Escape to the Movies: Untangling Spider-Man

[Sejborg]

However, the film was ridiculously unrealistic for one sole purpose. Who the fuck uses bing?! Especially not a teenager...

It just goes to show how socially awkward he is.

 

[Deathninja19]

You know, I'm starting to see why moviebob flipped out. It seems that everyone is determined to praise this movie for stuff that isn't there. Even here, people are determined to ignore the MANY problems of this movie and simply act like it is the greatest movie of all time, acting like it isn't an average-decent popcorn movie and announcing to the high heavens that it is the Picasso of movies (that isn't an exaggeration, someone told me that...). I too feel like screaming "Stop ignoring the flaws" at the top of my lungs... Ugh...

You can turn that on it's head and say people are determined to hate the movie because they think it goes against what Peter Parker should be when really the Peter Parker character is a cypher. Sure Spider-Man himself has a defined personality as a joker but Peter himself is rather characterless and basically any motivation revolves around his supporting cast.

Spider-Man is a great character but Peter Parker is anything the writer wants him to be and that is especially true for the comics.

Ummm...where do I say I'm talking about Spiderman/Peter Parker in that paragraph? I actually LIKED the movie. I just have a hard time believing people who keep on telling me that this movie is anything better than okay. (In my head, like meant I sat through with it without screaming in frustration. It's a low bar.) Sure, it's subjective, but you post is highlighting my annoyances. You are assuming that I am angry about Peter Parker characterization is different from the comics. I don't read Spiderman comics. I hardly know much other than what other people have told me. And even if it was, it still doesn't explain the plot holes, plot entanglement, and Peter's likability. *Sigh*, never mind. If you are assuming I actually came in that movie wanting to hate it, then I'll assume that you think this movie is perfect and flawless like everyone else I've talked to.

I'm not assuming anything at all, I was just discussing my views on the character in relation to what you said. Unlike MovieBob I have no problem with people disliking or liking any film, or for that matter any piece of media, that I happen to like or dislike. I apologize if I came of as attacking you, I just thought what you said was interesting and felt compelled to comment on it.

 

[SleepingDragon]

Now i know i'm supposed to be mad at Bob cause he doesn't like the new Spider-Man but and even greater problem has arisen. Manhunter has bad music? Are you out of your freaking mind?!? Listen to this awesomeness

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elf0S0FOm1s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eb2KhBDRsis&feature=relmfu

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3EBYMQokew&feature=relmfu

 

[immortalfrieza]

I couldn't disagree with Bob more if I tried. The Amazing Spider-Man may not be the best superhero movie ever, (though it's up there) but it's definitely the best SPIDER-MAN movie yet. ASM nails the comics characters and their personalities pretty much to a T, Peter is a snarky, sarcastic, and socially awkward nerd both in and out of costume, (he just dials up everything but the awkwardness when in costume) Dr. Connors is a good man that turns himself into a evil lizard with a obsession with turning every living thing into lizardmen like himself, Gwen Stacy is a beautiful science nerd like Parker but without the social issues that's also somewhat useful and avoids being damsel in distress material all the time, (unlike Mary Jane, the useless token hostage) and Flash Thompson is a bully but not a complete monster, all of that JUST LIKE IN THE COMICS.

The only thing they really changed is Captain Stacy, who was a steadfast ally to Spider-Man in the comics, but he ends up on his side in the end anyway, so that gets a pass. The action, once it gets going, is quite good, and it's nice to see Spidey defeat his enemy with his brains instead of his brawn like he usually does in the comics.

The Amazing Spider-Man movie may have been created by Sony to hold on to the license, but it isn't lackluster like it could have been if that's was it's only purpose. ASM is a faithful adaption to the comics, and should be held up as a shining example of what superhero movies SHOULD be.

 

[scorptatious]

I don't know Bob. I just seen the movie today and I can't really see very many of the complaints you gave about this movie. I thought it was pretty good.

I will agree with you somewhat on the Uncle Ben thing. I kinda felt that plot point just kinda dropped off suddenly. Ah well, perhaps that will be resolved in the sequel. If there's going to be a sequel that is.

Yeah, Bob is really showing his ignorance on this one. It has been said above me already, but yeah, the Lizard is a Jekyll/Hyde thing in which the alternate personality is EVIL. Period. Always has been. Also, constantly trying to turn others into lizards. That's what makes Conners a tragic villain: he can't control it.

Has Bob even read the comics? Or is this an obvious ignoring of the facts because it doesn't fit with Bob's "This movie is shit!" narrative?

See also: Gwen's dad has ALWAYS been a cop, teens have always hidden behind sarcasm and angst (christ Bob, do you not remember highschool?), and nobody ever actually said, "With Great Power comes Great Responsibility", it was always implied....as it is implied in the movie.

