Diversty in GTA

[kilenem]

Franklin is the best original black character.

Bro, did you even CJ from San Andreas?

More to the point: GTA games are all about stereotypes. They are the prime example of satirical stereotyping. That's the point.

If you read some of the other post I talk about how GTA does stereo types but they also do social commentary. SOmeone brought up a comparison of GTA to the Simpsons because they were both satires on American Life. I think its alright if forms of media do stereo types of people but as long as the forms of media made it known they are self aware . I might have to replay San Andreas its been a while.

 

[kilenem]

No games with female leads? What planet are you from? you then say most games have male leads... Contradicting your previous statement. How is it unbalance? I see games with female characters that you can play all around me. Every fallout, 2 out of 3 mass effects, tomb raider, saints row 2-4. Both left for deads. I got that last info from the front page which you obviously didn't read while you were rushing to write me a reply.

Do a little experiment, disregarding games where you can customize the gender of your characters, name every game you can think of that has a female lead.

That's not very hard, I bet you could get maybe 5 or even 10 if you looked hard enough.

Now do another test and write every game that has a male lead.
That may take you a while.

The mere fact that one might take you less than a minute and the other is an impossible task should tell you just what an imbalance it is.

(side question: why do you think only 2 out of 3 mass effect games let you play as a woman?)

Aren't their like more ten meteoroid games. I know what you mean but even if you were saying one per franchise um Lora croft, Beyond Good and Evil, Do the resident evil games count sense you change protagonist, The giana sisters, Wet, Remember me, Assassin's creed liberation, Mrs. Pac man, Mirrors edge, Lolly Pop chain saw, Meteoroid. Know name ten black protagonist.

 

[kilenem]

If you read some of the other post I talk about how GTA does stereo types but they also do social commentary. SOmeone brought up a comparison of GTA to the Simpsons because they were both satires on American Life. I think its alright if forms of media do stereo types of people but as long as the forms of media made it known they are self aware . I might have to replay San Andreas its been a while.

I'd say the difference is that GTA manages to enforce stereotypes rather than the Simpsons which breaks it down and pokes fun at the ideas.

I think COD and GTA are they only games were a Russian is the protagonist. I'm guessing Niko is Russian. In most forms media TV, film and video games Russians are the bad guys. The radio stations poke fun at a lot music and the talk show host. During hte whole game GTA is making fun of the target demographic through Micheal son. He calls him lazy he dosen't do anything all day but play video games . They complain about millennials through the whole game. Franklin has to check Micheal and Trevor on that and tell them that more or less a middle class thing.

Edit: Forgot about the Metro Series you are Russian in those games

 

[sweetylnumb]

I always though its odd that Rock Star gets flak for not havering women as playable characters but isn't given props for having characters who aren't white Americans. Franklin is the best original black character. His dialogue is great and he isn't some cookie cutter stereotype. Most black characters in video games look like they are on steroids or they are comic relief. Specially if you look at black people in Japanese games. I cringe every time i see a black person in a Japanese game.

If we look at some of the other protagonist in GTA like we have people of Italian decent, Chinese decent and Niko Bellic is probably of Russian Decent. I don't think Rock star has a problem with diversity as much as other companies. I know its sucks for women that most of your characters look s like a barbies but most characters who aren't white American males have the same character type or little variation. Its not just women who have the same art design so we should give praise to a company breaking the norm.

BUT THEY AREN'T GIRLS AND SINCE THEY AREN'T GIRLS IT IS OKAY TO *****! THEY ARE SEXIST ASSHOLES! FUCK THEM FUCK THEM FUCK THEM FUCK THEM FUCK THEM. <-- Major Exaggeration of how people act over this.

That is all I get from the forums as of late. I agree completely with you, but many seem so insistent that a game has to have a playable ugly gay female character they are sexist. I really do hate this trend and hope it dies off quickly.

*FLAMESHIELD ACTIVATE*

Yeah you do realize people only wondered about there being no female protagonist? there was hardly a rage about it. What people DID rage about was how horrible the rest of the game was towards women. And of course "its GTA what did you expect" is true, but then why is it so wrong to point it out, if everyone already knows?

 

[sweetylnumb]

I always though its odd that Rock Star gets flak for not havering women as playable characters but isn't given props for having characters who aren't white Americans. Franklin is the best original black character. His dialogue is great and he isn't some cookie cutter stereotype. Most black characters in video games look like they are on steroids or they are comic relief. Specially if you look at black people in Japanese games. I cringe every time i see a black person in a Japanese game.

