Fixing FFXIV Means Basically Redoing the Game, Says Square Enix

[v3n0mat3]

I like it how every other article discussing this press conference has been something along the lines of "FF Brand Damaged by XIV." The article on Gamesutra doesn't even MENTION this, nor does the article on the much less reputable, yet still more renowned than this site Massively. It's rather odd how the priority of two websites when reporting this are identical, yet on this site it appears totally different (at least in title only).

I guess this title just brings in the hits more, eh?

-snip-

Sounds like someone is a Wrath baby . Not that is a bad thing or an insult, but it just sounds like you don't know what to do when you try and play an MMO with some actual complexity instead of the simplified-to-the-point-of-near-insult design mentality like WOW. It really isn't the game's fault if you are lost because you were expecting something almost patronizing in terms of simplicity.

Actually, I was Vanilla. 5 years and counting!

 

[Davih]

Gotta stop cutting corners and I hope they have learned that.

 

[geizr]

I have no first-hand knowledge of the gameplay and game mechanics in FFXIV, but from all the negative descriptions I have been reading, this sounds like a prime example of a software project that should have been killed long ago(like half-way through the initial development). Right now, it seems this game is costing more money than it will ever recover. I think Square-Enix should just cut their losses with this one and move on. Although, it's possible that could be even worse because they've allowed things to string on for so long, so they may now have no choice but to eat major losses to keep from permanently losing customers. But, in doing that, they may still incur such on an extreme amount of loss that the company could be ruined anyway. (Sorry for the back-and-forth logic; thinking out-loud.)

You know, I do not envy anyone in the position of having to deal with this dilemma in the slightest. There's death-march and then there is marching dead.

(I admit that my opinion here could be totally off the mark since I have no first-hand experience with the game.)

 

[Monsterfurby]

FFXIV has damaged the brand? Buddy, I think you are still overrating the impact of your game. When I think Final Fantasy, I automatically ignore the online iterations. Those are mostly irrelevant to the brand. No, the damage was already done by certain... other... games... in the series.

 

[VincentX3]

Someone please explain in detail on how the game is supposedly so "Broken and horrible" to the point that it's unplayable.

If not then, just because it's not a WoW clone =/= Unplayable.

Most of my problems lie in that I'm used to playing FFXI, not that it's not a wow clone, since I can't stand WoW. It's like they didn't learn anything in the almost ten years that FFXI had been in existence. Lists of things I don't like:

Fast travel between points is limited by way of Anima. You get 200 Anima and it costs up to 6 Anima to teleport to crystals you've previously been to. Anima recharges slowly. Very slowly. So you have two options, walk, or hitch a ride with someone (until Chocobos and Airships are added with 1.19).

I both like and hate the job system. Not love, like. It's an interesting concept, but setting my abilities every time I switch weapons is slightly annoying. Sure I can make macros for it, but I'd rather it just remember what abilities for which job.

It's too asian. No, I'm not saying there's too many Japanese players. This is in regards to the grinding involved with Asian MMOs vs not nearly as much in western MMOs. If you're not doing Levequests, your SP (soon to be XP) will be coming in slooooooooow. Unless I've been doing something completely wrong.

The UI is just sluggish. I don't know if it's my PC, but it seems the UI is just shitty and slow. Targetting is a pain in the ass, selecting items to buy/sell lags. It takes forever to transfer stuff to a retainer or to sell to an NPC.

I don't know, maybe I just miss FFXI and I was hoping that XIV would be a HD version of XI.

I'm glad there's decent people somewhere, even if most of them are on the other half of the world.
I can't blaim Square for being frustrated when most people are "OMGZ IT TAKS ME 2 XTRA CLCIKS TO SELL!! HORRABLE GAME!!"

As I said before, my problem isn't with extra clicks to sell stuff, it's the interface is slow and not very well designed. It was much nicer in XI, which makes it weird that it's harder to use in XIV.

