Do you have any question for Pakistanis?

[mParadox]

Ok First of all, forcing someone to accept Islam, is utterly and completely forbidden in our religion, as is forcing anyone to accept Islamic morals. Like I said, when someone wants to cause havoc, they'll find any number of excuses to do so. Texts like the Quran, can be easily slanted to prove anything, or incriminate anyone, and hey, in my neighborhood in Karachi, there's an annual gay party, publicly advertised, so you cant say pople in Pakistan aren't getting over homophobia.

Yep. Pretty much this. We're getting more tolerant and that's the step in the right direction.

 

[Arif_Sohaib]

Pakistan, Y U NO HELP US KILL TALIBAN?

The Pakistan army has probably killed more Taliban than your country. Also, how many of them do you want to kill?
Exactly, what is your exit strategy? Or do you believe John McCain's character from W that "There is no exit strategy"?
The more people you kill, the more they will be against you.

your country harbors them, and isn't nearly as hard as them as they should be, nor do they work as closely with NATO as they could. yes i realize the army does battle with the Taliban in the mountains, but it's a not so well kept secret the Pakistani Special Police (i forget the actual name of them, sorry) have close ties with the Taliban, and even fund some of the warlords.

That is just plain and simple propaganda. When you shoot them in Afghanistan, they run over here and then we shoot them here they run over there. This is called guerrilla warfare,we aren't deliberately harboring them.
And there is a difference between helping NATO and turning your own country into a war-zone at their command.
Would you bomb New York or Toronto or London if there was evidence of Taliban there?
Would you even use drones?
Also, you still haven't mentioned what your exit strategy is.

The Pakistani government says it's propaganda, NATO and Afghan officials would disagree.
And no, I wouldn't want them bombing newyork. however, if they had to bomb the mountains out in the middle of no where to kill some enemies, sure, go for it. That's the situation. And I'm sure you would see far less mistakes resulting in civilian death if ISAF and Pakistan forces worked together on a better level.
And the exit strategy is to stabilize the region, allow the ANA and ANP to stand on their own feet with ISAF aide, and keep the Taliban out, then US troops would begin to leave.

The bottom line is, if both armies cooperated (which ISAF has said they are not only willing, but want it) the Taliban could be crushed much easier.

Of course ISAF and the Afghan officials would not call it propaganda, they are the ones spreading it to shield themselves from blame and responsibility. It is their responsibility to completely seal the Afghan side of the border.

To you, it might be "mountains in the middle of nowhere" but for Afghans and Pustoons, that's home, that's their New York.
Exit strategy always means stabilizing the region, but exactly how do you want to do that?
Where are you going to put the Taliban, in space? What are you going to do with the people who join the Taliban after seeing the deaths of their friends and family?
The only long-term solution according to General Kiayni is 'to win hearts and minds'. Killing people does not do that.
As for cooperation, do you really expect us to share all intelligence with you after what Raymond Davis did? And on top of that America is demanding diplomatic immunity for a guy who was clearly CIA. We know that CIA doesn't share everything they find with us, we don't even know how many of their agents are operating in Pakistan. These kind o f things don't help build trust.
This war is a lot more complicated than your media makes it out to be. This is not World War 2 where all Taliban would wear the same uniform and follow orders from some central command.

 

[Arif_Sohaib]

Alright, so I have a question this time:

A friend of mine is Pakistani. Best friend, actually. For the most part we agree on most things except for homosexuality. I'm tolerant because:

A. I abhor any form of bigotry and prejudice on principle
B. I don't believe mankind has any knowledge of God's will, only here-say mangled by hyperbole and censorship.

My friend, OTOH, wants to put them all on a desert island to die if he's generous, and cut their heads off when he's not. I understand how non-racist whites can maintain friendships with racist whites, but I digress, is homophobia a severe problem that must be dealt with, or does Pakistan in general concur with my friend?

Begam Nawaish Ali. That's what Pakistan thinks of homosexuality.
If it is bad God will punish or forgive it at His own will, it does not concern me.
If He punished the nation of Prophet Lut (A.S.)(I can't remember what Christians call him) it was for a lot more reasons than that. Those people were also huge cheats and looters and harassed visitors had many other vices and were really not going to listen to reason and would probably kill anyone who tried to stop them. After hundreds of years of trying to teach them through His messenger, He finally punished them.
Basically, I think Muslims are not supposed to do anything about it, God will do it. So I am against the Iranian punishment for it.

 

[Arif_Sohaib]

Some people did wrongly hail the murderer as a hero, I believe that this was wrong as it is not something Prophet Muhammad(S.A.W) would have done. Once he was preaching in Taif and people not only insulted him but also harrassed him and his followers and threw stones at him and made him bleed. The angel Gabriel came and offered to destroy the town but he refused and instead prayed for them and asked God to give them understanding. Now Taif is a resort between Mecca and Medina. Mullahs often forget the moral of this event or choose to ignore it at times.
Also there is a saying of Prophet Muhammad (S.A.W.) which roughly means that whoever prosecutes a non-Muslim in a Muslim country, he will be his prosecutor in the Hereafter.
And a part of the Quran that means killing a human is like killing the entire world and saving a human is like saving the world.
That said, most of our current government is corrupt and the death of two PPP ministers was probably just a way for them to get sympathy while their master Zardari loots our people. He wasn't called Mr 10% for nothing. I don't support killing him but a court case and asset freeze is in order and for entirely different reasons.

