Dealing with Spies (TF2)
- Thread starter galdon2004
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I can tell you are new to the game because anyone else will tell you Spies are weak lil bitches that can only exist when a team is full of buffoons.
They have low health, cant do anything while invisible, and once you know where to look they stick out like a raging sore thumb.
you see a scout running INTO your base, its a spy scouts cant defend or have any reason to be at home. They dont need to heal or resupply because they are minute men, an engineer well away from his stuff is probably a spy.
The problem with the game for spies is that its easy to spy check, they are like 3 shots til death, and you never really feel beat by them, only mildly tricked.
try getting into an enemy base as a spy you have to cloak across the battlefield and pop up in disguise and then what you get off one backstab before you get turned to mulch?
They have low health, cant do anything while invisible, and once you know where to look they stick out like a raging sore thumb.
you see a scout running INTO your base, its a spy scouts cant defend or have any reason to be at home. They dont need to heal or resupply because they are minute men, an engineer well away from his stuff is probably a spy.
The problem with the game for spies is that its easy to spy check, they are like 3 shots til death, and you never really feel beat by them, only mildly tricked.
try getting into an enemy base as a spy you have to cloak across the battlefield and pop up in disguise and then what you get off one backstab before you get turned to mulch?
The CnD has it's uses. I've used it's advantages to win rounds for my team numerous times. It's situational sure, and it may be a big crutch. But I personally think the Dead Ringer is the much bigger crutch. It pretty much instantly excuses any moronic thoughtless blunder with a gtfo-free card.Grufflenark said:
Unless there's a pyro on the other team actually isn't complete rubbish.
Unless you have the Dead Ringer. People don't give much credence to disguises but they can be useful. It may be easy to spycheck anything that runs into your base, but it might be a bit hard to focus on spy checking if the enemy team is dropping rockets and grenades and hails of boolets and ubers onto your lap. 1 unchecked spy can work a lot magic in sensitive moments like this.XT inc said:
Just keep playing and you'll learn to develop a "sixth sense" for detecting Spies. Here's some tips that might help:
1. ALWAYS look behind you every few seconds.
2. Unless the Spy is wearing the Saharan Spy set, decloaking with the Invisibility Watch or Cloak and Dagger will make a faint swishing noise if they're close to you. Train yourself to listen for that.
3. When a Dead Ringer Spy feigns death, the "corpse" instantly appears on the ground instead of taking a second to fall down.
4. If you see a Spy cloak, try to predict where he'll go. Most Spies will try to hide in a corner, so take a few potshots in these locations.
1. ALWAYS look behind you every few seconds.
2. Unless the Spy is wearing the Saharan Spy set, decloaking with the Invisibility Watch or Cloak and Dagger will make a faint swishing noise if they're close to you. Train yourself to listen for that.
3. When a Dead Ringer Spy feigns death, the "corpse" instantly appears on the ground instead of taking a second to fall down.
4. If you see a Spy cloak, try to predict where he'll go. Most Spies will try to hide in a corner, so take a few potshots in these locations.
If you're getting paranoid about spys, play Pyro and check corners. As long as you're careful, go into the less populated parts of the map and sweep it with flames. Spies usually don't try to backstab Pyros while they are spraying flames everywhere.
Check everyone on your team as well.
Check everyone on your team as well.
I'll try to keep these tips in mind when next I play and see if it helps; much more useful stuff here than I'd found on other random threads on the topic. Still not sure if i can pick out the sound of the decloaking over all the other battle sounds but I'll keep up an unhealthy obsession with corners.
It's pretty simple really,
1)Spy check anybody that looks even slightly suspicious, they might be running completely the wrong way, not even firing their gun or not seeming to take damage under enemy fire.
2) If you seem to be running into an invisible wall, it's a cloaked spy.
Spies are pretty harmless, only really good for sentry sapping, and most people that play spies tend to try and get a bunch of flashy back stab kills, and even the ones that are good at it don't get kills at the same level as pretty much every other class.
1)Spy check anybody that looks even slightly suspicious, they might be running completely the wrong way, not even firing their gun or not seeming to take damage under enemy fire.
