You put too much value on the "main quests". Id be just as happy with Skyrim with no main quests and that is the appeal. Its why I still to this day play Morrowind, and I assure you its not to do the main quest over and over.Comocat said:
Far Cry 3, is a better RPG than Skyrim.
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Well i think its simply requires more out of the player. To get the greatest experiences you usually have to work with the game alittle, and let it not be perfectly but rather pace it yourself, and be your own dungeon master. Skyrim tries to please every playstyle, you can follow the main quests and be engaged, but it still wants you to be able to wander anywhere on random and always find something interesting. So i see what you're saying, it can be annoying with all these things calling your attention when you already have something in your crosshairs.Comocat said:
So here you have to stop expecting the game to hold your hand or to present itself to you perfectly. I simply decided to allow myself to be sidetracked, if something caught my interest i ran with it unless i felt the main plot line was currently pressing. If you decide you want to be focused on the main plot, then you have to ignore the other attention-calling.
It doesnt make for the perfect experience but I think players should sometimes ask the game what they can do for it, and not what the game can do for them. Whilst you have certainly paid for it, your only helping yourself in the end. And i think it's fair from a game as massive and ambitious as Skyrim to ask this of the player.
So what's a better game, Ninja Gaiden or Bioshock Infinite?
See how pointless that is? The ONLY things the games really share in common are a Sandbox Style Environment and a first person perspective.
But ok whatever I'll bite.
Not only is Farcry not a better 'rpg', it's an inferior game in general.
1. Side missions+ mini games in FC3 are a boring, uninspired afterthought.
2. The FC3 sandbox environment while beautiful, is incredibly shallow. Once you kill a tiger for the umpteenth time and realise you are taking out the same outpost again and again, shit gets old fast. And don't even get me started on the laughable NPC character model and voice variety.
3. Complete disconnect between what you are doing in the main narrative and the random crap you get into in the regular game world. Almost to the point that it's like playing 2 separate games: One is some Call of Duty style spectacle on-rails shooter while the second is some kind of first person Just Cause 2.
4. Characters. While Skyrim's characters weren't particularly memorable or that well developed, it at least makes up for it in variety. My big gripe with FC3's characters, is that everyone goes on and on about how awesome they were without actually looking past the cool voice acting.
Look at Vaas for example. All you ever really learn about him, is that he's a nut case drug addict who wants to kill you because someone told him to. That's it. Then he disappears from the story. We never learn anything of his real motivations, past, personal experiences etc. He's just 'cool bad guy' stereotype. Same can be said for nearly all the characters in the game.
5. Exploration and rewards. In skyrim, I explore a cave and potentially find a nest of bandits with traps and treasure. In FC3 I explore a cave and find copy+past 'chests' with nonsensical vendor junk and maybe some lame ass collectible that I'm collecting...just because.
And let's not forget the modding scene, which adds immeasurable depth to Skyrim that FC3 could never hope to compete with.
See how pointless that is? The ONLY things the games really share in common are a Sandbox Style Environment and a first person perspective.
But ok whatever I'll bite.
Not only is Farcry not a better 'rpg', it's an inferior game in general.
1. Side missions+ mini games in FC3 are a boring, uninspired afterthought.
2. The FC3 sandbox environment while beautiful, is incredibly shallow. Once you kill a tiger for the umpteenth time and realise you are taking out the same outpost again and again, shit gets old fast. And don't even get me started on the laughable NPC character model and voice variety.
3. Complete disconnect between what you are doing in the main narrative and the random crap you get into in the regular game world. Almost to the point that it's like playing 2 separate games: One is some Call of Duty style spectacle on-rails shooter while the second is some kind of first person Just Cause 2.
4. Characters. While Skyrim's characters weren't particularly memorable or that well developed, it at least makes up for it in variety. My big gripe with FC3's characters, is that everyone goes on and on about how awesome they were without actually looking past the cool voice acting.
Look at Vaas for example. All you ever really learn about him, is that he's a nut case drug addict who wants to kill you because someone told him to. That's it. Then he disappears from the story. We never learn anything of his real motivations, past, personal experiences etc. He's just 'cool bad guy' stereotype. Same can be said for nearly all the characters in the game.
5. Exploration and rewards. In skyrim, I explore a cave and potentially find a nest of bandits with traps and treasure. In FC3 I explore a cave and find copy+past 'chests' with nonsensical vendor junk and maybe some lame ass collectible that I'm collecting...just because.
And let's not forget the modding scene, which adds immeasurable depth to Skyrim that FC3 could never hope to compete with.
I demand you treat this thread with the dignity it deserves. It's not every day you learn that FarCry is an RPG series. Or that combat mechanics make good RPGs.piinyouri said:
Wait....
As we have a weird definition of RPG.
I put it to you that Deus Ex: HR is a better RPG then skyrim or far cry;
A level up system that makes sense rather then some numerical incremental point system that somehow causes enemies to level up too and still isn't balanced
An inventory system that doesn't make you want to shoot yourself
Multiple characters with different motivations and personalities to flush out and care about
Combat that makes sense
Awesome graphic aesthetics
Seriously though almost all games have leveling up systems to unlock stuff and/or are open world. That does not mean they qualify to be an 'rpg'.
The new Tomb Raider and batman allow you to level up and unlock skills. It's just a way to pad the game and add a little variation (hoping people will replay games so they won't end up on the pre-owned shelf)
Far Cry 3 is probably a better all round game to Skyrim. Doesn't make it a better rpg.
