Dragon Age 2 is actually a Brilliant game!... Sorta, kinda, maybe

[Euryalus]

So now it's the norm to judge games on what they could have been? Or maybe what they should have been? Or if the story was stellar, it doesn't matter that everything else was below par?

First and foremost a game needs to be entertaining and engaging. If it fails here the rest is irrelevant. If it succeeds here, we can forgive it a lot.

No, it is an attempt by me to give credit where credit is due. I'm not talking just about what could have been, but what was actually good in a game that I, for the most part, thoroughly disliked.
I said previously that this game is weird to me because I didn't just find things I liked about a game I hate, or find things I didn't like about a game I love, I found things I love and things I hate in a game.
Nothing more nothing less. There is value in the game.

As for the second part, it was. For me. It succeeded in a very Aristotelian relativistic way. It can be said to be bad in a sense if you consider it was of limited cathartic value to most people, but it wasn't bad period. I got a lot more out of it than I ever thought I would and this spiel is me trying explain what WAS good about it.

What was good lead to speculations about how the bad stuff could have been handled in such a way as to have made the game even better.

 

[Euryalus]

-Unlikeable characters (except Varric who is a bro)
-ridiculous level of repeated environments.
-The Plot makes little sense (What's the crack with the mysterious relic)
-Blood mages. How are you supposed to feel sympathetic to mages when they do exactly what everyone expects of them.
-Templars. Am I supposed to like them? Hate them?
-No replay value. The choices are all fake.
-Very little party flexibility. You have to have a healer and a tank which pretty much decides the set up for you.
-Not allowed to romance the only likeable character (fu bioware)

Except thats not everything the game is. Its a list of things that are important to you. I agree with a lot of those sentiments personally, but its not all I was looking for. The other things, mostly the stuff I mentioned, but others as well, were done well enough for me to get value out of it.

[sub][sub][sub] The title was mostly bait. I would only call parts of the game brilliant. The rest was shit XD[/sub][/sub][/sub]

 

[verdant monkai]

I like the way it is set in only one city, this way we get to experience everything the city has to offer down to the smallest detail. From every fetch quest to all the background lore, we now know everything about Kirkwall so we get a satisfied feeling. Like finishing a whole huge meal, as opposed to most Rpgs's when the credits role you think "actually I wish I had visited that town.... that one with the 3 houses and one shop". Kirkwall was one of the best fantasy cities I have ever seen (the graphics are shit but the scale is right). It makes a change from being on a massive quest, and its somtimes good to try something new.

Also I loved the new combat, I was bored stiff by the static jerky crap in DAO. DA2 fights made me feel like I was in a magical adventure land, rather than playing runescape.

You see that swinging motion she's doing? You get bored after seeing it the first 50 times, then for the 50000'th time you start to bleed from your eyeballs.

 

[Auron]

Rather than take your relatively stale "WE HAVE TO SAVE THE WORLD FROM TEH MONSTERS" story, as beautiful a story as it can be *cough* Origins *cough*, and make it the focus, Bioware tried to take a harder look at the politics and problems of Thedas.

I actually liked this a lot! For once we were accompanying a character's story and he wasn't the SOLE SAVIOUR OF A DOOMED WORLD, he wasn't a simple schmuck either but the story is about him trying to build a new life in a different city and getting caught up in hellish conflict.


I liked most of the game and don't get the heavy critics it got, I mean it changed from da and the dialogue was watered down with the dialogue wheel but the fact every npc was dubbed in da to begin with already watered down multiple choice quite a bit, it's not like it's a sequel to Torment or anything, still I like both games very much.

 

[minispike47]

The problem with DA2 is that is that it constantly gets judged beside the great game that was Origins. If I hadn't played Origins then I probably would have enjoyed DA2. But while the story was pretty good and the characters (for the most part) were interesting, the combat was lacklusture. I was expecting a tactical combat experiance but what I got was a more hack and slash style of gameplay. In an effort to make the game more accessable, Bioware dumbed down what made the first game so good. In Origins, if you won an engagement after use assigned the actions perfectly it was so rewarding. While in DA2, the combat was more fast paced and less methodical; I guess its down to preference.

 

[putowtin]

With the exception of Sebastian and Anders,

Agreed two of the most annoying characters

I really liked the supporting cast, sarcastic Hawke and Varric are bestest bros

Sarcastic Hawke is the only way to play DAII!

It's really not a brilliant game. It's passable and rushed.

-Unlikeable characters (except Varric who is a bro)

Varric rocks, (though I was massively disappointed that he wasn't a romantic option for my female Hawke)

 

[The_Lost_King]

Blood Mages everywhere. Why? No reason.

