Escape to the Movies: The Amazing Spider-Man 2 - The Movie That Broke MovieBob

[Paradoxrifts]

If you're having a serious existential crisis over Spider Man movies then I honestly feel for you, Movie Bob. From experience, you can't choose the subject matter of what almost breaks you.

 

[kaizen2468]

It's nice having low expectations of movies. I'd go into that expecting him to swing around on his webs for awhile, fight a few goofy villains and then it would be over and I'll be happy. I mean it's nice when you get an Avengers but I have a blast at all these movies.

 

[Sejborg]

Lol. Bob hating on this movie actually makes me like it even more. I was on a 6/10 score, but I might turn it up to 7/10 now.

The "no character arcs" is bullshit by the way. Peter has an arc, Electro a short one, Harry a pretty important one.

 

[Dragonbums]

Lol. Bob hating on this movie actually makes me like it even more. I was on a 6/10 score, but I might turn it up to 7/10 now.

The "no character arcs" is bullshit by the way. Peter has an arc, Electro a short one, Harry a pretty important one.

And as Bob already detailed none of those arcs really came together to form any cohesive story in the overall grand scheme of things.

He literally acknowledged in the video that there were arcs in the movie, but no real definitive plot to nail down entirely.

 

[immortalfrieza]

It's nice having low expectations of movies. I'd go into that expecting him to swing around on his webs for awhile, fight a few goofy villains and then it would be over and I'll be happy. I mean it's nice when you get an Avengers but I have a blast at all these movies.

Exactly. These people who hate on movies like this should already know what they're getting into, and if they liked the concept enough to walk in to begin with they should enjoy the movie. In other words, don't expect something out of a movie when you already know that's not what you are going to get.

Captcha: yes definitely

Apparently even the captcha agrees.

 

[JimB]

I am using this post as representative of a trend I've noticed in this thread. Comic Sans is far from the only person doing it, but I have to get to work and don't have time to go quote mining.

I honestly believe that Bob doesn't want to like these movies. He has an idea in his head as to how it should be, and when it doesn't do that he rails against it.

Not for nothing, but I kind of get the same vibe about people who have a problem with his taste in the franchise. "It's impossible that he dislikes the movies for the reasons he stated in the videos! No, his real reasons are the narrative I assert about him being butthurt!"

I think people are forgetting all the flaws of the original Spider-Man films.

You're not the only person to do it, so I don't mean to single you out when I ask: why do people do this? When people criticize the current franchise, why do people try to change the subject and start ripping apart the old one? It's very suspicious to me, because I can't help noting that people almost never respond by defending the movie--by saying, "Here are things I like about the Amazing Spider-Man 2"--but rather they respond by attacking the previous trilogy. The implication there is not that the current franchise is actually good, but rather only that the previous one isn't. It feels like a bait and switch.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of the previous trilogy. Raimi loves his melodrama way too much for my taste. I just feel like people are tipping their hands when they're presented with a choice to defend this movie's good points or change the subject to attack a different movie's bad points and opt for the latter.

Writing the movie [off] and hoping it flops because a guy on the internet said it was bad is the height of ignorance.

I also think it's telling when people have the choice to defend the movie's good points or attack the people who don't see it, and opt for the latter. Suddenly it stops being about whether the movie is any good but whether people have the gall to disagree with you, which, for all the complaints about Mr. Chipman's bias, certainly calls your own into question.

 

[WhiteFangofWhoa]

Sorry to hear about your (hopefully) brief lapse into hatred of Spider-Man and comic book movies and Hollywood. Sounds like we have another Batman and Robin here, except this time the company making it is quite intent on making Batman Triumphant afterwards even if it does tank.

He's not just reacting to ASM2 being bad, but the promise of many more like it to come no matter what he says or does. Because licensing.

I know. Try cheering yourself out of this funk by doing a Big Picture or Intermission on the various Spider-Man animated series' and what you liked about each of them. Always cheers me up to remember personal favourite scenes in Spectacular and 90s Spidey. I even liked Norman Osborn's character in that one.

Or if you're up for something more relevant, explain to people 'Why Sam Raimi's Spider Man 2 Still Rules', because it's been listed on your top 3 favourite comic book movies before and people have given you flack for that. I just found it average myself, but maybe you can shed some light on why you like it so much.

 

[AstaresPanda]

HA well was never really a fan of spiderman always came off as emo to me back in the day and after those first 3 movies that just bored the shit outta me ive not even felt the need to watch these news ones. And this and many other people iove spoke to just seems kinda lame.

But now Bob knows how i felt with the Transformers made by Bay. It just ruined transformers for me, or it being taken more then anything else but a big long kids toy advert.

