FF 7 remake

[Bat Vader]

I hope it has the combat that was depicted in Advent Children or have a combat system akin to Kingdom Hearts.

 

[Saltyk]

I hope it has the combat that was depicted in Advent Children or have a combat system akin to Kingdom Hearts.

I read something stating that they would certainly be changing some things. And one thing that they are likely changing is the combat. I'm of mixed feelings on that.

Pros
~The old ATB system is rather clunky and a product of its time. I feel newer players would dislike it.
~A good system could be more dynamic and make the fights more fun and challenging/rewarding.
~I always felt like the characters were all pretty samey. Even the characters that had different stats really didn't feel different except doing less damage. Yuffie (the fastest) didn't feel that fast unless you compared her to Barret (the slowest) and even that was barely a thing. Despite her low physical attack, I never felt like Aerith's magic was much stronger than anyone other character. So, I'm hoping the game makes characters feel more unique and special.
~We have plenty of good systems that could be used. Like the Kingdom Hearts and Crisis Core mechanics or even the FFX system.
~Characters standing there in beautiful HD detail, waiting, then stepping forward and slashing enemies seems incredibly lame in modern graphics.

Cons
~ATB was the original system and I'm not sure that SHOULD change. Especially if we get a worse system, like FFXIII.
~What are they going to do with Materia? The equipping of it to weapons and armor is a cornerstone of the game. As well as the stat adjustment. They could change it to be more like Crisis Core, but they better not remove it! And that character customization is a major boon to FFVII. Not having to bring a healer around as anyone can heal.
~I want to control all my characters. That's FFVII. A Kingdom Hearts style combat means that I can't do that.
~LIMIT BREAK! Each character had several Limit Break Attacks that they developed and could be used. But if we can't control the characters, I'm not sure how this could be utilized. In addition, these attacks were spectacles to behold. And in a more player active system, you'll likely take less damage which was how they built before. How could these work, now?

I'm not sure how I feel about this. I love the idea of running around with Cloud smacking foes with the Buster Sword, but so many of the original's core mechanics seem like they could only exist in a ATB system. On one hand, I want the system to be updated because I'm not afraid of change. On the other hand, I don't want the new system to ruin what made the game unique.

About all I can do is wait and hope SE reveals some gameplay. Then, maybe I can judge the new system and see if I will like it or not. It seems like I will only really know how I feel at that point.

 

[Bat Vader]

I hope it has the combat that was depicted in Advent Children or have a combat system akin to Kingdom Hearts.

I read something stating that they would certainly be changing some things. And one thing that they are likely changing is the combat. I'm of mixed feelings on that.

Pros
~The old ATB system is rather clunky and a product of its time. I feel newer players would dislike it.
~A good system could be more dynamic and make the fights more fun and challenging/rewarding.
~I always felt like the characters were all pretty samey. Even the characters that had different stats really didn't feel different except doing less damage. Yuffie (the fastest) didn't feel that fast unless you compared her to Barret (the slowest) and even that was barely a thing. Despite her low physical attack, I never felt like Aerith's magic was much stronger than anyone other character. So, I'm hoping the game makes characters feel more unique and special.
~We have plenty of good systems that could be used. Like the Kingdom Hearts and Crisis Core mechanics or even the FFX system.
~Characters standing there in beautiful HD detail, waiting, then stepping forward and slashing enemies seems incredibly lame in modern graphics.

Cons
~ATB was the original system and I'm not sure that SHOULD change. Especially if we get a worse system, like FFXIII.
~What are they going to do with Materia? The equipping of it to weapons and armor is a cornerstone of the game. As well as the stat adjustment. They could change it to be more like Crisis Core, but they better not remove it! And that character customization is a major boon to FFVII. Not having to bring a healer around as anyone can heal.
~I want to control all my characters. That's FFVII. A Kingdom Hearts style combat means that I can't do that.
~LIMIT BREAK! Each character had several Limit Break Attacks that they developed and could be used. But if we can't control the characters, I'm not sure how this could be utilized. In addition, these attacks were spectacles to behold. And in a more player active system, you'll likely take less damage which was how they built before. How could these work, now?

I'm not sure how I feel about this. I love the idea of running around with Cloud smacking foes with the Buster Sword, but so many of the original's core mechanics seem like they could only exist in a ATB system. On one hand, I want the system to be updated because I'm not afraid of change. On the other hand, I don't want the new system to ruin what made the game unique.

About all I can do is wait and hope SE reveals some gameplay. Then, maybe I can judge the new system and see if I will like it or not. It seems like I will only really know how I feel at that point.

