Define: Games as Art

[MorganL4]

A few days back a guy in an english class made a post [link="{http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.320382-Pissed-at-my-English-teacher-justified?page=1}" here[/link] asking how he should proceed in regards to a paper he wrote the assigned topic " how art influenced my life" he wrote about Pokemon red version and got a bad grade because " games are not art" - English Teacher.... I posted a link to CNN where the supreme court ruling of "games ARE art" was reported. I also put in my two cents as did a guy who took the opposite view, he and I then did a quoted back and forth, and ultimately the question became " What IN games makes games art?"

if you want you can read our back and forth here:

Spoiler

I'll be the first to admit that little big planet looks better than Pokemon Red. However the ability of the Gameboy to render images and process user input in comparison to the PS3 is like comparing the Lotus to the model T and saying that one looks infinitely better and is thus more of a car.

It's not just about looking better, it's about putting real effort into having a unique aesthetic. I understand that's difficult to do with Game Boy games but to me at least that would mean you can't make a Game Boy game artistic and not that I should change my definition to allow for obsolete hardware. Pokemon Red looks essentially the same as any other game like that and I don't think you can pass that off as a hardware issue since Pokemon White looks just as generic.

are you saying that if I decide to copy the mona lisa then that invalidates the work of da Vinci? I mean we are talking about the FIRST gen of the game. Sure you could justifiably argue that for black and white or pearl or Soul Silver.... the list goes on. But Pokemon Gen 1 was the first of the franchise. (hence Gen 1) it was one of the first game boy games to require saving.... and it actually could only hold the one save file. They literally packed as much into that cartridge as modern day tech would allow (modern day being the 1990's). And as far as being unique goes? Can you name another game that had 150 different creatures to capture each with a unique set of abilities, multiple cities a plethora of items and the ability to trade and compete with friends that came before 1996? Because I can't... Though many have copied the concept in games since I can't think of one that came before.

I think Shin Megami Tensei did that first but still I think you missed my point. It had fairly unique game play that's true but when you're calling something art you don't look at its entertainment value, you look at its aesthetic and how thought-provoking it is. It's good entertainment but not art to me.

instead of going back and forth just he and I, I figured I'd put it to the community, now that the supreme court of the US has said "games are art" what about games makes that so? IS it the whole package is it the graphics, the uniqueness of the art style.... WHAT?

 

[enzilewulf]

Now friend I am not going to lie. I really don't see the "games are art thing". I mean not once while I was ever playing a game have I stopped to actually ponder what makes this game a piece of art. I honestly just find playing a video game to be relaxing and therapeutic. Maybe that is the art right there. If I had to guess though I would say it depends on genre. Horror games could be consider art on the atmosphere or pacing. While war games could be judged off game play and more novel games could be judged off story. The only problem with games that most genres of entertainment don't have is there is more to focus on in a game. While a book and movie has story that is what can make it, game play has a lot of merits. Graphics, story, game play, and atmosphere.

 

[Hero in a half shell]

Here's something I posted earlier today in another topic on the Escapist. It is quite relevant to this.

Within a Game you can find orchestral level soundtracks:


stunning visuals:

Spoiler: Dead Island

Spoiler: Crysis

Spoiler: Far Cry

Oscar worthy story moments: Modern Warfare's original nuke scene:
(Unfortunately much of the real impact of this moment is lost because the video medium it is shown in lacks the interactivity and therefore character investment you can get in games. That's right, I just said games have an artistic advantage towards film in creating empathy with protagonists, and are naturally therefore a better medium for getting across certain messages and themes.)

Other moments include (but are in no way limited to: FF7, Aeris' death, and in Knights Of The Old Republic, Revan's revelation

Literature level character development: (Cast of the Brothers In Arms Franchise)


and even political and Philosophical commentaries can be expressed in games: (Bioshock's take on Ayn Rand, Braid's twist on heroes and villains)

Although these individual elements all exist in different games, and there are compelling arguments as to why videogames aren't quite art yet, The argument for videogames being art is much stronger than most of what passes for "modern art" today.

Although I believe that while games contain an abundance of art, not all games are art, and I do find it hard to see what is artistic about the Pokemon Red game specifically.

 

[valleyshrew]

Games are more artistic than any other medium. They have exactly what films have, but with their own layer of interactivity and setting. Liberty city is a work of art, the architecture, the character design, the cars, the fashion, the advertisements, the radio stations. It's a nonsensical argument that games aren't art, because people still see games as toys or sport. Some games are toys, or sports but singleplayer games are generally as artistic as anything else.

 

[weker]

Art is generally when a form of media is proposing more then one emotion to different people, for instance if I play Bastion it could feel solitude, or joy. thus games = art, in the same way a picture can express multiple emotions for different people.

 

[RipRoaringWaterfowl]

What makes anything else art?

A lot.

Then realize the ones that span multiple mediums, which are the vast majority of the ones that can be named, apply to video games.

Plus, video games are interactive. It's a very novel thing.