Even though Muhammed killed people, quite alot of them.Actions speak louder than words.


So when are you guys going to learn to chill out with religion and be more secular ?

When did he kill innocent people?
It is the misunderstanding of religion that causes problems, not religion. Or would you blame World Of Warcraft for the problems it supposedly causes instead of the people playing it?
Also the murder of Salman Taseer was condemned in Pakistan but the BBC, Sky, CNN and Fox probably refused to show the condemnation.

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2011\03\05\story_5-3-2011_pg7_16

Quite regularly, I find his morals/actions to be completely the opposite of my own and I dont think highly of him, and that is putting it politely.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Muhammad/myths-mu-home.htm

Religion has claimed to guide people and claims authority, it "teaches" us. I can blame religion quite easily, especially when it encourages violent behavior on multiple ocassions. SOciety dragged religion through history and up to todays standard, religion had no issue with slavery, then society changed, religion isnt a teacher, its a stone holding society back, and slowing progress to a truely good society.

The site you mention is not working. I also know of it from another forum and know that it is one made only to defame Islam. If you want to give references, at least give them from sources that at least pretend to be unbiased.

I have one word for you, Rapture. The moment you go in there, you see huge signs says "No Gods or Kings, Only Man" then you go in and see a truly magnificent city but one whose society has completely broken down. I believe that is what society would devolve into without religion.
When you remove God, what accountability do you have except humans that you can easily fool?

The site shows quotes from your texts, so that part of your argument is basically this

It dosent matter what the sites purpose is, it gives references to your texts, they are correct, dont try and doge that.

Rapture, you mena the place that got messed up becuase ADAM was addictive and caused psychological effects.

How about you look at Sweden, Norway, Finland, etc. They arent very religious, mostly atheist iirc, and some of the best places in the world.
Now you have Israel, America who enjoy starting wars and still have lots of problems.
Then you have muslim countries who still have stupid blashemy laws, sharia and basically ignore human rights (stoning in Iran anyone ? Honour killings, amputation, etc.)

Without religion we would be much better, technologically and moraly.
God is an ass anyway demanding worship, bullying people, claiming to be loving then making threats if people dont conform, and half the shit that happened around the time those religions started, we dont do anymore, I am actually better than most of those "good" people.
I dont rape, enslave, murder, descriminate based on sex or sexuality. I dont need those rules becuase I am already above them.

Tell me the exact event and then I will clarify it because, as I said, the link is not working.

 

[Daveman]

What's your favourite flavour shisha? My pakistani mate is addicted to the stuff and I've been giving it a try myself. So far I've had mint, strawberry and apple.

 

[Arif_Sohaib]

I know it's a big problem, but I didn't know they started bombing mosques. Confused. What is that accomplishing? If they're already bombing mosques, why doesn't the government ask for help from the UN? Have a peace keeping force come in to protect those places and try to squeeze the Taliban harder and back towards Afghanistan and the Americans?

Which makes into a bigger problem. At least it people see that the Taliban are doing it for their own whacky agenda. And the UN has no real power in Pakistan, same thing converse. Pakistan has no real in UN.

and people have tried but... they're stubborn. >.<

As all leaders are, dictator or democratic. Not trying to make anyone angry, but if you get rid of religion, you end this senseless violence. We won't have Muslim extremists bombing mosques or markets, we won't have retarded politicians saying God told them that everyone should be free, and it would all but end tensions in the middle east related to Israel. We can stop bickering about things that MIGHT have happened 1200-3500 years ago and work on problems like global climate change, renewable energy, education, etc. But I digress. Hopefully this all ends soon.

Before Islam, Arabs used to burry their new born daughters alive and were involved in all kinds of evil and there was no rule of law. For some people, if they think there is no one to answer to when they die, what is the point of doing good things.

That's fucking terrible. Those 'some people' are pretty messed up. In these modern times, I know many people in the middle east still live in the bronze age, but for the rest of us, we've kind of figured out we shouldn't murder babies like that. If all you're looking forward to is your after life, kill yourself right now, but I'm going to live my life for my friends, family, and myself, not some invisible guy in the clouds.

I only mentioned the worse evil they had before Islam and they had many other vices too, you name it they did it.This was because they didn't care, they thought there was no accountability. I know doing good for fear of accountability doesn't sound noble, but for some people that the only reason they would,even today.
The character of Henry Leland in Alpha Protocol exemplifies this, he knows the law is in his hands, he knows the CIA would do anything to get his weapons and he knows that if he fails, he would just die and no one would really punish his greed. And so, just for money ,he orchestrates a plan to engulf the whole world in a war. Anyone who believes in accountability after this life, would never do that.

And with Islam, they are blowing themselves up and killing innocent people. Now, to them, there is accountability, and they think they are being rewarded for it in their afterlife. Did I miss something? If there is no accountability, it is bad, but if you can be held accountable to a massacre in the name of your god, you are rewarded? Epic WTF. I think they should've stuck to the baby murder.