What about the Tales games? The Tales of Xillia games have a pretty awesome combat system. You can switch between characters in battle and they can do special attacks too.

 

[CritialGaming]

I hope it has the combat that was depicted in Advent Children or have a combat system akin to Kingdom Hearts.

I read something stating that they would certainly be changing some things. And one thing that they are likely changing is the combat. I'm of mixed feelings on that.

Pros
~The old ATB system is rather clunky and a product of its time. I feel newer players would dislike it.
~A good system could be more dynamic and make the fights more fun and challenging/rewarding.
~I always felt like the characters were all pretty samey. Even the characters that had different stats really didn't feel different except doing less damage. Yuffie (the fastest) didn't feel that fast unless you compared her to Barret (the slowest) and even that was barely a thing. Despite her low physical attack, I never felt like Aerith's magic was much stronger than anyone other character. So, I'm hoping the game makes characters feel more unique and special.
~We have plenty of good systems that could be used. Like the Kingdom Hearts and Crisis Core mechanics or even the FFX system.
~Characters standing there in beautiful HD detail, waiting, then stepping forward and slashing enemies seems incredibly lame in modern graphics.

Cons
~ATB was the original system and I'm not sure that SHOULD change. Especially if we get a worse system, like FFXIII.
~What are they going to do with Materia? The equipping of it to weapons and armor is a cornerstone of the game. As well as the stat adjustment. They could change it to be more like Crisis Core, but they better not remove it! And that character customization is a major boon to FFVII. Not having to bring a healer around as anyone can heal.
~I want to control all my characters. That's FFVII. A Kingdom Hearts style combat means that I can't do that.
~LIMIT BREAK! Each character had several Limit Break Attacks that they developed and could be used. But if we can't control the characters, I'm not sure how this could be utilized. In addition, these attacks were spectacles to behold. And in a more player active system, you'll likely take less damage which was how they built before. How could these work, now?

I'm not sure how I feel about this. I love the idea of running around with Cloud smacking foes with the Buster Sword, but so many of the original's core mechanics seem like they could only exist in a ATB system. On one hand, I want the system to be updated because I'm not afraid of change. On the other hand, I don't want the new system to ruin what made the game unique.

About all I can do is wait and hope SE reveals some gameplay. Then, maybe I can judge the new system and see if I will like it or not. It seems like I will only really know how I feel at that point.

I actually see the combat system in the remake being like Final Fantasy 13, with the character actively moving around the battlefield, however instead of only selecting commands for one character, you select commands for everyone. Basically it remains the ATB system of yore, however it adds motion to the world which would make battles seem dynamic. Not to mention you could time entering commands to cause back attacks or flanking attacks and add another level of depth to combat control.

This style, I feel, will retain the spirit and feel of the original combat system while still bring the game into the modern era in such a way that new and old fans will have a good time with it. The key being that ALL characters must be controllable as their ATB bars fill.

 

[Saltyk]

I hope it has the combat that was depicted in Advent Children or have a combat system akin to Kingdom Hearts.

I read something stating that they would certainly be changing some things. And one thing that they are likely changing is the combat. I'm of mixed feelings on that.

Pros
~The old ATB system is rather clunky and a product of its time. I feel newer players would dislike it.
~A good system could be more dynamic and make the fights more fun and challenging/rewarding.
~I always felt like the characters were all pretty samey. Even the characters that had different stats really didn't feel different except doing less damage. Yuffie (the fastest) didn't feel that fast unless you compared her to Barret (the slowest) and even that was barely a thing. Despite her low physical attack, I never felt like Aerith's magic was much stronger than anyone other character. So, I'm hoping the game makes characters feel more unique and special.
~We have plenty of good systems that could be used. Like the Kingdom Hearts and Crisis Core mechanics or even the FFX system.
~Characters standing there in beautiful HD detail, waiting, then stepping forward and slashing enemies seems incredibly lame in modern graphics.

Cons
~ATB was the original system and I'm not sure that SHOULD change. Especially if we get a worse system, like FFXIII.
~What are they going to do with Materia? The equipping of it to weapons and armor is a cornerstone of the game. As well as the stat adjustment. They could change it to be more like Crisis Core, but they better not remove it! And that character customization is a major boon to FFVII. Not having to bring a healer around as anyone can heal.
~I want to control all my characters. That's FFVII. A Kingdom Hearts style combat means that I can't do that.
~LIMIT BREAK! Each character had several Limit Break Attacks that they developed and could be used. But if we can't control the characters, I'm not sure how this could be utilized. In addition, these attacks were spectacles to behold. And in a more player active system, you'll likely take less damage which was how they built before. How could these work, now?

