DOAX3 officially not being localized for the west

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Dreiko_v1legacy

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erttheking said:
Dreiko said:
You do know that it turns out that this had nothing to do with SJWs right?

https://twitter.com/koeitecmoeurope/status/669507094584950784

This says they don't approve that the blame was put on anyone, not that putting it there was a mistake, just that they shouldn't have revealed the reason. It still is the reason even if you don't publicly reveal it. Think about it, the company wants to make SJW type issues not be talked about in their page enough to not bring the game over. It stands to reason they'd not want to poke the hornet's nest and that in their eyes it'd be a bad pr move to put the blame where it belongs.
 

Erttheking

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Dreiko said:
erttheking said:
Dreiko said:
You do know that it turns out that this had nothing to do with SJWs right?

https://twitter.com/koeitecmoeurope/status/669507094584950784

This says they don't approve that the blame was put on anyone, not that putting it there was a mistake, just that they shouldn't have revealed the reason. It still is the reason even if you don't publicly reveal it. Think about it, the company wants to make SJW type issues not be talked about in their page enough to not bring the game over. It stands to reason they'd not want to poke the hornet's nest and that in their eyes it'd be a bad pr move to put the blame where it belongs.
So in other words because they didn't word it in an exact way you're insisting that it WAS the fault of SJWs? The company wants SJW issues to not be talked about, based on the comment made that they are now condemning. It really does feel like you've already made up your mind that it was SJWs based on that one comment, even though the company is now denying it.

As for not poking the hornet's nest, it's already been poked.
 

crimson5pheonix

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erttheking said:
Dreiko said:
erttheking said:
Dreiko said:
You do know that it turns out that this had nothing to do with SJWs right?

https://twitter.com/koeitecmoeurope/status/669507094584950784

This says they don't approve that the blame was put on anyone, not that putting it there was a mistake, just that they shouldn't have revealed the reason. It still is the reason even if you don't publicly reveal it. Think about it, the company wants to make SJW type issues not be talked about in their page enough to not bring the game over. It stands to reason they'd not want to poke the hornet's nest and that in their eyes it'd be a bad pr move to put the blame where it belongs.
So in other words because they didn't word it in an exact way you're insisting that it WAS the fault of SJWs? The company wants SJW issues to not be talked about, based on the comment made that they are now condemning. It really does feel like you've already made up your mind that it was SJWs based on that one comment, even though the company is now denying it.

As for not poking the hornet's nest, it's already been poked.
Well this company branch is also supportive of [https://twitter.com/koeitecmoeurope/status/669451694107947008] Play-Asia [https://twitter.com/koeitecmoeurope/status/669156347213127681] and, as Dreiko said, haven't really denied that it's true. [https://twitter.com/koeitecmoeurope/status/669161772906061825]
 

Ogoid

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Dreiko said:
This says they don't approve that the blame was put on anyone, not that putting it there was a mistake, just that they shouldn't have revealed the reason. It still is the reason even if you don't publicly reveal it. Think about it, the company wants to make SJW type issues not be talked about in their page enough to not bring the game over. It stands to reason they'd not want to poke the hornet's nest and that in their eyes it'd be a bad pr move to put the blame where it belongs.
Aye, seems pretty consistent to me that a company whose stated reason not to bring a game to the West was fear of a possible controversy would distance themselves from an actual controversy.
 

Dreiko_v1legacy

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erttheking said:
Dreiko said:
erttheking said:
Dreiko said:
You do know that it turns out that this had nothing to do with SJWs right?

https://twitter.com/koeitecmoeurope/status/669507094584950784

This says they don't approve that the blame was put on anyone, not that putting it there was a mistake, just that they shouldn't have revealed the reason. It still is the reason even if you don't publicly reveal it. Think about it, the company wants to make SJW type issues not be talked about in their page enough to not bring the game over. It stands to reason they'd not want to poke the hornet's nest and that in their eyes it'd be a bad pr move to put the blame where it belongs.
So in other words because they didn't word it in an exact way you're insisting that it WAS the fault of SJWs? The company wants SJW issues to not be talked about, based on the comment made that they are now condemning. It really does feel like you've already made up your mind that it was SJWs based on that one comment, even though the company is now denying it.

