Dragon Age, looking towards Inquisition

[TT Kairen]

With Inquisition on the horizon, I figured we could discuss the previous two titles, get our thoughts and feelings in order in preparation. Or rejection.

I for one, am optimistic. I like what I've seen on the game so far (except Cassandra's face... the horror), and both of the previous installments brought me many hours of entertainment. They're both mixed bags, obviously, but their upsides outweigh the cons, at least in my eyes.

Origins brought gripping and interesting introductions, and the world building in the game was phenomenal. Most of the party members are excellent characters, fleshed out and varied. Exploring, learning about the culture of Fereldan, the dwarves, the dalish, all of it was simply a treat. The only thing that keeps me from playing it repeatedly is the mind-numbingly slow, plodding, irritating combat. I'm playing through it again right now to make a new save for Inquisition, but damn do I wish I could just skip the fights.

Dragon Age 2 was a more personal experience. A tale of a man and his efforts to do the best he can for his family and friends. A lot of people had a problem with going from such a large world to a single city, but it didn't bother me that much. The party members each having places they hang out and visiting each other at those places was a great touch, one I'm glad they brought to Mass Effect 3. The game gets (deserved) criticism for re-using areas too often, which is a bit of an issue for me as well. The combat shines for me here as well. A bit too over-the-top for the setting they went for originally, but at least it's far more entertaining.

Whichever game was your favorite though, I think we can all agree that Varric is the best companion in either game.

Share your thoughts as we await the third installment to this great series.

 

[votemarvel]

The praise Dragon Age II gets for its combat puzzles me, since it is the same as in Origins. The only real difference is that on the console versions you need to hammer a button in order to do basic attacks.

Don't get me wrong it is animated far better, but it is still the same combat system.

I am looking forward to Inquisition and am happy to see them bringing back things such as being able to pull the camera out to a isometric viewpoint.

The only shame for me with Inquisition is that the returning cast members are some of those I liked the least.

 

[TT Kairen]

The praise Dragon Age II gets for its combat puzzles me, since it is the same as in Origins. The only real difference is that on the console versions you need to hammer a button in order to do basic attacks.

Don't get me wrong it is animated far better, but it is still the same combat system.

I am looking forward to Inquisition and am happy to see them bringing back things such as being able to pull the camera out to a isometric viewpoint.

The only shame for me with Inquisition is that the returning cast members are some of those I liked the least.

Largely yes, which is why I fail to understand why Origins apologists rip on it so much. But the addition of cross class combos, more impactful abilities, and a higher speed make it more entertaining. Not much BETTER, mind you, but more fun.

 

[Twyce]

I'm optimistically cautious. It seems (note the word 'SEEMS' here), like Bioware realizes they messed up pretty bad with DA2 and thus are trying to recapture the spirit of DAO in Inquisition. If that happens...Well, we will see.

Personally, I love DA2 despite it's numerous flaws. I vastly prefer the personal story rather than the grand sweeping one that DAO had, but thats just my preference, lots would disagree. When I first played DA2, I found the companions very lackluster (minus Varric), but in subsequent play throughs they definitely grew on me. I agree that the companion 'home bases' were a neat idea, but IMO were horribly implemented. Companion mechanics all around were pretty crap now that I think about it. I hated that you couldn't click on them during your travels like in DAO, also hated how the only time you could 'chat' was when specific things were completed.

As for the re-used environments...I honestly wonder what Bioware was thinking doing that. Did they think we wouldn't notice that this was the same cave/mansion/city, over and over again? Were they too rushed to care? Did they think we wouldn't care? Ah well, I guess. I will say, i did enjoy the faster paced combat a lot more in 2.

I'd say DAO is the better game overall, but DA2 holds a special place in my heart. I really really hope DAI can combine the best of both the games.

Also totally have my fingers crossed that Cullen is a companion.

 

[Frozengale]

As for the re-used environments...I honestly wonder what Bioware was thinking doing that. Did they think we wouldn't notice that this was the same cave/mansion/city, over and over again? Were they too rushed to care? Did they think we wouldn't care? Ah well, I guess. I will say, i did enjoy the faster paced combat a lot more in 2.

When you are literally given 1 year to make a huge sprawling RPG making unique environments for everything is not a priority.

I think most people forget that most of the flaws of DA2 come from the fact that EA basically gave Bioware an incredibly small time frame to complete the game. I think they were hoping to turn Dragon Age into a "Once a year" type think like Ubisoft does for the 'Screed series.

