DMing advice needed.
- Thread starter bdcjacko
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Depends. You can't set up an unlosable situation. If the dice really decide to butt rape the players, then someone will probably end up dead. Actively attempting to kill your players is a horrid idea and they will soon grow tired. There are a few Gigax setups that are basically character meat grinders and if you really want to, feel free to play those. Boss battles can kill off or injure a character, but remember that narrative is better than gameplay. If you want to, feel free to stretch the rules a tiny bit for the sake of a good narrative or character. An example I like is from Counter Monkeys, where one of the people in his D&D got killed by the Scorpion Queen. Instead of killing him off, he offered a way out, a curse. This gave the character more motivation and whatnot.
The gist of what I am trying to say, is that you have to be fair. Yes, if anyone is dying, it will be because either you set a death trap, or the dice gods decided to smite sir dies-a-lot. Don't make the adventure too easy, but don't make it brutalizingly hard either.
The gist of what I am trying to say, is that you have to be fair. Yes, if anyone is dying, it will be because either you set a death trap, or the dice gods decided to smite sir dies-a-lot. Don't make the adventure too easy, but don't make it brutalizingly hard either.
depending on what edition you're playing I can help you more, but in any case, add unexpected traps into dungeons that have a good chance of injuring the characters(the middle of a fight, have the fighter charging across the field at the necro casting spells suddenly make a Dex/Reflex/etc. check with a pretty steep modifier or fall into a pit of pungee sticks. Go look up Grimlock's(it may be Grimtooth's) trap book, it has some seriously lethal trap ideas and more than one both the players and the GM can laugh about.
Now, I'll just tell you the way I'd deal with it, have the Necros instead start sending out skeletal messengers or whatever instead of themselves, or have the air vibrate with magical energy as the ground around the entrance explodes in a flurry of undead jumping out of their resting places. If you're having trouble with thief's and and their little sneak attack killing your necros that come out for whatever reason, flood the area with light spells, so that their sneakiness is rendered a bit moot with their shadow being cast ten miles long. Patrolling baddies that they can't take on at their level, bone golems or something.
Or make up an entirely new monster, I'll give you an idea I had for mine, and it fits most necro holds, the Refuse "Shit" Golem, ten feet tall, each time you hit it, they have to take a test to see if they can hold the puke in from the stuff that stick to their weapon when they pull it out.Each time it hits them, there's a good chance that it grabs ahold of them and sticks them into it's body, where they have five turns before they get sucked in and then another five before they suffocate, either way, they come out of it sickened and refuse to wear their armor until it has been cleaned, polished, and then cleaned again, but the smell will persist FOREVER. Very effective against people saving money and spending it all on their armor, especially thieves, since their ability to sneak attack is greatly reduced. The only way to cause lasting damage to it is to set fire to it, which causes it to explode when it hits 0 and everyone spends the next hour loudly retching, drawing major attention to their area.
Now, I'll just tell you the way I'd deal with it, have the Necros instead start sending out skeletal messengers or whatever instead of themselves, or have the air vibrate with magical energy as the ground around the entrance explodes in a flurry of undead jumping out of their resting places. If you're having trouble with thief's and and their little sneak attack killing your necros that come out for whatever reason, flood the area with light spells, so that their sneakiness is rendered a bit moot with their shadow being cast ten miles long. Patrolling baddies that they can't take on at their level, bone golems or something.
Or make up an entirely new monster, I'll give you an idea I had for mine, and it fits most necro holds, the Refuse "Shit" Golem, ten feet tall, each time you hit it, they have to take a test to see if they can hold the puke in from the stuff that stick to their weapon when they pull it out.Each time it hits them, there's a good chance that it grabs ahold of them and sticks them into it's body, where they have five turns before they get sucked in and then another five before they suffocate, either way, they come out of it sickened and refuse to wear their armor until it has been cleaned, polished, and then cleaned again, but the smell will persist FOREVER. Very effective against people saving money and spending it all on their armor, especially thieves, since their ability to sneak attack is greatly reduced. The only way to cause lasting damage to it is to set fire to it, which causes it to explode when it hits 0 and everyone spends the next hour loudly retching, drawing major attention to their area.
No, never try to intentionally kill characters. Remember, they are the main characters in the story. And your players will hate you. There is a reason nobody liked Superman 64. and that reason is because it felt more like punishment than gaming.
I would say the goal of the DM is to challenge your players, but give them a feeling of accomplishment when they complete the dungeon/quest/module whatever.
I would say the goal of the DM is to challenge your players, but give them a feeling of accomplishment when they complete the dungeon/quest/module whatever.
They are basically done with the necromancer quest for now and found an evil book of Vecna in the necromancer's fort. Not quiet sure how I want to handle that. But maybe they don't get back to town before I kill off their hirer city guards which will then make the city not trust them.Redryhno said:
I think the book is going to be like monster allure bait that will bring more monsters after them not giving them any time to rest.
You could have the book drive whoever's holding it insane. It could get bad enough that one party member has to fight the restbdcjacko said:
I think the one holding it already died once at the end of the last session our first dm did before he move away. The character had just started and her husband was playing the character at the time. So when I took over she magically...we divinely was ressurected. I would feel bad about turning her insane. But they will probably need to destroy the book in a magical way. Who ever ends up doing it might get cursed. Suggestions?
