Education: No Zero Grading Policy Opinions

[rasputin0009]

No Zero Grading Policy is essentially an education grading system that does not give zeroes for not handing in assignments. Instead, they are given multiple opportunities to hand in completed schoolwork, and are graded upon knowledge of the subject.

As I understand, Nordic European countries (like Norway) have been using this systems with great success. They are world leaders when it comes to teaching children.

On the opposite side, there's America's standard for giving zeroes and F's for unfinished work. They aren't even close to the top when it comes to education in First-World countries.

Canada is in the middle of a transition between the two. Some public school divisions are embracing the no zero policy, while others are firm in not changing. Canada is neither at the top or bottom, but in between.

So I have a few questions for you:
1. What did you grow up with? (And where?)
2. What do you think of the no zero policy?
3. What do you think is wrong with the policy?
and 4. What do you think is right with the policy?

I grew up (in Western Canada) with zeroes, but I was lucky enough to be a good student so it didn't bother me much. I initially thought the no zero policy was terrible until I actually started reading about it. Now, I'm all for it, based on the fact that the no zero policy grades based on ability rather than behaviour. Public education isn't meant to teach behaviour, it's supposed to teach skills.

I'm writing an argument essay for my University English, and want some examples of arguments for and against by the above-average intelligence of the Escapist community. Thanks for responding.

 

[Heronblade]

I do not like the way America's system is make or break, and shifting focus to ability is something I've wanted educators to do for quite some time.

However, ultimately, school also is supposed to prepare students to APPLY the skills in question I have yet to meet an employer that will let you delay completing a task without a damn good reason.

 

[OneCatch]

So I have a few questions for you:
1. What did you grow up with? (And where?)
2. What do you think of the no zero policy?
3. What do you think is wrong with the policy?
and 4. What do you think is right with the policy?

South Wales, UK

1. We had zero grading if you didn't hand any work in, but you'd usually have an opportunity to hand work in late without grade penalty, and unfinished would be marked as extensively as possible. I think that's a good balance.

2. I'd disagree with it in a limited way. I'm all for testing the overall knowledge of a pupil rather than rote learning (and marks based on discussion instead of essay or exam is something I'd approve of). That said, I do think if a particular task isn't handed in at all, the pupil can't legitimately complain if they don't get credit for it.

3. As above, I don't think you can complain if you fail to make an effort to complete work.

4. It would help pupils who have difficulty completing work, though there are probably other means of support that would be more appropriate - extending deadlines for struggling pupils, offering extra lessons, etc.

 

[Albino Boo]

The problem is that you are not comparing like with like. Finland which has the best performing state education system uses a child centred policies. That said Finland is small culturally and racially homogenous society in which it's very hard to be dirt poor. There are strong social pressures to perform at school and the social problems that are part of the US education system don't exist to any where near the same extent in Finland. It's like taking a school system from Martha's Vineyard and putting it into downtown Detroit. A closer comparison to the US is the UK's state education system. The UK has flirted with child centred education for the last 20 years or so and according to the OECD todays children are less numerate and literate than their grandparents. To be blunt, child centred education is fine for middle class kids with strong social support at home but crap for anyone else.

As last point part of the whole point of deadlines at school is to prepare for adult world of work. If you come from world in which there is no downside for not doing the thing that you are asked, you are going to be in for real shock in the real world where you get fired for not doing work.

 

[Elfgore]

I grew up with a you could get zeroes, but your overall grade would never fall below a 50. So recovery is possible.

I think the policy is a little to forgiving for not doing schoolwork, but it makes logical sense because they have to know the subject to pass.

 

[Redd the Sock]

Alberta. We didn't get automatic zeros, but we lost a full letter grade per day late. I had a cousin with a far more forgiving teacher and she took full advantage of it. She's on welfare now.

