life.
who cares, we want hot ass hookers whoo might re traumatize the few of our fem. reader we did not drive of with out fuckery yet.
if she gets her own series, she has to please the male gaze because it wont sell if she were clothed and there were no dumb immature and insensitive crap in panel 4 to shock without value.
mayby we pack a rape scene into it and to weight that out..Oh, wait, I have the BEST idea evar:
a hot lesbian love scene with poison ivy-for all the cranky old feminist who are pissed because we want to sell
but lets fire this annoying women (Gail) and people who want really progressive stuff like gay marriages instead of raunchy sexualisation of lesbianism. It doesnt matter anyway(mark millar said something like that..)
We dont want critic, we want to sell the stuff we know and our 30 year old teens know. tits and sex and crap. We are so an progressive club here. why arent we taken serious?
[/polemic²]
they could at least print it on the front, like a trigger warning. but that would reduce the shock(which is reduced anyway because of the ubiquity of rape in this kind of media.)
less polemic, but polemic enough:
If they would want to shock, they could make something about race&sexism(like the guy who made the walking dead. The strong Black woman(trope) who gets beaten, tortured and raped(trope) just to show how badass she(trope)*
is because it seems to me that it is hard to show how badass some women are without getting dem a bit raepn torture. tingling the readers private parts is a nice side-effect.
Homosexuality isnt their favourite shock-motif although it would have a shocking impact on some-but that's the wrong one. it seems that they want the horny shock, not the social-justice-&-equality-of-love-shock. (although there are enough cases(Sherlock is only one example) of lesbians getting straight for the one hero who gets all pussy(or could have it at least). This would be a perfect place to tuck in a bit of "corrective" rape to show that these world has sick people who think that these wacky male hating lesbians just need a hard fuck and then they are whole good women(okay, now tainted because they had sex, the whores) again.
Or he is sooo hot that even the butchiest-lesbian cant resist his hero-ness who saves the wacky butch-lesbian from corrective rape (in its beginning stadium to get a bit nakedness at least, the lesbian will be as erotic as almost all female comic-heroines are.
TWBL will fall in love with him and out of role (Females are bisexual by default, even if the state they are lesbian-they cat resist the heroes manliness. Heterosexual men stay in the default-role 100%)
so homosexuality to shock?
neh. lesbians dont shock anybody, they are hot and necessary. EVAR. we have to SELL. and who wants gay man? and them being sexualized in sexy poses (see hawkeye initiative) our reader will feel sooooo awkward. we cant dare to do something that progressive with a big hero& in canon. We have to SELL
they like/need to shock-but only shock with stuff they are into. eg rape on paper. racism on paper would not sell enough because it cant be eroticized.
not really at least. In fantasy, yes, but even there its not that blatant.
(hell, a lot of women, myself included have rape-fantasies. I like porn who plays out that stuff. but that is exactly that-porn. and not all of the porn is rape porn (also they have interviews before and after where the actors talk about their expectations, ideas and after about their experience&whether they want to come back. that's really nice, I like that, but i know that there are tons of people who are really not into that and getting uncomfortable or even worse-triggered up to a flashback and having to feel the same horrible experience without control out of the blue again.
So I don't want that in my ALLMOST ALL OF US-DC-comic-series. Especially if done so lazy by people who dont know rape. they read about it but i seriously doubt that they talked with survivors or such.
I don't want it to become that way that the fans will ask the writer how long it will take, how long they will have to wait until the heroine is FINALLY getting raped.(Seanan mcguire: http://seanan-mcguire.livejournal.com/470626.html)
but i fear that this is too late.
but its never too late to criticize this shit.
(on how to make a good comic about rape: bryan talbot: the Tale of One Bad Rat http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/476899.The_Tale_of_One_Bad_Rat#other_reviews)
*and then will take revenge(trope)...
is because it seems to me that it is hard to show how badass some women are without getting dem a bit raepn torture. tingling the readers private parts is a nice side-effect.
Homosexuality isnt their favourite shock-motif although it would have a shocking impact on some-but that's the wrong one. it seems that they want the horny shock, not the social-justice-&-equality-of-love-shock. (although there are enough cases(Sherlock is only one example) of lesbians getting straight for the one hero who gets all pussy(or could have it at least). This would be a perfect place to tuck in a bit of "corrective" rape to show that these world has sick people who think that these wacky male hating lesbians just need a hard fuck and then they are whole good women(okay, now tainted because they had sex, the whores) again.
Or he is sooo hot that even the butchiest-lesbian cant resist his hero-ness who saves the wacky butch-lesbian from corrective rape (in its beginning stadium to get a bit nakedness at least, the lesbian will be as erotic as almost all female comic-heroines are.
TWBL will fall in love with him and out of role (Females are bisexual by default, even if the state they are lesbian-they cat resist the heroes manliness. Heterosexual men stay in the default-role 100%)
so homosexuality to shock?
neh. lesbians dont shock anybody, they are hot and necessary. EVAR. we have to SELL. and who wants gay man? and them being sexualized in sexy poses (see hawkeye initiative) our reader will feel sooooo awkward. we cant dare to do something that progressive with a big hero& in canon. We have to SELL
they like/need to shock-but only shock with stuff they are into. eg rape on paper. racism on paper would not sell enough because it cant be eroticized.
not really at least. In fantasy, yes, but even there its not that blatant.
(hell, a lot of women, myself included have rape-fantasies. I like porn who plays out that stuff. but that is exactly that-porn. and not all of the porn is rape porn (also they have interviews before and after where the actors talk about their expectations, ideas and after about their experience&whether they want to come back. that's really nice, I like that, but i know that there are tons of people who are really not into that and getting uncomfortable or even worse-triggered up to a flashback and having to feel the same horrible experience without control out of the blue again.
So I don't want that in my ALLMOST ALL OF US-DC-comic-series. Especially if done so lazy by people who dont know rape. they read about it but i seriously doubt that they talked with survivors or such.
I don't want it to become that way that the fans will ask the writer how long it will take, how long they will have to wait until the heroine is FINALLY getting raped.(Seanan mcguire: http://seanan-mcguire.livejournal.com/470626.html)
but i fear that this is too late.
but its never too late to criticize this shit.
(on how to make a good comic about rape: bryan talbot: the Tale of One Bad Rat http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/476899.The_Tale_of_One_Bad_Rat#other_reviews)
*and then will take revenge(trope)...
I was out-raged until I learned it was Harley Quinn. I mean it is Harley, she is meant to be freaky and psycotic. I mean it is definitly in poor taste and I am rather uncomfortable about the matter, but I feel the identity of the character kind of changes the dynamic of the story and probably should have been included in the articles name.