dragon age 2 whats with all the hate?

[ecoho]

now first off i did a search for this and found many simmular topics but none like this.

ok now on to my point im makeing this thread to find out why so many people hate dragon age 2.
I have guide lines though. first and formost if you disliked the game give reasons and i mean more then the simple they changed every thing cause that wont work here.(oh and if you liked the game and wish to defend it the same rules apply tell everyone what you liked about it

Now i will give you my personal opinoin on the game i love it on my 4th play through. the combat is alot better and fluid then the first game and as is the new rivilry/friend system.(no more morigan disaproves what i dis liked about the game though is whant most people will point out as why they hate it. The ending was a bit lacking for me not enoth to spoil the game for me but it was a bit anti-climactic. the game in my opinion is far from perfect but the good outweighs the bad.

So what did you find good or bad about the game?

BTW please be civil with people of differing opinions

 

[RatRace123]

Personally I like the game, the combat was fun. Some Lots Most dungeons or random areas were copy/pasted, but it wasn't enough of a bother to be a deal breaker.
I liked the story for the most part, ending was lacking, you covered that point. The cast was good as it always is.

I have nothing that really pisses me off about the game, it's not perfect or even Bioware's best, but it's pretty good and it's pretty fun.

The only thing that I found kinda frustrating was the level up system, I know the web was supposed to eliminate this, but it was still kinda constricted. Instead of getting abilities in a chain, you had to put enough points into a tree and reach the branch to get an ability or upgrade. I would've preferred a system closer to Origins where you needed a specific amount of a stat and be at a certain level to unlock a move or spell and then reach the "branch" but still be in the web format. The Web is a good idea, but in the end it still seemed as constricting as the system in Origins.

Again, that's my only real frustration and it's certainly not a dealbreaker for me. All of this is IMO, of course.

 

[DustyDrB]

The hate has kind of died down as people have actually played it. I think opinions have sort of reached a middle. It's certainly not BioWare's best work, but it's far from a bad game. I enjoyed the hell out of the combat, and also love the new ability trees.

 

[Brutal Peanut]

You know, I really liked the game.I tend to be a bit of a loyalist were Bioware and Bethesda are concerened, though. ^_^

I enjoyed the way the mage played more then anything else. I felt sluggish in Origins, but in DA2 I felt like a serious caster. Bam, bam, bam! How about some molten fireballs from the sky, AND electricity after I freeze you in place! Bwhahahahaha!

The only thing that bothered me was the continuously reused dungeon maps, and the relationships didn't feel as deep as in Origins. The personal feelings your character is supposed to feel for your romantic party member of choice, seem rushed, and felt a bit flat.

 

[Kyogissun]

The general reasoning for all the hate seems to fall under these categories as of late:
-Butthurt 'elitist' (As in, rarely ventures outside into an environment where their opinion isn't guaranteed to be shared) PC master race users who are still mad that the game was built around a console improvement in gameplay
-SRPG fanatics who still are mad that the SRPG gameplay isn't the focus anymore
-'diehard' fans offended by the fact that their impacts seem to not have any impact anymore (When they have little to no knowledge of what plans BioWare has for the future for DA1's decisions)

And that's about it, anyone else feel free to toss in others that seem like repeated complaints. Cause you know, three weeks isn't enough for people to get over their bitching and moaning, as a thread I was in earlier proved as such.

EDIT: Oh and just to be clear, I'm aware of the fact there are problems with DA2. Bugs, repetitive areas, simplification in some areas that didn't need it... It's just that unlike the haters, I'm willing to DEAL WITH THESE PROBLEMS AND STILL ENJOY THE GAME.

 

[ecoho]

The general reasoning for all the hate seems to fall under these categories as of late:
-Butthurt 'elitist' (As in, rarely ventures outside into an environment where their opinion isn't guaranteed to be shared) PC master race users who are still mad that the game was built around a console improvement in gameplay
-SRPG fanatics who still are mad that the SRPG gameplay isn't the focus anymore
-'diehard' fans offended by the fact that their impacts seem to not have any impact anymore (When they have little to no knowledge of what plans BioWare has for the future for DA1's decisions)

And that's about it, anyone else feel free to toss in others that seem like repeated complaints. Cause you know, three weeks isn't enough for people to get over their bitching and moaning, as a thread I was in earlier proved as such.

