Do you torrent? (pun most definitely intended)

[perfectimo]

so, what you are saying is because you can copy it and play it for free, you should have that right? regardless of whether you pay for it in the end or not, its ok for you to steal something because "it doesn't hurt anyone" even though it quite clearly does?

Dear god, this is worse than an atheist vs Christian debate.

You have my view, you have my point. Done. It doesn't hurt anyone because I pay for it. It only hurts the developer if I don't pay for it. Which I don't.

All you're saying is that I should buy games even if they're a horribly putrid piece of crap. I've made all my damn points in my past few posts and although I'm getting tired of repeating myself, I obviously can't get it through your head. This is probably the only industry where you have to deal with it. You can't return a shitty product, even though if it was *anything* else, like a TV, or a car, or a telephone, whatever, you would be able to.

It "hurts" them because you *expect* me to put up with shitty products.

Did you know that you can't return most products solely on the basis that you didn't like it? Also I don't think you realise how wrong you are.

Here is an example of something non-tangible: You want to buy a certain model car. The problem arises that you can't test drive it and have no way of physically testing the vehicle yourself. So, from my understanding of your reasoning, the only way to fix this problem is to "borrow" the car from a dealership and then return it if you don't like it and if you do like it you might buy it?

EDIT: Grammar

 

[jim_doki]

zeph, if you dont pay, you dont get to play. the fact that you're done within a week of playing it doesn't justify stealing it. I want a ferarri, if i steal it i go to jail

 

[Mariena]

It "hurts" them because you *expect* me to put up with shitty products.

thats called being a consumer. sometimes you win, sometimes you dont. this is why you do research, like I mentioned several posts ago. the trick is to stop buying once they let you down

Funny. I have uncovered this trick many years ago, like I mentioned several posts ago. Hence the whole reason I decided to go with the "try before you buy" policy on games.

 

[thedo12]

I deserve free shit because it's there, regardless of who gets hurt. in the times we are living in it's the industry's fault I'm stealing from them

its not stealing, its "copyright infringment",

 

[jim_doki]

its not a trick, its the way the world works

EDIT

if anyone can show me a legitimate difference between stealing and copywrite infringement i will shut up and never post here again

 

[Zephirius]

Like I said, I don't think it's right. I just don't really care. I try not to torrent games by small companies, but the big ones will pay their developers regardless of whether I buy it. Sure, some get fired, but that's hardly due to piracy, more likely due to poor sales performance. And no, most people are not, in fact, pirates. You can't blame piracy for a poor sales performance entirely, it has to have something to do with the quality too, and perhaps the marketing, which is all on the company.

Stop comparing this stuff to stealing cars. If I torrent a version of a game it is completely unlike stealing a car. Stealing a car means that the car is yours now, not their former owners'. Which means that they will miss it. I am not copying the data from the developers' hard drives and erasing them afterward. NO, I am not saying this makes it right, just pointing out your shitty comparisons.

 

[thedo12]

its not a trick, its the way the world works

and like I said, its the information age the world is changeing rapidly.

 

[jim_doki]

its not a trick, its the way the world works

and like I said, its the information age the world is changeing rapidly.

and that gives you the right to overhaul economics? Why should you get something for free when it's being sold? that's really the crux of the issue here

 

[perfectimo]

its not a trick, its the way the world works

EDIT

if anyone can show me a legitimate difference between stealing and copywrite infringement i will shut up and never post here again

The spelling?

 

[Mariena]

Like I said, I don't think it's right. I just don't really care. I try not to torrent games by small companies, but the big ones will pay their developers regardless of whether I buy it. Sure, some get fired, but that's hardly due to piracy, more likely due to poor sales performance. And no, most people are not, in fact, pirates. You can't blame piracy for a poor sales performance entirely, it has to have something to do with the quality too, and perhaps the marketing, which is all on the company.

Stop comparing this stuff to stealing cars. If I torrent a version of a game it is completely unlike stealing a car. Stealing a car means that the car is yours now, not their former owners'. Which means that they will miss it. I am not copying the data from the developers' hard drives and erasing them afterward. NO, I am not saying this makes it right, just pointing out your shitty comparisons.