2) If you seem to be running into an invisible wall, it's a cloaked spy.
Spies are pretty harmless, only really good for sentry sapping, and most people that play spies tend to try and get a bunch of flashy back stab kills, and even the ones that are good at it don't get kills at the same level as pretty much every other class.
Awww, you give the syringe gun no chance?4173 said:
Medics are actually really good at detecting spies in-base, because they have a rapid-fire weapon, and with the blutslager, you get a +health bonus when you hit an enemy that instantly tells you if you shot a spy.
whenever I feel like I feel like I bumped into something I tell my team and generally they find whatever spy was roaming around. I also have tendency to call out whenever I hear the dead ringer sound regardless of if I think it is a spy on my team. and one more thing once you play a map enough you get used to the usual spy ambush points and know to check there first.
all that being said a good spy is still frustrating as hell
all that being said a good spy is still frustrating as hell
I would stop playing engineer if you are new. Spies tend to target engies and their buildings, so I would advise playing medic. Sure, you become the biggest target for the enemy team, but you learn how to constantly strafe and dodge to avoid enemy fire. Never run straight in one direction. Always jump or do a quick turn to the side to frustrate spies.
Make sure that you keep away from walls and always look ahead at where the enemy is coming from.
When you hear a swishing sound, it's usually your own friendly spy disguising. Nothing to worry about.
Let the Pyros run ahead, they're much more useful on the front line.
Always have a dispenser further back, out of the way of your sentry; and always make sure you upgrade the teleporter by standing on top of it.
For Soldiers, rocket jump everywhere, all that low health lets you use your equalizer more effectively.
Spies are very much underpowered and need a boost to be effective.
From my experience, C&D spies like to hide in corners or on top of props that are out of the way so nobody would see them move unless they were intentionally checking for them (and lets face it not many people spy check). Be weary of your surroundings, your spy sense will develop as you play more and more, in the case of spawn killing I would suggest not running with your back facing in one direction for too long, continuously look around sometimes will let you see them move or even catch them off guard as they decloak for the attack. If all else fails call out to your team that there is a spy near the spawn room, this will usually bring a pyro or two looking to burn the spy down.galdon2004 said:
As for the sounds they do exist. The volume of the sound depends on the watch the spy is using, I wish I could find a sound clip of what you are looking for but at the moment I am unable due to my work computer not having speakers >.<. My best suggestion for this would be to go spy and listen to the noises made when they cloak and decloak just to familiarize yourself with them.
Note: I play CTF nearly exclusively, so that's where my perspective is coming from. Much of this transfers to other game modes, though.
First of all, if a spy is singling you out then its probably because you're making yourself an easy target. Unless you are a spy yourself, you shouldn't be attacking the enemy base by yourself. Provide the other team has halfway decent players, a lone person isn't going to accomplish much anyway. If you're attacking alone, then there's not much risk for the spy to uncloak and backstab you. If you're attacking alongside someone else, then things become much more risky for the spy. He'll either have to pick his spot very carefully, backstab you and hope he can also take out the other attacker(s) or get away before he's killed, or he'll let you pass and wait for an easier target.
Second, notice spy patterns. For example, I know pretty much every good hiding spot in 2fort. I know attack patterns and how to watch my own back while I'm defending. This is something that just comes with time, but it comes more quickly if you know what to look for. Check the corners when you go through doorways. Spies like to hide in corners a lot and take people out just as they are entering a new area.
Third, spy-check. This is what Pyros are best at (that and breaking up a Heavy-Medic combo with their compression blast). If you're defending in your own base, then it's often advantageous to stay in the same area as an Engie's buildings. Or you can patrol narrow hallways and try to block a Spy's way through. Pay attention to your team, they'll let you know if they are dealing with a Spy (I'll warn my team if there is one in the general area). Make sure you use the team chat to issue warnings. If you use the main chat and say, "Spy Pyro in base entrance", then the Spy will probably change his disguise and move elsewhere.
