Also the reason why there is gang culture is because they were gangs in the first place its not like NWA came out and black started killing each other no NWA came out after gangs were apparent also what about the war on drugs that was ment to break up black communities and the fact blacks are most likely to be arrested for drugs despite both whites and blacks using it at the same rate.
Whites and Asians where also just as heavily involved in gang warfare once upon a time, yet both as communities moved away from it when compared to how many people involved are from these groups.
Also, the arrest rate for drug possession is an argument based on at best a poor understanding of statistics, because something politicians who complain about the higher level of drug possession charges for African Americans ignore the critical fact that those charges are not an isolated charge in almost all of cases, but are instead part of a list of changes and the person involved happened to have drugs on them when they where arrested.
If you're arrested for assaulting someone and the cops find crack on you, that's being added to your charges.
Also, if the war on drugs is the reason for the higher incarceration rate, why did the spike only occur under Bill Clinton when Reagan was the one who started this war? While it may factor into it, it certainly is not the beginning and end of it, and anyone who proves the war on drugs was made to be a war on African Americans would be the first to do so.
Also the reason why there is gang culture is because they were gangs in the first place its not like NWA came out and black started killing each other no NWA came out after gangs were apparent also what about the war on drugs that was ment to break up black communities and the fact blacks are most likely to be arrested for drugs despite both whites and blacks using it at the same rate.
Whites and Asians where also just as heavily involved in gang warfare once upon a time, yet both as communities moved away from it when compared to how many people involved are from these groups.
Also, the arrest rate for drug possession is an argument based on at best a poor understanding of statistics, because something politicians who complain about the higher level of drug possession charges for African Americans ignore the critical fact that those charges are not an isolated charge in almost all of cases, but are instead part of a list of changes and the person involved happened to have drugs on them when they where arrested.
If you're arrested for assaulting someone and the cops find crack on you, that's being added to your charges.
Also, if the war on drugs is the reason for the higher incarceration rate, why did the spike only occur under Bill Clinton when Reagan was the one who started this war? While it may factor into it, it certainly is not the beginning and end of it, and anyone who proves the war on drugs was made to be a war on African Americans would be the first to do so.
Yeah white moved away from it when Alchoal became legal but unfortunately things such as cannabis are still illegal.
No no I said arrest not charged blacks are still arrested for it despite using it at the same rate and blacks are still more likely to be searched and even based on similar Histories blacks are still more likely to be charged more with it.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/25/us/racial-disparity-traffic-stops-driving-black.html?_r=0
Also Nixon was the one who started the war on drugs and when Reagan was in office the prison population still spiked
http://www.drugpolicy.org/new-solutions-drug-policy/brief-history-drug-war
[No no I said arrest not charged blacks are still arrested for it despite using it at the same rate and blacks are still more likely to be searched and even based on similar Histories blacks are still more likely to be charged more with it.
That's because of two factors: first being that because they're arrested for other reasons with drugs on them they are charges and arrested for it more often (having a charge placed on you only because it was found on you when being arrested for another reason is pretty much a guarantee of arrest). The second is that random searches occur in black communities more, which itself occurs because of the higher crime and violent crime rate, which is why it happens regardless of the racial makeup of police forces. Black or white majority, it happens because the areas with worst crime are patrolled and searched more.
Also Nixon was the one who started the war on drugs and when Reagan was in office the prison population still spiked
That I will admit I did not know, though that doesn't change the fact that the mass incarceration of African Americans everyone complains about happened because of House Clinton.
[No no I said arrest not charged blacks are still arrested for it despite using it at the same rate and blacks are still more likely to be searched and even based on similar Histories blacks are still more likely to be charged more with it.
That's because of two factors: first being that because they're arrested for other reasons with drugs on them they are charges and arrested for it more often (having a charge placed on you only because it was found on you when being arrested for another reason is pretty much a guarantee of arrest). The second is that random searches occur in black communities more, which itself occurs because of the higher crime and violent crime rate, which is why it happens regardless of the racial makeup of police forces. Black or white majority, it happens because the areas with worst crime are patrolled and searched more.
