Do you obey the law?
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Do I always obey the law? Depends, do i obey ALL of the laws? No, but I do obey the important ones.
It's impossible to obey all of the laws all of the time. Think about driving, if you drive can you honestly say you have never exceeded the speed limit...ever? Or I bet if not all but definitely most of the men on here have at some point urinated outside against a strategic tree or bush after a few drinks (hell I bet most of the ladies have too, when you got to go you got to go after all)
In short, everyone has broken the law at some point, because when you really look into it there are an awful lot of dumb laws out there so don't worry about it, just stick to keeping the important ones[footnote]Like not killing people or raping or steeling...you know what I'm getting at[/footnote] an you'll be ok.
It's impossible to obey all of the laws all of the time. Think about driving, if you drive can you honestly say you have never exceeded the speed limit...ever? Or I bet if not all but definitely most of the men on here have at some point urinated outside against a strategic tree or bush after a few drinks (hell I bet most of the ladies have too, when you got to go you got to go after all)
In short, everyone has broken the law at some point, because when you really look into it there are an awful lot of dumb laws out there so don't worry about it, just stick to keeping the important ones[footnote]Like not killing people or raping or steeling...you know what I'm getting at[/footnote] an you'll be ok.
For me obeying the law never enters the equation. I have my own code of ethics and don't feel at all obligated to obey any laws I didn't make myself or wasn't consulted on. Basically, I do what I must to achieve my goals with as little trouble as possible.
Somebody I knew downloaded the entire Dragon Ball series+movies and gave it to me on a hard drive
>_>
<_<
Since piracy is getting legalized in the UK I guess that's fine now though
>_>
<_<
Since piracy is getting legalized in the UK I guess that's fine now though
The OP reminded me of an interesting post I read the other day: http://blog.codinghorror.com/the-just-in-time-theory/
It references an old saying that "some people will always steal, some people will never steal, but for most people...it depends". You can extend what that post talks about to the general obeying of the law - most people might break the law if it's breaking it *just a little* and they won't get caught, and maybe they can argue that the law is nonsensical/unjust. (Breaking the speed limit? There's no one on the damn road!)
We can pretend that most people never jaywalk or break the speed limit by 10mph or copy a dvd that their friend gave them (even though it CLEARLY says no unauthorized copying), but you know... Bending society rules to fit what you can get away with is a very human thing to do.
It references an old saying that "some people will always steal, some people will never steal, but for most people...it depends". You can extend what that post talks about to the general obeying of the law - most people might break the law if it's breaking it *just a little* and they won't get caught, and maybe they can argue that the law is nonsensical/unjust. (Breaking the speed limit? There's no one on the damn road!)
We can pretend that most people never jaywalk or break the speed limit by 10mph or copy a dvd that their friend gave them (even though it CLEARLY says no unauthorized copying), but you know... Bending society rules to fit what you can get away with is a very human thing to do.
I'm a young black man man, bad things will happen to me if I don't obey the law or stay under the radar.
Aside from ridiculous stuff like J-walking, I usually follow the rules. Occasionally I'll bend stuff when it's something inconsequential and it's just me who'd be affected if something goes wrong. Stuff like climbing structures outdoors being an example, and even then I am careful and make sure I'm not doing it around impressionable kids or in a way that I'll kill myself.
Generally you should care because excessive speeding can cause more frequent and more dangerous accidents. But fuck the man! Right?
You need some line (I hope you agree with at least this much) where you say that something's illegal. And unless that line is leaning so ridiculously towards the dangerous then you will always have people trying to push that line. In which case you need to have some sort of deterrent for people breaking it. Taking away their license, fining them, whatever. I don't know what it's like where you live, but where I live they will give you about 10km of leeway before a camera or police officer will fine you. They let people push it a little because people are always going to push it a little
EDIT:
Because it's your unalienable right to speed without repercussion? I'm sorry, but that doesn't so much sound like a invasion of privacy as much as "I don't want to pay speeding fines". Justifying that as an invasion of privacy is like someone who goes around spraying CCTV cameras because he doesn't want his privacy invaded when he mugs people in those streets.Reiper said:
Generally you should care because excessive speeding can cause more frequent and more dangerous accidents. But fuck the man! Right?
There needs to be a line though where you start enforcing it somehow. Having absolutely no speed limits would be ridiculous. I know a guy who went 200km on an icy highway in the winter (roads which I was struggling to not glide off of the road just going the regular speed limit) with a bunch of preteen kids in the vehicle. If he slid to the side when passing a vehicle or just going straight (I had to fight that myself) then he would have veered off the road and killed everyone in the vehicle, possibly several other vehicles if he had a head on collision.