EDIT: Oh and just to be clear, I'm aware of the fact there are problems with DA2. Bugs, repetitive areas, simplification in some areas that didn't need it... It's just that unlike the haters, I'm willing to DEAL WITH THESE PROBLEMS AND STILL ENJOY THE GAME.

please no pc master race talk its a little insalting and i dont want this to become a flame fest

 

[ThePirateMan]

I did not like DA 2, I might have liked it if it was under any other name, but it wasn't. (I was increadibly excited for DA 2 after playing DA: O)

Why? I don't know, it just bored the crap out of me. Dialogue wheel and the main character's voice actor pissed me off and ruined the immersion for me, the combat was even more boring then what you all claim to be the "boring slow shit" that was DA: O, most of my tactical thinking was ruined by enemies constantly popping up from bloody nowhere and lastly, the lack of variety in locations and the MMO-like grindfest that Act 1 felt like bored me to death. I also failed to find any characters appealing.

 

[PlasmaFrog]

Because folks keep creating redundant threads such as this one.

In my opinion, the game is a letdown from the previous installments. Feels like a rushed product.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

I generally loved it, but here's what I didn't like:

Copy paste dungeons and caves

Very buggy (I don't recall encountering one bug in 60 + hours of DA:O)

City starts to look samey after 40+ hours

Some of the characters weren't as storng as Wynne, Morrigan, Sten, Oghren ect...

Ugly character models

Endless waves of combat got boring

Stupid story developments at points

 

[mavkiel]

Game breaking bugs, a short story that doesn't have a satisfying conclusion. Your choices mean nothing in the game.

For example, trying to rescue someone and your given about 5 dialog options(one of them opening up several options) and all of them result in the hostage dying. The only difference is a couple lines of dialog. That sort of thing is repeated again and again in da2.

The 'wave' system of enemies is more annoying then challenging. Your tactics are pretty much the same for every fight, because you know some people are going to appear out of thin air behind whatever defensive line you put up.

Characters being introduced like "remember me, we worked on x job together". Is used three times to introduce characters. No, I dont recall the person because I never met the bloody person before. That sort of thing is abused to much in the game.

 

[ecoho]

Overall i'm going to use the term CONSOLIZATION! Yep, thats right i'm blaming Bioware for dumbing down a PC game into a console game. PC players get screwed enough, the few games we get ported over from other systems usually do not work well on the PC, so when Bioware makes a PC game thats not up to even there own standard people notice. Its not a case of being Butthurt, its a case of being seriously disappointed in a mediocre product.

ok first off they didnt "dumb it down" for anyone they fixed big problems from the first and yes pc players got the short end of the stick news flash you always will. you want to know why this game was made more for consoles? its cheaper its faster oh and you have a larger base. its economics not rocket science. Now do i wish they would have done what they did with origens and made the pc version for the pc instead of porting it? yes im sad that i got to play a great game and you got a bad port and ill admit they kinda slacked off in that regarde but dont dam us, bioware, or the game because it doesnt cater to your minority.

 

[justnotcricket]

I've generally liked it so far, actually. There have only been a few things that bothered me, but not enough to be deal breakers (not at all).

1) The famous 'copy-paste' dungeons. Yes, they're not terribly original after a while, but really, I'm enjoying the conversations and the combat too much to care what the wallpaper looks like. The world feels sufficiently large and diverse for the purpose. This game isn't a sandbox game, and it doesn't have to be. Plus, at least they sort of tried to make the different parts of the areas accessible in different quests (if I remember rightly).

2)The lack of balance in the leveling system. I sort of feel that this game punishes you if you wanted to try and make a truly stat-balanced character. Now, I know you don't need to, and that is why it isn't a huge issue, but I did feel that, as a rogue, I was almost *forced* to dump all my points into CUN and DEX just so I could have half a shot at opening the locked chests. I *know* that you don't need high CON and STR as a rogue, because you're not tanking, but a little more room to put points into WIL and CON would have been nice. And yes, I realise I could have just gone nuts on the CUN attribute of Varric or Isabela and used them, but it would have meant I had to cart around a bizzarely spec'd character through every quest in case there was a locked chest in it.