OT: I'm looking forward to Inquisition. I never really like Origins that much to be honest. I tried REALLY hard to like it. Like REALLY REALLY hard, I have over 100 hours clocked in on that game but most of that is because I would play a character for a while, get extremely bored and frustrated, and then not play for about a year. When I came back I had no idea what was going on so I would delete my character and start over. A lot of the problems I had with that game I eventually solved through mods (it's amazing how much more willing I am to play a game once I can actually respec my characters). In Dragon Age I did not like the character progression. The abilities in the game were fairly bland and boring unless it was a Mage ability. Once I got to the expansion I basically just made a Mage team with Me, Anders, and the angry Elf. Then I would rotate in the other characters depending on which one annoyed me the least. I still have no idea what abilities Rogues and Warriors have.

I hated most of the characters in DA:O. Alistar was incredibly whiny and douchey. I ended up killing Wynne when I first encountered her. She seemed like the character that would berate me for anything and everything, and I already had Morrigan for that. Morrigan was interesting, but not interesting to interact with. Shale was fun for the most part. Oghren was everything I hate about Dwarf characters wrapped up in a tiny package. Lilianna was the least annoying but the most bland, once I played her DLC I actually had a change of heart and she became my favorite character. Sten constantly pissed me off. Stoic characters can be fun sometimes. This was not one of those times. And Zevran, I actually liked Zevran for the most part.

Combat in DA:O was incredibly one sided and boring. I was playing on Nightmare the entire time and it was a cakewalk since I was a Mage, blood Mage no less. By the end of it I was actually using console commands to kill most of the small mobs because it took about the same amount of time, and was the same amount of challenge, just required less clicking.

While DA2 suffers from a lot of problems I found the characters to be much more enjoyable, or at least less annoying. Aveline and Isabela are fairly generic but fun. Varric was enjoyable and actually funny. And Merril is one of the few characters that actually seems to have real conflict and some depth. Also it's kind of hard to not feel sorry for her when literally everything that goes wrong with her life is because other people jump to conclusions and screw themselves over. Fenris was a truly awful character and Anders seems to have gone from interesting to bland. But if it's a choice between DA:O characters and DA2 I'll take DA2 anyday.

DA2 combat while similar to DA:O was actually a WHOLE lot better. There was actual challenge for one, at least when you play on Nightmare. Though I did lower the difficult for some battles, there was one battle where I fought the guy for literally 20 minutes. He couldn't kill me, but I could only chip away his life bar then he would heal to just a little bit less then what he started at. Eventually I learned that for most boss fights it's better to just put the difficulty to Hard, because it takes about the same strategy, just doesn't take forever to kill them. Leveling up was actually fun, because all the abilities actually meant something and there was a lot more reason to learn every single class, and every single character. Even if a character was horrible story wise, there was usually a reason to keep them around for combat. DA2 combat had much more strategy involved and was much better paced.

I'm hoping that DA:I takes after DA2 more then DA:O. DA2 had lots of problems, but like I said most of that came down to it being rushed. DA2 is superior in almost every way.

 

[votemarvel]

Largely yes, which is why I fail to understand why Origins apologists rip on it so much. But the addition of cross class combos, more impactful abilities, and a higher speed make it more entertaining. Not much BETTER, mind you, but more fun.

I first played Dragon Age II on the PC, where the combat system was immediately obvious to be like that of Origins.

Personally I like them both. I just don't get how people can hate the one in Origins but love the one in DAII, when they are the same.

Personally, I love DA2 despite it's numerous flaws. I vastly prefer the personal story rather than the grand sweeping one that DAO had, but thats just my preference, lots would disagree.

I didn't really find Hawke's tale to be personal. In fact I often felt like an outsider to the story because of the time jumps, I felt like most of the personal moments were happening off screen.

 

[Twyce]

I didn't really find Hawke's tale to be personal. In fact I often felt like an outsider to the story because of the time jumps, I felt like most of the personal moments were happening off screen.

Hmm...Interesting take. I can totally understand how one might feel like that (and yea, those time jumps were jarring). I think I found it to be more 'personal' because the events were happening to/centered around Hawke, if that makes sense? Everything that took place in Kirkwall was because, or at least due largely, to Hawke's actions. It's a story (or supposed to be) about a person and their effect on the city (and the ripples it makes throughout the world).

DAO is much more broad and sweeping... If that makes sense? Like, I know the Warden obviously has a HUGE impact with the Blight and stopping the Arch Demon, but compared to DA2, the story was much more pulled back then character focused.

Ugh, I'm rambling. Not sure if that made any sense at all. >.<

Snip

When you are literally given 1 year to make a huge sprawling RPG making unique environments for everything is not a priority.

I think most people forget that most of the flaws of DA2 come from the fact that EA basically gave Bioware an incredibly small time frame to complete the game. I think they were hoping to turn Dragon Age into a "Once a year" type think like Ubisoft does for the 'Screed series.