As for not poking the hornet's nest, it's already been poked.
When one statement is not exact and the prior one is exact, one ought to put more weight on the exact one. They're still not condemning the comment, just the part of it where it reveals more than they wish to reveal, they still describe it as "honest".

I didn't "already" make up my mind in a sense that I did so without any information due to bias. There's no "already", they made a clear statement so I made my mind based on it. In the subsequent one they didn't clarify that the prior one is untrue, just that it's not something they'd wish to have said. It's like calling a fat person fat and saying "I shouldn't have said that" afterwards, this just means that it was impolite to say whatever it is that you said, not that the thing you said is actually untrue.
 

TheTygre

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I have to wonder how much of this hypothetical avoided controversy is based on certain characters in DoA and now DoAX.
 

TheMysteriousGX

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That's a good point. I mean, why localize for Europe if you didn't want to deal with Sweden again or whatever. Makes much more sense than being scared of hypothetical game reviews they didn't give half a shit about before.

Dealing with some grumpy governments or ratings boards for a game that's probably not going to sell very well? Ehh, we'll just let folks import.
 

K12

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I think the fact that this thread has been full of people saying "this is terrible, damn those SJWS" and barely anyone saying "this is terrible, I really wanted to play this" might say something about why this isn't getting localised.

I hadn't even heard that this game was being made until now and this now people are talking about... and of course if they now change their mind and localise the game down the line they can probably get a lot of the "screw the SJWs" dollars that games like "Hatred" managed to rake in. The alternative to making an engaging game is to wrap a dull game up in an engaging controversy.

Having said that maybe I'm overestimated the subtle intelligence of a group of people capable of making the first few Dead of Alive Beach Volleyball games.
 
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K12 said:
I think the fact that this thread has been full of people saying "this is terrible, damn those SJWS" and barely anyone saying "this is terrible, I really wanted to play this" might say something about why this isn't getting localised.

I hadn't even heard that this game was being made until now and this now people are talking about... and of course if they now change their mind and localise the game down the line they can probably get a lot of the "screw the SJWs" dollars that games like "Hatred" managed to rake in. The alternative to making an engaging game is to wrap a dull game up in an engaging controversy.

Having said that maybe I'm overestimated the subtle intelligence of a group of people capable of making the first few Dead of Alive Beach Volleyball games.
I was with you until the last part... Seems needlessly arsey.

It's a niche game to start with, even in Japan really. According to: http://www.vgchartz.com/game/482/dead-or-alive-xtreme-beach-volleyball/ http://www.vgchartz.com/game/481/dead-or-alive-xtreme-2/ North America is actually where they got the most sales on the predecessors.

Seems like NA is actually the key territory, so maybe their reluctance is due to social pressure and fear of their brand-name being forever associated with the accusations levied at them by Western media.
 

nomotog_v1legacy

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Sexual Harassment Panda said:
K12 said:
I think the fact that this thread has been full of people saying "this is terrible, damn those SJWS" and barely anyone saying "this is terrible, I really wanted to play this" might say something about why this isn't getting localised.

I hadn't even heard that this game was being made until now and this now people are talking about... and of course if they now change their mind and localise the game down the line they can probably get a lot of the "screw the SJWs" dollars that games like "Hatred" managed to rake in. The alternative to making an engaging game is to wrap a dull game up in an engaging controversy.

Having said that maybe I'm overestimated the subtle intelligence of a group of people capable of making the first few Dead of Alive Beach Volleyball games.
I was with you until the last part... Seems needlessly arsey.

It's a niche game to start with, even in Japan really. According to: http://www.vgchartz.com/game/482/dead-or-alive-xtreme-beach-volleyball/ http://www.vgchartz.com/game/481/dead-or-alive-xtreme-2/ North America is actually where they got the most sales on the predecessors.

Seems like NA is actually the key territory, so maybe their reluctance is due to social pressure and fear of their brand-name being forever associated with the accusations levied at them by Western media.
I the fact that they get more sales in NA brought out as an excuse that the game will sell in NA, but I don't know if that is the case. You have to keep in mind NA is much much bigger then japan. Any game would sell more units in NA, but your capturing a much much smaller % then it looks. Though the real bugbear is distribution. Because NA is so big, the cost to get the game in stores is a lot higher. The density might not be enough. (Then you know localization is a thing.)
 