If you need to camp in an area for whatever reason, don't leave your back exposed (for example: I'll camp on the grates in my base in 2fort as a Demoman and continually have a sticky bomb trap set on the entrance. It's not the most exciting way to play, but it gets the job done. While doing this, I'll make sure my back is in the corner so that the spy can't backstab me). Being flat up against a wall doesn't protect you, but being in a corner will. You can also camp (and not be confined to a corner) if you stay within the range of one of your team's sentries. The spy can backstab you, but he'll be killed instantly by the sentry (unless he's using Your Eternal Reward. Dead Ringers can survive sometimes too, if they're good).
Keep at it and you'll improve. Don't listen to people who tell you to not play a certain class while you're new. You learn way better from doing.
First of all, if a spy is singling you out then its probably because you're making yourself an easy target. Unless you are a spy yourself, you shouldn't be attacking the enemy base by yourself. Provide the other team has halfway decent players, a lone person isn't going to accomplish much anyway. If you're attacking alone, then there's not much risk for the spy to uncloak and backstab you. If you're attacking alongside someone else, then things become much more risky for the spy. He'll either have to pick his spot very carefully, backstab you and hope he can also take out the other attacker(s) or get away before he's killed, or he'll let you pass and wait for an easier target.
Second, notice spy patterns. For example, I know pretty much every good hiding spot in 2fort. I know attack patterns and how to watch my own back while I'm defending. This is something that just comes with time, but it comes more quickly if you know what to look for. Check the corners when you go through doorways. Spies like to hide in corners a lot and take people out just as they are entering a new area.
Third, spy-check. This is what Pyros are best at (that and breaking up a Heavy-Medic combo with their compression blast). If you're defending in your own base, then it's often advantageous to stay in the same area as an Engie's buildings. Or you can patrol narrow hallways and try to block a Spy's way through. Pay attention to your team, they'll let you know if they are dealing with a Spy (I'll warn my team if there is one in the general area). Make sure you use the team chat to issue warnings. If you use the main chat and say, "Spy Pyro in base entrance", then the Spy will probably change his disguise and move elsewhere.
If you need to camp in an area for whatever reason, don't leave your back exposed (for example: I'll camp on the grates in my base in 2fort as a Demoman and continually have a sticky bomb trap set on the entrance. It's not the most exciting way to play, but it gets the job done. While doing this, I'll make sure my back is in the corner so that the spy can't backstab me). Being flat up against a wall doesn't protect you, but being in a corner will. You can also camp (and not be confined to a corner) if you stay within the range of one of your team's sentries. The spy can backstab you, but he'll be killed instantly by the sentry (unless he's using Your Eternal Reward. Dead Ringers can survive sometimes too, if they're good).
Keep at it and you'll improve. Don't listen to people who tell you to not play a certain class while you're new. You learn way better from doing.
that's the beauty of having a work computer dedicated only to sound (but has firefox on it anyway)Rhojin said:
it shows the sounds of spy cloaks, you can ignore the rest of the video since it's about why you shouldn't be able to customize your spy sounds (you shouldn't)
EDIT: be warned that the custom spy sound they make is very loud for obvious reasons please don't blow your ears out.
Ok, before I do begin allow me to say ignore the damn trolls who are saying it is your fault cause you must be a noobie to the game. Disgusting replies if you ask me and they do not help you in the slightest. If anything skip straight to Limecake, sorry if I butchered the name, as the actions outlined within will become second nature to yourself. I know, I spy check every one I see!
There are two more things to keep in mind.
The first is that TF2 is a giant game of rock ? paper ? scissors. If you are having trouble defeating spies as a soldier, it is because soldiers are not really designed to do anti-spy work. Lucky for you, soldiers are not the primary target of a spy. I would say keep moving, that is usually the best way to deal with a spy when you are a soldier. This will make them either choose a target they can get close to, such as an engineer or slow moving heavy, or deplete their cloak and become obvious.
If you are looking to become good at anti-spy work, and please please please do as I am an engineer by trade, then you need to focus on the more anti-spy classes such as the Pyro. You really do need the ability to just spray bullets over a wide area a spy could possibly be in to locate them. For that, Pyro is the best choice but even a good heavy can suffice.