I have one last hope that a warhammer40k movie will happen and not suck lol

fuck you sony for making Bob sad Bob

 

[petef201]

So much for giving it a chance, eh? I get that it's a very cynical approach to filmmaking by mainly existing to set up future movies and I can see why that would be annoying. But is it really that much different to the Marvel Studios method? Yes the Marvel films are generally better but I can't help but feel MovieBob's forcing himself to hate this a bit more than he needed to. I've seen the film and it's definitely not perfect, but I had a good time with it despite not particularly enjoying the first one.

I can see how hating the behind the scenes stuff, combined with having issues with the film (to be fair most of his negative comments about the actual film are fairly accurate) could lead to hating it, but there's still so much positive stuff he ignored. For me Spider-Man himself was pretty much perfect in how he moved and acted. The action was superb, not just 'cos it looked cool but because he spoke and fought like Spider-Man, something I'd argue Tobey McGuire never did.

I don't normally complain about reviews, and I usually enjoy MovieBob's stuff, but this seemed a bit too far. No the film isn't perfect and I have no issue with folk not liking it for some of the weak characters and (occasional) poor dialogue; or the conveniences and generally messiness of the plot. But I can't help but think that if the Sinister Six and Amazing Spider-Man 3 through 900 hadn't already been announced that this would've been a more positive review.

The difference between The Amazing Spider-man and The Marvel Movies is the Marvel movies focus on creating stand-alone features with world-building, and sequel set-up relegated to the sidelines, whereas here a lot of the story is about bringing up plot points that are meant to pay off in future sequels or spin-offs, and lots of interesting characters and threads are dropped for use in later movies. Iron Man 2 has set-up for future Marvel movies, but Iron Man doesn't spend a third of the film looking for Thor's hammer, or freeing Captain America from the ice.

Good point well made. The world building does get in the way here, but think I just felt MovieBob was overly harsh.

 

[petef201]

As far as my interests of Spiderman go, The Playstation 1 game is probably the only thing I played and genuinely like about Spiderman, The first Raimi movie is sillier in hindsight, but Spiderman otherwise hasn't been a property I've been interested in too much for quite some time (Well, okay, I bought Web of Shadows and I hear Spiderman 2: The game is amazing, but the PSX game is the highest point to me).

As far as the movies go, I didn't like Amazing Spider-man, I thought it wasn't coherent enough to really get into, the film felt more of an amalgam of comedy, sci-fi (slick sci-fi, the kind that explains midichlorians to an audience, not dark difficult sci-fi) and adventure, but not as smart or witty enough to really get into, but neither was Sam Raimi's version.

But, it was fine, I was glad I waited until it came out in such a fashion that I didn't have to pay for it to watch it, but I don't think this will be much better, and I'll probably reserve the "Wait N' See" option of the last movie for this one. I could go see Capt. America, that's still in theaters.

A great (but as what cost?) review, Moviebob.

I loved the PSX Spider-Man games! Great memories!

 

[Trooper924]

Not for nothing, but I kind of get the same vibe about people who have a problem with his taste in the franchise. "It's impossible that he dislikes the movies for the reasons he stated in the videos! No, his real reasons are the narrative I assert about him being butthurt!"

Yeah, I feel the same way. While I think Bob is a little hard on ASM, I often feel that his detractors go too far in the other direction, with them glossing over or outright ignoring any flaws or missteps the film had. In the more extreme cases, they'd be essentially arguing that ASM was the Citizen Kane of superhero films, a flawless, sacred work of art.

(Personally, I thought ASM was okay at best. It had a lot of good points and a lot of potential, but it also had many, many problems holding it back.)

 

[josemlopes]

He can't be serious, can he?

Of course he can. Have you never been exposed to something you truly hate and thought, This is my future, this is what the world holds for me now? I have. For instance, love of the roleplaying game Exalted was a pretty huge part of my life for ten or fifteen years, but a few years back, after trying so hard to navigate the train wreck of the game created by an entirely too eager system designer playtested by no one in particular and eight years of the series having no cohesive editorial oversight because the company was floundering and that no one involved just gave a shit about to the point that books were printed with text copied and pasted from the previous edition referencing mechanics that no longer exist...I just couldn't sustain my enthusiasm. Something broke inside me. I began to hate the line, the books (that is, the physical objects sitting on my shelf), and the community surrounding them. I'm still not totally over it. The game line is now being developed by a publisher that gives a damn, and the books are being written by the all-stars whose work was actually good, but I'm still not totally over it. I still kind of hate it.