I don't think there is ANY accountability after I'm alive, mostly because I'll be dead. That doesn't mean I'm going to bury babies alive or try to start a world war. And there are people who contradict your last sentence entirely. Example: George W Bush. This failure of a human being does think there is accountability in the after life, and he started a war for no reason that has left a massive number of civilians and soldiers dead or wounded. Accountability in the afterlife is meaningless with someone this diluted.

If you removed the fear factor of accountability in the afterlife, people would naturally become nicer and more peaceful. You shouldn't scare children into going to church because they'll go to hell otherwise, and you shouldn't teach them how to operate an AK-47 because a book told you to hate the infidel. Everyone is equally at fault here. It's human nature to attack those different than you, but if we all become a bit more alike, maybe we would be better off, no?

Islam does not tell people to blow themselves up, nor does it tell them to kill or hate infidels.
It has been here for 1400 years. If if told us to do those things, either we or everyone else would be dead by now.
And about accountability, perhaps you are just a good person or one who believes or subconsciously believes in karma, that if you do good things, good things happen to you and if you do bad things, bad things happen to you. Not everyone is like that.

 

[ScourgeOfHell]

This law is meant for the time of the holy prophet, when any man was free to rape a passerby women, and beauty was a commodity. By encouraging women to wear the hijab, they are protected from decietful stares of random people. Now wer'e alot more sophisticated ,but in many places its still necessary. If you and your girlfriend lived in those times, anyone could have killed u and stolen her

 

[Syntax Error]

So how is the Metal scene treated in Pakistan? Kinda made me curious when I saw that one documentary.

 

[mParadox]

So how is the Metal scene treated in Pakistan? Kinda made me curious when I saw that one documentary.

Developing. Frankly, there are more rock bands-in-the-making than anything else.

 

[RUINER ACTUAL]

I know it's a big problem, but I didn't know they started bombing mosques. Confused. What is that accomplishing? If they're already bombing mosques, why doesn't the government ask for help from the UN? Have a peace keeping force come in to protect those places and try to squeeze the Taliban harder and back towards Afghanistan and the Americans?

Which makes into a bigger problem. At least it people see that the Taliban are doing it for their own whacky agenda. And the UN has no real power in Pakistan, same thing converse. Pakistan has no real in UN.

and people have tried but... they're stubborn. >.<

As all leaders are, dictator or democratic. Not trying to make anyone angry, but if you get rid of religion, you end this senseless violence. We won't have Muslim extremists bombing mosques or markets, we won't have retarded politicians saying God told them that everyone should be free, and it would all but end tensions in the middle east related to Israel. We can stop bickering about things that MIGHT have happened 1200-3500 years ago and work on problems like global climate change, renewable energy, education, etc. But I digress. Hopefully this all ends soon.

Before Islam, Arabs used to burry their new born daughters alive and were involved in all kinds of evil and there was no rule of law. For some people, if they think there is no one to answer to when they die, what is the point of doing good things.

That's fucking terrible. Those 'some people' are pretty messed up. In these modern times, I know many people in the middle east still live in the bronze age, but for the rest of us, we've kind of figured out we shouldn't murder babies like that. If all you're looking forward to is your after life, kill yourself right now, but I'm going to live my life for my friends, family, and myself, not some invisible guy in the clouds.

I only mentioned the worse evil they had before Islam and they had many other vices too, you name it they did it.This was because they didn't care, they thought there was no accountability. I know doing good for fear of accountability doesn't sound noble, but for some people that the only reason they would,even today.
The character of Henry Leland in Alpha Protocol exemplifies this, he knows the law is in his hands, he knows the CIA would do anything to get his weapons and he knows that if he fails, he would just die and no one would really punish his greed. And so, just for money ,he orchestrates a plan to engulf the whole world in a war. Anyone who believes in accountability after this life, would never do that.

And with Islam, they are blowing themselves up and killing innocent people. Now, to them, there is accountability, and they think they are being rewarded for it in their afterlife. Did I miss something? If there is no accountability, it is bad, but if you can be held accountable to a massacre in the name of your god, you are rewarded? Epic WTF. I think they should've stuck to the baby murder.

I don't think there is ANY accountability after I'm alive, mostly because I'll be dead. That doesn't mean I'm going to bury babies alive or try to start a world war. And there are people who contradict your last sentence entirely. Example: George W Bush. This failure of a human being does think there is accountability in the after life, and he started a war for no reason that has left a massive number of civilians and soldiers dead or wounded. Accountability in the afterlife is meaningless with someone this diluted.

If you removed the fear factor of accountability in the afterlife, people would naturally become nicer and more peaceful. You shouldn't scare children into going to church because they'll go to hell otherwise, and you shouldn't teach them how to operate an AK-47 because a book told you to hate the infidel. Everyone is equally at fault here. It's human nature to attack those different than you, but if we all become a bit more alike, maybe we would be better off, no?

Islam does not tell people to blow themselves up, nor does it tell them to kill or hate infidels.
It has been here for 1400 years. If if told us to do those things, either we or everyone else would be dead by now.
And about accountability, perhaps you are just a good person or one who believes or subconsciously believes in karma, that if you do good things, good things happen to you and if you do bad things, bad things happen to you. Not everyone is like that.