If we look at some of the other protagonist in GTA like we have people of Italian decent, Chinese decent and Niko Bellic is probably of Russian Decent. I don't think Rock star has a problem with diversity as much as other companies. I know its sucks for women that most of your characters look s like a barbies but most characters who aren't white American males have the same character type or little variation. Its not just women who have the same art design so we should give praise to a company breaking the norm.

Also,a black male character that talks in thick urban dialect, owns a scary dog, lives in a slum, and happens to be a criminal, is an original and worthy black character?

Maybe i stepped into a parallel universe where all black men are corporate leaders and speak like Indiana Jones villains.

 

[sweetylnumb]

I always though its odd that Rock Star gets flak for not havering women as playable characters but isn't given props for having characters who aren't white Americans. Franklin is the best original black character. His dialogue is great and he isn't some cookie cutter stereotype. Most black characters in video games look like they are on steroids or they are comic relief. Specially if you look at black people in Japanese games. I cringe every time i see a black person in a Japanese game.

If we look at some of the other protagonist in GTA like we have people of Italian decent, Chinese decent and Niko Bellic is probably of Russian Decent. I don't think Rock star has a problem with diversity as much as other companies. I know its sucks for women that most of your characters look s like a barbies but most characters who aren't white American males have the same character type or little variation. Its not just women who have the same art design so we should give praise to a company breaking the norm.

Also,a black male character that talks in thick urban dialect, owns a scary dog, lives in a slum, and happens to be a criminal, is an original and worthy black character?

Maybe i stepped into a parallel universe where all black men are corporate leaders and speak like Indiana Jones villains.

Franklin wanted to change his lot in life and make something of himself,that makes him pretty original to me.

You know how horrible that sounds right? Oh yeah hes a typical black guy but OH he wants to be a good person and actually be a worthy member of society HOW ORIGINAL

Not implying your racist or anything, just kind of supports my point :/

 

[sweetylnumb]

I always though its odd that Rock Star gets flak for not havering women as playable characters but isn't given props for having characters who aren't white Americans. Franklin is the best original black character. His dialogue is great and he isn't some cookie cutter stereotype. Most black characters in video games look like they are on steroids or they are comic relief. Specially if you look at black people in Japanese games. I cringe every time i see a black person in a Japanese game.

If we look at some of the other protagonist in GTA like we have people of Italian decent, Chinese decent and Niko Bellic is probably of Russian Decent. I don't think Rock star has a problem with diversity as much as other companies. I know its sucks for women that most of your characters look s like a barbies but most characters who aren't white American males have the same character type or little variation. Its not just women who have the same art design so we should give praise to a company breaking the norm.

Also,a black male character that talks in thick urban dialect, owns a scary dog, lives in a slum, and happens to be a criminal, is an original and worthy black character?

Maybe i stepped into a parallel universe where all black men are corporate leaders and speak like Indiana Jones villains.

Franklin wanted to change his lot in life and make something of himself,that makes him pretty original to me.

You know how horrible that sounds right? Oh yeah hes a typical black guy but OH he wants to be a good person and actually be a worthy member of society HOW ORIGINAL

Not implying your racist or anything, just kind of supports my point :/

Considering I'm 50% black I don't see how my post was racist.All I'm saying is Franklin is not like the stereotypical black guy that is portrayed in media because he actually wants to make something of himself and not be a gangster from the hood.

I suppose your right, its just kind of sad that that's what considered to be a well written black character, everything bad the media tells us about black people with his only not shit quality being that he doesn't want to be so bad. Its like the guy off the walking dead who is perfectly lovely but oh of COERCE he's a convicted murderer because otherwise he'd be too white for a black guy.

Anyway, im a)female and b) white so i'm probably wrong about everything im saying here.

 

[Bix96]

Why there exists this idea that audiences can't connect with characters who arn't white and male is beyond me. Did anyone play walking dead and throw the controller to the ground saying "A black character?! I just can't get into this!"

I think that's a very good point and if falls in line with what I have been telling people since the whole thing started, I honestly don't think anyone has a problem playing as a set gender/race if the story calls for it...why then do we see this getting brought up so often? I think when this sexism debate blew up there was a lot of confusion and misconceptions between two sides that suddenly started drawing battle lines and no matter your view on this you fell into one side or the other so "artistic integrity" got lumped in with "I hate women" and "want more female leads" got bunched up with "every game ever is sexist."