So, Mr. Chipman, should you be reading it, I think I understand how you feel, and you have my sympathies. The only thing I can say to you is that people heal. They may scar, but the wound does close.

Dude, accept that good things dont last forever and you will be fine. For what was worth that game kept you entertained for ten to fifteen years and you probably really enjoyed it during those times so be gratefull that it happened and accept that it went to shit. I can still listen to the first few albums of Offspring even though they turned to shit without any problem, sure it would have been awesome if they kept the quality they once had but I am thankfull that I did (and can still) listen to those old ones.

And Bob basicly had a franchise he liked a lot be incredibly turned into an advertisement (loosing the chance to be a worthwile movie or part of the Avengers for a long time), well, that sucks but the comics (what is the actual Spiderman) are still going as they always have been and movies in general are still going to be good or bad, its not like ALL movies will be like The Amazing Spiderman 2 or anything, just the next Spiderman movies that he can choose to ignore.

Basicly he is a huge fanboy crying that the movie adaptation of that thing he liked is shit. Get over it.

 

[Uberpig]

Bob, grow up. Seriously. It was an okay movie - not great, not memorable, just okay.
For you to declare this harmless bit of fun as something that destroyed Spiderman is difficult to understand. In ASM, Spiderman is actually a wisecracker and the love interest does something other than scream for help - which is truer to the source material when compared to the original trilogy.
The Richard Parker thing is lacking a payoff at the moment, I'll give you that.
And it's true that some of the dialogue and scenes in ASM are dripping with cheese - but the original trilogy suffered the same problem.
ASM and ASM2 are okay movies, same as Spiderman 1 and 2.

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

Huh. I feel pretty sorry for Bob. It seems like an unfortunate coincidence for him that Hollywood's obsession with remakes and adaptions has rolled around when stuff from his childhood is just getting to the 'old enough to be retro'. Transformers, TMNT, Robocop, comics (not specific to his generation, but certainly not a big part of younger ones)... It must suck seeing things you love get turned into things that you really, really don't. Even if they're not outright terrible a lot of the time, seeing it happen to every damned thing must be disheartening. I sure as hell know that if the Lego Movie had sucked I'd probably have shed a few tears in the cinema (I did, but more because it was awesome). I suppose this might be more a case of the straw that broke the camel's back rather than this specific film being devilspawn.

 

[JimB]

Dude, accept that good things don't last forever and you will be fine.

That really has nothing to do with what I'm talking about, but thank you for that glib advice on how to live my life and what beliefs to hold, I guess.

Bob, grow up. Seriously. It was an okay movie - not great, not memorable, just okay.

Would you like to explain why it was okay, or shall we just take your word for it?

For you to declare this harmless bit of fun as something that destroyed Spider-Man is difficult to understand.

Your difficulty understanding why he said that may spring from him not having said that. Apart from him clearly disagreeing with you about it being harmless, he didn't say Spider-Man is ruined; he said he felt sick for a while (his exact words are, "for longer than I'd care to admit") of Spider-Man.

It's true that some of the dialogue and scenes in the Amazing Spider-Man are dripping with cheese, but the original trilogy suffered the same problem.

And more of this refusal to allow people to discuss the movie being reviewed unless they also tear apart the movies from ten years ago. I seriously do not get this. What is this mentality that we must castigate movies other than the one being talked about? Is it some kind of human shield defense, like, "If you complain about the movie I like, then you also have to complain about this other movie that isn't involved in the current conversation?"

 

[MidnightRaith]

I think people who are giving Movie Bob a hard time don't see where he's coming from.

Usually I don't jump into these sort of things... because I avoid drama. However, I can totally understand Movie Bob's perspective on this. The Amazing Spider Man 2 isn't the worst movie ever- he even addresses this by saying it was better then the first movie.

What he dislikes about it... is the direction. The way they shoehorned the villains in and how the movie just has a terrible story/plot. It's one of those movies that butchers a franchise/tradition and goes it's own way of doing things. Imagine if you grew up with the cartoons, the classic (insert show/comic/book/movie here) for a long time.

Then, a company decides to make a movie off it. Turns out to be a great success and you love it. Great!
Buy hold on... there's a reboot. Yea... that, reboot. The one where the company (or a different one) decides to give it a shot. Then they change everything you know, love, and feel about the series as a whole. It drains you, and I would personally know this with the Dead Space series. Instead of a reboot though, it was Dead Space 3.

When they turn characters into something they're not suppose to... having a dumb sub-plot shoved in there, having the lore around it change just to get more appeal saying "Hey look how crazier this series became!"