Have you read the Qur'an?

?Whoever seeks other than Islam as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he will be with the losers? ?Slay the idolators [non-Muslims] wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the last Day?. Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah! (Sura 9:5,29,41).

I'm just saying, it does say it. And there is people trying to kill infidels, because they were told to. Only the extremists follow it to that point, but theres extremists in every religion, which is really the problem. For every 10 people with the same idea, theres 1 that take that idea a step too far.

 

[DavidTanis]

The graphic novel Pakistan is one of the top 25 ever written, just wondered if you'd read it what you thought.

 

[Arif_Sohaib]

I know it's a big problem, but I didn't know they started bombing mosques. Confused. What is that accomplishing? If they're already bombing mosques, why doesn't the government ask for help from the UN? Have a peace keeping force come in to protect those places and try to squeeze the Taliban harder and back towards Afghanistan and the Americans?

Which makes into a bigger problem. At least it people see that the Taliban are doing it for their own whacky agenda. And the UN has no real power in Pakistan, same thing converse. Pakistan has no real in UN.

and people have tried but... they're stubborn. >.<

As all leaders are, dictator or democratic. Not trying to make anyone angry, but if you get rid of religion, you end this senseless violence. We won't have Muslim extremists bombing mosques or markets, we won't have retarded politicians saying God told them that everyone should be free, and it would all but end tensions in the middle east related to Israel. We can stop bickering about things that MIGHT have happened 1200-3500 years ago and work on problems like global climate change, renewable energy, education, etc. But I digress. Hopefully this all ends soon.

Before Islam, Arabs used to burry their new born daughters alive and were involved in all kinds of evil and there was no rule of law. For some people, if they think there is no one to answer to when they die, what is the point of doing good things.

That's fucking terrible. Those 'some people' are pretty messed up. In these modern times, I know many people in the middle east still live in the bronze age, but for the rest of us, we've kind of figured out we shouldn't murder babies like that. If all you're looking forward to is your after life, kill yourself right now, but I'm going to live my life for my friends, family, and myself, not some invisible guy in the clouds.

I only mentioned the worse evil they had before Islam and they had many other vices too, you name it they did it.This was because they didn't care, they thought there was no accountability. I know doing good for fear of accountability doesn't sound noble, but for some people that the only reason they would,even today.
The character of Henry Leland in Alpha Protocol exemplifies this, he knows the law is in his hands, he knows the CIA would do anything to get his weapons and he knows that if he fails, he would just die and no one would really punish his greed. And so, just for money ,he orchestrates a plan to engulf the whole world in a war. Anyone who believes in accountability after this life, would never do that.

And with Islam, they are blowing themselves up and killing innocent people. Now, to them, there is accountability, and they think they are being rewarded for it in their afterlife. Did I miss something? If there is no accountability, it is bad, but if you can be held accountable to a massacre in the name of your god, you are rewarded? Epic WTF. I think they should've stuck to the baby murder.

I don't think there is ANY accountability after I'm alive, mostly because I'll be dead. That doesn't mean I'm going to bury babies alive or try to start a world war. And there are people who contradict your last sentence entirely. Example: George W Bush. This failure of a human being does think there is accountability in the after life, and he started a war for no reason that has left a massive number of civilians and soldiers dead or wounded. Accountability in the afterlife is meaningless with someone this diluted.

If you removed the fear factor of accountability in the afterlife, people would naturally become nicer and more peaceful. You shouldn't scare children into going to church because they'll go to hell otherwise, and you shouldn't teach them how to operate an AK-47 because a book told you to hate the infidel. Everyone is equally at fault here. It's human nature to attack those different than you, but if we all become a bit more alike, maybe we would be better off, no?

Islam does not tell people to blow themselves up, nor does it tell them to kill or hate infidels.
It has been here for 1400 years. If if told us to do those things, either we or everyone else would be dead by now.
And about accountability, perhaps you are just a good person or one who believes or subconsciously believes in karma, that if you do good things, good things happen to you and if you do bad things, bad things happen to you. Not everyone is like that.

Have you read the Qur'an?

?Whoever seeks other than Islam as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he will be with the losers? ?Slay the idolators [non-Muslims] wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the last Day?. Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah! (Sura 9:5,29,41).

I'm just saying, it does say it. And there is people trying to kill infidels, because they were told to. Only the extremists follow it to that point, but theres extremists in every religion, which is really the problem. For every 10 people with the same idea, theres 1 that take that idea a step too far.

The first Ayat tells one of the conditions about which God will judge you, it says nothing about our behavior towards non-Muslims. The second one is usually taken out of context(including by illiterate Mullahs). It is about the Battle of Badr. Do you expect us to stand around like hippies in a battlefield? Or be forced to choose between our religion or our life like the always ignored "turn the other cheek".

 

[Musclepunch]

Not in a racist way, how come so many of you move to england

Economics mainly. And I hate immigrants as much as you do. England should belong to the English. I believe that unpatriotic and selfish Pakistanis are steeling jobs that your people deserve. I would hate it if your people came here and started steeling our jobs too, so I feel the same if someone does it to you. I also feel that educated people who leave Pakistan when it needs them are traitors who have betrayed their country and will betray yours if given enough money.