I'd be surprised if Square doesn't just not decide to screw the American version of the game and stick with the Japs on this one.

I'm surprised that they didn't just throw in the towel overall for the game.

Someone please explain in detail on how the game is supposedly so "Broken and horrible" to the point that it's unplayable.

If not then, just because it's not a WoW clone =/= Unplayable.

Ok initially during the beta and early days of it the game was absolutely unplayable and it really had nothing to do with it being dissimilar from WoW. For example one thing that really did It for me was having my toon become glitched and allowed to continue leveling but restricted from earning advanced skills for leveling. However bugs can be fixed.

No the unplayable parts were trying to release an MMO that was clearly centered around Tradeskills at the expense of combat. Or the sheer lack of viable quest content coupled with XP throttling, Coupled with an XP model that made it virtually useless to fight mobs unless your on a quest, yet limiting the number of quests you can not only hold, but actually get (cant get quests that dont exist) And an outside issue was an unrealistic system spec vs very weak optimization. Running last year on a 2.5 dual core, 4gb ram, 1gb GTX 250 and I was getting 20 frames per second.

Those were the biggest things that rendered the game unplayable at launch. However it is clear the game has been worked on and improved. It was just an insane decision to launch an MMO without proper support to combat classes, or the combat experience. However the game was even in those days very firmly salvagable with many interesting possibilities that made it worth considering as an MMO.

(Side note. What the hell is with SE and making their 2 MMOs control so stiff. Seriously its like every Player char is spawned with a stick up their ass that limits the upper turning velocity. Best way to ensure your brand spanking new MMO with slick graphics and all sorts of pretty shineys look really bad is when you rehash a control mechansim that was infuriatingly antiquated 10 years earlier last time you tried it)

Much better! Thank you both for the detailed explanation.

I'm just so sick these days of people saying EVERYTHING sucks and when you ask them why there like "UHHH...NEDZ MOO GRAPHCIS!" or something incredibly retarded.

But yes, both of your explanations sound like MMO Killers and are really a big hassle.
As for the EXP I'm not sure how bad it was, But I remember some years ago already I was playing an online game called "Fly For Fun" (Or FFF) it was really cartoonish but a great game in the beginning.

2 years later, I was earning 00.01% per mob (At lv98), It's still like that but there's people that got to lv120 (MAX) back then and it was outrageous the amount of time you have to spent to level (Lack of quests)

Really bad when it get's to that point =/

 

[Redd the Sock]

I thought it was a mistake to make another FF MMO in the first place. I don't play them myself, but I didn't think FFXI's subscriptions had sunk far enough to merit a total restart in a game genre than if done right, can more or less be expanded indefinatly. Make a new expansion pack and a PS3 upgraded disk and you're good to go. It'd have been better to try a different series/genre. MMO Front mission sounds easy enough. MMO Busido Blade would at least be a new setting. MMO Chrono Tirgger, might take some creativity, but isn't impossible. Even something new wouldn't be ot of iline. MMOs don't have to be stellar out the gate, but they do need to do something unique, not rely on one of the last brand names to not drop the numbering system.

And sorry, the damage is to the Square Enix name, not Final fantasy. FF vs XIII is still in high demand and FFVII is still one of hte most requested projects in existance. If FF can survive The Spirits withing and two shitty anime attempts, it'll get through this. We still love us some Final Fantasy, and blame the tallent behind it (which, let's face it, changes with each game these days) for screw ups. We've all seen dying francises thrive under new developers, and while I'd hate to see that happen, recent rack records haven't been stellar, even outside FF.

 

[RollForInitiative]

While it's all well and good for Wada to be contrite now, it does beg the question as to why the game was released in such a sorry state in the first place.

I will forevermore use this game as an example of what happens if you don't delay a game that's obviously not finished. It's a fantastic example of why it's better to withhold rather than release in a damaged state.

By the way, "beg the question" doesn't mean what you think it does in that context. I misused the expression for years until somebody finally informed me [http://begthequestion.info/] otherwise.