3) The comparative lack of conversation. Is it just me, or did you have more chances to talk one-on-one with yout companions in DA:O, and therefore discover more little random things about them? Maybe my memory is warped, but I sort of miss the camp environment, and how you could talk to them in the field and it might actually initiate an actual dialogue, rather than a one-line comment.

Console Boss Fights
Stupid multipronged console style boss fights. I only recall a single boss fight where at some point the boss didn't vanish from the battle field, leaving you to fight minions as they shot at you from safety.


Overall i'm going to use the term CONSOLIZATION! Yep, thats right i'm blaming Bioware for dumbing down a PC game into a console game. PC players get screwed enough, the few games we get ported over from other systems usually do not work well on the PC, so when Bioware makes a PC game thats not up to even there own standard people notice. Its not a case of being Butthurt, its a case of being seriously disappointed in a mediocre product.

Also, I realise I'm stepping into dangerous waters here, but will someone please explain to me what this whole 'dumbing down for the consoles' thing is? How do you 'dumb a game down' for a different machine? It's the same game? I don't get how it's any less complex than on the PC? I play games on my PS3 because my PC is too old to run anything faster-paced than Civ 5 on the lowest settings, and even that chokes. I have, however, played games (including RPGs) on my PC in the past, and I can't see the difference. even the boss fights you describe are more of a problem endemic to videogames in general than consoles in particular, it seems to me. The only difference I can see is perhaps the controls are a little more awkward in terms of issuing orders to different party members during a fight, but is that really 'dumbing' it down? When you make it *harder* to use? I'm not saying the console version is better (which would be just as bizarre a claim), I'm just saying that I truly do not get why the word 'dumbing' (down) is applied.

I'm not looking for a fight. I just want a calm explanation.

 

[ecoho]

ok first off they didnt "dumb it down" for anyone they fixed big problems from the first and yes pc players got the short end of the stick news flash you always will. you want to know why this game was made more for consoles?

Sure it got dumbed down. It went from a compelling game, with compelling storyline, characterization & tactical combat, to something that possessed none of those things. By anyones definition that is dumbed down. The fact that it was dumbed down as to be more appealing to a console crowd, doesn't change the fact that it got dumber down. Dumbed Down, is dumbed down & it can't really be argued by anyone that it didn't get dumbed down when you look at it objectively. Even looking at the tech, it got dumbed down so it could be played with a controller rather then a mouse and keyboard.

So DA2 was in fact DUMBED DOWN & fans who purchased this based on an enjoyment of the previous title in the series have ever right to be fucked off about it.

im done trying to reason with you here pc man meet console man

The general reasoning for all the hate seems to fall under these categories as of late:
-Butthurt 'elitist' (As in, rarely ventures outside into an environment where their opinion isn't guaranteed to be shared) PC master race users who are still mad that the game was built around a console improvement in gameplay
-SRPG fanatics who still are mad that the SRPG gameplay isn't the focus anymore
-'diehard' fans offended by the fact that their impacts seem to not have any impact anymore (When they have little to no knowledge of what plans BioWare has for the future for DA1's decisions)

And that's about it, anyone else feel free to toss in others that seem like repeated complaints. Cause you know, three weeks isn't enough for people to get over their bitching and moaning, as a thread I was in earlier proved as such.

EDIT: Oh and just to be clear, I'm aware of the fact there are problems with DA2. Bugs, repetitive areas, simplification in some areas that didn't need it... It's just that unlike the haters, I'm willing to DEAL WITH THESE PROBLEMS AND STILL ENJOY THE GAME.

sorry to bring you into this but i beleave you have more experiance with this type of person then me.

 

[mavkiel]

I've generally liked it so far, actually. There have only been a few things that bothered me, but not enough to be deal breakers (not at all).

Also, I realise I'm stepping into dangerous waters here, but will someone please explain to me what this whole 'dumbing down for the consoles' thing is? How do you 'dumb a game down' for a different machine? It's the same game? I don't get how it's any less complex than on the PC? I play games on my PS3 because my PC is too old to run anything faster-paced than Civ 5 on the lowest settings, and even that chokes. I have, however, played games (including RPGs) on my PC in the past, and I can't see the difference. even the boss fights you describe are more of a problem endemic to videogames in general than consoles in particular, it seems to me. The only difference I can see is perhaps the controls are a little more awkward in terms of issuing orders to different party members during a fight, but is that really 'dumbing' it down? When you make it *harder* to use? I'm not saying the console version is better (which would be just as bizarre a claim), I'm just saying that I truly do not get why the word 'dumbing' (down) is applied.