Have its mind infect whoever destroyed it maybe? If there's one way to kill off a party, its to divide it.bdcjacko said:
Your job isn't to kill them. If being a DM is a job, it isn't right. DMing is about having fun, and if your the only one having fun then your not gonna have players very long. There is a balance of difficulty you have to strike with them. You should want it to be challenging, but if they are coming to near death at every turn it is probably a bit to hard.
I not saying to you can't kill your players, especially if they do something incredibly stupid. That should be reserved for punishment.
That is my opinion at least.
I not saying to you can't kill your players, especially if they do something incredibly stupid. That should be reserved for punishment.
That is my opinion at least.
What you have said is perfect. Challenge them, and make them feel like they have earned their victories.Hussmann54 said:
Sounds like youre new to DMing, and itll take time, im sure youll learn just as the players will. But never intentionally gun down a character. Thats not very fun for anyone.
I'll say, if they're seeing chinks in your story/plot/setup/etc., then start intentionally leaving 2 or 3 chinks in it, and when/if they exploit them, make sure you have the back-up that really messes with them, maybe not kill one of them, but make it unpleasant.
As for the Book Break you're talking about, you could make it a bit of a long arc, with them first having to find an artifact to destroy it. Give them a choice, either going after a shard of the Sword of Kas(Vecna's homebody if you don't know/remember, just say that it was destroyed in a battle against St. Cuthbert, or...it's been years since I played in Greyhawk...uh...Pelor maybe and that parts of it have been recovered by his worshippers) OR, they can go after the easier of the two, and go on a holy war against Iuz, with the intention of getting Cuthbert's favor and get him to destroy the book, which incidentally, could also get them out of trouble with the city guards that are angry at them. I've found that giving your players at the very least the illusion of choice very effective.
The Curse, on the other hand, could grant them the attention of Vecna(or they become inundated with a part of his magic/soul). Not always necessarily bad, but not good either. Critical miss, make up a table of six possibilities, which you then have them roll on, behind your GM screen of course, with 1-5 being varying levels of bad shit - lightning bolt strikes the nearest thing, ally or enemy, with half the power of their combined levels, A flamestrike centered on the character, A Bigby's Interposing hand blocking them with the worst possible consequences that you can see, that kind of thing - with a roll of SIX doing nothing, just a regular critical miss, however you handle them in your games. Of course, followers of Vecna are immune to the effects.
Just trying to give you ideas, but with combat, I advise you to use every dirty trick in the book, go into each situation with the intention of, at the very least, seriously injuring the party. My players keep coming back despite there being other options around them, so it works for me.
As for the Book Break you're talking about, you could make it a bit of a long arc, with them first having to find an artifact to destroy it. Give them a choice, either going after a shard of the Sword of Kas(Vecna's homebody if you don't know/remember, just say that it was destroyed in a battle against St. Cuthbert, or...it's been years since I played in Greyhawk...uh...Pelor maybe and that parts of it have been recovered by his worshippers) OR, they can go after the easier of the two, and go on a holy war against Iuz, with the intention of getting Cuthbert's favor and get him to destroy the book, which incidentally, could also get them out of trouble with the city guards that are angry at them. I've found that giving your players at the very least the illusion of choice very effective.
The Curse, on the other hand, could grant them the attention of Vecna(or they become inundated with a part of his magic/soul). Not always necessarily bad, but not good either. Critical miss, make up a table of six possibilities, which you then have them roll on, behind your GM screen of course, with 1-5 being varying levels of bad shit - lightning bolt strikes the nearest thing, ally or enemy, with half the power of their combined levels, A flamestrike centered on the character, A Bigby's Interposing hand blocking them with the worst possible consequences that you can see, that kind of thing - with a roll of SIX doing nothing, just a regular critical miss, however you handle them in your games. Of course, followers of Vecna are immune to the effects.
Just trying to give you ideas, but with combat, I advise you to use every dirty trick in the book, go into each situation with the intention of, at the very least, seriously injuring the party. My players keep coming back despite there being other options around them, so it works for me.
No, your job as a GM is not to kill your players, your job as a GM is to give them a good game. How you go about that depends on who you are dealing with. You don't throw Tomb of Horrors at a group that mostly enjoys player interactions and roleplaying, and I wouldn't advise having a group that enjoys hack and slash be put into a political intrigue situation.
Make sure the challenge is legitimate. Earlier on, you can try to go easy on them, but as they progress, make death a real option. Your players need to understand that the challenge is for their own good. The sense of accomplishment they'll feel when they get to the treasure room after having just survived a really hard boss battle will be easily ten times greater than if you'd just let them waltz in there.
Rule of thumb: Be fair, but be cunning is the way I think about it when DMing. I might be every NPC, but I always imagine that I'm the bad guy first and foremost to make sure that the challenge I present them with is actually a true challenge.
Rule of thumb: Be fair, but be cunning is the way I think about it when DMing. I might be every NPC, but I always imagine that I'm the bad guy first and foremost to make sure that the challenge I present them with is actually a true challenge.