Dreiko_v1legacy

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nomotog said:
Sexual Harassment Panda said:
K12 said:
I think the fact that this thread has been full of people saying "this is terrible, damn those SJWS" and barely anyone saying "this is terrible, I really wanted to play this" might say something about why this isn't getting localised.

I hadn't even heard that this game was being made until now and this now people are talking about... and of course if they now change their mind and localise the game down the line they can probably get a lot of the "screw the SJWs" dollars that games like "Hatred" managed to rake in. The alternative to making an engaging game is to wrap a dull game up in an engaging controversy.

Having said that maybe I'm overestimated the subtle intelligence of a group of people capable of making the first few Dead of Alive Beach Volleyball games.
I was with you until the last part... Seems needlessly arsey.

It's a niche game to start with, even in Japan really. According to: http://www.vgchartz.com/game/482/dead-or-alive-xtreme-beach-volleyball/ http://www.vgchartz.com/game/481/dead-or-alive-xtreme-2/ North America is actually where they got the most sales on the predecessors.

Seems like NA is actually the key territory, so maybe their reluctance is due to social pressure and fear of their brand-name being forever associated with the accusations levied at them by Western media.
I the fact that they get more sales in NA brought out as an excuse that the game will sell in NA, but I don't know if that is the case. You have to keep in mind NA is much much bigger then japan. Any game would sell more units in NA, but your capturing a much much smaller % then it looks. Though the real bugbear is distribution. Because NA is so big, the cost to get the game in stores is a lot higher. The density might not be enough. (Then you know localization is a thing.)
They could just release it digital-only if the distribution really is such an issue, then.


Honestly, I find this reason quite ridiculous if you wish to justify not bringing the game over at all with it.
 

nomotog_v1legacy

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Dreiko said:
nomotog said:
Sexual Harassment Panda said:
K12 said:
I think the fact that this thread has been full of people saying "this is terrible, damn those SJWS" and barely anyone saying "this is terrible, I really wanted to play this" might say something about why this isn't getting localised.

I hadn't even heard that this game was being made until now and this now people are talking about... and of course if they now change their mind and localise the game down the line they can probably get a lot of the "screw the SJWs" dollars that games like "Hatred" managed to rake in. The alternative to making an engaging game is to wrap a dull game up in an engaging controversy.

Having said that maybe I'm overestimated the subtle intelligence of a group of people capable of making the first few Dead of Alive Beach Volleyball games.
I was with you until the last part... Seems needlessly arsey.

It's a niche game to start with, even in Japan really. According to: http://www.vgchartz.com/game/482/dead-or-alive-xtreme-beach-volleyball/ http://www.vgchartz.com/game/481/dead-or-alive-xtreme-2/ North America is actually where they got the most sales on the predecessors.

Seems like NA is actually the key territory, so maybe their reluctance is due to social pressure and fear of their brand-name being forever associated with the accusations levied at them by Western media.
I the fact that they get more sales in NA brought out as an excuse that the game will sell in NA, but I don't know if that is the case. You have to keep in mind NA is much much bigger then japan. Any game would sell more units in NA, but your capturing a much much smaller % then it looks. Though the real bugbear is distribution. Because NA is so big, the cost to get the game in stores is a lot higher. The density might not be enough. (Then you know localization is a thing.)
They could just release it digital-only if the distribution really is such an issue, then.


Honestly, I find this reason quite ridiculous if you wish to justify not bringing the game over at all with it.
If they have that infrastructure, then ya they can do that. I kind of wonder why that isn't more of an option with Japanese games. I mean there are a lot of games that they aren't shipping here not simply one.
 

Dreiko_v1legacy

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nomotog said:
Dreiko said:
nomotog said:
Sexual Harassment Panda said:
K12 said:
I think the fact that this thread has been full of people saying "this is terrible, damn those SJWS" and barely anyone saying "this is terrible, I really wanted to play this" might say something about why this isn't getting localised.