I'm not sure how I feel about this. I love the idea of running around with Cloud smacking foes with the Buster Sword, but so many of the original's core mechanics seem like they could only exist in a ATB system. On one hand, I want the system to be updated because I'm not afraid of change. On the other hand, I don't want the new system to ruin what made the game unique.

About all I can do is wait and hope SE reveals some gameplay. Then, maybe I can judge the new system and see if I will like it or not. It seems like I will only really know how I feel at that point.

I actually see the combat system in the remake being like Final Fantasy 13, with the character actively moving around the battlefield, however instead of only selecting commands for one character, you select commands for everyone. Basically it remains the ATB system of yore, however it adds motion to the world which would make battles seem dynamic. Not to mention you could time entering commands to cause back attacks or flanking attacks and add another level of depth to combat control.

This style, I feel, will retain the spirit and feel of the original combat system while still bring the game into the modern era in such a way that new and old fans will have a good time with it. The key being that ALL characters must be controllable as their ATB bars fill.

That could be somewhat interesting. It would probably need to be slightly slower to allow players to actually input commands, though. On the other hand, I don't know if I can see a XIII style system working. Unless a single "Attack" command would execute multiple attacks and magic was considerably more powerful to make up for it.

Also, I disliked that you couldn't control the character's movements in XIII. So often my idiot character walked right into a AOE attack that I knew was coming and would have avoided myself. I really disliked XIII's combat, honestly... Because there wasn't any combat. It was all AI.

What about the Tales games? The Tales of Xillia games have a pretty awesome combat system. You can switch between characters in battle and they can do special attacks too.

I don't know. Wouldn't quite feel like Final Fantasy.

Square really needs to show us some gameplay so I can figure out how I feel about this. I mean I already know I'll be buying the Collector's Edition (because you know they're making one), and the Special FF7 Edition PS4 (because you know they're making one), and even the Collector's Edition Stratedgy Guide ([insert running theme here]), but I want it to be good.

 

[elvor0]

It's nothing special really. The gameplay was mediocre to me, and I wouldn't call it the Best game of all time. The story was average at best, because "saving the world" hasn't been beaten to death right?

So what? That's the plot, not the story. Saving the world is a framing device that is perfectly fine to use. Are we not allowed to use fairly standard writing tools anymore because it's too mainstream? It's how you tell the story that's the important thing.

This brings up a good time to ask all you ff7 fans

How many of you knew about Sephiroths killing Aerith before playing it?

This isn't even spoiler is it?

I didn't. It was a genuinely shocking moment for me. I remember that much.

"Long ago, we looked upon a foreboding sky. The memory of the star that threatened all burns eternal in our hearts."

He's talking about Jenovah, I guess? I thought people didn't really know much about that in-game? Am I misremembering?

It could be Cloud or someone else referring to the meteor like a narrator who knows the ending might.

I'm guessing Red 13. He outlives Midgar itself, so he's certainly one of the only characters who would end up being old enough for the events of FF7 to be "long ago", presumably telling his cubs.

Did I say it wasn't allowed? No, I didn't, but the story was pretty predictable, but thats a given since I knew what to expect since the fans tend to spoil what happens. Like I said it was nothing special in my opinion, I'm not sorry if my opinion is different then yours regarding FF VII. Since it's pretty overrated.

I just don't think that complaining about the framing device of "save the world" is a constructive complaint. It's an epic fantasy game, /of course/ you're going to be saving the world. People are more than welcome to dislike it, just dislike it for reasons that are fair. To extrapolate I mean "I don't like that there is a villian" isn't a fair complaint, "I dislike the villian" is a fine complaint.

Also, can you really deem the plot as predictable if you'd been told and doubtless had the plot spoiled multiple times over the years? Thats kind of...."well I figured out what was going to happen" "Oh how so?" "Someone told me".

When you're told vital plot points over and over by fans on message boards, you will know what to expect, maybe not all the details, but I was able to piece together based on info fans have said on message boards.

Of course I gave the game a chance and it's story even with the knowledge I had of it's plot, even then I still thought "I seen it all before."

I hate to bring up Dragon Age II, because I know alot of people hate that game, but using it as an example, you can still have a fantasy game, and still not center around saving the world. I'm not saying Dragon Age II had a great story, and I do agree it was incoherent, but I preferred Hawke's story and how he/she rose up in the game, then trying to kill a generic villain wishing to destroy the world for no reason at all, it's one of the criticisms I said about Dragon Age: Inquisition. The game's story was average, so was FF VII. I never said it was bad by any means, just generic in my opinion.

