Did anyone else just watch the Dr Who finale?
- Thread starter Sillyrian
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Did not like it at all. Had the same problem most episode have had since Moffat took over. Nothing seems to happen for the first 30 mins and then the last 15 feel rushed. And what the hell was that speech Captain Boring (Danny) did at the end? They were all Cybermen at that point with no emotions. I guess it was there to make the audience feel something but all it did to me was make me cringe and hit the mute button.
The bit where Clara was prtending to be the Doctor simply made me roll my eyes and mute as well. I seriously belive at this point that if the BBC would let him, Moffat would simply have the Doctor regenerate into Clara.
And lastly did they have to kill off the Master again? Even if Moffat dosen't use him/her again the next guy will which means we will get yet another stupid reason as to why he/she suvived.
However as always I did love Capaldi as the Doctor. Just a shame he dosen't have better writing to work with.
The bit where Clara was prtending to be the Doctor simply made me roll my eyes and mute as well. I seriously belive at this point that if the BBC would let him, Moffat would simply have the Doctor regenerate into Clara.
And lastly did they have to kill off the Master again? Even if Moffat dosen't use him/her again the next guy will which means we will get yet another stupid reason as to why he/she suvived.
However as always I did love Capaldi as the Doctor. Just a shame he dosen't have better writing to work with.
Well thats all folks for this season, well almost the Christmas special is to come. A cleaver and emotional episode this week. Also, it was good note to end on the day before Remembrance Sunday. It felt right that things didn't quite end happily ever after. Some good nods to the past and nice appearance from an old friend.
Overall this series has been patchy and not all episodes have worked dramatically. However they served purpose and resolved some of internal conflict of the Dr. Personally I would prefer two 4 part stories per season but the needs of the international market drives to the 1 hour complete story, all be it with a loose story arc connecting them.
The one shining bright light all the way through is Capaldi's performance. It could only come from a ture Dr Who fan, there are enough elements of the past Drs in there but without becoming a pastiche. He obviously takes the reasonability of being the Dr very seriously. He received a letter from a 9 year old autistic boy and he sent the following as a reply
Overall this series has been patchy and not all episodes have worked dramatically. However they served purpose and resolved some of internal conflict of the Dr. Personally I would prefer two 4 part stories per season but the needs of the international market drives to the 1 hour complete story, all be it with a loose story arc connecting them.
The one shining bright light all the way through is Capaldi's performance. It could only come from a ture Dr Who fan, there are enough elements of the past Drs in there but without becoming a pastiche. He obviously takes the reasonability of being the Dr very seriously. He received a letter from a 9 year old autistic boy and he sent the following as a reply
There is another thread open about the episode but I will post what I said here as well.albino boo said:
Did not like it at all. Had the same problem most episode have had since Moffat took over. Nothing seems to happen for the first 30 mins and then the last 15 feel rushed. And what the hell was that speech Captain Boring (Danny) did at the end? They were all Cybermen at that point with no emotions. I guess it was there to make the audience feel something but all it did to me was make me cringe and hit the mute button.
The bit where Clara was prtending to be the Doctor simply made me roll my eyes and mute as well. I seriously belive at this point that if the BBC would let him, Moffat would simply have the Doctor regenerate into Clara.
And lastly did they have to kill off the Master again? Even if Moffat dosen't use him/her again the next guy will which means we will get yet another stupid reason as to why he/she suvived.
However as always I did love Capaldi as the Doctor. Just a shame he dosen't have better writing to work with.
I thought it was kinda crap. Firstly, the day is saved by the power of love? Shit, didn't see that one coming. Besides that, the Doctor never really does anything, he just gets carted about whilst various people tell him what they think of him. Making Cybermen fly was another goofy upgrade- Cybermen lose all their menace when they're not lumbering along. And yeah, Danny making a rousing speech to a bunch of people that A) He has under remote control and B) are having their emotions artificially suppressed was dumb as hell.
That speech on the day before the British nation commemorates the the members of the armed forces that died in service of country, nope emotional resonance there. Absolutely no reference whatsoever to George Orwell's statementGizmo1990 said:
Every villain in the Dr Who cannon has been destroyed more than once and yet they always come back with little or no explanation since the show started. Its not knew and its not Moffat, its what Dr Who has always done
Ok you don't like Moffat fine but each and every week you have made the same post, to be honest its like reading a UKIP supporter blaming everything on the EU. At least try and look at what's in front of you and see in the wider context of the 60 year show and real world events.
I hated it, and yet I know it'll receive glowing praise despite that.
first of all Moffat just doesn't get grief, the rest moves into spoiler territory so...
first of all Moffat just doesn't get grief, the rest moves into spoiler territory so...
there were a few good parts, the Doctor being made president of earth but the plot like the first half makes no sense at all there is no explanation for how the Master survived, no explanation of why the cybermen allied with her, and we still have the paradox of Danny's identical descendant meaning the universe should rip itself to shreds because Danny's now properly dead and Clara sure as hell isn't pregnant, and the "santa" saving throw at the end feels weak.