I hadn't even heard that this game was being made until now and this now people are talking about... and of course if they now change their mind and localise the game down the line they can probably get a lot of the "screw the SJWs" dollars that games like "Hatred" managed to rake in. The alternative to making an engaging game is to wrap a dull game up in an engaging controversy.

Having said that maybe I'm overestimated the subtle intelligence of a group of people capable of making the first few Dead of Alive Beach Volleyball games.
I was with you until the last part... Seems needlessly arsey.

It's a niche game to start with, even in Japan really. According to: http://www.vgchartz.com/game/482/dead-or-alive-xtreme-beach-volleyball/ http://www.vgchartz.com/game/481/dead-or-alive-xtreme-2/ North America is actually where they got the most sales on the predecessors.

Seems like NA is actually the key territory, so maybe their reluctance is due to social pressure and fear of their brand-name being forever associated with the accusations levied at them by Western media.
I the fact that they get more sales in NA brought out as an excuse that the game will sell in NA, but I don't know if that is the case. You have to keep in mind NA is much much bigger then japan. Any game would sell more units in NA, but your capturing a much much smaller % then it looks. Though the real bugbear is distribution. Because NA is so big, the cost to get the game in stores is a lot higher. The density might not be enough. (Then you know localization is a thing.)
They could just release it digital-only if the distribution really is such an issue, then.


Honestly, I find this reason quite ridiculous if you wish to justify not bringing the game over at all with it.
If they have that infrastructure, then ya they can do that. I kind of wonder why that isn't more of an option with Japanese games. I mean there are a lot of games that they aren't shipping here not simply one.

There need not be a special infrastructure. The game is on ps4/vita. PSN already exists. Almost every game that is released is released digitally on psn as well as in stores nowadays.

In the past they DID release some psn digital only games, in fact. (the Atelier plus remakes) So if they wished they certainly could do it here too.
 

hentropy

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Dreiko said:
It's the precedent it sets. Censorship is insidious like that. First they come for the boobs and ass simulator and nobody gives a damn but by the time things "mainstream westerners" tend to like are getting disallowed it'd be already too late. You can't say "this one thing, this one is just vile enough that it's ok to censor it" because who is to say what is "vile enough". You may draw the line at this game but someone could draw it at something like GTA, someone could draw it at God of War. The only 100% surefire way to ensure that we can keep having the games we actually like is not allowing anything to be censored.
"Censorship" of that kind happens all the time, however, especially with content from Japan. A manga called Kodomo no Jikan was planned for localization, and shouted down by groups in the US because the main child character takes a bath with her uncle, something not unheard of outside the US. Nobody cared about that censorship or the precedent it set, they only care when there's SJWs involved.

Right there, just now, I lied to you. In fact it was opposed for its over-the-top and rather persistent and pedophilic themes, but it's an example of the way these things can be framed to manipulate people's emotions. Still, the point still mostly stands, first they come for the softcore pedo stuff, then for the grown up T&A, then we're gassing Jews for microaggressions. Slippery slope!

The fact is that no one is entitled to these things, the developer made a conscious decision not to release it in the west for what is probably a litany of reasons (anyone who honestly think business decisions like this are made on any one reason is a tool), it does not constitute insidious censorship, regardless of where the line for "acceptable content" is drawn.
 

SquallTheBlade

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Defective_Detective said:
Paradoxrifts said:
I cannot think of a single instance wherein the localisation of a Japanese game improved the product for the consumer purchasing it. The vast majority of titles would've been objectively better gaming experiences had the unaltered game been available to purchase from Japan, but with English menus, interfaces and subtitles included for non-Japanese consumers who wanted the authentic experience.
What about games like Phoenix Wright? That's a series with an excellent english release localization team behind most of its releases.

(Still waiting for Edgeworth Investigations 2 AAAARGH)

Without localization there'd be a ton of weird Japanese cultural references that would go over many persons heads (especially younger teens), and the series wouldn't have the excellent reputation it has for humor and compelling storytelling if the text was just google-translated subtitles.
Just do it like Steins;Gate did. Once the text references something, you can open a sub-menu with an explanation of the word or phrase so everyone can understand it. I liked it in steins;Gate and would like to see it in other games/VNs too.