Quoted. For. Truth.

I am done here, because I am not getting through your thick skulls. I will happily continue to try my games before I support the developers that deserve their money. If you want to buy every shitty game out there only to realise it's a piece of junk and have it shelved for the rest of eternity... be my guest. I, for one, am not putting up with this.

 

[thedo12]

its not a trick, its the way the world works

and like I said, its the information age the world is changeing rapidly.

and that gives you the right to overhaul economics? Why should you get something for free when it's being sold? that's really the crux of the issue here

its not my fualt their model is outdated,

this site makes money, it dosent pyshicaly sell you anything (as far as I know) their cacthing on, why cant game developers?

 

[jim_doki]

Like I said, I don't think it's right. I just don't really care. I try not to torrent games by small companies, but the big ones will pay their developers regardless of whether I buy it. Sure, some get fired, but that's hardly due to piracy, more likely due to poor sales performance. And no, most people are not, in fact, pirates. You can't blame piracy for a poor sales performance entirely, it has to have something to do with the quality too, and perhaps the marketing, which is all on the company.

Stop comparing this stuff to stealing cars. If I torrent a version of a game it is completely unlike stealing a car. Stealing a car means that the car is yours now, not their former owners'. Which means that they will miss it. I am not copying the data from the developers' hard drives and erasing them afterward. NO, I am not saying this makes it right, just pointing out your shitty comparisons.

Where do these companies get the money to pay their developers?

Where's the incentive to make better games if you're just going to steal them?

do you have a problem with my burger comparison too, or are you just one of these people who think you can't steal anything you can't touch?

EDIT

its not my fualt their model is outdated,

this site makes money, it dosent pyshicaly sell you anything (as far as I know) their cacthing on, why cant game developers?

this site makes money because it sells Ad space to people. you will notice most of the ads here are for games. they have started this website and we use it for free, but we have to look a the ads in the same way commercial TV is free. The difference between that and taking a game for sale is The Escapist doesn't expect it's readers to pay to be here. So are you saying you think that games should have more product placement and things?

this is a legit question, because i dont think it's that bad of an idea

 

[perfectimo]

Like I said, I don't think it's right. I just don't really care. I try not to torrent games by small companies, but the big ones will pay their developers regardless of whether I buy it. Sure, some get fired, but that's hardly due to piracy, more likely due to poor sales performance. And no, most people are not, in fact, pirates. You can't blame piracy for a poor sales performance entirely, it has to have something to do with the quality too, and perhaps the marketing, which is all on the company.

Stop comparing this stuff to stealing cars. If I torrent a version of a game it is completely unlike stealing a car. Stealing a car means that the car is yours now, not their former owners'. Which means that they will miss it. I am not copying the data from the developers' hard drives and erasing them afterward. NO, I am not saying this makes it right, just pointing out your shitty comparisons.

Quoted. For. Truth.

I am done here, because I am not getting through your thick skulls. I will happily continue to try my games before I support the developers that deserve their money. If you want to buy every shitty game out there only to realise it's a piece of junk and have it shelved for the rest of eternity... be my guest. I, for one, am not putting up with this.

I'm replying to both here.

If you read my post correctly you would have noticed I said something along the lines of "it's like borrowing a car then returning it the next day without permission" which is, and I stress this, exactly the same circumstance as copying a game.

Bye and thanks for posting. I'm sorry my thick skull, which shouldn't stop me from understanding a point of view, can't be gotten through to by you.

 

[thedo12]

Like I said, I don't think it's right. I just don't really care. I try not to torrent games by small companies, but the big ones will pay their developers regardless of whether I buy it. Sure, some get fired, but that's hardly due to piracy, more likely due to poor sales performance. And no, most people are not, in fact, pirates. You can't blame piracy for a poor sales performance entirely, it has to have something to do with the quality too, and perhaps the marketing, which is all on the company.