I'm not looking for a fight. I just want a calm explanation.

Hardware limitations mainly(both memory and controller). Consoles might have a hard time displaying lots of bodies? Solution: get rid of the bodies via explosion. That breaks animate dead spell? Simple get rid of it.

And the overall impression that console users enjoy more arcade-like games. Which is why they get the blame for wave spawn mechanic which really messes with my enjoyment. There seems very little point with trying to set up a battlefield, when you know something is just going to spawn ontop of you and often.

edit: Oh and I forget, I could have sworn microsoft gets a cut of profits of games sold on their system, with number of cd's being a variable(Could have sworn I read that someplace). So they also get the blame for re-used content to reduce the size of the game.

 

[kuyo]

I couldn't make a male character that didn't look like a douche (I like my unique characters enough to disregard the default model, too bad I can't use it as a base). I really wanted to support the mages, but it was a hard when all the paranoid templar accusations were true.

I liked it, but I guess I probably wasn't going to like it as much as I would have without the Skyrim song stuck in my head.

 

[ecoho]

im done trying to reason with you here pc man meet console man

no, you are trying to pick a fight, fanboy style over which system is better. Were as i'm saying if you are going to make a PC game, make a fucking PC game. Do not make a console game, for the PC. Its no different then if Sony started making playstation FPS games, that not only required the use of a keyboard & mouse, but the entire game was based on there use.

seriously man calm down im not trying to start a fight. also im not the one whos saying one systems better then the other you are. I beleave both pcs and consoles are equal in that regarde as they both have their strangths and weaknesses if you cant accept that please just put me on ignore and stop posting.

 

[justnotcricket]

I've generally liked it so far, actually. There have only been a few things that bothered me, but not enough to be deal breakers (not at all).

Also, I realise I'm stepping into dangerous waters here, but will someone please explain to me what this whole 'dumbing down for the consoles' thing is? How do you 'dumb a game down' for a different machine? It's the same game? I don't get how it's any less complex than on the PC? I play games on my PS3 because my PC is too old to run anything faster-paced than Civ 5 on the lowest settings, and even that chokes. I have, however, played games (including RPGs) on my PC in the past, and I can't see the difference. even the boss fights you describe are more of a problem endemic to videogames in general than consoles in particular, it seems to me. The only difference I can see is perhaps the controls are a little more awkward in terms of issuing orders to different party members during a fight, but is that really 'dumbing' it down? When you make it *harder* to use? I'm not saying the console version is better (which would be just as bizarre a claim), I'm just saying that I truly do not get why the word 'dumbing' (down) is applied.

I'm not looking for a fight. I just want a calm explanation.

Hardware limitations mainly(both memory and controller). Consoles might have a hard time displaying lots of bodies? Solution: get rid of the bodies via explosion. That breaks animate dead spell? Simple get rid of it.

And the overall impression that console users enjoy more arcade-like games. Which is why they get the blame for wave spawn mechanic which really messes with my enjoyment. There seems very little point with trying to set up a battlefield, when you know something is just going to spawn ontop of you and often.

OK...but how is removing one spell 'dumbing' something down? I agree that it's a shame when they remove stuff that you liked or found useful, especially for hardware reasons, but I still don't see how the fact that a console might not have the processing power of a PC (which people can upgrade easily compared to a console) makes the console gamers themselves less intelligent than the PC gamers. For that is the implication of 'dumbing down'. Perhaps that's not how people are using the term, but it's pretty hard to take it otherwise.

Also, as for the wave spawn mechanic, I'm pretty sure that's not limited to consoles. Isn't it basically the entire premise of enemy manoeuvres in RTSs (a generally purely PC genre?). I admit, I haven't played many RTSs, but I have watched a friend play countless hours of StarCraft, and that seems to be how things go: waves of enemies come at you from different sides, you fight them off (hopefully), rinse, repeat...??