Escape to the Movies: Frozen

[hexFrank202]

>It's jarring how Gaston's evil plan changes on a dime at the start of the 3rd act

>It's clumsy how we get introduced to the Castle from the POV of Belle's father... and then we get ANOTHER introduction to the Castle from the POV of Belle herself

>It's ridiculous how the servants of the Castle never showed any concern for the prospect of being house appliances forever; they only ever showed worry about the Beast, and didn't even bring it up. I thought they were inanimate objects brought to life, not the other way around

>In the opening song, Belle suddenly goes into "there must be something more" in a really weird way. There wasn't anything in the number that lead up to that theme

>The Clock and the Candle guys just seem like they split Sebastian into two, weaker characters


We haven't had a perfect Disney movie since ever

 

[Cpt. Slow]

I am surprised that a Disney film made it into Bob's top 10 list. Wow. Still going to 'pick it up' when the Bluray gets released. But it's nice to see something remotely 90's-ish getting praise and good reviews without it being ironic. However, I wonder what would happen if they went into full retro mode and actually make it look like a classic drawn 2D animation instead of the 3D rendered (but still wonderful) looking eye poking feast we have on our hands now.

Probably a box office killer because people still long for something out of the 90's.

 

[scorptatious]

Glad to see you liked it too Bob.

The movie was just damn fun. And I also really how it throws out conventional tropes that often appear in these kinds of movies.

Spoiler

I was expecting the usual "true love's kiss" schtick from Kristoff, but instead, Elsa was the one who ends up saving Anna from death. As you said, it really is a love story between two women.

Olaf was pretty fun too.

 

[trimanx123]

As something of a raving animation fanboy, most Disney movies are required viewing, but I'm really very happy that this is good. But is it just me or have a lot of critics forgotten both Tangled and The Princess and the Frog? Those were both extremely solid, with gorgeous artwork overall.

On another more movie criticism note, I've been watching a few of the other canonified Disney classics recently and started reading Tim Brayton at Antagony & Ecstasy again. He's blogged reviews of the entire Disney canon and they're absolutely fantastic: extremely informative, thought-provoking and occasionally laced with wit. They are really long though. But if anyone's interested in reading further into Disney animation, here you go:

http://movieglut.blogspot.com/2010/01/disney-animation.html

 

[AJey]

So close to Bob's definition of perfect, and yet Miyazaki's new work blows it out of the park. Such a vast chasm between east and west animation.

I wouldn't go that far. There is a TON of bad animation that comes out of the East, it's just that we usually only get to see/hear the best they have to offer (unless you're seriously into anime and look at a ton of it.) I love Miyazaki as much as the next guy and think that Spirited Away is one of the best animated movies of all time, but the West produces animated masterpieces as well.

To be clear, Miyazaki might be the greatest director of animation ever, so using him as the standard of Eastern animation would be sort of like using a Stanley Kubric or Francis Ford Coppola movie or their body of work, to claim that there is a vast chasm between the quality of movies produced in the West vs the East. It just seems like you might be thrusting the very best of the very best forward and suggesting that it is the stock standard for the region. I'm not sure that is a good way to do a comparison is all.

You are right, my comparison is limited and flawed, but I do indeed compare the best of the best. I realize that Miyazaki is not a standard even for Japan. Just like US with movies, Japan produces many animes (full-feature and episodic), and most of them are sub-par at best. So the reason I take Miyazaki is because he is an epitome of quality in that niche genre. Just like Kubric or Coppola for movies. And in my opinion these people set standards that we should aspire to.

 

[Mana Fiend]

Okay, Bob's made me seriously want to do see this. It sounds like a fantastic setup for a movie - the ad made me think 'maybe on DVD...' but it just sounds really good. Plus, I do like the character design for Elsa: I'm a sucker for any ice-type look.

 

[Flight]

Loose adaptation..? Considering that it sounds nothing like the story that H.C. Andersen wrote, it sort of comes off as "nothing alike, apart from there being a snow queen in it".

Forgive me if I sound snobbish about this, but The Snow Queen is the first story I ever read as a kid, that really spoke to me of a sense of wonder and amazing imagination.
One of the interesting parts of this story, is that almost all the characters are women or girls, with the exception of Kaj, the Prince and the Devil, who all serve minor roles.

I don't know if I want to see it at all. It sounds like a nice spin-off, but at the same time I'm sad that the story has become so distorted. The Little Mermaid I can understand that the story was changed in a drastic way, since it's a very sad story, but Frozen sounds like it's butchered the story.