The second thing to keep in mind is that a good player will screw you over every time. I have encountered many good spies as an engineer. A good spy will beat me 9 out of 10 times, even around spy checks, and I have to just accept that fact. Engineers are the primary targets for spies after all. If you come across a good player in TF2 all you can do is take your licks, accept that they are skilled at what they do, and focus on becoming as skilled as you can be at what YOU do.
I know you where looking for some good easy trick so you could detect spies every time, but short of cheating all you have is common sense outlined by Limecake coupled with choosing a anti-spy class or making yourself less viable a target. As others have pointed out: Spies are NOT the most deadly class out there and will likely only be a pain in the behind every now and then. Outside of a good team, and good luck finding that on pub. servers, a spy is useless.
As an engineer, I reserve the rights trade secrets and will NOT give you advice on how to be a good spy. There are a few tricks, both anti-spy and pro-spy, that I know and will be keeping to myself. Each anti-spy trick released is a way for them to work out how to get around it and I already hate spies sapping my stuff.
On a side note: Anyone else having pages half load today?
There are two more things to keep in mind.
The first is that TF2 is a giant game of rock ? paper ? scissors. If you are having trouble defeating spies as a soldier, it is because soldiers are not really designed to do anti-spy work. Lucky for you, soldiers are not the primary target of a spy. I would say keep moving, that is usually the best way to deal with a spy when you are a soldier. This will make them either choose a target they can get close to, such as an engineer or slow moving heavy, or deplete their cloak and become obvious.
If you are looking to become good at anti-spy work, and please please please do as I am an engineer by trade, then you need to focus on the more anti-spy classes such as the Pyro. You really do need the ability to just spray bullets over a wide area a spy could possibly be in to locate them. For that, Pyro is the best choice but even a good heavy can suffice.
The second thing to keep in mind is that a good player will screw you over every time. I have encountered many good spies as an engineer. A good spy will beat me 9 out of 10 times, even around spy checks, and I have to just accept that fact. Engineers are the primary targets for spies after all. If you come across a good player in TF2 all you can do is take your licks, accept that they are skilled at what they do, and focus on becoming as skilled as you can be at what YOU do.
I know you where looking for some good easy trick so you could detect spies every time, but short of cheating all you have is common sense outlined by Limecake coupled with choosing a anti-spy class or making yourself less viable a target. As others have pointed out: Spies are NOT the most deadly class out there and will likely only be a pain in the behind every now and then. Outside of a good team, and good luck finding that on pub. servers, a spy is useless.
As an engineer, I reserve the rights trade secrets and will NOT give you advice on how to be a good spy. There are a few tricks, both anti-spy and pro-spy, that I know and will be keeping to myself. Each anti-spy trick released is a way for them to work out how to get around it and I already hate spies sapping my stuff.
On a side note: Anyone else having pages half load today?
I'll second that...4173 said:
The primary job of a Medic is to heal people and more time spent Spy checking is the closer your team mate gets to death. It is not really possible for a Medic to stop healing every time there is a slight chance of a Spy being in the area, twice so as the threat of a Spy being in the area is a constant concern. Medics just have to pray that they have team mates that are actually team oriented and willing to watch their backs.
That isn't true at all. I use the Cloak and Dagger most of the time as a Spy (and, again, I'm a CTF player mainly). You can be a great help to your team just by getting inside and reporting what you see through the team chat. I can tell my team what the enemy's base defenses are like, what the weak spots are, etc. And then I can assist them when the attack starts. Grabbing the intel a bit early to draw enemies away from their main defenses, then have my team come in behind me to clean up while the enemies are distracted. You'd be surprised at the amount of havoc you can cause as a spy by grabbing the intel, walking a bit, then dropping it and decloaking. I can basically lead enemies into a trap.Grufflenark said:
When I'm being more offensive, I've trained myself to think backwards. I'm aware of where CnD Spies usually like to hide, so I just do something else. No one expects you to cloak and then stand in the middle of a room. Sometimes I start to run towards a corner just before I cloak and then change directions once I cloak. I'm definitely more of a support spy than an offensive spy, though.