I don't like the usual "save the world" tropes we have in most games, however I can forgive an average story because I'm playing a video game, I play it for the gameplay. FF VII again in my opinion didn't have fantastic gameplay to back up the long hours it has. I can also forgive it's average story if the characters were likable, had good character development, and they were interesting in my opinion.

Different strokes, for different folks and to sum it up, it was just an average RPG, it wasn't terrible, but nothing special in my opinion. I wasn't captivated by it when it was released in the 90s.

Yes well, that's fair enough, I can get behind that, I don't /agree/ on all points but for the most point yeah different strokes. However! "I've seen it all before" is one of those things you've got to think about in retrospect, yeah you've seen it all before /now/ but FF7 is at least for video games codifier of a lot of it's tropes or elements. Is it fair that the game gets the blame for "seen it all before" or "generic" when it came "first"?

Though I'd say although DA2s story itself isn't about saving the world, it's very much a set up for it, due to being the second game in (at least) a trilogy. Given there's an overall running story though the Dragon Age games, you just experience it through the eyes of different characters, the plot is still about saving the world, just Hawke wasn't the man to do so, he's a cog in a far larger machine.

This brings up a good time to ask all you ff7 fans

How many of you knew about Sephiroth's killing Aerith before playing it?

This isn't even spoiler is it?

I did not. I was only 6 or 7 myself at the time that it came out and we didn't even have a computer. Well we might of done, but the computer was for Duke Nukem 3D.

Wait did you say FF VII was the first for having a "save the world tropes" in video games? Cuz I'm pretty sure alot of games with that plot came before, and even then in fictional media, it's not exclusive to video games, these tropes, people consume more then one thing in life then just video games, rather it be movies, books, comics, songs, cartoons, etc. Maybe because it was sound back then with how "original" it was, (I disagree on that statement), but it still means it didn't age well either.

No, I didn't say that FF7 was the first to have save the world plot, because that would conflict with my earlier statement of asking why using a standard "save the world" trope isn't allowed. The notion that I would even suggest that is pretty silly.

I'm saying that elements of the game are trope codifiers (that's not an originator) for video games, not the first, best, or deepest but that it was pivotol in bringing elements such as a deeper stories and characters, addressing certain themes (such as eugenics, genocide, PTSD etc), how a story was told to the audience (such as Cloud being an unreliable narrator) being the poster boy for addled protagonists and villians, a richer, more expansive world, especially in the west. I'm not for one instant suggesting that the game doesn't have flaws, or that it is as good as it seemed back in 98, because you're right, certain elements have aged poorly, or are no where near as good as certain things today, but as always, in 98, it was huge.

 

[elvor0]

It's nothing special really. The gameplay was mediocre to me, and I wouldn't call it the Best game of all time. The story was average at best, because "saving the world" hasn't been beaten to death right?

So what? That's the plot, not the story. Saving the world is a framing device that is perfectly fine to use. Are we not allowed to use fairly standard writing tools anymore because it's too mainstream? It's how you tell the story that's the important thing.

This brings up a good time to ask all you ff7 fans

How many of you knew about Sephiroths killing Aerith before playing it?

This isn't even spoiler is it?

I didn't. It was a genuinely shocking moment for me. I remember that much.

"Long ago, we looked upon a foreboding sky. The memory of the star that threatened all burns eternal in our hearts."

He's talking about Jenovah, I guess? I thought people didn't really know much about that in-game? Am I misremembering?

It could be Cloud or someone else referring to the meteor like a narrator who knows the ending might.

I'm guessing Red 13. He outlives Midgar itself, so he's certainly one of the only characters who would end up being old enough for the events of FF7 to be "long ago", presumably telling his cubs.

Did I say it wasn't allowed? No, I didn't, but the story was pretty predictable, but thats a given since I knew what to expect since the fans tend to spoil what happens. Like I said it was nothing special in my opinion, I'm not sorry if my opinion is different then yours regarding FF VII. Since it's pretty overrated.

I just don't think that complaining about the framing device of "save the world" is a constructive complaint. It's an epic fantasy game, /of course/ you're going to be saving the world. People are more than welcome to dislike it, just dislike it for reasons that are fair. To extrapolate I mean "I don't like that there is a villian" isn't a fair complaint, "I dislike the villian" is a fine complaint.

Also, can you really deem the plot as predictable if you'd been told and doubtless had the plot spoiled multiple times over the years? Thats kind of...."well I figured out what was going to happen" "Oh how so?" "Someone told me".