I put it to you that Deus Ex: HR is a better RPG then skyrim or far cry;
A level up system that makes sense rather then some numerical incremental point system that somehow causes enemies to level up too and still isn't balanced
An inventory system that doesn't make you want to shoot yourself
Multiple characters with different motivations and personalities to flush out and care about
Combat that makes sense
Awesome graphic aesthetics
Seriously though almost all games have leveling up systems to unlock stuff and/or are open world. That does not mean they qualify to be an 'rpg'.
The new Tomb Raider and batman allow you to level up and unlock skills. It's just a way to pad the game and add a little variation (hoping people will replay games so they won't end up on the pre-owned shelf)
Far Cry 3 is probably a better all round game to Skyrim. Doesn't make it a better rpg.
First of all, Far Cry 3 is not an RPG. If it is then any shooter with an upgrades system is an RPG. But that is besides the point.
What makes an RPG? Well, a leveling system that directly influences your abilities is what is generally thought of as being the core mechanic to an RPG. Is Far Cry 3 like this? Nope. You can very easily go through a game without needing to level up. What about skyrim? Yes. The levels in that game are a direct influence on your ability in combat. As you level up you grow stronger and can kill more easily. Go try to kill a giant at level one in that game and you can see that leveling is necessary.
What makes an RPG? Well, a leveling system that directly influences your abilities is what is generally thought of as being the core mechanic to an RPG. Is Far Cry 3 like this? Nope. You can very easily go through a game without needing to level up. What about skyrim? Yes. The levels in that game are a direct influence on your ability in combat. As you level up you grow stronger and can kill more easily. Go try to kill a giant at level one in that game and you can see that leveling is necessary.
I will admit the lines are quite blurred these days of what an RPG is. Number crunching? Levelling up? Choices that matter? Crafting? Dungeon crawling? Having a party? These are some of the things an RPG can have.
Yes you can gain skills in far cry.
Yes there is crafting, but it just boils down to holding more weapons and ammo. Can you create guns? No.
Are there choices within the story of far cry? no.
Far cry 3 is a game with RPG elements (like others have said). I really like how most of the skills are useful. Nothing like ripping through an entire outpost with one long chain-takedown and a knife throw ^_^
Yes you can gain skills in far cry.
Yes there is crafting, but it just boils down to holding more weapons and ammo. Can you create guns? No.
Are there choices within the story of far cry? no.
Far cry 3 is a game with RPG elements (like others have said). I really like how most of the skills are useful. Nothing like ripping through an entire outpost with one long chain-takedown and a knife throw ^_^
What's the distinction then? If it is to be a meaningful term then there must be a deciding factor. Most people seem to be comfortable with the term "RPG-elements" referring to progression, so it must be something along those lines. How do you decide whether something is an RPG or an "X with RPG-elements"?IronMit said:
Again, I've not played Farcry 3, but from my understanding the progression system is tied to that black-magic tatoo thing you've got going on, and that fact that your character is growing stronger is an integral part of the story. That's a theme of progression, rather than just a bolted on mechanic. If you take something like Tribes: Ascend, then you unlock weapons and upgrades using experience you gain through matches, but there's no story to speak of and no overarching reason that your character should grow stronger. So the progression is purely mechanical and not thematic.uchytjes said:
That's just my take on it. And yes, I see no reason not to call a game like Deus Ex an RPG. I mean, why not?
I'm sorry but you clearly lack imagination. You only see what's in front of you. If I did that then I'd be bored with the game. But I still play it. That's because I allow myself to be fully immersed in the game. It's not just my character that has a background and a personality I give him or her, I do that with other characters as well. With companions mostly.hazabaza1 said:
Also, I play on PC, and mods really help. Armor being bland for example is not an issue. My companions all have their own unique stuff and skillet, and sometimes I dress them in the same armor as myself. Mods really do help you get more out of the game.
I meant that it is easy to bog yourself down in silly fetch quests and essentially play like you have schizophrenia. I like coherent arcs, whether major or minor and if I'm working on Dark Brotherhood quests while trying to solve a civil war and at the same time saving the whole world from dragons- it just seems silly.Saelune said:
I agree entirely. The real challenge I think is having enough awareness to play the game in a coherent way. Sure I could become a guild master of all guilds, but does that really make any sense? IMO playing like that sort of ruins the experience because the game flows more like a checklist than an emerging story. I appreciate an open-ended adventure like Skyrim but I think a lot of people dont, like me achievement whoring on my first playthrough, because they try and do everything which just leads to a crappy game experience.Anton Qvarfordt said:
Then that's a credit to your imagination and the mods, not to the game itself. Though I say this as I run around with Serana myself, as she is one of the more, if not most, developed companions available. Not to mention she flattens everything around her.Adam Jensen said:
I wouldn't even call Far Cry 3 an RPG at all. It's just a really good shooter. I would say Skyrim's combat is better in general because there's more than two ways to take care of baddies, even if the enemies don't pursue you enough once they've been hit with an arrow. Crafting is much deeper and more useful. Minor characters have relatively unique appearances as opposed of the two or three different people who give you side quests in Far Cry. Story is kind of a wash in my opinion. Far Cry is a little more interesting, but Skyrim has side quests with purpose, rather than "ERMAHGERD, MY DAUGHTER IS BEING ATTACKED BY 3 LIZARDS THAT GO DOWN IN ONE HIT HALP MEH."