 

[genericusername64]

I'd say It started at 10, then got worse from there, ff12 excluded.

 

[Gridlock]

The Final Fantasy Francaise have basically been spiraling downwards ever since the launch of Final Fantasy X(watch spooney review). It began to hammer in the point with needles at Final Fantasy X and by the time of Final Fantasy XIII was released it had started to use giant nails to hammer in the point.

The real trillion dollar question is what happened? How did a game series that had everything a great JRPG needs and was a glowing example of how JRPGs should be made to becoming an example of how a game should most defiantly NOT be made.

It can´t be because of lack of inspiration there is literally a ton of it out there, the most recent being the Persona 3 and 4 games, those two games where shinning examples of what Final Fantasy should have been great gameplay an even greater story.

So again what happened to Square Enix to make them almost incapable of making a great Final Fantasy?

 

[Nu-Hir]

So again what happened to Square Enix to make them almost incapable of making a great Final Fantasy?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hironobu_Sakaguchi

Scroll down and look at which FF games he didn't do the original concept for. He took his talent elsewhere, and with him took Square's best composer.

 

[Azurian]

I'm pretty sure this game as done it's fair share to damage the FF brand name.

 

[Aiddon_v1legacy]

The Final Fantasy Francaise have basically been spiraling downwards ever since the launch of Final Fantasy X(watch spooney review). It began to hammer in the point with needles at Final Fantasy X and by the time of Final Fantasy XIII was released it had started to use giant nails to hammer in the point.

The real trillion dollar question is what happened? How did a game series that had everything a great JRPG needs and was a glowing example of how JRPGs should be made to becoming an example of how a game should most defiantly NOT be made.

It can´t be because of lack of inspiration there is literally a ton of it out there, the most recent being the Persona 3 and 4 games, those two games where shinning examples of what Final Fantasy should have been great gameplay an even greater story.

So again what happened to Square Enix to make them almost incapable of making a great Final Fantasy?

All of Square's best and brightest left the company due to executive meddling, including the one man (Matsuno) who could have taken the series in a bold, new direction. Nowadays it's just full of hacks like Toriyama and has-beens like Nomura and Kitase.

 

[Trishbot]

Newsflash: FFXIV was HARDLY the first game to "tarnish" the brand name of Final Fantasy.

They seriously need to take a break from Final Fantasy and do some new projects. To quote a friend, "Now, I'm sick to death of Final Fantasy games, even the good ones, because they just KEEP pumping them out at such a ridiculous pace: Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy XIII-2, Final Fantasy Type-0, Dissidia Final Fantasy, Dissidia 2 [012] Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy IV: After Years, Final Fantasy VII: Dirge of Cerberus, Final Fantasy VII: Crisis Core, Final Fantasy XII: Revenant Wings, Final Fantasy :Crystyal Chronicles, Final Fantasy Tactics A2: Grimoire of the Rift, Final Fantasy: The 4 Heroes of Light, Theatrhythm Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: Echoes of Time, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: My Life as a Darklord, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: The Crystal Bearers, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: My Life as a King, and Final Fantasy XIV: online, in ADDITION to all the remakes and re-releases.

We have had over 30 Final Fantasy releases in less than 10 years.

Stop it."

Here's a better idea; start doing original IPs and games again. You know, games like Vagrant Story, Chrono Cross, Chrono Trigger, Xenogears, Bushido Blade, Tobal, Erhgeiz, Parasite Eve, Secret of Mana, Front Mission, the SaGa series, Brave Fencer Musashi, and Threads of Fate. Hell, I'd even take a new "The Bouncer" game at this point.

You know "The World Ends With You"? More games like THAT, please.

 

[Ukomba]

Do I smell a Galaxies style CU and NGE coming for FFXIV?