Oh no, I totally get that they had zero time to get the game out (and agree with you on the annual franchise hope). But I guess my wonderment comes into play from the fact that its just such blatant corner cutting with the reused environments. I mean, did they know they would get knocked on that and just say "eh, we'll deal." or did they honestly think people would let it slide?

 

[The Madman]

The idea that you're ostensibly playing as the head of a massive order of zealots is a neat one and one that if used properly could make for some great plot elements, but even so I'm more than a bit wary of Bioware these days as well so you'll excuse me if I'm not exactly holding my breath here. After all Dragon Age 2 had tons of great ideas and yet all the same that never saved it from being mediocre at absolute best in my mind.

So I'm taking the cautious wait and see approach with this one. Not really sure what to expect from Bioware anymore.

 

[Raikas]

I'm optimistic. I enjoyed DAO, loved DA2 and even enjoyed the post-DA2 (The adventures of Isabela, Varric and Alistair) comics that David Gaider wrote for Dark Horse, so I feel fairly confident in saying that I'll probably enjoy Inquisition, even if it turns out imperfectly.

I didn't really find Hawke's tale to be personal. In fact I often felt like an outsider to the story because of the time jumps, I felt like most of the personal moments were happening off screen.

Hmm...Interesting take. I can totally understand how one might feel like that (and yea, those time jumps were jarring). I think I found it to be more 'personal' because the events were happening to/centered around Hawke, if that makes sense? Everything that took place in Kirkwall was because, or at least due largely, to Hawke's actions. It's a story (or supposed to be) about a person and their effect on the city (and the ripples it makes throughout the world).

I saw it as a personal story too, but for slightly different reasons - not so much because it was centred on Hawke, but more because most of the changes that we see in the game are about the people rather than plot or the world. My favourite example is the banter where Anders asks Hawke about his/her father and the answer depends on your Hawke's percentage of diplomatic vs. snarky vs. aggressive choices.

 

[Twyce]

I saw it as a personal story too, but for slightly different reasons - not so much because it was centred on Hawke, but more because most of the changes that we see in the game are about the people rather than plot or the world. My favourite example is the banter where Anders asks Hawke about his/her father and the answer depends on your Hawke's percentage of diplomatic vs. snarky vs. aggressive choices.

Oh yea! I totally forgot about that. I really loved the fact that they changed Hawke's tone/response (for times you couldn't pick) to match the 'voice' you usually picked in conversations (including party banter and combat). It was a very nice touch.

 

[Fdzzaigl]

I haven't really been following every single dev post on the game. But so far it looks good.
The faster pacing of DA2 together with much better worldbuilding and more impactful story choices + tactical combat, that was pretty much what I was asking for. And it looks like I'll be getting it.

Things I'd like to see in DA:I and don't know about yet:
1)Manage your companion's equipment and armor like in DA:O. I got really pissed off in DA2 when I had to trash 80% of all the shit I found because I was playing a rogue and got tons of drops for mages and warriors that I couldn't use or give away.

2)True difficulty with more and more varied boss fights. As much as I liked playing DA2 on top difficulty, the waves got boring after a while.

3)More memorable characters and returning characters from DA:O. It's good to see Varric return, but I'd also like a few from Origins to come back. Generally the humor and wittiness needs to be cranked up a few notches from DA2.

4)Mods. Official tools probably won't happen, but the community usually finds a way nonetheless (like they did in ME3). Here's hoping the devs or EA won't try to stop them (frak you origin).

 

[Ferisar]

1)Manage your companion's equipment and armor like in DA:O. I got really pissed off in DA2 when I had to trash 80% of all the shit I found because I was playing a rogue and got tons of drops for mages and warriors that I couldn't use or give away.

I can address this. They've said this has made a return, and did a showcase of it briefly in one of their convention shows (I'm not sure which one because it's been a while and I was mostly just looking for gameplay videos).

OT:
I'm looking forward to Inquisition quite a bit, but most of it isn't based on my experiences with the previous two games. I stomached completing Origins one and a half times, and I finished DA2 twice or three times (I think), but neither the first's narrative outlook nor the second bear much on me in terms of what to look forward to. The first, DLC aside, began and concluded more or less neatly. Morrigan's Chris Hansen baby isn't really my problem until it comes up again. Whoever rules the kingdom is also not my issue at this particular moment, although it could be interesting.

As for the second game, Hawke's impact is obviously going to be felt based on the ending of the game, but I doubt we'll be seeing Hawke again as directly (The only way I would suddenly care is if Hawke came back as a companion, which would be insane, but who knows). I'm sure some of the characters will be around, but, again, their importance ranges wildly based on how Bioware uses them.