The thing is, students are supposed to learn life work skills in addition to the elements of the class being taught. I work in payroll for example and I don't get to let things be late. People count on me to pay them promptly so they can pay their bills. I'd be causing a lot of trouble for others if I didn't meet those deadlines. I am on the receiving end of the reverse as people aren't aware that the deadlines for their times sheets are there so I have time to do my job, and being late is at best a hassle, and at worst, very problematic.

The no zero policy reenforces bad life habits like procrastination, poor time management, and disregard for the impact your actions may have on others. Life very seldom gives people free reign to say "I'll do it in my own sweet time".

 

[McMullen]

Getting zeroes for not handing in work or not handing it in by the deadline seems fine to me; after all if I fail to get a project completed for a client by the time he needs it, no amount of catching up is going to change the fact that it'll be too late for him to do anything with the product he paid me to make.

What is ridiculous are classes that give out two or more assignments a week, do not let you do work outside of the class even when you try to work out a solution with the teacher, and fail you automatically if you have a single one of them incomplete. I failed such a class in high school even though I was the only person to pass the final exam.

But I think it only matters to the extent that the students think it does; I barely got out of high school with a 2.1 GPA (~70% average for those of you across the Atlantic) after taking night classes, but was on the Dean's List of my university 3 years later, and I'm currently maintaining a 4.0 (the maximum) as a Masters student. Very little of what happens in k-12 really affects your later life, at least as far as the schoolwork goes. I suppose interactions with one's fellow students have a significant impact on one's social skills and, potentially, psychological issues, but with a couple exceptions the teachers and the material are pretty much irrelevant.

 

[Foolery]

British Columbia. Uh, yeah, no. Never really had that in school. It was usually either hand in the assignment or fuck you, you're getting nothing. Depends on the teacher. Some allowed extensions or make up projects. I'm not sure how I feel about a zero policy.

 

[Miss G.]

The Bahamas. We don't have the "No Zero" policy as of yet, but grading more or less depended on the teacher, as some would give extensions, make-up work or subtract a full letter grade per day from what your work would've gotten had you completed it (sucks if you would've started with a C/75% and take long to finish things) instead of just giving you a zero. Then again, I've only ever been to private schools, so I don't know how it is in the government schools here.

 

[legend of duty]

My education is not horrible. My fellow students are. The ones who give a shit pass the ones who don't pass anyway basically taking the point out of grades anyway. Its not just math or science either its every subject even construction. They cannot bring themselves to mix mortar and lay four bricks within an hour. They are there for the free lunch plain and simple.

 

[Phrozenflame500]

Canada. Went to a private school in Ontario.

We grade "as is" when handed in incomplete, rarely a flat zero although you could still fail if you didn't answer enough correct. Assignments can be marked down for late, but they're generally generous as long as it's not a repeat habit. Not sure about any other school though.

I fail to see how this is any different from our current system aside from "you don't can insta-failed if late".

 

[Simple Bluff]

I don't get it. If you don't hand in an assignment (without a valid excuse), why wouldn't you get zero? No assignment = no marks. Seems pretty fair to me. Am I missing something here?

EDIT: Forgot to answer the OP.

I'm from Ireland. In school, we don't have a continued assessment system - just a few really big exams at the end of your education. I'm not fond of it to be honest, it'd be fairer if it was split into two exam periods, or given graded assignment work.

EDIT 2: I'm an idiot. Forgot to answer the OP's other question.

I don't like the idea of no zero grading. Unless I misunderstood (which is probably the case), it just sounds too nice. If you set fair deadlines with a reasonable amount of work, then the work should be done. Laziness or lack of proper time management shouldn't be accommodated.

What do I think is right about the policy? Erm... I suppose it alleviates a bit of stress. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[WouldYouKindly]

I'd have loved such a system. I didn't care for homework at all. To me it was nonsense busy work. I knew the subject matter because I payed attention when you taught it. In history, I could answer the questions other kids asked better than the teacher could.