 

[ProjectTrinity]

Damaged the brand? Ohhohoho! Charming play, sir! Oh no. It just iced the Cake of Insults while we were all desperate to get the taste of FFXIII out of our mouths. Final Fantasy XII may have separated who liked teenage angst and whining over political intrigue and Star Wars maturity, but XIII just outright messed up to anyone who isn't overly forgiving optimistic about their plots and characters.

 

[Centrophy]

Newsflash: FFXIV was HARDLY the first game to "tarnish" the brand name of Final Fantasy.

They seriously need to take a break from Final Fantasy and do some new projects. To quote a friend, "Now, I'm sick to death of Final Fantasy games, even the good ones, because they just KEEP pumping them out at such a ridiculous pace: Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy XIII-2, Final Fantasy Type-0, Dissidia Final Fantasy, Dissidia 2 [012] Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy IV: After Years, Final Fantasy VII: Dirge of Cerberus, Final Fantasy VII: Crisis Core, Final Fantasy XII: Revenant Wings, Final Fantasy :Crystyal Chronicles, Final Fantasy Tactics A2: Grimoire of the Rift, Final Fantasy: The 4 Heroes of Light, Theatrhythm Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: Echoes of Time, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: My Life as a Darklord, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: The Crystal Bearers, Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: My Life as a King, and Final Fantasy XIV: online, in ADDITION to all the remakes and re-releases.

We have had over 30 Final Fantasy releases in less than 10 years.

Stop it."

Here's a better idea; start doing original IPs and games again. You know, games like Vagrant Story, Chrono Cross, Chrono Trigger, Xenogears, Bushido Blade, Tobal, Erhgeiz, Parasite Eve, Secret of Mana, Front Mission, the SaGa series, Brave Fencer Musashi, and Threads of Fate. Hell, I'd even take a new "The Bouncer" game at this point.

You know "The World Ends With You"? More games like THAT, please.

Let's not forget that Enix has some good IP's still in their library (That aren't Dragon Quest/Dragon Warrior, because let's face it, it's almost as prevalent as FF) like;

Actraiser, Soul Blazer, 7th Saga, Ogre Battle, Terranigma, Illusion of Gaia, Star Ocean, Bust a Groove, Mischief Makers, Grandia.

I'm sure there are more, they had some good talent back in their SNES days. Amazing that when these two companies merged to become Squeenix they lost everything that made both of them good in their own respects.

 

[Logan Westbrook]

By the way, "beg the question" doesn't mean what you think it does in that context. I misused the expression for years until somebody finally informed me [http://begthequestion.info/] otherwise.

I've never heard "beg the question" used in any way other than "you have to ask why." I think the BTQ campaigners may have to accept that language evolves and that they've lost this one.

 

[Gridlock]

We have had over 30 Final Fantasy releases in less than 10 years.

Stop it."

Here's a better idea; start doing original IPs and games again. You know, games like Vagrant Story, Chrono Cross, Chrono Trigger, Xenogears, Bushido Blade, Tobal, Erhgeiz, Parasite Eve, Secret of Mana, Front Mission, the SaGa series, Brave Fencer Musashi, and Threads of Fate. Hell, I'd even take a new "The Bouncer" game at this point.

You know "The World Ends With You"? More games like THAT, please.

That´s a good idea, though i wouldn´t say leave the Final fantasy series for good, I would rather say let it rest for a bit.

Do some other stuff try other games where you can experiment without PISSING OFF the series fans.

And if you really want to still do some Final Fantasy here´s a good idea re-release ALL of them on X-box live and Playstation store, Final Fantasy 1 to 12.
And if you really want to fix them up, polish the graphic a little here and there fix some glitches and translation errors that might have been in the original product and then just let the series rest for a bit.

Then when you got the energy back to make a Final Fantasy game once again, you can take the game series up again and make it a great series once again.

If you keep doing this at this pace all you´ll end up with is a continually watered down product that in the end nobody wants to buy.

 

[circularlogic88]

Mischief Makers

Can we please get something like this going again? I loved that game.

 

[LogicNProportion]

No, Square, YOU damage the Final Fantasy brand.