The only thing that I can truly say I'm excited for stemming from the previous games is the implication of the DLC from DA2 toward the end, (the one where you face that one guy with the thing from the place with the maker). Thematically, it's a really neat idea given the previous world-building surrounding the mages and religion.

I need more Qunari in my life, that's all I know. I can't wait to play one. I don't know how they can possibly make it work, but whatever. WHATEVER. HORNS PLEASE.

But yeah, looks promising given what they've showed/said/how much time they've had to develop the game. If the structure is similar to Origins with the combat more like 2 (in the stylistic aspects, not parachutes), then I'm all for it. On that note, more development of style would also be nice. Origins felt so bland. I really would hate if Inquisition went back to that weird drab "we're kind of different from the stock but hey brown is a fun color when you're taking a dump", appearance. Just... variety and a more defined sense of place wouldn't hurt.

I'm honestly not sure why I'm worried about that last one given what various gameplay videos have shown already, but GRRR HYPOTHETICAL RAGE IS THERE, CAN I TAKE YOUR ORDER ************?

I mean...

I'm cautiously optimistic?

 

[Talvrae]

I'm pretty optimist about it... Despite his flaws i loved Dragon Age 2... And the ending of Mass Effect 3 is a pretty minor anooyance to me. Bioware still never have left me down

 

[Boogie Knight]

Personally, I thought Dragon Age 2 wasn't that bad. The major flaw had to do with the episodic nature of the story, and that you don't actually rise to power. We had the ingredients, Hawke had friends in important places, and tales of hie exploits he could parlay into support. The final act's weaknesses were the big problem. Still, they provided themselves an out because they could insist later on that much of what happened was made up by Varric. In fact, I think it would fit some of the themes of the game if the instigating incident was a complete fabrication and there was a more mundane explanation of how the situation spiraled out of control.

As for Inquisition, there is an overarching plot which would better tie together everything going on. Origins had the Blight and sorting out the internal problems of allies so they could devote their forces to stopping the march of the Darkspawn. Inquisition has a straightforward existential crisis and plenty of opportunities for intrigue.

However, the one part of Dragon Age 2 I really hated had to do with maintaining relationships with allies. Their feelings were dictated mostly by their reactions to your choices. I hated that. Origins was reasonable with its crisis moments because they made sense, the more pious would have problems with defiling the remains of an important religious figure or siding with a traitor/psycho/other. And to top it off, if you were leaning in the rivalry direction then there were scenes with them which would add on to the rivalry no matter what. I liked that in Origin that while Morrigan would be very snarky and disapproving of my goody goody ways, that she could still be amicable after a nice conversation (and in retrospect, Alister and I bromanced hard during our misadventures in Ferelden as we quipped and kicked ass).

Contrast that with DA2 where you might lose party members because you had a complicated relationship with them, and then had to make an arbitrary choice where they would part ways fo-eva' and you were thus strategically crippled. I just want to play through the story with my unique blend of idealism and pragmatism and not be excessively hampered by thinking about what my party members would think.

 

[TheVampwizimp_v1legacy]

I know I will like it. I love Origins, like a lot, and 2 is a very enjoyable game, however many people claim that it's garbage. Basically, Dragon Age as a property has only made me happy so far, so I have every reason to be confident that Inquisition will be similarly excellent.

 

[krazykidd]

I'm going to buy it. I loved DA:O and DA2 was ok . So i'll buy DA:I ( seriously the guy who names these games should be fired... Or work for nintendo). Howeer i have not looked into the game, and am going on blind faith ( like with Dark souls). Dragon age and TES are the only wrpgs i enjoyed last gen.

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

Inquisition looks potentially awesome. I've always liked the series (played Origins and 2 at least 5 times) but the gameplay was never as good as it should be. Based on what I've seen that won't be the case this time.

I ended up killing Wynne when I first encountered her. She seemed like the character that would berate me for anything and everything, and I already had Morrigan for that.

She'd berate you for anything Morrigan wouldn't anyway, full coverage!

Seriously though, is there anyone who likes Wynne? I'd only have her in my party when I was forced to because I'd rather listen to Morrigan's sometimes funny sarcasm than Wynne's bland lecturing.

Things I'd like to see in DA:I and don't know about yet:
1)Manage your companion's equipment and armor like in DA:O. I got really pissed off in DA2 when I had to trash 80% of all the shit I found because I was playing a rogue and got tons of drops for mages and warriors that I couldn't use or give away.

They've confirmed that you can do that.

 

[Augustine]

Inquisition? No preorder, even if they promise heaven and earth with it. I won't buy it until much later after the release, and only if it is proven to be actually good.
I have no trust left in Bioware.