When you're told vital plot points over and over by fans on message boards, you will know what to expect, maybe not all the details, but I was able to piece together based on info fans have said on message boards.

Of course I gave the game a chance and it's story even with the knowledge I had of it's plot, even then I still thought "I seen it all before."

I hate to bring up Dragon Age II, because I know alot of people hate that game, but using it as an example, you can still have a fantasy game, and still not center around saving the world. I'm not saying Dragon Age II had a great story, and I do agree it was incoherent, but I preferred Hawke's story and how he/she rose up in the game, then trying to kill a generic villain wishing to destroy the world for no reason at all, it's one of the criticisms I said about Dragon Age: Inquisition. The game's story was average, so was FF VII. I never said it was bad by any means, just generic in my opinion.

I don't like the usual "save the world" tropes we have in most games, however I can forgive an average story because I'm playing a video game, I play it for the gameplay. FF VII again in my opinion didn't have fantastic gameplay to back up the long hours it has. I can also forgive it's average story if the characters were likable, had good character development, and they were interesting in my opinion.

Different strokes, for different folks and to sum it up, it was just an average RPG, it wasn't terrible, but nothing special in my opinion. I wasn't captivated by it when it was released in the 90s.

Yes well, that's fair enough, I can get behind that, I don't /agree/ on all points but for the most point yeah different strokes. However! "I've seen it all before" is one of those things you've got to think about in retrospect, yeah you've seen it all before /now/ but FF7 is at least for video games codifier of a lot of it's tropes or elements. Is it fair that the game gets the blame for "seen it all before" or "generic" when it came "first"?

Though I'd say although DA2s story itself isn't about saving the world, it's very much a set up for it, due to being the second game in (at least) a trilogy. Given there's an overall running story though the Dragon Age games, you just experience it through the eyes of different characters, the plot is still about saving the world, just Hawke wasn't the man to do so, he's a cog in a far larger machine.

This brings up a good time to ask all you ff7 fans

How many of you knew about Sephiroth's killing Aerith before playing it?

This isn't even spoiler is it?

I did not. I was only 6 or 7 myself at the time that it came out and we didn't even have a computer. Well we might of done, but the computer was for Duke Nukem 3D.

Wait did you say FF VII was the first for having a "save the world tropes" in video games? Cuz I'm pretty sure alot of games with that plot came before, and even then in fictional media, it's not exclusive to video games, these tropes, people consume more then one thing in life then just video games, rather it be movies, books, comics, songs, cartoons, etc. Maybe because it was sound back then with how "original" it was, (I disagree on that statement), but it still means it didn't age well either.

No, I didn't say that FF7 was the first to have save the world plot, because that would conflict with my earlier statement of asking why using a standard "save the world" trope isn't allowed. The notion that I would even suggest that is pretty silly.

I'm saying that elements of the game are trope codifiers (that's not an originator) for video games, not the first, best, or deepest but that it was pivotol in bringing elements such as a deeper stories and characters, addressing certain themes (such as eugenics, genocide, PTSD etc), how a story was told to the audience (such as Cloud being an unreliable narrator) being the poster boy for addled protagonists and villians, a richer, more expansive world, especially in the west. I'm not for one instant suggesting that the game doesn't have flaws, or that it is as good as it seemed back in 98, because you're right, certain elements have aged poorly, or are no where near as good as certain things today, but as always, in 98, it was huge.

Oh I get you then, and you mean 97 right? The year it was released?

And I never said it wasn't allowed, it's just, in my opinion it's the usual save the world trope most rpgs tend to do as a plot device and I found it average. If it's anything I found FF7's story much better then Dragon Age: Inquisition's more cliche storyline.

Oops, yes 97. I didn't play it myself till 98 because that was when I got my PS1, so I'm guessing that's where I pulled 98 from.

Yeah well, Bioware have been stuck in a creative rut for ages now(though not nearly as bad as Square). I enjoyed Mass Effect, but even Dragon Age Origins I don't get the praise for. I ejoyed it, but it just feels like a poor mans Baldurs gate with a lot of the life sucked out and the less said about DA2 or DA Inquisition the better ><

 

[cdemares]

I, for one, have nothing but hope. I know they'll change stuff. I don't care. There's a huge gulf between not-perfect and bad. I was a big defender of Diablo 3. That, I think, says it all. I liked playing it, even if it wasn't the game I would have made. That will probably be true of this remake. But a few leaks will not sink this thing. I think it would take an awful lot to screw this up in any serious way. The irony is, it would take tons more work to screw this up than get it right, I think. I just hope they don't overthink things too much.