You're being a hater for hates sake. At least with Green Lantern, you pointed out bad filmaking decisions, here you just point out things you didn't like.

Pretty much this. Although I wasn't exactly thinking of Jekyll/Hyde specifically, that's still sorta how I felt Connors/Lizard's character worked.

 

[Elpollomyloco]

Can you tell us what changes you would make to the movie?

As a hardcore Spider-man fan, I was also disappointed with the movie from the get-go. The thing I hated most was the TERRIBLE interpretation of Peter Parker and his lack of transformation into Spider-man (as you very clearly mention--thank you!). Please give us some a glimpse into a good Spider-man movie we might have had.

 

[Trishbot]

After all Bob's TWO videos of hate on the movie, I saw it yesterday expecting to thoroughly hate this piece of crap...

... and instead walked out pretty much thinking the film was just as good as the original Spider-man film. Not as good as Spider-man 2, better than Spider-man 3, and tied with Spider-man 1.

Was it perfect? No way. It had some major pacing issues, story issues, a completely forgettable movie score, and plotholes. But it did really well in spite of all that, delivering strong performances from every actor, great action, and fun heroics.

I rewatched the original Spider-man origin movie.... it has it's problems too. Completely ridiculous and cheesy one-liners, bad costumes (why, Green Goblin?), hammy and cartoony performances, loads of product placement, really bizarre cameos (Macy Gray, everyone!), and almost zero chemistry between the leads.

If you could combine the two, it'd be the perfect movie. As is, they've both got their strengths and weaknesses, and I, for one, enjoyed Amazing Spider-man.

So it was made because of a contract? Some of the best movies ever made did the same. Doesn't mean those films are bad, and neither was this one. I'll probably snap it up on DVD, which is something I can't say for Spider-man 3.

 

[TheDrunkNinja]

Except he wasn't saying it was bad because it was like Twilight, he said it was trying to be like Twilight and failed to do even that. He even goes into detail as to why it failed to do that. So really what he is saying is that if you're going to pander towards demographics and copy other popular franchises, at least do it right.

Except that it wasn't.

I've seen Twilight, god help me, and this movie's romance dialogue and chemistry doesn't even have the slightest echo of Edward and Bella. The movie has teen romance, yes, but it was far more reminiscent of the romances Peter would go through in the early comics when he was still in highschool or even in Ultimate Spider-man.

Teen romance and the other comparisons that were brought up weren't tropes created or even popularized by Twilight. Every movie has its moments of pandering, but this is such a weak attempt to garner hate for a movie by even comparing it to something like Twilight.

 

[anthony87]

I agree with Bob I much prefer old Spidey, but Amazing was a lot better than he gives it credit for IMO.

1st off the whole rally behind, "an old Spidey character doesn't realistically exist in today's world" I call a bunch of horseshit. If was only slight tweaks to Peter Parker to make him more modern I'd be fine but what I watched gave me a Twilight/Edward vibe during the high school romance scenes more than Peter Parker.

So any scene in which a guy with styled hair talks to a girl he likes is now comparable to Twilight?

 

[anthony87]

You're wanting Parker to be a sort of nerd or geek that, by and large, doesn't exist anymore.

He said he understands why he's not that kind of geek. That was not his criticism of the character.

Unfortunately, it was. It's one thing to say, "I know this thing," and it's another thing to say, "I know this thing (but what I say next will completely ignore it.)"

One of the more out-there criticisms Bob has about this incarnation of Spider-Man is that Bob draws some Twilight parallels. Why? Because Bob hates Twilight, and Bob hates this movie, so drawing parallels is only natural -- like people always trying to equate people they disagree with to Hitler.

The "similarities" Bob sees to Edward Cullen (from Twilight) are basically that this Spider-Man is an angsty teen that tends toward brooding and has a bit of a "bad boy" angry side. But Bob never stopped to consider the reason Edward Cullen is written that way, despite Meyer being an abysmal writer: It's because that's how a ton of teenage "geeks" really are.

Meyer wrote that character because it has appeal with today's teen. Because that's how today's teen acts, on average. Even the ones that hate Twilight. For all that woman gets wrong, she dialed in what teens want pretty damn well.

This movie created a more authentically "modern teen" Peter Parker, so it's only natural there would be some similarities. I mean, we haven't heard Bob complain about similarities between Batman and Wolverine (and there are many)... because he grew up with both characters.

I'm telling you: This Peter Parker acts like the kind of teenager that has been through what Peter has been through. My source is real-life teens, with whom I work all year long. And about 2/3 of them don't have both real parents, so there's an element of "broken home" in most cases, even. About 10% live with aunt/uncle or grandparents. And, since I'm a band director, most of my kids identify themselves as SOME kind of "geek," and feel a bit socially outcast.

Seriously. This Peter Parker is one of the most authentic teen (or very-early 20's) characters I've seen in a very long time. Just the right balance of smart-beyond-his-years, but not wise.