I never said I hate immigrants or pakistanis

 

[RUINER ACTUAL]

I know it's a big problem, but I didn't know they started bombing mosques. Confused. What is that accomplishing? If they're already bombing mosques, why doesn't the government ask for help from the UN? Have a peace keeping force come in to protect those places and try to squeeze the Taliban harder and back towards Afghanistan and the Americans?

Which makes into a bigger problem. At least it people see that the Taliban are doing it for their own whacky agenda. And the UN has no real power in Pakistan, same thing converse. Pakistan has no real in UN.

and people have tried but... they're stubborn. >.<

As all leaders are, dictator or democratic. Not trying to make anyone angry, but if you get rid of religion, you end this senseless violence. We won't have Muslim extremists bombing mosques or markets, we won't have retarded politicians saying God told them that everyone should be free, and it would all but end tensions in the middle east related to Israel. We can stop bickering about things that MIGHT have happened 1200-3500 years ago and work on problems like global climate change, renewable energy, education, etc. But I digress. Hopefully this all ends soon.

Before Islam, Arabs used to burry their new born daughters alive and were involved in all kinds of evil and there was no rule of law. For some people, if they think there is no one to answer to when they die, what is the point of doing good things.

That's fucking terrible. Those 'some people' are pretty messed up. In these modern times, I know many people in the middle east still live in the bronze age, but for the rest of us, we've kind of figured out we shouldn't murder babies like that. If all you're looking forward to is your after life, kill yourself right now, but I'm going to live my life for my friends, family, and myself, not some invisible guy in the clouds.

I only mentioned the worse evil they had before Islam and they had many other vices too, you name it they did it.This was because they didn't care, they thought there was no accountability. I know doing good for fear of accountability doesn't sound noble, but for some people that the only reason they would,even today.
The character of Henry Leland in Alpha Protocol exemplifies this, he knows the law is in his hands, he knows the CIA would do anything to get his weapons and he knows that if he fails, he would just die and no one would really punish his greed. And so, just for money ,he orchestrates a plan to engulf the whole world in a war. Anyone who believes in accountability after this life, would never do that.

And with Islam, they are blowing themselves up and killing innocent people. Now, to them, there is accountability, and they think they are being rewarded for it in their afterlife. Did I miss something? If there is no accountability, it is bad, but if you can be held accountable to a massacre in the name of your god, you are rewarded? Epic WTF. I think they should've stuck to the baby murder.

I don't think there is ANY accountability after I'm alive, mostly because I'll be dead. That doesn't mean I'm going to bury babies alive or try to start a world war. And there are people who contradict your last sentence entirely. Example: George W Bush. This failure of a human being does think there is accountability in the after life, and he started a war for no reason that has left a massive number of civilians and soldiers dead or wounded. Accountability in the afterlife is meaningless with someone this diluted.

If you removed the fear factor of accountability in the afterlife, people would naturally become nicer and more peaceful. You shouldn't scare children into going to church because they'll go to hell otherwise, and you shouldn't teach them how to operate an AK-47 because a book told you to hate the infidel. Everyone is equally at fault here. It's human nature to attack those different than you, but if we all become a bit more alike, maybe we would be better off, no?

Islam does not tell people to blow themselves up, nor does it tell them to kill or hate infidels.
It has been here for 1400 years. If if told us to do those things, either we or everyone else would be dead by now.
And about accountability, perhaps you are just a good person or one who believes or subconsciously believes in karma, that if you do good things, good things happen to you and if you do bad things, bad things happen to you. Not everyone is like that.

Have you read the Qur'an?

?Whoever seeks other than Islam as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he will be with the losers? ?Slay the idolators [non-Muslims] wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the last Day?. Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah! (Sura 9:5,29,41).

I'm just saying, it does say it. And there is people trying to kill infidels, because they were told to. Only the extremists follow it to that point, but theres extremists in every religion, which is really the problem. For every 10 people with the same idea, theres 1 that take that idea a step too far.

The first Ayat tells one of the conditions about which God will judge you, it says nothing about our behavior towards non-Muslims. The second one is usually taken out of context(including by illiterate Mullahs). It is about the Battle of Badr. Do you expect us to stand around like hippies in a battlefield? Or be forced to choose between our religion or our life like the always ignored "turn the other cheek".

It doesn't say anything about behavior, but it does say if you're not Muslim, you're fucked.

You can't say they illiterate if they read the passage.

 

[Arif_Sohaib]

I know it's a big problem, but I didn't know they started bombing mosques. Confused. What is that accomplishing? If they're already bombing mosques, why doesn't the government ask for help from the UN? Have a peace keeping force come in to protect those places and try to squeeze the Taliban harder and back towards Afghanistan and the Americans?

Which makes into a bigger problem. At least it people see that the Taliban are doing it for their own whacky agenda. And the UN has no real power in Pakistan, same thing converse. Pakistan has no real in UN.

and people have tried but... they're stubborn. >.<

As all leaders are, dictator or democratic. Not trying to make anyone angry, but if you get rid of religion, you end this senseless violence. We won't have Muslim extremists bombing mosques or markets, we won't have retarded politicians saying God told them that everyone should be free, and it would all but end tensions in the middle east related to Israel. We can stop bickering about things that MIGHT have happened 1200-3500 years ago and work on problems like global climate change, renewable energy, education, etc. But I digress. Hopefully this all ends soon.

