EDIT: Mass Effect 3 indoctrination theory?

[ThePS1Fan]

Can someone please explain what this is? I know it has to do with the endings but other than that I have no clue.

EDIT: I would like to thank everyone who tried to explain the theory and who suggested videos on the topic, I have watched several and believe I have a good understanding of this theory.

As for my thoughts on the Indoctrination Theory and the endings in general, I do hope this theory is correct and it does have a lot of strong evidence to support it. The endings are weak with no closure at all as they stand so this gives some hope for the future of this franchise, We know DLC is coming and I don't think even for a second this will be the last ME game, just the end of Shepard's story. Even if the 'true' ending is DLC I suppose seeing a proper ending for these characters and their stories is better than nothing. After this I don't think Bioware will be doing anything potentially controversial for some time and hopefully other developers/publishers look at this and realize we aren't just walking wallets that will eat up any thing they throw at us and can really make some noise when we need to.

 

[putowtin]

http://w11.zetaboards.com/Theorycraftng_HUB/topic/7688087/1/

this is a good explaination

 

[soren7550]

I'll try to explain it the best I can w/o going into too much detail (spoilers, obviously).

In short, the Indoctrination Theory is the belief that by the end of Mass Effect 3, Commander Shepard has become indoctrinated. The main points for this theory are as follows:

- Shepard seems to be the only one to have ever seen the boy from the beginning of the game. Also, no one is seen interacting with him other than Shepard. According to the Codex, indoctrinated people do see ghostly apparitions of people that they and they alone see (which could also explain Shepard's dreams of the boy).

- The Catalyst (also known as Vent Boy and King Reaper) makes the options that don't destroy the Reapers seem far more favorable than the option to destroy them. Shepard doesn't (nor can) question the options, and agrees with them, which hint at indoctrination since Shepard is going along with it, rather than questioning it like they usually do.

- After being blasted by Harbinger, Shepard seems to see things and move in a dream like state. Also, some believe that the scene showing Joker & co. escaping is Shepard trying to reassure themselves that they're Ok. The same is also sometimes said about the mass relays exploding but not destroying the systems - it's all in Shepard's head and is their way of trying to assure themselves that things will be fine. No relays, no Reapers going through relays to kill everyone.

I've simplified this I know, but I'm rushing though this a bit.

 

[Lithan]

Ending was bad.
Ending was horrifically written and had plotholes you could charge a platoon of krogans through.
Sad players convinced themselves it was all a big dream sequence and there is a secret "real" ending coming.
Sad players remember this be the future, change "dream sequence" to "indoctrination hallucination".
Bioware said "lulz screw you. End is end."
Bioware noticed 95%+ of their customers were calling for their heads on a plate while at the same time waving their wallets in the air.
Bioware Hmmm'ed.
Bioware said, "lulz we waz just kidding. Super secret stuff coming. Get out your credit cards, cause its all secret and stuff."
I bragged on forums about how I called it.

By the way, I totally called it.

 

[ThePS1Fan]

Snip.

Ok thanks, I think I understand now. Seems somewhat likely that Bioware might look at this and go "Oh yeah, we meant that!" But as things are I can't see this being Bioware's plan from the beginning.

 

[Kirkybobz]

Ending was bad.
Ending was horrifically written and had plotholes you could charge a platoon of krogans through.
Sad players convinced themselves it was all a big dream sequence and there is a secret "real" ending coming.
Sad players remember this be the future, change "dream sequence" to "indoctrination hallucination".
Bioware said "lulz screw you. End is end."
Bioware noticed 95%+ of their customers were calling for their heads on a plate while at the same time waving their wallets in the air.
Bioware Hmmm'ed.
Bioware said, "lulz we waz just kidding. Super secret stuff coming. Get out your credit cards, cause its all secret and stuff."
I bragged on forums about how I called it.

By the way, I totally called it.

Actually, the upcoming DLC ending is free. And I thought I was a cynic. EA were the ones who rushed the ending, not Bioware. EA wanted instant profits, not profits in another month.

 

[blizzaradragon]

Snip.

Ok thanks, I think I understand now. Seems somewhat likely that Bioware might look at this and go "Oh yeah, we meant that!" But as things are I can't see this being Bioware's plan from the beginning.

Personally I think they planned it from the start, especially considering in the Final Hours of Mass Effect 3 app they talked about wanting to end it with the Reapers fully controlling Shepard through indoctrination but had to cut it because they couldn't get the gameplay right. So it was probably planned, but not in the state it was released in.

I was going to recommend the link that putowtin put, but clicking it takes you to an error page now. Instead if you do some searching around on pretty much any gaming site you can see some interesting points for the theory. If you want to know more I'll be happy to help out with info as well.

Captcha: lumpy gravy
I think the Escapist has a weird taste in food...

 

[ThePS1Fan]

Snip.

Ok thanks, I think I understand now. Seems somewhat likely that Bioware might look at this and go "Oh yeah, we meant that!" But as things are I can't see this being Bioware's plan from the beginning.

Personally I think they planned it from the start, especially considering in the Final Hours of Mass Effect 3 app they talked about wanting to end it with the Reapers fully controlling Shepard through indoctrination but had to cut it because they couldn't get the gameplay right. So it was probably planned, but not in the state it was released in.