You need some line (I hope you agree with at least this much) where you say that something's illegal. And unless that line is leaning so ridiculously towards the dangerous then you will always have people trying to push that line. In which case you need to have some sort of deterrent for people breaking it. Taking away their license, fining them, whatever. I don't know what it's like where you live, but where I live they will give you about 10km of leeway before a camera or police officer will fine you. They let people push it a little because people are always going to push it a little
EDIT:
This being said, in my experience they will usually let you bend the rules to a degree. I've never seen someone ticketed for jaywalking, and I've never heard of someone being ticketed for going 5km above the speed limit. I'm pretty sure that when they make the laws they know people are going to try to push them, so they consider that when they make them, and give a bit of leeway.mmiki said:
I ride a bicycle without having any kind of light on it. Never got busted.
#ExtremeHardcoreToDaMax
(never going to do that again)
#ExtremeHardcoreToDaMax
(never going to do that again)
Ok, so my privacy is limited to what I have on my property? Well last time I checked, my car was my property, even when it is on public roads. The issue is not necessarily a camera that takes an single picture of your car, though I don't really want that either. The issue is that these ANPR system which crosscheck license plates can be used to track your movement and patterns at all times. As these systems become more advanced, privacy will only be eroded further.lacktheknack said:
And if you are going to use a google maps analogy, I could build a wall around my house if I wanted to block it, so too should I be able to use countermeasures against these invasive devices in public.
So my sense of what "should" be legal does not "stink", especially seeing as how these things are entirely subjective. I simply envision a future society where we respect privacy, and acknowledge the dangers that technology can have upon it. Nice try at condescending flame-bait though.
I rarely if ever speed. I would not want the countermeasures so I can flaunt the rules of the road, but rather because the principle behind these devices makes me uncomfortable. As I mentioned above, many of the ANPRs system can cross check the license of every vehicle they see, and if you deploy enough of them, they can track exactly where you are all the time.The Almighty Aardvark said:
I consider myself to be a very safe driver, and I understand that these systems can be valuable tools for police, but I also feel that they cross a line, and that their benefit does not outweigh there cost.
...But I'd still be able to take a picture of your brick wall.Reiper said:
^still an invasion of privacy, since the wall is on your property
You should consider loosening your views on privacy, if only to spare yourself the stress-induced heart attack when you find out how your official papers, internet data, mail, etc. are treated when they leave your hands/computer.
Yeah, it's sub-optimal. No, it's not going to change.
Exactly, couldn't agree more. Get your disorganised shit together, and maybe you'll arrive at work on time.zhoominator said:
It's really the urban and country road speeders that get my back up, though, I see motorway speeders as slightly less of a threat. Mainly because everyone develops a bit of a lead foot on the motorways here anyway, with the traffic mostly averaging out to about 80 MPH, rather than 70 (the speed limit on motorways here). Given that there's no pedestrians, everyone's going the same way and most people drive sensibly, that's not a particularly big deal. Even if there's someone stopped on the hard shoulder, they're at far more risk from a tired lorry/car driver drifting out of lane and swiping them, than they are the guy doing 80 in a straight line.
Given the choice between someone doing 80, driving sensibly, staying in lane, not tailgating or flashing their lights, and someone doing 70 and the opposite of all that, the cops here will go for the latter guy every time. Not that that will get you off if you're doing 80 and everyone else around you is doing 70, and there's no-one driving like an idiot, they'll still pull you.
Seeing a marked car or average speed camera signs makes everyone slow down, though, regardless of how good they're driving. XD
Sorry, gotta butt in here.Reiper said:
Seriously, what even is? ANPR is not used to track your position. There is no positional data relayed back to anywhere, it simply contacts the DVLA database (or whatever the equivalent is in your country) to find out if there's any outstanding flags against the registered car.
What type of car is the license registered to? (For example: Audi A8, Black)
Who is the registered owner?
Is the car flagged as stolen?
Is it flagged as "off the road"?
Has it been involved in any crimes recently/has it got a criminal history?
Is it taxed?
Is it insured?
Does it have a valid MOT (or whatever your country's equivalent is)?