Before Islam, Arabs used to burry their new born daughters alive and were involved in all kinds of evil and there was no rule of law. For some people, if they think there is no one to answer to when they die, what is the point of doing good things.

That's fucking terrible. Those 'some people' are pretty messed up. In these modern times, I know many people in the middle east still live in the bronze age, but for the rest of us, we've kind of figured out we shouldn't murder babies like that. If all you're looking forward to is your after life, kill yourself right now, but I'm going to live my life for my friends, family, and myself, not some invisible guy in the clouds.

I only mentioned the worse evil they had before Islam and they had many other vices too, you name it they did it.This was because they didn't care, they thought there was no accountability. I know doing good for fear of accountability doesn't sound noble, but for some people that the only reason they would,even today.
The character of Henry Leland in Alpha Protocol exemplifies this, he knows the law is in his hands, he knows the CIA would do anything to get his weapons and he knows that if he fails, he would just die and no one would really punish his greed. And so, just for money ,he orchestrates a plan to engulf the whole world in a war. Anyone who believes in accountability after this life, would never do that.

And with Islam, they are blowing themselves up and killing innocent people. Now, to them, there is accountability, and they think they are being rewarded for it in their afterlife. Did I miss something? If there is no accountability, it is bad, but if you can be held accountable to a massacre in the name of your god, you are rewarded? Epic WTF. I think they should've stuck to the baby murder.

I don't think there is ANY accountability after I'm alive, mostly because I'll be dead. That doesn't mean I'm going to bury babies alive or try to start a world war. And there are people who contradict your last sentence entirely. Example: George W Bush. This failure of a human being does think there is accountability in the after life, and he started a war for no reason that has left a massive number of civilians and soldiers dead or wounded. Accountability in the afterlife is meaningless with someone this diluted.

If you removed the fear factor of accountability in the afterlife, people would naturally become nicer and more peaceful. You shouldn't scare children into going to church because they'll go to hell otherwise, and you shouldn't teach them how to operate an AK-47 because a book told you to hate the infidel. Everyone is equally at fault here. It's human nature to attack those different than you, but if we all become a bit more alike, maybe we would be better off, no?

Islam does not tell people to blow themselves up, nor does it tell them to kill or hate infidels.
It has been here for 1400 years. If if told us to do those things, either we or everyone else would be dead by now.
And about accountability, perhaps you are just a good person or one who believes or subconsciously believes in karma, that if you do good things, good things happen to you and if you do bad things, bad things happen to you. Not everyone is like that.

Have you read the Qur'an?

?Whoever seeks other than Islam as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he will be with the losers? ?Slay the idolators [non-Muslims] wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the last Day?. Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah! (Sura 9:5,29,41).

I'm just saying, it does say it. And there is people trying to kill infidels, because they were told to. Only the extremists follow it to that point, but theres extremists in every religion, which is really the problem. For every 10 people with the same idea, theres 1 that take that idea a step too far.

The first Ayat tells one of the conditions about which God will judge you, it says nothing about our behavior towards non-Muslims. The second one is usually taken out of context(including by illiterate Mullahs). It is about the Battle of Badr. Do you expect us to stand around like hippies in a battlefield? Or be forced to choose between our religion or our life like the always ignored "turn the other cheek".

It doesn't say anything about behavior, but it does say if you're not Muslim, you're fucked.

You can't say they illiterate if they read the passage.

If you don't believe it why does that even matter to you.
And when I say illiterate, I don't mean people who can't read. I mean people who can't understand the true meaning and the don't know the conditions in which the Ayat was revealed.

 

[RUINER ACTUAL]

I know it's a big problem, but I didn't know they started bombing mosques. Confused. What is that accomplishing? If they're already bombing mosques, why doesn't the government ask for help from the UN? Have a peace keeping force come in to protect those places and try to squeeze the Taliban harder and back towards Afghanistan and the Americans?

Which makes into a bigger problem. At least it people see that the Taliban are doing it for their own whacky agenda. And the UN has no real power in Pakistan, same thing converse. Pakistan has no real in UN.

and people have tried but... they're stubborn. >.<

As all leaders are, dictator or democratic. Not trying to make anyone angry, but if you get rid of religion, you end this senseless violence. We won't have Muslim extremists bombing mosques or markets, we won't have retarded politicians saying God told them that everyone should be free, and it would all but end tensions in the middle east related to Israel. We can stop bickering about things that MIGHT have happened 1200-3500 years ago and work on problems like global climate change, renewable energy, education, etc. But I digress. Hopefully this all ends soon.

Before Islam, Arabs used to burry their new born daughters alive and were involved in all kinds of evil and there was no rule of law. For some people, if they think there is no one to answer to when they die, what is the point of doing good things.