I wish Bob would read all of your comments and attempt to come up with some kind of rebuttal. I doubt that will happen though...

Yeah not a chance of that happening. The closest thing to a "rebuttal" you'll get from Bob is some snarky Tweets implying that he knows more than the people criticising his opinion. Which is both immature, unprofessional as hell and a real shame because I'd like to see an actual response from him sometimes beyond "I'm right because I said so".

 

[CK76]

For anyone interested in how the film is fairing after one week.

----------

Domestic: $140,000,000 41.0%
+ Foreign: $201,600,000 59.0%
= Worldwide: $341,600,000

Production Budget: $230 million

Source: http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=spiderman4.htm

---------

Now, I know marketing and all come into cost as well, but I think it is safe to say even with a steep drop off Sony will make a great deal of money on the film and the merchandise in the coming year. I have little doubt now "Amazing Spider-Man 2" will come out in 2015 range. I look forward to it as they build the story with some great pieces in place.

 

[chaosyoshimage]

You're wanting Parker to be a sort of nerd or geek that, by and large, doesn't exist anymore.

He said he understands why he's not that kind of geek. That was not his criticism of the character.

Unfortunately, it was. It's one thing to say, "I know this thing," and it's another thing to say, "I know this thing (but what I say next will completely ignore it.)"

One of the more out-there criticisms Bob has about this incarnation of Spider-Man is that Bob draws some Twilight parallels. Why? Because Bob hates Twilight, and Bob hates this movie, so drawing parallels is only natural -- like people always trying to equate people they disagree with to Hitler.

The "similarities" Bob sees to Edward Cullen (from Twilight) are basically that this Spider-Man is an angsty teen that tends toward brooding and has a bit of a "bad boy" angry side. But Bob never stopped to consider the reason Edward Cullen is written that way, despite Meyer being an abysmal writer: It's because that's how a ton of teenage "geeks" really are.

Meyer wrote that character because it has appeal with today's teen. Because that's how today's teen acts, on average. Even the ones that hate Twilight. For all that woman gets wrong, she dialed in what teens want pretty damn well.

This movie created a more authentically "modern teen" Peter Parker, so it's only natural there would be some similarities. I mean, we haven't heard Bob complain about similarities between Batman and Wolverine (and there are many)... because he grew up with both characters.

I'm telling you: This Peter Parker acts like the kind of teenager that has been through what Peter has been through. My source is real-life teens, with whom I work all year long. And about 2/3 of them don't have both real parents, so there's an element of "broken home" in most cases, even. About 10% live with aunt/uncle or grandparents. And, since I'm a band director, most of my kids identify themselves as SOME kind of "geek," and feel a bit socially outcast.

Seriously. This Peter Parker is one of the most authentic teen (or very-early 20's) characters I've seen in a very long time. Just the right balance of smart-beyond-his-years, but not wise.

I wish Bob would read all of your comments and attempt to come up with some kind of rebuttal. I doubt that will happen though...

Yeah not a chance of that happening. The closest thing to a "rebuttal" you'll get from Bob is some snarky Tweets implying that he knows more than the people criticising his opinion. Which is both immature, unprofessional as hell and a real shame because I'd like to see an actual response from him sometimes beyond "I'm right because I said so".

Yep, I've tried talking to critics I disagree about this film on Twitter. All I get are snarky replies until I say something really good and then it's all like "Fuck, well, I don't have any real replies to that." There's way too much "I'm right and you're wrong" going on with this movie as opposed to differing opinions. I'm starting to think some critics are bashing this film due to well, realizing that they're getting old. I mean, that's really the best explanation for some of these out of touch declarations about nerds and teenagers.

 

[A Curious Fellow]

Saw it today, then watched the review just now....

Yeah that's all true.

 

[Datacide]

WTF?! Manhunter has an awesome score and the inclusion of this is one of the best uses of music in a movie...ever! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEW2FwJfaIo

 

[The Human Torch]

The only two dumb things in this movie were Peter Parker using Bing (seriously, who uses Bing? NO ONE!) and using a photo camera that has his name on it. That was the only moment that made me /facepalm.

For the rest it was a good movie, better than the first trilogy (which was cheesy and flawed as hell), this new Spiderman has a female protagonist who is not completely helpless and actually aids Spiderman (instead of Kirsten 'The Victim' Dunst) and Andrew Garfield is such a likable guy, it's just good to watch.

 

[Something Amyss]

"Miss me yet?"

Oh HELL no. Even if this movie's ten times as bad as you say, Bob, I will likely NEVER miss Toby's Spider-Man. Or the Raimi films at all.

You gotta face the unfortunate fact that people(main stream audiences) are sucker for Spiderman.

Lousy Mainstream, enjoying things I don't. RAWR!