I think it was established in an interview with the main writer for the story. Some people will decry it as non-canon considering it wasn't established in game, but then again I don't think it was ever established that she was heterosexual in the game.archiebawled said:
Do we need more LGBTQ+ protagonists in video games?
- Thread starter Swarles
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Don't worry, us gay folks have been taking control of straight white guys for ages now and we're still gaming!NuclearKangaroo said:
Don't know about the word 'need', but it would certainly be very nice. If only for diversity's sake. I don't need a gay character to identify with, but it's just nice to see once in a while. Just as it's nice when some celebrity comes out. It doesn't change my world profoundly but it's still good.
To be fair, nothing really makes me role my eyes harder than "the token character." They're usually bland boring and range from mildly to very offensive depending on how much of a stereotype it is.Colour Scientist said:
The black guy trope in movies is just painful
OT: I don't think we need any... I mean what are we basing the need off of? But I do want to see more perspectives in stories.
I mean I love games with the "30 somethings white dude." Not just the games, but what they've done with those characters too.
You have your pretty boys, gruff stoic guys, badass marines, cocky spitfucks. It's great. It's a well represented demographic in the positive sense of the word.
I want more Clementines and Sten's. I want more Tali's, Samus's, and Lee's (Hell, Kenny too since you don't see actual non stereotyped really southerners that much). I want people with different experiences and philosophies because they're interesting.
I mean... that's it really. I'm not the type to look at a character and see or want a nebulous idea of progress. I don't really care if I'm not interested in the ideas or story of someone.
...so in short yeah kind of. It'd be good to see some new ideas.
...Such as? Barring having the protagonist suffer from prejudice against his/her sexuality[footnote]Not to be dismissive of those troubles, mind you. It's just that considering that kind of thing results in a disproportionately high suicide rate for LGBT youth that's the kind of material that I'd imagine developers would be very cautious about including.[/footnote], what stories can videogames with LGBT protagonists tell that stories without LGBT protagonists cannot?Swarles said:
haha ok mate i totally understand your point, just bringing that up, personally id feel a tiny bit unconfortable controlling a gay character, atleast if some romantic stuff is brought up, but thats just me, im not really agaisnt the ideaNimcha said:
women, LBTQ, i dunno aliens, whatever, more character diversity would be nice, if they are well-written and have a reason to exist
I don't know about we, but I certainly need more LGBTQ(insert letters here) protagonists because if I have to see another ham-fisted romance subplot between 30 year old white male John Doe with big_breasted_babe#7612 one more time, something is going to end up being broken. People complain that gay people shove their sexuality in media yet I've yet to see any well-written and believable LGBTQ+ characters in video games who aren't either side-lined, tertiary to the plot, or stereotypes. It doesn't help that optional relationships in most games feel superficial either. Just simply having your generic brown-haired, gruff, daily man get the guy instead of the girl for once would be an improvement.
the main character from gone home, kanji tatsumi and nNaoto shirogane from persona 4, ellie from the last of us, they are few but they are not non-existanterttheking said:
Correction: We need well-written and interesting LGBTQ protagonists.
As countless others have said before me, just crow-barring in an LGBTQ character is just cheap and pointless. All it would serve to do is to check off a list of pre-requisites.
What matters is how much of a character a protagonist is first. If they're LGBTQ, then it's a bonus.
As countless others have said before me, just crow-barring in an LGBTQ character is just cheap and pointless. All it would serve to do is to check off a list of pre-requisites.
What matters is how much of a character a protagonist is first. If they're LGBTQ, then it's a bonus.
Wait, how is Naoto LGBT? She's just a crossdresser, that's not exactly LGBT. And Kanji isn't a protagonist.NuclearKangaroo said:
Fair enough with Ellie though.
I hate threads like this
(Why'd you click on it?)
shut up that's why...
Do we need more... well it's not like we'll die with out them.
would I like to see some? Sure! Why not.
but as this new console generation of gaming gets under way, I'd much rather see a game that's just fun to play.
(I mean one that's fun to play and not developed by Telltale)
not a single game that's been announced looks fun to play. so the protagonist could be the gayest transsexual minority ever and I still wouldn't care.
Did I really out grow video games?
I'm old, fuck me...
(Why'd you click on it?)
shut up that's why...
Do we need more... well it's not like we'll die with out them.
would I like to see some? Sure! Why not.
but as this new console generation of gaming gets under way, I'd much rather see a game that's just fun to play.
(I mean one that's fun to play and not developed by Telltale)
not a single game that's been announced looks fun to play. so the protagonist could be the gayest transsexual minority ever and I still wouldn't care.
Did I really out grow video games?
I'm old, fuck me...