That's fucking terrible. Those 'some people' are pretty messed up. In these modern times, I know many people in the middle east still live in the bronze age, but for the rest of us, we've kind of figured out we shouldn't murder babies like that. If all you're looking forward to is your after life, kill yourself right now, but I'm going to live my life for my friends, family, and myself, not some invisible guy in the clouds.

I only mentioned the worse evil they had before Islam and they had many other vices too, you name it they did it.This was because they didn't care, they thought there was no accountability. I know doing good for fear of accountability doesn't sound noble, but for some people that the only reason they would,even today.
The character of Henry Leland in Alpha Protocol exemplifies this, he knows the law is in his hands, he knows the CIA would do anything to get his weapons and he knows that if he fails, he would just die and no one would really punish his greed. And so, just for money ,he orchestrates a plan to engulf the whole world in a war. Anyone who believes in accountability after this life, would never do that.

And with Islam, they are blowing themselves up and killing innocent people. Now, to them, there is accountability, and they think they are being rewarded for it in their afterlife. Did I miss something? If there is no accountability, it is bad, but if you can be held accountable to a massacre in the name of your god, you are rewarded? Epic WTF. I think they should've stuck to the baby murder.

I don't think there is ANY accountability after I'm alive, mostly because I'll be dead. That doesn't mean I'm going to bury babies alive or try to start a world war. And there are people who contradict your last sentence entirely. Example: George W Bush. This failure of a human being does think there is accountability in the after life, and he started a war for no reason that has left a massive number of civilians and soldiers dead or wounded. Accountability in the afterlife is meaningless with someone this diluted.

If you removed the fear factor of accountability in the afterlife, people would naturally become nicer and more peaceful. You shouldn't scare children into going to church because they'll go to hell otherwise, and you shouldn't teach them how to operate an AK-47 because a book told you to hate the infidel. Everyone is equally at fault here. It's human nature to attack those different than you, but if we all become a bit more alike, maybe we would be better off, no?

Islam does not tell people to blow themselves up, nor does it tell them to kill or hate infidels.
It has been here for 1400 years. If if told us to do those things, either we or everyone else would be dead by now.
And about accountability, perhaps you are just a good person or one who believes or subconsciously believes in karma, that if you do good things, good things happen to you and if you do bad things, bad things happen to you. Not everyone is like that.

Have you read the Qur'an?

?Whoever seeks other than Islam as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he will be with the losers? ?Slay the idolators [non-Muslims] wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the last Day?. Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah! (Sura 9:5,29,41).

I'm just saying, it does say it. And there is people trying to kill infidels, because they were told to. Only the extremists follow it to that point, but theres extremists in every religion, which is really the problem. For every 10 people with the same idea, theres 1 that take that idea a step too far.

The first Ayat tells one of the conditions about which God will judge you, it says nothing about our behavior towards non-Muslims. The second one is usually taken out of context(including by illiterate Mullahs). It is about the Battle of Badr. Do you expect us to stand around like hippies in a battlefield? Or be forced to choose between our religion or our life like the always ignored "turn the other cheek".

It doesn't say anything about behavior, but it does say if you're not Muslim, you're fucked.

You can't say they illiterate if they read the passage.

If you don't believe it why does that even matter to you.
And when I say illiterate, I don't mean people who can't read. I mean people who can't understand the true meaning and the don't know the conditions in which the Ayat was revealed.

I'm just trying to gain some information. You have avoided some things that I kind of expected. Like just now, you know that since I'm not muslim, I am fucked in the eyes of your religion. You can agree/confirm that, I know it's true, you don't have to counter with a question. Anyways, my fate, that doesn't matter to you in particular, you're normal, it matters to those Mullah that still want to kill me because of it! And that is where the problem is. Perhaps the religious leaders of Islam should state, "this is what this is about" just to clear up some confusion and save a couple thousand innocent lives. I've seen Religiulous though, and they are very traditional, stubborn people.

The correct phrasing then would have been "misinterrupted."

 

[Arif_Sohaib]

I know it's a big problem, but I didn't know they started bombing mosques. Confused. What is that accomplishing? If they're already bombing mosques, why doesn't the government ask for help from the UN? Have a peace keeping force come in to protect those places and try to squeeze the Taliban harder and back towards Afghanistan and the Americans?

Which makes into a bigger problem. At least it people see that the Taliban are doing it for their own whacky agenda. And the UN has no real power in Pakistan, same thing converse. Pakistan has no real in UN.

and people have tried but... they're stubborn. >.<

As all leaders are, dictator or democratic. Not trying to make anyone angry, but if you get rid of religion, you end this senseless violence. We won't have Muslim extremists bombing mosques or markets, we won't have retarded politicians saying God told them that everyone should be free, and it would all but end tensions in the middle east related to Israel. We can stop bickering about things that MIGHT have happened 1200-3500 years ago and work on problems like global climate change, renewable energy, education, etc. But I digress. Hopefully this all ends soon.

Before Islam, Arabs used to burry their new born daughters alive and were involved in all kinds of evil and there was no rule of law. For some people, if they think there is no one to answer to when they die, what is the point of doing good things.

That's fucking terrible. Those 'some people' are pretty messed up. In these modern times, I know many people in the middle east still live in the bronze age, but for the rest of us, we've kind of figured out we shouldn't murder babies like that. If all you're looking forward to is your after life, kill yourself right now, but I'm going to live my life for my friends, family, and myself, not some invisible guy in the clouds.