Same reason there are Sith in Star Wars, UNLIMATED POWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRR!!!!!!!

It is extreemely mediocre. Not good, not bad, just meh.

 

[Auron]

Blood Mages everywhere. Why? No reason.

Same reason there are Sith in Star Wars, UNLIMATED POWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRR!!!!!!!

More like... Survival.

 

[The_Lost_King]

Blood Mages everywhere. Why? No reason.

Same reason there are Sith in Star Wars, UNLIMATED POWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRR!!!!!!!

More like... Survival.

Well yes, some Sith did that too. I really think that the magic in DA:O was based of of the force. The dark side demons are tempting you to give in to the dark side blood magic turning you into an sith evil abomanation.

 

[ResonanceSD]

Many things have potential. Weimar Germany had potential, then look what happened. Just because something COULD be good doesn't mean that it IS good.

 

[boradam]

TL;DR

I actually quite like DA2, now that I've stopped foaming at the mouth for "what it it did to the series." The story basis is quite interesting, and its only real crime is that it was underdeveloped.

Discuss! Or tell me why I'm full of shit idk XD

I agree with you. Dragon Age 2 is to me what Knights of the Old Republic: The Sith Lords was, a great game that was sadly rushed out the door, both games I enjoy immensely and hold high opinions of but both are/were unappreciated in their own right. Thankfully KotOR 2 isn't deemed as a pile of garbage, and a lot of people love it, but I can't help but wish that DA2 had better reception.

Captcha: it's super delicious.

yes captcha, da2 is very delicious

 

[Phlakes]

As someone who only got to it last year (and consequently wasn't caught up in the now-obligatory Bioware hatestorm), yeah, it really wasn't that bad. Not that it didn't have problems, but they're not really a big deal if you're not trying to make them a big deal.

 

[Ferisar]

I recently slogged through the last couple acts of origins (god I hate myself) just to have an applicable save to load into 2 (awakening too, obviously). I can safely say that whilst I had to stop playing origins every... I don't know, two hours of gameplay (probably compounded by the fact that I had to limit the game to run on only two cores because EL OH EL CRASH EVERY TIME YOU USE AOE), I sat through 2 and finished it in maybe 4 or 5 days. I've had Origins for near as long as its been out and HAVEN'T EVEN BOTHERED TO FINISH IT. This is my third time completing 2. The companions are better (mostly), the actual DESIGN of the game is MILES ahead of Origins (Seriously, the art in Origins felt like a giant pile of gray goop that had obtained color via symbiosis), and the combat didn't bore me to death.

That said, the peak enjoyment of companions for me is higher in Origins on very specific notes (Alistair, Morrigan, mostly), the placement and presentation of setting in Origins was a bit smoother, mostly in terms of consistency and difference between specific areas and their respective sub-zones (this is mostly due to the re-use of environments in 2, so it's only as valid as I let it be). The combat was more tactical and, I guess, challenging in the first game, whereas the second relies often on parachutes and cross-class combinations which were nearly required on higher difficulties (Or just bringing three mages along and saying FUCKALL to health bars).

Origins had more time spent on it, and it shows, but DA2 had its moments. The world-building stuff wasn't as clear-cut as the first, which was unfortunate, but ultimately came down to the condensed setting. The story itself (as in the main 3-part plot) was, to me, a lot more impressive than Origins. I've seen the story in Origins. I've played the Mass Effect games. I've seen/read Lord of the Rings. I really am tired of saving the world from an obviously evil threat (kind of [THANKS AWAKENING]). I'd like to just be in the middle of it all and get tossed around a bit than be the godhood of sentient life that has a way out EVERY TIME A HARD DECISION COMES UP.

A lot of this is conceptual, honestly. I still feel that 2 wasn't what it should have been. It had more potential and should not have been rushed, and it could've been something special. To me, it still is, but I have to look past a loooooot of problems to see it. I'm still looking forward to 3 and mostly looking forward to meeting my Hawke

Oh, one thing that infuriated me is the Sebastian character DLC. I seriously regret ever using that little shit in my playthrough. I hate him.

 

[JellySlimerMan]

Well, at least it gave us this at 2:18:


Not sure if this counts as damning with faint praise...

 

[Cheesepower5]

What I gathered from this topic: DAII is the Western equivalent to Final Fantasy XII. A game with fantastic ideas and potential that struggled through development and was pushed out without fully realising those great possibilities.

I thought they were both decent, too. Varric and Balthier ftw.