I totally understand Movie Bob. He doesn't hate this movie because it sucks. He hates it because the direction is totally screwed up and blowing over what made the original Spider Man good in quality. You could also say that everyone loved the Dark Knight, but imagine if the Batman and Robin movie (with the nipples) came out after. That is EXACTLY what's happening here with Movie Bob.

You're free to like this movie. That's perfectly okay. But don't be giving Movie Bob a hard time please... I can totally sympathize with the man. He did this review the best he could without acting immature and told us straight up how he felt.

So yea...

I actually do get where he's coming from, that's not the problem. I felt this way with Mass Effect 3 and the ending. However, I disagree with you entirely when you say he's not being immature. He is. He just spent the majority of what was supposed to be devoted to the actual review whining that his interest in Spider-Man and movies have been severely impacted by a single movie he did not like. That's just... ridiculous for an adult to say in my opinion, let alone a professional. Reviewing the movie the best he could would have been him staying on topic and not trying to come off like some gigantic fan since forever and because of that he has to absolutely despise this movie. It certainly doesn't help that he railed on the last one for months on end. Super-hero and monster movies in general always make me want to doubt Bob's professionalism. He seems to never be able to separate his fanboyism from whatever the topic is and review the movie for what it is. He'll recommend terrible movies like Pacific Rim. He'll swear up and down an okay movie is the worst thing he's ever seen like ASM. He has absolutely no consistency in these topics.

I can understand that some people are not going to agree with me on Bob's reaction and whether or not it was warranted. That's fine. But don't go expecting that people like me are not to call him out on how we perceive his behavior. If you or Bob thought that he wasn't going to get any flack for this video and instead only endless sympathies, then well... I'm not quite sure what you expected.

 

[jFr[e]ak93]

Someone convince Sam Raimi to reboot those reboots. Anything, literally *anything* would be better than this.

Ya know, as much hate as the Sam Raimi trilogy got (as an adaptation, deserved) at least the first two were good MOVIES.

Not necessarily Spider-man movies, but movies.

The ASM movies don't even hold up in that category. They are just soulless 2 and a half hour slogs through New York and CGI.

OT - I'm not seeing this in theaters. If they want my money, they can earn it. Guardians of the Galaxy, here I come.

 

[DeimosMasque]

You're not the only person to do it, so I don't mean to single you out when I ask: why do people do this? When people criticize the current franchise, why do people try to change the subject and start ripping apart the old one? It's very suspicious to me, because I can't help noting that people almost never respond by defending the movie--by saying, "Here are things I like about the Amazing Spider-Man 2"--but rather they respond by attacking the previous trilogy. The implication there is not that the current franchise is actually good, but rather only that the previous one isn't. It feels like a bait and switch.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of the previous trilogy. Raimi loves his melodrama way too much for my taste. I just feel like people are tipping their hands when they're presented with a choice to defend this movie's good points or change the subject to attack a different movie's bad points and opt for the latter.

I think the reason for this is that Bob has pretty much held up the Sam Raimi movies as "The Best Spider-Man Movies!" He puts them on a pedestal and then complains about the Amazing Spider-Man movies as if they are some sort of sacrilege. Rather than just an average reboot that is actually pretty good as far as reboots tend to go these days.

He doesn't like them, that's fine. But when the first one came out he spent months harping on how it was representative of everything wrong with Hollywood and has been trashing ASM2 on his blog since the first information on it came out.

I can't speak for anyone else of course, but that's what grates me about his opinion of these movies. He doesn't seem to dislike them because they are objectively or even subjectively bad. He hates them because they aren't the Sam Raimi movies. That would be fine normally, but like I said he's been raking ASM movies over the coals since before the first one even came out.

People go after the Raimi movies and point out their flaws, logic hiccups and bad writing/acting because that's what Bob does to the ASM movies, while claiming the Raimi ones are the definitive versions. It's not the right way to go about it, but considering the vitriol Bob shows for the ASM movies, I'm not surprised alot of people want to tear down his pedestal as well.

 

[castlewise]

I thought the overall rotten tomatoes scores of the spidey movies was interesting. Aggregate scores don't always tell the whole story, but they do give a general impression.

Movie = Critic Score, Audience Score
Spider Man = 89%, 67%
Spider Man 2 = 94% 81%
Spider Man 3 = 63%, 51%
Amazing Spider Man = 73%, 78%
Amazing Spider Man 2 = 58%, --

By this metric the latest movie is the worst, beating out Spider Man 3 by a little. I think its interesting that Spider Man 2 is the best rated. I like it, but I have friends who walked out during the middle. It also looks like critics tend to enjoy the original 3 more than audience members, and its the other way around for ASM (no audience ratings for ASM2 yet).