 

[Domehammer]

Art can be random joe writes name on shovel he bought for five dollars. Now me personally I would use that shovel as a shovel not call it art but some people see it as art. Nowadays if one person thinks that is art it's art. Videogames are easily art when you have a soup can or a shovel be art.

 

[CrashBang]

A game is art because it is something devised and created by people to be enjoyed by people. Games take skill, time and patience to produce. Games consist of music, enjoyable aesthetics, interesting and engaging design and a story (an interactive one, no less).
I'm not sure how you can argue that games aren't art when they are made up of so many different elements which, individually, constitute as art or elements of art.

Games are art, this is a fact. They're created for the enjoyment of others on several levels. They appeal to the senses and engage an audience. They are art.

EDIT: The thread about the English teacher has kinda been and gone and I didn't notice it before so I'll just say this here. I'm a trainee English teacher. In about 8 months I'll be qualified and if I asked my pupils to write that essay and some used video games as their topic choice, I'd be very impressed.

 

[BreakfastMan]

This question confuses me. The definition of art is subjective and can change from person to person. What proves one thing to be art to one person might not to another. It is like asking someone "what makes something beautiful?". When you get right down to it, it is pretty much all subjective, which means any answer I or others could give wouldn't solve or prove anything.

Besides, one might as well ask what makes films, novels, or music art. Just try explaining that one.

 

[spartan231490]

The whole package which inspires emotion. Same thing as any other art.

 

[DarkRyter]

To create art is to create.

Someone had to draw Mario's moustache. Compose a theme song. Pick out mushroom colors. Design the layout of the level. Program the jump button. Put it all together.

Someone consciously made it, thus art.

Even, if you disagree with that definition (because you're a tool individual with stupid opinions), other mediums generally considered to be artistic (such as film or architecture) have such a great deal in common with video games as a medium, I can't think of a plausible reason to exclude them.

 

[Thaius]

Um... everything.

What makes film art? Visuals, story, music, writing, acting... many elements combine into one to create an art form. The same is said of radio, stage drama, and even literature.

Video games are art because they consist of many different art forms coming together not simply to create a collection of art, but a single, cohesive artwork wherein each artistic element gives added meaning to all the others. Though hardly a comprehensive definition, that is what makes many art forms actual art rather than a collection of art along the lines of a museum. Video games have art in them, and each artistic element grants meaning to each other element that would not exist if not for this combination.

 

[Kestor]

Dont forget, much like fine food, some will savor and really enjoy the way the flavor creeps out of some well made dishes, others will just stuff it down to fill their gullet, following with a big burp.
Games are so much like this, some will just bang through to the end as fast as they can without giving a thought, while others will take the time to admire the artists work, be it audio, visual or even the writing.
I remember playing American McGee's Alice for the first time, and just going wow, to all the level design and really out-there characters and atmosphere, it truly was a work of art, as the game was made by an artist.

Also dont forget, even all the established arts are very very subjective, Ive been to quite a few galleries, and what some people consider fine art, to me just looks like someone let their 5 year old loose on a canvas on the ground with buckets of paint, just utter crap in my opinion, but others see it differently...

 

[Thaius]

Although I believe that while games contain an abundance of art, not all games are art, and I do find it hard to see what is artistic about the Pokemon Red game specifically.

What we're talking about here is whether video games are an art form. You seem to be of the persuasion that only good art is even art in the first place, in which case yes, Pokemon Red is hardly the pinnacle of interactive art. But from the perspective viewing video games as an art form, each example of a video game is in fact a work of art, even if it's not a good work of art. Pokemon Red is an entertaining game with a wealth of depth in certain aspects of its world development and many very interesting elements. As a video game, it's good, and though it's not the most artistically deep example of the medium, it is good, and it is a video game, and video games are art, thus it is a good work of art.

 

[Jdb]

To me, art is synonymous with mastery. Whether it's a good or bad mastery is a different conversation.

 

[jessegeek]

As they are player-driven, so have to have some form of structure, the best way to judge video games as art would be to judge which fit a similar criterion to structured films and books that are judged as art.

Books as art tend to have a higher symbolic function above the narrative structure, which transcends and/or exemplifies the archetypes it uses to tell its story. The method of the delivery is well-structured (ie well-written) and causes a great emotional and/or cognitive response in the reader.

Art films combine a well-realised (not necessarily beautiful) aesthetic with well-acted characters, well-scripted dialogue and sound and scenery which again go above and beyond the norms of their chosen genre, causing the emotional/cognitive response as in the books.

Therefore: exemplars of the game world which demonstrate these qualities would be the 'art' games. Now the subjective part, imo the games I have played that I can class comfortably as art are Bioshock, Batman: Arkham Asylum, Silent Hill 2, Killer 7 and Alice: Madness Returns.

 

[Fieldy409_v1legacy]

I prefer to take games apart. I wouldnt call the physics engine art but a unique monster or character design or location could be considered art. There is art within the game but the entire game isn't art.