Killing off the Doctor's fan girl felt in many ways like a middle finger to the people who enjoyed 11's era, and we never got to see her mothers reaction and grief, it was needless cruel and petty, it fits for the Master but felt like a waste in story telling potential.
The conclusion felt forced killing the Master again will just raise even more questions when he/she inevitably returns again, and the inclusion of Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart as a cyberman saving the Doctor's "soul" felt like a bigger middle finger to the memory of Nicholas Courtney, it doesn't honour or respect the character, it felt cheap and tacky.
Danny's plot felt rushed, if they wanted us to feel sorry or understand his sacrifice to save the boy he killed then we should have had him as a companion and had that developed further his "sacrifice" to give the boy life again has no meaning because we as an audience barely know Danny pink, we never saw him and the boy interact enough to understand why the boy was more important than him, or why he couldn't move on past his grief.
Worse, this episode didn't answer the arc question, am I a good man? it tries to, but the answer is unsatisfying.
this could have been a great episode about grief and moving on, accepting sacrifice and honouring those that have died it but it devolved into a kill em all for cheap shocks, and once again the Doctor is sidelined to make it all about Clara.
Killing off the Doctor's fan girl felt in many ways like a middle finger to the people who enjoyed 11's era, and we never got to see her mothers reaction and grief, it was needless cruel and petty, it fits for the Master but felt like a waste in story telling potential.
The conclusion felt forced killing the Master again will just raise even more questions when he/she inevitably returns again, and the inclusion of Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart as a cyberman saving the Doctor's "soul" felt like a bigger middle finger to the memory of Nicholas Courtney, it doesn't honour or respect the character, it felt cheap and tacky.
Danny's plot felt rushed, if they wanted us to feel sorry or understand his sacrifice to save the boy he killed then we should have had him as a companion and had that developed further his "sacrifice" to give the boy life again has no meaning because we as an audience barely know Danny pink, we never saw him and the boy interact enough to understand why the boy was more important than him, or why he couldn't move on past his grief.
Worse, this episode didn't answer the arc question, am I a good man? it tries to, but the answer is unsatisfying.
this could have been a great episode about grief and moving on, accepting sacrifice and honouring those that have died it but it devolved into a kill em all for cheap shocks, and once again the Doctor is sidelined to make it all about Clara.
Fair enough about the speech, like I said I hit mute. The death thing I will also give you, but for every time the Master died in old who he also simply managed to run away before anyone could catch him.albino boo said:
You like it and I don't, thats fine. I really am glad that you and other continue to enjoy the show. But comparing me to a UKIP supporter thats just uncalled for
Personally I hated it. It was the worst of Moffat's era condensed into an hour, which is a complete shame because the premise was so good and the acting from Capaldi and Gomez was amazing.
It had all the cliches that have been so prevalent lately
-Companion making the Doctor practically useless
-A dangerous and menacing force that isn't dangerous or menacing
-Plot holes for the sake of fan service
3/10 in my opinion.
It had all the cliches that have been so prevalent lately
-Companion making the Doctor practically useless
-A dangerous and menacing force that isn't dangerous or menacing
-Plot holes for the sake of fan service
-IT'S THE POWER OF LOVE!
-Emotional ending that goes by faster than Sonic the Hedgehog
-The finale HAS to segue into the Christmas special no matter what the impact
-Emotional ending that goes by faster than Sonic the Hedgehog
-The finale HAS to segue into the Christmas special no matter what the impact
3/10 in my opinion.
Don't care about the episode, I care about Nick Frost as Santa Claus.
Okay, not entirely. But mostly. Anyway, as others have said it's the classic Moffat 30 minutes of not much happening with a great set up and then a rushed last bit. But to add to that, wasn't the Doctor's 'scheme' a bit superfluous? He had control of all the Cybermen himself, he didn't need Danny to do it for him. There was nothing stopping him from just turning to Missy and going "Well if you're going to give me control of all these Cybermen then I'll just use them to clean up the mess you made", was there? Maybe I wasn't paying attention.
Oh, and another thing that's struck me as fridge logic is the decision that Missy has to die. It seems like Clara just decides that she should, and... Yeah, the Doctor is completely down for that. Clara has every reason to really, really hate Missy so that's fine, but since when was the Doctor so easily talked into killing someone, especially the only other (free) surviving member of his species? Clara keeps getting her way, saying "Screw you Doctor", and for once he should have just said "Well screw you too, you don't get to decide who deserves to die".