I completely agree. The Snow Queen was my favorite fairy tale, bar none, when I was growing up. At first, I was highly excited to see this. Then I learned about most of the women in the story being cut out (apparently because animating women in a diverse manner is "hard"), as well as the animation style looking to be a bit too similar to Tangled for my tastes, and my interest pretty much went down the tubes. That said, it looks like it may be a decent film in its own right, and I may very well rent it or something when it comes out.

 

[Azure Knight-Zeo]

I might have to go see this.

 

[Piorn]

Looks great, I just wish they'd market it better. Especially in germany.
I mean sure they can't really take the english title, but instead they take the original story title and add a punny subtitle that hits so low, you don't even cringe anymore, you just die a little inside.

I might go see it, but only if I find a time without kids in the cinema. They ruined Wreck-It-Ralph for me. Seriously who brings a 3-year-old to a movie? They don't even understand sentences, much less focus, how do you expect them to follow a narrative?

 

[chozo_hybrid]

This better be good then, my girlfriend wants to see it and it looked kinda meh, but you've made it sound good. So lets hope it now doesn't disappoint.

I might go see it, but only if I find a time without kids in the cinema. They ruined Wreck-It-Ralph for me. Seriously who brings a 3-year-old to a movie? They don't even understand sentences, much less focus, how do you expect them to follow a narrative?

Go to a night screening around 8pm ish, doubt you'll have young kids then, it's what I do for these kinds of flicks.

 

[TristanBelmont]

Holy butts...
Was NOT expecting that. With all the aggressive marketing for this lately, I was expecting it to be garbage in comparison to the under-advertised Free Birds. Imagine my surprise when I hear it's right up there with Mulan. Alright, count me in.

 

[Nurb]

I can't tell you why the third act is amazing, but it's revolutionary for Disney film making

This isn't a 'It's great because Feminism' type things, is it? Because this is Disney and the internet is getting stirred up, I am assuming that's the case. If I turn out to be right, I will be somewhat disappointed. It's not that I disagree with whatever good message it might be trying to convey, it's just I don't think that neccisairly makes things better or worse at the end of the day. i guess it could be racism too, but I didn't see the opportunity for that in those clips. It's not homophobia either, since Bob already confirmed that's not what this is about.

well you can read it here

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/columns/moviebob/10778-Lets-Talk-About-the-Ending-of-Frozen?utm_source=features&utm_medium=index_carousel&utm_campaign=all

but if your one of those people who tunes out things over one paragraph here's a TLDR for you

Spoiler

Love a first sight is shown to be bunk, and "prince charming" turns out to be an evil douche.

From what I've seen and read from Bob in the last 8 months. I can't say I wasn't expecting this sort of explination for the excitement.

 

[VikingKing]

I will honestly say that while I enjoyed a lot of this movie, the whole song and dance number they had about love was probably the low point of the movie, if only because I'm tired of Disney trying to force the idea of marriage being the ultimate solution to all your problems in life.

 

[xaszatm]

I will honestly say that while I enjoyed a lot of this movie, the whole song and dance number they had about love was probably the low point of the movie, if only because I'm tired of Disney trying to force the idea of marriage being the ultimate solution to all your problems in life.

...uh...did you watch the movie?

Spoiler

When and where in the movie is "Marriage is the answer" ever stated? The only time is the "Love is an open door" song, and that is quickly realized to be completely bunk. Hell, Anna DOESN'T marry Kristof at the end and Elsa doesn't have a romantic partner nor seems interested in one. Hell, I'd say that this lesson is an improvement over previous Disney ones in that it places importance on familial relationships and implies that romantic ones take time.

 

[Not G. Ivingname]

So close to Bob's definition of perfect, and yet Miyazaki's new work blows it out of the park. Such a vast chasm between east and west animation.

I wouldn't go that far. There is a TON of bad animation that comes out of the East, it's just that we usually only get to see/hear the best they have to offer (unless you're seriously into anime and look at a ton of it.) I love Miyazaki as much as the next guy and think that Spirited Away is one of the best animated movies of all time, but the West produces animated masterpieces as well.

To be clear, Miyazaki might be the greatest director of animation ever, so using him as the standard of Eastern animation would be sort of like using a Stanley Kubric or Francis Ford Coppola movie or their body of work, to claim that there is a vast chasm between the quality of movies produced in the West vs the East. It just seems like you might be thrusting the very best of the very best forward and suggesting that it is the stock standard for the region. I'm not sure that is a good way to do a comparison is all.