The study itself only count drug possessions if it was for anything else then it would say it also the cops find more drugs and weapons from white people cars so it doesn't make sense for them to search blacks more. Another thing is that white America had Heroin problem not to long ago because of the lack of police in the white community so which proves my point that the "War on drugs" is was ment to police poor and minority communities.
That I will admit I did not know, though that doesn't change the fact that the mass incarceration of African Americans everyone complains about happened because of House Clinton.
It also happened because of the House of Reagan especially from Nancy Reagan anti drug campaign and the House of Bush didn't really make it better with the increase militarization of the police. No president regardless of being Republican or Democrat so far has been lax with the "War on Drugs" so far and black and latino people are still getting hurt for it.
Well that's not necessarily true at all. It's about the execution more so than them just being 'furry'. I mean, for one you have the myraid of Disney movies that prints money that often involve pure furry and animal characters in a romantic situation. Or do you need to be reminded that Lion King features literal cartoon lions that's only human characteristics are talking and emotional gestures. Hell at one point they even had the fuck me bedroom eyes going on.
Then you have Zootopia that was as FurAffinity Furry as you can get an no shortage of people being attracted to Judy Hopps despite her basically being a talking Rabbit.
This isn't going in to other films such as Fantastic Mr.Fox, Cars, Happy Feet, Ice Age etc. that feature mostly animals and/or anthropomorphic objects that still had sensual appeal.
Let's not stray from what the original criticism of this thread is. When it comes to Western media and their designing of monstrous women- at any given point the women can be any of those percentage points and nobody would give a shit.
However when it comes to Japanese anime, regardless of how the opposite sex of the same species looks like the women are ALWAYS designed to be 10-15% furry so to speak and if it's above that by like 30% we are praising it for it's 'original' monster designs and how fucking out there they are.
You made the claim that anime is the one medium where they 'take a spin' on the original origins. But they don't. They simply strip away 98% of what makes Orcs, Orcs and just make them cute girls with tusks. That's not 'taking a spin' on anything.
Taking a spin on the orc trope is what Elder Scrolls did with their orcs.
They aren't brutish low intelligence mob enemies. They are a culture of Mer that were cursed to what they are due to their God being tricked by another and cast aside as a pariah. Due to that they were shunned by other races and they built a strong community of hardwork, blacksmith, and warrior mindset to survive in a world that doesn't like them. Even then you have plenty of Orc NPCs and side characters that range from being mages, librarians, cooks, etc.
Taking an Orc or a Dwarf woman and making her look like a cute moe isn't taking any 'spin' on the tropes of their respective races. Especially when anime is literally bloated to bursting with girls being cute and moe.
And judging from the previous page anime has already done dwarves and it's exactly as unoriginal and cliche as you would expect it to be. Just cute loli girls. They aren't even stocky in any way, and if you hadn't told me that they were dwarves I literally would of thought none the wiser.
yeah there are more male "ugly monsters" but usually it's for justifying killing them rather then other reasons.
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Monster boys are allowed to be MONSTER boys. They are allowed to be characters that exist outside of 'how hard can I fap to this' box that monster girls are often locked in as
Well to our persepctive, but to say a Brit, Australian... Or an Israeli like inu-kun. North America is the foreign market, though mostly where media comes from, not so much were media is exported to though.
The discussion was about American media, the implication is that the North American domestic market is not part of the foreign market when talking about these issues.
I don't know where you got that impression actually... It was a comparison between East Asian and Western media being made in regards to LGBT representation. Specifically a rather silly concept that anime has better representation, when it really doesn't, at least where homosexual characters are concerned.
Zontar said:
KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
I really don't think that asking for enough normalization where being outed as trans, or gay won't result in being beaten, or being refused service, a job, or housing... That's a pretty big issue and minimizing it from a cis/straight position doesn't actually make it any less of an issue. The big battles haven't been "won", even marriage equality in the US, if Trump is elected and puts his first choice on the bench for the SCotUS, there is a chance that marriage equality will be brought back and reversed by the supreme court.