Stop comparing this stuff to stealing cars. If I torrent a version of a game it is completely unlike stealing a car. Stealing a car means that the car is yours now, not their former owners'. Which means that they will miss it. I am not copying the data from the developers' hard drives and erasing them afterward. NO, I am not saying this makes it right, just pointing out your shitty comparisons.

Quoted. For. Truth.

I am done here, because I am not getting through your thick skulls. I will happily continue to try my games before I support the developers that deserve their money. If you want to buy every shitty game out there only to realise it's a piece of junk and have it shelved for the rest of eternity... be my guest. I, for one, am not putting up with this.

I'm replying to both here.

If you read my post correctly you would have noticed I said something along the lines of "it's like borrowing a car then returning it the next day without permission" which is, and I stress this, exactly the same circumstance as copying a game.

Bye and thanks for posting. I'm sorry my thick skull, which shouldn't stop me from understanding a point of view, can't be gotten through to by you.

no, when borrowing a car your taking, a PYSCHICAL COPY of said item, said game dosent exsit in the real world.


anyways, most dealers let you test drive their veichles anyways, why cant game developers.

 

[perfectimo]

no, when borrowing a car your taking, a PYSCHICAL COPY of said item, said game dosent exsit in the real world.


anyways, most dealers let you test drive their veichles anyways, why cant game developers.

And when you take a game you are taking a physical copy too, a hard drive isn't imaginary.

So because one industry let's people test their product and another doesn't you must steal a copy and justify it by saying that "if they had demos blah blah blah", that's ridiculous.

 

[thedo12]

this site makes money because it sells Ad space to people. you will notice most of the ads here are for games. they have started this website and we use it for free, but we have to look a the ads in the same way commercial TV is free. The difference between that and taking a game for sale is The Escapist doesn't expect it's readers to pay to be here. So are you saying you think that games should have more product placement and things?

this is a legit question, because i dont think it's that bad of an idea

if thats the way they want to make money then yes , more power to them.

they can lower prices, and therefore sell more copies, and therefore make more money, magizine companies have been doing it for years.

 

[thedo12]

And when you take a game you are taking a physical copy too, a hard drive isn't imaginary.

So because one industry let's people test their product and another doesn't you must steal a copy and justify it by saying that "if they had demos blah blah blah", that's ridiculous.

no your not taking a pyshical copy, your making a duplicate made out of information at negliable cost.

your not stealing a copy, your creating a copy and then taking the copy you created.

its like saying making a mercades is stealing, becuase you would have bought a mercades if you didnt make one.

 

[perfectimo]

And when you take a game you are taking a physical copy too, a hard drive isn't imaginary.

So because one industry let's people test their product and another doesn't you must steal a copy and justify it by saying that "if they had demos blah blah blah", that's ridiculous.

no your not taking a pyshical copy, your making a duplicate made out of information at negliable cost.

your not stealing a copy, your creating a copy and then taking the copy you created.

its like saying making a mercades is stealing, becuase you would have bought a mercades if you didnt make one.

So you are certain that copying data isn't the same because it's information? That "information" you speak of is actually physical, not to the human eye though, and a hard drive or CD burner is making another physical version of this without permission, please understand stealing is taking something without the owner consent, and by doing so you are stealing in the same way that counterfeiting is stealing.

If someone started talking the same as you, dressing like you and acting exactly like you would you say that they are stealing your image? Or would you say, just so you can be right about piracy, that they are copying your image which is not stealing because they didn't take anything physical from you?

Making a copy of a Mercedes is stealing, do you actually know what stealing is in all it's senses?

 

[Chekov]

No torrenting in covered areas. Sorry.

I don't torrent. I have, But not now. 1gb download cap ftw!

 

[s-l-u-g]

Usually i'll only torrent movies, Because i have a huge love for asian horrors and if i buy them off t'internet it'll come in region 1 and i dont have a multi-region player ;[ And it's really hard to find an english site to buy them off [i dont trust ebay, too many HORROR stories ;p]
If i can't afford a pc game i MIGHT resort to torrenting but usually i'll give up and pay up.. there's always a good game with just 5 seeds.