At no point is anyone actually tracking the locational data of this info. The worst you'd have to worry about is your car being mentioned in a police report, with the only reasons for that being you have been involved in an accident/crime, at which point, I think you've got bigger concerns. Applying any kind of counter-measures against speed cameras, most of which don't actually work, will get the attention of any cops behind you because either they've spotted it sat over your plate and it's aroused their suspicions, or it's screwing with the ANPR camera, causing it to go "I can't read this", and thus arousing their suspicions. Either way, you're drawing unnecessary attention to yourself.
Then don't move over here. Ours take two!Reiper said:
I do follow the law, primarily because I don't want to be one of the unfortunate low-level law breakers that gets killed by an inexperienced, negligent and overly brutal cop.
If I'm doin' a crime it's 'cus I can do the time; I can't exactly hold that end of the deal if I'm dead.
If I'm doin' a crime it's 'cus I can do the time; I can't exactly hold that end of the deal if I'm dead.
This, especially since I'm old enough to be tried as an adult! Having two strikes on myself for just being alive is not how I wanted to spend my time obeying the law all the time...Shadow flame master said:
With that said...
On an unrelated note, I was not expecting this song to be used in a trailer about the Penguins from Madagascar...
Well there was the time I was a pirate, smoked something other than tobacco, Jay walked, and watched porn before I was 18. was perfect and never did anything wrong. In fact, i still am.
dun dun dunIdsertian said:
https://wiki.openrightsgroup.org/wiki/National_Vehicle_Tracking_Database
Muh...muh freedoms
This information will be deadly once skynet comes online. They called me paranoid, but at least the killer AIs wont know my routine!
I obey the law becuase my morality aligns with the law (for the most part), that being said; Do I think certain laws are extremely stupid? yes. Should they be revised or repealed because they're ineffective or never obeyed anyway or just plain stupid? some of them. Have I ever disobeyed the law? everyone has committed at least one misdemeanour, even if it was just jaywalking (which incidentally is about the worst "crime" I have committed, I'm a goody two shoes).
My dad and I fired a tennis ball out of a makeshift Rocket Launcher made of conduit once. To this day, it's probably still in someone's roof gutter. We've used fireworks, even had fights with fireworks etc.
But these are all questionably safe/unsafe.
At my house, we own more than 2 dogs without a $200 council permit. This is the kind of shit I couldn't care less about, it's just a blatant money grab created by a corrupt government. People might say "Well that's just the way it is, you're breaking the law", but those people are mindless drones and wastes of oxygen that can't think for themselves. If I live on 10 acres, I can damn well take care of a few dogs without a $200 dollar permit.
As for an answer, I let common sense guide me.
But these are all questionably safe/unsafe.
At my house, we own more than 2 dogs without a $200 council permit. This is the kind of shit I couldn't care less about, it's just a blatant money grab created by a corrupt government. People might say "Well that's just the way it is, you're breaking the law", but those people are mindless drones and wastes of oxygen that can't think for themselves. If I live on 10 acres, I can damn well take care of a few dogs without a $200 dollar permit.
As for an answer, I let common sense guide me.
I do, because it is troublesome not to. I consider that all current governments on Earth are psychotic and working directly towards the death of all humanity. The laws they make have no purpose, good or bad, they are just manifestations of insanity. A new law made is no different to a lunatic in an asylum screaming out gibberish.
But the government does have power, and so the best thing to do is live your life as well as you can, while keeping apprised of the laws and trying to obey them. Not because they are right or wrong, but because you will be destroyed if you don't.
But the government does have power, and so the best thing to do is live your life as well as you can, while keeping apprised of the laws and trying to obey them. Not because they are right or wrong, but because you will be destroyed if you don't.
Huh, I had not heard of that. The only ANPR I'd heard of was that which is mounted on the cars of the traffic police. I consider myself duly corrected.Reiper said:
Yeah, I'll admit that's a little shady, but I don't think it's anything to be overly concerned by. What you need to remember is that, despite appearances, the police/government generally do things because they think it's the best course of action for all involved. It's the "Cock Up Before Conspiracy" equation. Chances are, those involved in any big "scandal" haven't done something because conspiracy, they've either done it because they thought it was a good idea, or they're just simply inept.
Same with that really. Someone's gone: "Hang on, what if we convert all the cameras to ANPR and keep the data for x years? That way, we can prove that car A was at the scene of a crime and use it as evidence!", and everyone else has said: "Yeah, not a bad idea." without thinking far enough ahead or of any possible consequences. There's no conspiracy to erode freedoms (of which there aren't that many in this country anyway), it's just a case that someone thought it was a blindin' idea and would help make policing easier.