The vast majority (+90%) of every Western nation, even the United States, is against these things. As it stands the largest fights, that against the strong arm of the law, is over in most places, with pretty much every territory having the refusal of service or housing on the basis of being LGBT being illegal (though we do have a very serious problem these days of people not going to legal authorities when something illegal happens). Jobs are another matter, and are a fight that needs to be fought.
And no, Trump isn't suddenly going to become anti-gay while also stuffing the SCotUS with enough far right judges to reverse the nation wide legalisation of gay marriage. I know many like to paint him as literally hitler but that's overblowing it
Actually in the US only 23 states have any equal employment and housing protections for LGBT people, and a majority of 27 states lack those protections. Also a lot of states are doing this "religious freedom restoration act" crap, which is specifically worded so that LGBT people can be discriminated against, regardless of what other laws say, just because of someones supposed "deeply held religious beliefs".
This is a perfect example: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/08/in-michigan-its-totally-legal-to-fire-trans-people-for-their-gender-identity/496559/
Then you factor in the fact that 28 percent of Americans think being gay should be illegal: http://www.gallup.com/poll/1651/gay-lesbian-rights.aspx
As for Trump? Well let's see, he picked Mike Pence as his running mate, that's a man who is a vehemently anti-LGBT politician. Trump spoke at an anti-LGBT closed doors hate gathering in Orlando exactly on the two month anniversary Pulse shooting. He flip-flopped on the bathroom debate, backing the patently transphobic and homophobic law that is HB 2. Seriously HB2 nullified all municipally instituted LGBT protections state wide and banned new ones from being put in, while North Carolina has no LGBT protections at the state level. His short list of judges for the SCotUS is composed of social conservatives with histories of voting against LGBT protections. Don't kid yourself or me here man, Trump being elected won't be good for the LGBT community, legally speaking it could easily result in our civil rights being set back half a century. He's not Hitler, but he's definitely not an ally of LGBT people, period.
Zontar said:
KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
When you can be fired for being LGBT, when you can be denied a job because of it, when you can be denied housing and even evicted from your home for being LGBT
You can be fired, dined a job, evicted from your home, and denied housing by land lords all for being LGBT in most of the US. Not "some parts" that are particularly backwards, in most states that's all perfectly legal, and there are no protections for us at the federal law level. Think about that.
Zontar said:
KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
Either Canada is a wonderland of acceptance, or you're very sheltered and don't have any clue what it's like to actually be a LGBT person.
Yeah, so have you been abused by your own family for the arbitrary reason of being Anglo, denied a job, and physically assaulted for the same thing? I don't mean pushed or shoved either, I mean beaten within an inch of your life, or raped, in a "good neighborhood" no less. Because that's a common experience for LGBT people.
Zontar said:
KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
I lean towards the latter because I know a trans person who lives in a really very LGBT heavy section of Toronto, who is also bombarded with hate near her home every day by "Christian activists", who are looking to repeal what few protections she has under the law.
Well others say Montreal isn't much better for LGBT folk either. I seriously doubt you have to worry about being jumped beaten outside an Anglo centric bar, like a LGBT person does coming out of an alternative bar that caters to them. Which still happens
Also a trans person going to the cops, who at best will tell them "too bad, fuck off", but is fairly likely to arrest them on the grounds of suspecting them of being a prostitute, simply because they're being trans. When 57-67% of trans people surveyed say they were disrespected, or harassed by the police... While a 60-70 report being the victim of physical or sexual violence at the hands of police... You Think trans people are going to go to the police for help, when the police are probably just going to victimize them further? Not very likely is it? Source: http://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/AFSP-Williams-Suicide-Report-Final.pdf
Zontar said:
KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
Being able to evict LGBT people from their apartments, or able to refuse to tent to them because they're LGBT
Unless the United States has secretly changed the law regarding this in the past few weeks this is the type of situation one should, as stated already, deal with it with authorities because the current laws on the book prevent it.
I didn't say it was a side issue, I said compared to the real battles it's not as significant. Two very different things where one is true and one is not.
These are the real battles, they are significant, and you're minimizing. The LGBT does not get the benefit of most of the civil rights protections offered in the civil rights act of 1964. That is major, it's significant, it's freaking more important than marriage-equality actually is. You know, because basic civil rights are what make it possible to have a life worth living to start with...