I can understand why some folks would like an authentic experience too, but I don't think it's correct to broadly say non-localization results in objectively better games. Not everyone wants that Authentic Made In Japan experience. Many people want the language to be in properly written english text, edited for a westernized context, with english voice acting.
If I didn't want an authentic japanese experience, I wouldn't buy a japanese game. When I'm playing a game from japan, I want everything it had in as authentic as possible but with a language I can understand. That's what translation should be like.
 

Something Amyss

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Lightspeaker said:
In fact I've defended the game numerous times elsewhere against rather more unpleasant crowds than are seen around here for its artistic stylings.
...and if I had said you specifically, or that nobody had ever defended it, this might be relevant. Don't accuse me of insulting you if you're not going to be insulted at what I actually said. I never said it wasn't possible. I specifically said that you lot were "hardly" heard from. That you personally said something doesn't make that true. In fact, the paucity of responses kinda indicates the other way around.

It IS possible to both support Gone Home's existence AND to oppose this kind of societal suppression by conservative attitudes and perspectives.
Basically, you're saying I'm wrong because you've demonstrated something I have not contested. I'm curious as to why.
 

Something Amyss

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undeadsuitor said:
Except America has 3 times the population of Japan, so really adjusted for population size the game sells about the same.
Also factor in that DOAX 1 and 2 were exclusive to consoles which don't sell well in Japan.

I wonder if the end result might be different on a console that does....

nomotog said:
If they have that infrastructure, then ya they can do that. I kind of wonder why that isn't more of an option with Japanese games. I mean there are a lot of games that they aren't shipping here not simply one.
This still requires localisation and will be for a smaller base (at least with consoles). I imagine that if distribution and numbers are a problem, they will likely continue to be going to DD route. And I've seen this come up for non-fetish games before. Just because the store doesn't cost them money anymore doesn't mean there aren't other issues.
 

Dreiko_v1legacy

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hentropy said:
Dreiko said:
It's the precedent it sets. Censorship is insidious like that. First they come for the boobs and ass simulator and nobody gives a damn but by the time things "mainstream westerners" tend to like are getting disallowed it'd be already too late. You can't say "this one thing, this one is just vile enough that it's ok to censor it" because who is to say what is "vile enough". You may draw the line at this game but someone could draw it at something like GTA, someone could draw it at God of War. The only 100% surefire way to ensure that we can keep having the games we actually like is not allowing anything to be censored.
"Censorship" of that kind happens all the time, however, especially with content from Japan. A manga called Kodomo no Jikan was planned for localization, and shouted down by groups in the US because the main child character takes a bath with her uncle, something not unheard of outside the US. Nobody cared about that censorship or the precedent it set, they only care when there's SJWs involved.

Right there, just now, I lied to you. In fact it was opposed for its over-the-top and rather persistent and pedophilic themes, but it's an example of the way these things can be framed to manipulate people's emotions. Still, the point still mostly stands, first they come for the softcore pedo stuff, then for the grown up T&A, then we're gassing Jews for microaggressions. Slippery slope!

The fact is that no one is entitled to these things, the developer made a conscious decision not to release it in the west for what is probably a litany of reasons (anyone who honestly think business decisions like this are made on any one reason is a tool), it does not constitute insidious censorship, regardless of where the line for "acceptable content" is drawn.
First of all I know all about kojika, I believe the scene in question was the one in the gym where they were under the same shirt cause it was cold and the guy was getting an erection, so what you originally mention is factually inaccurate, unlike things in this case here. (as an aside, Kojika is a coming of age story from the eyes of the female protagonist and it deals with sexuality since it is a big part of growing up, even if people are creeped out by it in the west, it's just too culturally different for the west so they couldn't publish it, the author, a woman, was quite surprised by this, in fact. I think it's a gross over-exaggeration to call it softcore pedo stuff)


We are entitled to a free market and if people don't like stuff they can speak with their wallet and not buy it. People aren't entitled to ban content that they don't like.
 

TheMysteriousGX

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Good thing they aren't doing that then.

Besides, DoA is already the "boob physics" fighter. The only criticism T-K would be getting is the exact same stuff they get now. The isn't some new strain of "Super SJW" that's going to be marring a company with a clean rep here.