Yeah, Eastern animation has loads of issues that doesn't happen as often with Western animation projects.

To begin with, anime on average has about a THIRD of the animation cost an animated series has in the US (over 100,000 versus over 300,000). That is why so many series have things like sweat drops and shifts into chibi style, it's cheaper. This also deeply effects the voice acting quality.

Also, very few films get any kind of international attention. Sure, the series get plenty of translations, but besides of Miyazaki, almost no anime get's theatrical runs outside of Japan.

 

[VikingKing]

I will honestly say that while I enjoyed a lot of this movie, the whole song and dance number they had about love was probably the low point of the movie, if only because I'm tired of Disney trying to force the idea of marriage being the ultimate solution to all your problems in life.

...uh...did you watch the movie?

Spoiler

When and where in the movie is "Marriage is the answer" ever stated? The only time is the "Love is an open door" song, and that is quickly realized to be completely bunk. Hell, Anna DOESN'T marry Kristof at the end and Elsa doesn't have a romantic partner nor seems interested in one. Hell, I'd say that this lesson is an improvement over previous Disney ones in that it places importance on familial relationships and implies that romantic ones take time.

Huh, I'm not actually sure why I said that upon reflection, since what you've said is correct.

Spoiler

For the record though, it was the song by the trolls that really bothered me, not the earlier bit. Because while the first song was used as a method of setting up a later plot twist, the whole thing about falling in love with someone you just met being a bad idea...well, while Anna doesn't marry Kristof, she falls in love with him quickly. This also applies to Kristof mind you.

In the end, while marriage doesn't occur, a deep powerful relationship builds between these two individuals far too quickly for my liking. Disney took a step forward but their bad habits will take some time to undo.

 

[Realitycrash]

I'm sorry, but No. NO. You can tout up the character-animation and personalities all you want, but it isn't going to stop the fact that both the girls are thin, cute, ever-perfect beauty-pageant posters. We keep sending this message to children (Hey, heroes look good, if you don't look good, start looking good!) and I'm not going to accept it.
No matter how revolutionary the story.
No matter how how focus the women get compared to the men.
No matter the hidden adult themes.
When you start having the major protagonists looking AVERAGE (without being portrayed with any negative stereotypes associated with 'average' looks, like dorky, bookish, boring, comic relief, etc), then I will give a hoot. This goes for men AND women.

I'm probably going to see this movie anyway, and enjoy it, but I'm not going to accolade it with anything.

 

[Programmed_For_Damage]

Wow. I've got two daughters that were all fired up to see this and I was just dreading the thought due to the annoying ad campaign. Thanks to the review I'm now a little psyched to see it!

My youngest daughter is named Aurora so there is definately a bit of love for the Disney princesses in our household.

 

[Trishbot]

I'm sorry, but No. NO. You can tout up the character-animation and personalities all you want, but it isn't going to stop the fact that both the girls are thin, cute, ever-perfect beauty-pageant posters. We keep sending this message to children (Hey, heroes look good, if you don't look good, start looking good!) and I'm not going to accept it.
No matter how revolutionary the story.
No matter how how focus the women get compared to the men.
No matter the hidden adult themes.
When you start having the major protagonists looking AVERAGE (without being portrayed with any negative stereotypes associated with 'average' looks, like dorky, bookish, boring, comic relief, etc), then I will give a hoot. This goes for men AND women.

I'm probably going to see this movie anyway, and enjoy it, but I'm not going to accolade it with anything.

... Um, I know you said you haven't seen the movie, but they kind of DO go out of their way to show some of these "ever-perfect" princesses in a joyfully ordinary light in Frozen. Us girls take ages to "get pretty", and there's a brilliant scene in the movie of one of the girls fresh out of bed in a pretty awesome, undignified sort of way... apart from the way she stuffs chocolate in her mouth.

Even the phrase "I promise you, sir, she's entirely ordinary..." is thrown in for good measure.

And the poor male lead gets an entire song-and-dance number about his vices (from spitting to smelling to picking his nose, etc.)

It's not suddenly turning everyone into Plain Janes, of course (they ARE pretty once they get cleaned up... like most pretty girls), but they're well-written characters with enough realism and vices to keep them more grounded than arguably most other Disney princesses can claim to be.

You're not going to see Princess Jasmine drooling on her pillow with her hair looking like Edward Scissorhands anytime soon.