I'm not even going to address that last part because you're looking at the things that are biasing people positively to Asian Americans, who benefit from a ton of positive stereotypes... When the negative stereotypes associated with the Latinx and African American communities are part of what prevent them from even getthing their foots in the door to improve their situation in most cases.
*Sigh* True. Sadly true. I wasn't trying to say that other mediums were perfect, just that the idea that anime was somehow better was utterly untrue. For the reasons you pointed out. I didn't mention it in my original reply but I have a gay friend who utterly hates yaoi because to paraphrase him, it was homosexuality as understood by straight Japanese housewives.
*Sigh* True. Sadly true. I wasn't trying to say that other mediums were perfect, just that the idea that anime was somehow better was utterly untrue. For the reasons you pointed out. I didn't mention it in my original reply but I have a gay friend who utterly hates yaoi because to paraphrase him, it was homosexuality as understood by straight Japanese housewives.
Actually yaoi was coined because of how gay boys were presented to the shojo audience. So Yaoi is what male homosexuality as understood by horny hormonal straight teenage Japanese girls.
*Sigh* True. Sadly true. I wasn't trying to say that other mediums were perfect, just that the idea that anime was somehow better was utterly untrue. For the reasons you pointed out. I didn't mention it in my original reply but I have a gay friend who utterly hates yaoi because to paraphrase him, it was homosexuality as understood by straight Japanese housewives.
Actually yaoi was coined because of how gay boys were presented to the shojo audience. So Yaoi is what male homosexuality as understood by horny hormonal straight teenage Japanese girls.
Sadly I think your about as likely to get women like that as I am to get a fantasy story where we actually get female dwarves with beards. Not likely, as neither line up with the popular desire.
(Seriously, if there's one thing I like about the Hobbit movies, it's that Gimili's mom has a bigass beard)
Sadly I think your about as likely to get women like that as I am to get a fantasy story where we actually get female dwarves with beards. Not likely, as neither line up with the popular desire.
(Seriously, if there's one thing I like about the Hobbit movies, it's that Gimili's mom has a bigass beard)
Less than that, about as likely as having a chubby or overweight woman as a main character in an anime. Oh they exist, rarely, but the few times they do they're always made to be intentionally repulsive or antagonistic, or they're mostly side or background characters. Not to mention they're mostly ridiculed just for the sin of not being a perfect anime girl.
Ya just don't see them look this good on purpose!
And yes, obviously there are overweight male characters that are ridiculed or come of as dirtbags. Hell, my favorite overweight male character is Kohta Hirano from the Highschool of the Dead "franchise" and he gets fucked over more times than a schoolgirl in... literally any anime porn you can think of. But there are SHIT. TONS. of them, so there are wider ranges in personality and character dev..
Which is why, I think it is far less likely to see female monsters when anime can barely show normal imperfections in human women and yet take almost sexual pleasure in showing ever wrinkle, wart, age spot, and ingrown hair in any male character.
Sadly I think your about as likely to get women like that as I am to get a fantasy story where we actually get female dwarves with beards. Not likely, as neither line up with the popular desire.
(Seriously, if there's one thing I like about the Hobbit movies, it's that Gimili's mom has a bigass beard)
Less than that, about as likely as having a chubby or overweight woman as a main character in an anime. Oh they exist, rarely, but the few times they do they're always made to be intentionally repulsive or antagonistic, or they're mostly side or background characters. Not to mention they're mostly ridiculed just for the sin of not being a perfect anime girl.
Ya just don't see them look this good on purpose!
And yes, obviously there are overweight male characters that are ridiculed or come of as dirtbags. Hell, my favorite overweight male character is Kohta Hirano from the Highschool of the Dead "franchise" and he gets fucked over more times than a schoolgirl in... literally any anime porn you can think of. But there are SHIT. TONS. of them, so there are wider ranges in personality and character dev..
Which is why, I think it is far less likely to see female monsters when anime can barely show normal imperfections in human women and yet take almost sexual pleasure in showing ever wrinkle, wart, age spot, and ingrown hair in any male character.
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