I was going to recommend the link that putowtin put, but clicking it takes you to an error page now. Instead if you do some searching around on pretty much any gaming site you can see some interesting points for the theory. If you want to know more I'll be happy to help out with info as well.

Captcha: lumpy gravy
I think the Escapist has a weird taste in food...

I never got that app so I didn't know they had planned for Shepard to be indoctrinated. Does make it seem a lot more likely, guess we will have to wait and see where this goes.

 

[Zen Toombs]

Actually, the upcoming DLC ending is free. And I thought I was a cynic. EA were the ones who rushed the ending, not Bioware. EA wanted instant profits, not profits in another month.

I desperately want to believe you, but I must say:

Note: I can totally get behind the scratched out parts.

 

[lemiel14n3]

Snip.

Ok thanks, I think I understand now. Seems somewhat likely that Bioware might look at this and go "Oh yeah, we meant that!" But as things are I can't see this being Bioware's plan from the beginning.

Actually I suspect that Bioware's plan from the beginning was more along these lines

 

[thatonedude11]

Actually, the upcoming DLC ending is free. And I thought I was a cynic. EA were the ones who rushed the ending, not Bioware. EA wanted instant profits, not profits in another month.

Wait, upcoming free DLC ending? Did I miss something? Last time I checked, Bioware was talking about doing something, but no plans were stated.

 

[Heeman89]

Actually I suspect that Bioware's plan from the beginning was more along these lines

I would actually be happy with that ending, logical conclusions to everything, no plot holes, wraps up nicely without throwing away everything I did.

 

[lemiel14n3]

@Heeman89:
So would I, which is why I'm very surprised that isn't what they did, especially since the source I got it from claims that this was THE PLAN during production a year or two ago.

Honestly, what happened, how did the possibility of success depending on your preparedness and outcomes based on your earlier actions become a choice of three pallet-swapped explosions with consequences described by something pulled out of a cross between the shitty Matrix movies and Contact?

I mean.. yeah, EA, it would have cost money to make these different endings, but you had a fanbase so large and willing to spend that you were pretty much guaranteed a return on your investment.

I had always suspected that the final mission would be something along the lines of the collector base. If you rushed into it, yeah you'd get the job done, but you'd loose everything in the process, even your own life, but the time you put into it to ensure success would be rewarded with the survival of not only yourself, but everyone who depended on you, your companions and crew members. Just with ME3, on a much grander scale.

 

[joonatanr]

Watching that jpg just gives me this incredibly depressing feeling of what could have been. if you compare this ending to the one we got, the actual ending seems unbelievable. Unbelievable because it just doesn't make sense to me how could anybody at bioware not realize that this was a bad idea. I mean it's not really that hard now is it? I think the endings on the jpg might not be perfect, but all in all they would make me satisfied with the whole series and it would feel like my choices truly mattered and affected the final assault.

If random people at forums can figure out how to make a decent ending for mass effect 3 then how did professional writers manage to drop the ball. Bioware claims that the ending was to meant to polarize people's opinions. But that seems like a complete load of BS. Currently the only polarization among people is that about half of the people want a completely new ending and the others want the current ending improved. I mean seriously how could anybody be satisfied with the ending we got is beyond me. It isn't that it's an ending that people don't agree with. It's an ending that doesn't really fulfill the function of an ending at all. It does nothing to wrap up the series, it does nothing to conclude the player's relationships with the characters and most of all it does nothing to make any of our choices throughout 5 years matter at all.

Maybe the worst thing about the whole ordeal is that when I really started to analyze how gameplay affects the ending I realized that playing a few days of multiplayer has a vastly greater impact on how the ending plays out than any choices made during ME3 and previous games.

How did this happen?? How could anybody think that this was a good idea??? Didn't test gamers feel let down and disappointed. Didn't the writers see that the ending was full of plotholes and nonsense? I just don't understand..... I really wish the lemiel134-s picture was the real ending of mass effect 3.

 

[SwagLordYoloson]

The Indoctrination Theory :
> Plebeians play Mass Effect
> Plebeians fall in love with Mass Effect
> Bioware uses Plebeians to take over world

 

[joonatanr]

Goddammit I just can't get over this. Why isn't this the real ending???????? I want to witness that ending. EA and Bioware suck...

 

[IBlackKiteI]

Just checked it out, and I thought the pre-release ME2 and ME3 speculation was bad.

The 'evidence' is not some deep hidden message or allusion to a masterfully executed plot device that's been there all along, they are simply the result of a crappy, rushed segment. Some shit was reused, some shit didn't make sense because of crappy rushed level design/writing.
That's it.

Anyway, it's so hilarious (at least the zetaboards http://w11.zetaboards.com/Theorycraftng_HUB/topic/7698722/1/ one) and dumb that if the fans weren't so utterly desperate for some sign of any different ending, so long as it's better than the one we've got, then even they would probably call it on it's insanity.

 

[Imperius]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ythY_GkEBck&feature=g-all-s&context=G2ebf056FAAAAAAAAAAA


This will explain it all clearly. I personally believe the destruction of the mass relays was Shepard's mind of wanting to "free" the galaxy of Reaper control entirely

 

[dancolls]

I'm glad I watched that video and read the thing in the description. It makes sense, simply put. Explains all the 'plot holes' and also explains why the option where you're told Shepherd and all synthetic life will be destroyed is the only one where Shepherd might actually survive...