 

[Little Gray]

The biggest problem with Dragon Age 2 is actually the story and that unlike Origins they didnt go out of their way to try and hide all the reused locations. The story in Dragon Age 2 was very unconventional and it didnt really start to come together until the second chapter which is normally at least six or seven hours in and even then it starts slow.

As for the reused locations they did the exact same thing with Origins except that instead of using the exact same cave/building/location they used the exact same cave/building except they put it in a different location.

The enemies spawning out of nowhere was kind of silly but it also worked in certain areas like the town.

Dragon Age 2 seems like a decent attempt at a political, character driven story.

Until you play The Witcher 2.

Then you realise what it could have been. It was a mess. Then you realise the politics in Origins were much better than in DA2 as well. The game was such a failure.

But Origins didnt have any politics other then a certain somebody who throws logic out the window with every decision he makes.

 

[TheCommanders]

I really liked Dragon Age 2, even with all it's faults. It's a pity that because so many people didn't like the game, they never got to play Legacy or Mark of the Assassin, both of which were excellent DLCs.

 

[endtherapture]

Dragon Age 2 seems like a decent attempt at a political, character driven story.

Until you play The Witcher 2.

Then you realise what it could have been. It was a mess. Then you realise the politics in Origins were much better than in DA2 as well. The game was such a failure.

But Origins didnt have any politics other then a certain somebody who throws logic out the window with every decision he makes.

Origins has the pretty cool Dwarven politics section.

 

[Amaror]

I have to disagree. I found the story of Dragon Age 2 to be completely horrible trash, just like the rest of the game.
The Mages - Templar Conflict:
It was allready a big deal in Origins and Awakening and they did it better in them. There was just too much stuff that made no sense at all. In Origins the Mages Tower get's overthrown by blood mages but, just as it should be, the actual blood mages are few, but strong, because blood magic is just very powerfull.
In DA 2 every single Mage turns into a blood mage, which is just stupid as hell. Take Orsino. I took his side and he said:"Well, you believe in me not being a blood mage. Good then, because of that i am going to turn into a blood mage now and instantly know everything about blood magic." It just makes no sense.
Overall too much stuff in DA 2 just makes no sense at all. Anders blowing up the church was one of the biggest things that didn't made sense. I know Bioware tried to make the ending dramatic but turning every character into an idiot is NOT Drama.
And while were on the subject of Anders it's really impressive how Bioware found a way to destroy TWO cool characters from Awakening in one move. Just sooo impressive.
The Conflict with the Qunari was pretty interresting, but it wasn't well done either.
The story is just such a big mess, i can't enjoy it one bit.

 

[darth.pixie]

Skipping the idea of plot - rushed, senseless and simply all over the place - Bioware always made character based games. And most of the characters were very ..bad. Underdeveloped, tossed there simply to fuel the conflict that had been done so many times, there are tropes for it and lacking chemistry with one another. Those who hated each other didn't do anything (unlike in Obsidian games - mainly KotOR 2), and those who liked each other didn't really have any characteristics to make them mesh. DA:O had done so much better.

The idea that an asshole like Hawke (he was one no matter what choices you picked) was god's gift to Kirkwall was absurd - in terms of what a PC does in a fantasy game, it wasn't even that epic - and a lot of the quests that were there to add depth to characters fell flat. An example is the Aveline one (which was simply...bad, for me and completely out of the left field when talking about her character) or the serial killer one (that added depth to Hawke) in which, after the first (or second, I forget) part of the quest was done, I spent ages wandering about, looking for another clue. There is a serial killer out there, but yes, let's forget about that for a couple of years, because what? Death, undeath, magic and weeping relatives? What do I care? More rush mobs, please! And booze!

They all display the sense of mindlessness that can only be found in NPCs who know they're in a video game and have to wait for scripted cues. Thus don't react to anything other than that.

The mages vs templars was awful. Making it a centric event was even worse. What about investigating where the Black City came from? Or the talk of a new Blight? Or politics? Or the Fade? Or demons? Or what happened to the talking darkspawn? Or the approaching war? No, apparently, mages were more interesting. Especially after making every single mage a blood mage. Everywhere you turned, there were five of them. In DA:O, the Warden entered a little boy's mind and could intimidate a demon to not only leave forever but also grant them forbidden knowledge without losing anything. In DA2, you scrape your knee and blood magic pours out. You sort of have to side with the templars, if only because they seem less likely to explode like magic bombs made of angst.

And every time someone talks about this game, I get fired up because I genuinely liked the setting and wanted to know more about it, then got this