Okay, not entirely. But mostly. Anyway, as others have said it's the classic Moffat 30 minutes of not much happening with a great set up and then a rushed last bit. But to add to that, wasn't the Doctor's 'scheme' a bit superfluous? He had control of all the Cybermen himself, he didn't need Danny to do it for him. There was nothing stopping him from just turning to Missy and going "Well if you're going to give me control of all these Cybermen then I'll just use them to clean up the mess you made", was there? Maybe I wasn't paying attention.
Oh, and another thing that's struck me as fridge logic is the decision that Missy has to die. It seems like Clara just decides that she should, and... Yeah, the Doctor is completely down for that. Clara has every reason to really, really hate Missy so that's fine, but since when was the Doctor so easily talked into killing someone, especially the only other (free) surviving member of his species? Clara keeps getting her way, saying "Screw you Doctor", and for once he should have just said "Well screw you too, you don't get to decide who deserves to die".
Typical Moffat big build up then half arsed bullshit resolution. Hey lets build a cyberman army then do nothing with it, and bring back the Master and have him not really actually do anything. The Doctor has always beaten his enemies with some pulled out his ass conversation strategy, but they used to be smart, not just 'because everybody loves each other, I win. yey happy time!'.
I highly doubt she's dead. She was teleporting around in the episode, so she almost certainly had some trick up her sleeve. She was far too casual about her execution.Gizmo1990 said:Fair enough about the speech, like I said I hit mute. The death thing I will also give you, but for every time the Master died in old who he also simply managed to run away before anyone could catch him.albino boo said:
You like it and I don't, thats fine. I really am glad that you and other continue to enjoy the show. But comparing me to a UKIP supporter thats just uncalled for
I hope when she returns it's not as the Big Bad for the series. The problem with the finales is you pretty much have to knock off the main villain otherwise it rings hollow... so we got finale after finale where the Daleks or Cybermen were defeated forever... until the next time they winked into existence with a bigger and more destructive plan... so they had to be destroyed once and for all.. until the next time...
And they explained The Master's survival... kind of. The last we saw of him, he was diving at Rassillon as Gallifrey went back in the Time Lock. With Gallifray saved, Missy's existence is one off-screen death and regeneration away. Broad strokes are there, I don't need the fine details.
I quite liked the first half of the finale, but didn't enjoy this episode. Too many holes, too weak a story.
There's no good reason for Cyber-Danny to be able to stop himself hurting Clara when his emotion inhibitor was turned off; there's no good reason for him to be able to make rousing speeches and make moral soldiery decisions. He was a Cyberman. The fluffy power of love shouldn't overcome that.
Newly-emerging Cybermen also looked rather silly wandering aimlessly around graveyards, rather than standing to attention as they should have done. They're bloody Cybermen!
Very little sense of gravitas this episode. Cybermen didn't seem threatening, because they didn't actually do anything except totter around a few steps when they emerged. Missy's death was undramatic.
Disappointed, on the whole, though it did have redeeming features. I liked Capaldi's reaction to finding Gallifrey wasn't at the co-ordinates at the end. I liked both Clara and the Doctor lying to one another in the restaurant.
There's no good reason for Cyber-Danny to be able to stop himself hurting Clara when his emotion inhibitor was turned off; there's no good reason for him to be able to make rousing speeches and make moral soldiery decisions. He was a Cyberman. The fluffy power of love shouldn't overcome that.
Newly-emerging Cybermen also looked rather silly wandering aimlessly around graveyards, rather than standing to attention as they should have done. They're bloody Cybermen!
Very little sense of gravitas this episode. Cybermen didn't seem threatening, because they didn't actually do anything except totter around a few steps when they emerged. Missy's death was undramatic.
Disappointed, on the whole, though it did have redeeming features. I liked Capaldi's reaction to finding Gallifrey wasn't at the co-ordinates at the end. I liked both Clara and the Doctor lying to one another in the restaurant.
So if all the Cybermen exploded in the sky to kill the nanobot rain, how come the Brigadier Cyberman didn't?
They didn't kill her, when she used the device to kill people it shot red, when she teleported out of the plane and when the point you're saying the doctor killed her was blue, remember, the doctor lies..Gizmo1990 said:
I've not been a fan of the storylines from late Smith to all of Capaldi's (which is a shame as he himself would make a cracking Doctor given the chance). The bad guys never have any real coverage or menace, the storyline's too busy focusing on Danny and Clara and The Doctors relationship that the monster of the week isn't given any chance to be intimidating or seemingly pose a real threat and then everything's resolved deus ex machina.
I always used to be sad that series are short and when they were over it was a long look forward to the next, now, meh, not really bothered.
They did kill her, but it wasn't the Doctor it was the Cyberman version of Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart though the Doctor for once was willing to, they took a cop out and had someone else do it.Sampler said:
That's why he saluted the cyberman, it was set up even if it was unbelievably stupid.