I only mentioned the worse evil they had before Islam and they had many other vices too, you name it they did it.This was because they didn't care, they thought there was no accountability. I know doing good for fear of accountability doesn't sound noble, but for some people that the only reason they would,even today.
The character of Henry Leland in Alpha Protocol exemplifies this, he knows the law is in his hands, he knows the CIA would do anything to get his weapons and he knows that if he fails, he would just die and no one would really punish his greed. And so, just for money ,he orchestrates a plan to engulf the whole world in a war. Anyone who believes in accountability after this life, would never do that.

And with Islam, they are blowing themselves up and killing innocent people. Now, to them, there is accountability, and they think they are being rewarded for it in their afterlife. Did I miss something? If there is no accountability, it is bad, but if you can be held accountable to a massacre in the name of your god, you are rewarded? Epic WTF. I think they should've stuck to the baby murder.

I don't think there is ANY accountability after I'm alive, mostly because I'll be dead. That doesn't mean I'm going to bury babies alive or try to start a world war. And there are people who contradict your last sentence entirely. Example: George W Bush. This failure of a human being does think there is accountability in the after life, and he started a war for no reason that has left a massive number of civilians and soldiers dead or wounded. Accountability in the afterlife is meaningless with someone this diluted.

If you removed the fear factor of accountability in the afterlife, people would naturally become nicer and more peaceful. You shouldn't scare children into going to church because they'll go to hell otherwise, and you shouldn't teach them how to operate an AK-47 because a book told you to hate the infidel. Everyone is equally at fault here. It's human nature to attack those different than you, but if we all become a bit more alike, maybe we would be better off, no?

Islam does not tell people to blow themselves up, nor does it tell them to kill or hate infidels.
It has been here for 1400 years. If if told us to do those things, either we or everyone else would be dead by now.
And about accountability, perhaps you are just a good person or one who believes or subconsciously believes in karma, that if you do good things, good things happen to you and if you do bad things, bad things happen to you. Not everyone is like that.

Have you read the Qur'an?

?Whoever seeks other than Islam as his religion, it will not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he will be with the losers? ?Slay the idolators [non-Muslims] wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the last Day?. Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah! (Sura 9:5,29,41).

I'm just saying, it does say it. And there is people trying to kill infidels, because they were told to. Only the extremists follow it to that point, but theres extremists in every religion, which is really the problem. For every 10 people with the same idea, theres 1 that take that idea a step too far.

The first Ayat tells one of the conditions about which God will judge you, it says nothing about our behavior towards non-Muslims. The second one is usually taken out of context(including by illiterate Mullahs). It is about the Battle of Badr. Do you expect us to stand around like hippies in a battlefield? Or be forced to choose between our religion or our life like the always ignored "turn the other cheek".

It doesn't say anything about behavior, but it does say if you're not Muslim, you're fucked.

You can't say they illiterate if they read the passage.

If you don't believe it why does that even matter to you.
And when I say illiterate, I don't mean people who can't read. I mean people who can't understand the true meaning and the don't know the conditions in which the Ayat was revealed.

I'm just trying to gain some information. You have avoided some things that I kind of expected. Like just now, you know that since I'm not muslim, I am fucked in the eyes of your religion. You can agree/confirm that, I know it's true, you don't have to counter with a question. Anyways, my fate, that doesn't matter to you in particular, you're normal, it matters to those Mullah that still want to kill me because of it! And that is where the problem is. Perhaps the religious leaders of Islam should state, "this is what this is about" just to clear up some confusion and save a couple thousand innocent lives. I've seen Religiulous though, and they are very traditional, stubborn people.

The correct phrasing then would have been "misinterrupted."

The Muslims do not have an equivalent of a Pope so no one can say something about religion that all Muslims would get behind. Also, the US has some responsibility in the matter as during the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, the CIA promoted Jihad in ways that is not there in Islam and used our religious sentiments to fuel their war and avenge Vietnam.
Ask anyone who knows Pakistan and they will tell you that before the late 1970s, no one even knew what an AK47 was ,suicide bombing was unimaginable and the most frightening form of violence was the Hatorra(Hammer) group, rumored KGB agents who killed people with a hammer. People didn't even lock their doors when leaving their house. The Afghan war changed everything and 911 made it much worse.

 

[Darth_Dude]

I noticed that there aren't many Pakistanis here

I'm Pakistani! =3

 

[Darth_Dude]

This is more a question about religion,

Why do you cover your women up (That's Muslim isn't it? :S)

Because you're worried other peeps will look at her, if other males look at my GF I feel complimented almost, they think she's hot (maybe) and I've got her.. it also compliments her too does it not?

Women in Islam are required to dress modestly to protect their decency. A woman should have the right to be judged by her intellect, character and morals, rather than her looks. But wearing a veil is not a barrier to lead a good life. I'll use my mother as an example here, she wears a veil, but she is a doctor. No one stopped her from going to uni, from driving, and from leading a independent life.

While reading your post, I thought about something. When other people look at your GF like that, aren't they treating her like a piece of meat? Isn't that degrading to her or anything?