Homework should be a tool you use to help teach yourself the material. It's like practice. You probably shouldn't practice the things you already know you do very well. Using a sports analogy that the Canadians in question would like. If a player is great on the forecheck, he shouldn't focus his practices on that, should he? Say he can't seem to back check properly without drawing a penalty, that's something he really should work at.

So, yeah, I'm in favor of that system. I'd have passed with straight A's using it. You can say it doesn't teach proper work ethic, but I think that's what parents are for.

 

[MysticSlayer]

I was homeschooled throughout high school and my parents never bothered to give me a zero on anything. Then again, I was a diligent enough student that if I didn't turn something in on time then it was because I just ran out of time. I think my parents just eventually dropped time limits all together, but my brother learned the hard way that they would deduct points off the final grade if one of us had the habit of turning everything in excessively late.

In any case, I'm somewhat torn. On the one hand, whether or not the person is actually learning the material, regardless of their method of doing so, will be reflected on the exams. This became very obvious to me during my Calculus class where those he did the optional homework did very well while those who didn't do any work outside of cramming in for the exam the night before did very poorly. On the other hand, not putting time limits on homework runs the risk of discouraging character growth (which is just as important to education as developing a set of skills to use in life and work), and not having homework potentially harms poor test takers who rely on assignments to get by.[footnote]Note: Not everyone who does poorly on tests isn't learning. They may just not be good at a testing environment, which is an issue I run into with some professors. For instance, a student who specializes in linking information, analyzing it, and coming to reasonable conclusions about it may struggle on tests where all they have to do is regurgitate facts because it isn't in line with who they are as a learner.[/footnote] Ultimately, I think it should be a decision left up to the teacher/professor based on how they understand their class. If their class is very good at doing work without having to have someone keeping up with them then I'd say go for it, but if their class has issues with actually doing work then they should be willing to give out zeroes.

As I understand, Nordic European countries (like Norway) have been using this systems with great success. They are world leaders when it comes to teaching children.

On the opposite side, there's America's standard for giving zeroes and F's for unfinished work. They aren't even close to the top when it comes to education in First-World countries.

Do be careful about drawing cause and effect here. The difference in education quality might be due to other factors, such as how a country divides its students, the way material is presented (American has a horrible reputation for teaching the test), etc. Also consider how they rank success. If a students' grades are considered, then not giving out zeroes would act as an artificial inflator of success rate.

 

[krazykidd]

What . The . Fuck . Seriously . If you don't do your work , or don't hand it in on time ( without a valid reason)you should get a 0. Why are we teaching kids it's okay to not so shit? What's going to happen when they at work and don't hand in their report on time? School is suppse to prepare you for real life.

 

[Easton Dark]

I'm in the U.S., some teachers just gave zeroes if it wasn't turned in at the due date, others lowered it a letter grade each day.

Regardless of the fact I think homework is worthless,

If you don't do the work assigned to you, you should get nothing in return for it.

Spoiler: EQUIVALENT EXCHANGE BABY

 

[Vausch]

1. What did you grow up with? (And where?)

-Most of my high school teachers in Idaho had different methods. Some would let you complete any homework late but you could only get a passing grade, some would deduct 10% per day late, and some would just not accept late work.

My physics teacher ran on the idea that learning the material was more important than memorising keywords and jotting them down only to forget after the fact, so his policy was we had to pick our own grades then attempt to justify to him why we earned them. If he liked our argument, we got what we wanted. If not, we had to try for a lower one.


2. What do you think of the no zero policy?

If the teachers can motivate the students to always get the work in on time and they actually learn the material, more power to them.

3. What do you think is wrong with the policy?

Situations like the US would be difficult because we're constantly struggling with overcrowded classrooms, which lets students that aren't interested not get the attention and help they need while the focus goes to those that already understand the material. That and I don't fully grasp what happens if a student just doesn't bother.

4. What do you think is right with the policy?

It definitely can create a situation where the student can learn without the stress of a hard deadline, and insuring they get the material learned is more important than an arbitrary number.