Eh...to be perfectly honest I'm not sure. I'll have to look it up. Forgive my confusion, it's just that some people like to claim that Naoto is transexual when I feel that that is factually incorrect.NuclearKangaroo said:
i dont know eithererttheking said:
tough technically SHE WANTS to be a man
i do admit Atlus kind of chickened out with both characters, but personally i still think they are good characters, particulary kanji
I think it's less she wants to be a man and more that she just wants to be accepted. They are both good characters though.NuclearKangaroo said:
I thought the entire point of her story was that she wouldn't let herself believe that women could do the job she does and she's supposed to be a man, not that she actually wanted to be.NuclearKangaroo said:
Yeah, I suppose we do. Only 14 year old Call of Duty players would be the type to complain about it.
That said, A CHARACTER'S SEXUALITY SHOULD NOT BE THEIR DEFINING FEATURE.
Unless the story involves an active love interest (which many don't), a character's sexuality should only, if at all, be mentioned in passing. Shit, any character that hasn't been mentioned as straight could easily be gay (or bi or trans), since it doesn't change the plot at all. Lara Croft or Sergeant Johnson (from Halo) could be gay or trans for all we know. And we shouldn't know, barring some random letters or whatever if they happen to be scattered around the map.
Seriously, who the fuck cares. Not the majority of gamers (excluding immature dudebros that probably only play WoW or CoD and little else, like the flipside SJW army that ignores the numerous indie games that feature well-written female or gay protagonists just because they aren't AAA games).
We're already stuck with the myth that characters in Japanese games are white, when they are in fact, surprise, Japanese in the majority of cases. See: Animal Crossing, where some people got in a tizzy because they couldn't be black, not recognizing that they can't be white, either.
(Side note: Why do so many incoming gamers think that they need characters to be like them just to project themselves onto them? I loved playing as Joanna Dark in Perfect Dark or Faith from Mirror's Edge and easily projected myself onto them, as I have numerous other non-white or non-male characters. It really isn't that big of a deal unless you *want* it to be a big deal).
That said, A CHARACTER'S SEXUALITY SHOULD NOT BE THEIR DEFINING FEATURE.
Unless the story involves an active love interest (which many don't), a character's sexuality should only, if at all, be mentioned in passing. Shit, any character that hasn't been mentioned as straight could easily be gay (or bi or trans), since it doesn't change the plot at all. Lara Croft or Sergeant Johnson (from Halo) could be gay or trans for all we know. And we shouldn't know, barring some random letters or whatever if they happen to be scattered around the map.
Seriously, who the fuck cares. Not the majority of gamers (excluding immature dudebros that probably only play WoW or CoD and little else, like the flipside SJW army that ignores the numerous indie games that feature well-written female or gay protagonists just because they aren't AAA games).
We're already stuck with the myth that characters in Japanese games are white, when they are in fact, surprise, Japanese in the majority of cases. See: Animal Crossing, where some people got in a tizzy because they couldn't be black, not recognizing that they can't be white, either.
(Side note: Why do so many incoming gamers think that they need characters to be like them just to project themselves onto them? I loved playing as Joanna Dark in Perfect Dark or Faith from Mirror's Edge and easily projected myself onto them, as I have numerous other non-white or non-male characters. It really isn't that big of a deal unless you *want* it to be a big deal).
Yes and no.
Demanding more LGBT protagonists, even more so than demanding more female protagonists, is getting way ahead of where the majority of the industry is at. We need better writing and more interesting characters first. Once games by and large have a level of writing that exceeds a Seagal vehicle and we have protagonists with a personality then LGBT and female protagonists will surely follow.
If devs start writing shitty, dull LGBT protagonits they will still be shitty, dull protagonists. Either people are going to whine that it's gratuitous and tacked-on, or people are going to whine that it's an embarrassing stereotype of LGBT people. Either way, a poorly written LGBT character is a lose-lose situation. If you want good LGBT characters, stop demanding them right now, and start demanding a decent level of writing.
Seriously, writing is a much, much bigger issue. Just because you can't be a social justice crusader in the name of good writing and get on a fucking high horse about it doesn't mean that it's not a million times more important.
Demanding more LGBT protagonists, even more so than demanding more female protagonists, is getting way ahead of where the majority of the industry is at. We need better writing and more interesting characters first. Once games by and large have a level of writing that exceeds a Seagal vehicle and we have protagonists with a personality then LGBT and female protagonists will surely follow.
If devs start writing shitty, dull LGBT protagonits they will still be shitty, dull protagonists. Either people are going to whine that it's gratuitous and tacked-on, or people are going to whine that it's an embarrassing stereotype of LGBT people. Either way, a poorly written LGBT character is a lose-lose situation. If you want good LGBT characters, stop demanding them right now, and start demanding a decent level of writing.
Seriously, writing is a much, much bigger issue. Just because you can't be a social justice crusader in the name of good writing and get on a fucking high horse about it doesn't mean that it's not a million times more important.
she said that in her mental image of she being a detective, the fact she was woman didnt fit, she wanted to be a man to fit the "ideal" image of a detective she had in her mindLoop Stricken said:
if i got it all correctly