These companies don't care about any of use on an individual level and they don't care if we think these games are sexist or not all they want is our money so we accomplish nothing by siting here nitpicking and arguing about every game that is released. What gamers NEED to do is stop this petty squabbling and band together and show the games industry that we all want more female leads because diversity can only ever be a good thing.

 

[EternallyBored]

I always though its odd that Rock Star gets flak for not havering women as playable characters but isn't given props for having characters who aren't white Americans. Franklin is the best original black character. His dialogue is great and he isn't some cookie cutter stereotype. Most black characters in video games look like they are on steroids or they are comic relief. Specially if you look at black people in Japanese games. I cringe every time i see a black person in a Japanese game.

If we look at some of the other protagonist in GTA like we have people of Italian decent, Chinese decent and Niko Bellic is probably of Russian Decent. I don't think Rock star has a problem with diversity as much as other companies. I know its sucks for women that most of your characters look s like a barbies but most characters who aren't white American males have the same character type or little variation. Its not just women who have the same art design so we should give praise to a company breaking the norm.

Also,a black male character that talks in thick urban dialect, owns a scary dog, lives in a slum, and happens to be a criminal, is an original and worthy black character?

Maybe i stepped into a parallel universe where all black men are corporate leaders and speak like Indiana Jones villains.

Franklin wanted to change his lot in life and make something of himself,that makes him pretty original to me.

You know how horrible that sounds right? Oh yeah hes a typical black guy but OH he wants to be a good person and actually be a worthy member of society HOW ORIGINAL

Not implying your racist or anything, just kind of supports my point :/

Considering I'm 50% black I don't see how my post was racist.All I'm saying is Franklin is not like the stereotypical black guy that is portrayed in media because he actually wants to make something of himself and not be a gangster from the hood.

By make something of himself, you mean content with being a big time bank robber? that's kind of his whole story arc he talks about getting out of the hood and making something of himself, but he still ends up as a sociopathic thug that just rolls with professional thieves rather than ghetto gangbangers, it's not exactly a massive character transition. He's basically every black stereotype in existence cranked up to 11, even the, "I wanna get out of the hood and make something of myself" is a cliche at this point, practically every line that comes out of his mouth when talking about the hood feels like its ripped off from a thousand gangbanger movies, t.v. shows, and even video games. He's basically a less characterized version of CJ from San Andreas.

To be fair, I think that is kind of the point Rockstar was going for, pretty much every character is an exaggeration or a parody to some extent. I just don't get where your coming from with this idea that Franklin's desire to better himself is somehow unique, the gangbanger with dreams of getting out of the hood is a well worn character archetype at this point. Even at the end Franklin basically fails to better himself anyway, he's still a crook, he's just got more powerful friends now, and he still jumps back to the hood life to help Lamar whenever he asks, so he even failed in really escaping the hood.

 

[mokes310]

Franklin is the best original black character.

Bro, did you even CJ from San Andreas?

More to the point: GTA games are all about stereotypes. They are the prime example of satirical stereotyping. That's the point.

If you read some of the other post I talk about how GTA does stereo types but they also do social commentary. SOmeone brought up a comparison of GTA to the Simpsons because they were both satires on American Life. I think its alright if forms of media do stereo types of people but as long as the forms of media made it known they are self aware . I might have to replay San Andreas its been a while.

If you have to explain the joke, it loses its impact. Ergo, GTA would be less effective a media if Rockstar came out and explained that, "no, we don't truly believe people are like this, etc..."

Stereo types are different from stereotypes, just fyi...

 

[Saelune]

I dont think they deserve flak, but Id love a female protagonist in the next GTA. I also want them to forever keep the multi-protagonist system...and I want the female character to be off her lid like Trevor. Alot of types of people have not been featured as GTA protagonists too, but we arent all freaking out. Personally, youd think NOT being portrayed as a criminal would be preffered. As much as you may root for them, the people you play as in GTA deserve life in jail, or a seat in the chair.

 

[WolfThomas]

I like the three characters interactions but a female character could work, especially now with multiple characters. Heck someone like Taliana Martinez the crew member you can find, she'd work just as a getaway driver character like Franklin.