Flashbangs and stuns in COD

[TheEndlessSleep]

I know I'm not alone when I say a huge part of my COD rage comes from flashbangs or stun grenades.

I realise that they're real miliatary hardware and they work really well, but i'm not sure they work in games, chiefly because of the fact that it's such a massive playing field leveler.

Example -----> You can be the best player in the world, but as soon as you've been blinded, or stunned facing the other direction, all you can do is lie down and pray that the guy who threw it doesn't notice you. Or, if you are facing where he is coming from, open fire like a madman and hope to get away with it. At this point, all skill is taken out of the equation and we enter the domain of luck.

And it's not like they can really be avoided: I might not mind as much if you had the ability to turn away to avoid the flash, but in COD even looking away from a flashbang blinds you. Which just makes for a doubly annoying death if you actually managed to spin around, only to be blinded anyway.

Anybody who has a converse opinion or feels the same please drop a comment

EDIT: It's probably worth pointling out, having read some of these comments, I AM NOT A CAMPER, and so calling me out on that as my reason for hating flashbangs is irrelevant.

 

[Xorph]

I guess for me its based on the situation. Grenade spammers who use One Man Army to replenish them piss me off, but if you use them every now and then in the match I'm fine with that, since half the time it either misses or I kill them anyway.

 

[TheEndlessSleep]

Actually if your facing the other direction you wont be blinded. I know this because I often flashbang my friends while playing online with them, so I toss it turn around and it blinds them and not me.

I think its perfectly fair to have them in the game. Its not like you cant kill the person who threw it at you, although its alittle blury you can still see people coming in you just move slower.

It doesn't if you throw it, but next time you get flashbanged by an enemy try turning round and seeing how much good it does you. And, if you get hit by a direct flashbang and the screen goes completely white you are basically screwed.

 

[L4hlborg]

Well, skill is also taken out of the equation when someone snipes you to the face. You cannot prevent it, if you are in the line of fire. Same goes for flashes and stuns. I don't really see the difference. Sure they can be annoying (especially when surviving an impossible firefight just to be killed by a random spec nade to the face) but using them requires atleast some skill and timing.

 

[Tharwen]

It's a good way of breaking a stalemate when the only other option is to let your team throw itself at a heavily defended room over and over again.

 

[Audio]

These things where probably designed for organized 5 v 5 matches which dont allow respawns.
They are tactical devices so they mean bugger all in a 24 person death match :/

 

[Scout Tactical]

A good alternative to using grenades would be to give the medic class a sort of Übercharge, if you will.

Oh wait, wrong franchise.

 

[SalamanderJoe]

I always face a wall when I see one or throw one. Sounds silly but you only get the tail end to nothing of the flash for just a second long action.

 

[Flying-Emu]

Welcome to war. It's not always about skill: Luck HUGELY factors into the equation.

 

[PissOffRoth]

I liked these better when turning away from them actually did something. Now they somehow flash me through the back of my head, and that pisses me off. Just cause someone is too stupid to throw the flashbang properly means I should have to suffer for their incompetence? Or is there an actual reason this happens in MW2?

 

[Eclectic Dreck]

In this question, I think the equation remains balanced for the most part.

The one who throws the flashbang has expended a finite resource. If he chose correctly, then it is the result of one of several scenarios:

1) The player recognized a pattern where their success in a given action was improved if they first threw a flashbang
2) The player recognized that the presence of a player in the location where the flashbang would be thrown was likely
3) The player threw randomly and was lucky.

Point one and two are a subset of skill. It may not be a technical skill like target recognition, acquisition and dispatch but is instead the result of conditioning. Point three is mitigated by the very limited supply of thrown projectiles.

On the other hand, the player on the receiving end has met with several scenarios himself
1) He established or continued a pattern that could be recognized by the opposing player.
2) He was unlucky.

Point 1 is the fault of the player on the receiving end. The advantage of a position often lies in knowing how likely it is the position will be known to an opposing player. Point two equates to point three on the attacking end and again, this is mitigated by the scarcity of the item.

The outcome of such a situation has several possible results as well.
1) The attacker does not move quickly to capitalize on the advantage.
2) The attacker moves quickly enough to to theoretically gain an advantage but fails to recognize, acquire and dispatch the target before the advantage expires.
3) The attacker moves quickly enough and dispatches the target.
4) The target quickly responds with a counter that will reduce the advantage

In point 1, we find that the advantage is finite. In point two, we move quickly enough but because of some circumstance the advantage expires before it can be exploited. In point 3 all things went according to plan. Point 4 is the catch as the player on the receiving end has options. They may choose to fire in an area knowing it is likely that the opposing player will move through said zone. They may choose to throw a grenade of their own to deny the advantage and return the playing field to a state of equality. They have choose to maximize the time it takes for the attacker to recognize their presence in hopes of nullifying their advantage before effective fire is exchanged.

It is only in a few cases that luck can be said to be the only determining factor. A lucky throw that creates an advantage is meaningless if the player does not capitalize upon it. By the same token, the receiving player made a tactical choice that resulted in their being in a particular location. If they themselves practice pattern recognition, they are as capable of mitigating the possibility of this situation occurring as the attacker is of ensuring it happens.

 

[TheEndlessSleep]

[
It doesn't if you throw it, but next time you get flashbanged by an enemy try turning round and seeing how much good it does you. And, if you get hit by a direct flashbang and the screen goes completely white you are basically screwed.

Actually its the exact same if you throw it or your teamate or an enemy. Same shit happens nomatter who tosses the grenade.

You never completely screwed though yes if you get hit directly with a flashbang there is a good chance you will die. I think this is actually a good thing. It gives people a way to clear out a room full of campers. Ever tried taking out somebody who is hiding in the upstairs of a building, without a flashbang your completely screwed. They are strategic weapons that are very very useful.

If your enemy gets a direct hit with a flashbang on your and your completely blinded which is extremely rare then yes he deserves to have an advantage over you. If however your only half blinded which is what normally happens you can still easily kill him. Remember he doenst know your exact position but you know exactly where he is. Even blind fire in the doorway will hold him back untill you can fully see again. If you start running around in circles or stand their like an idiot doing nothing then you deserve to die.

If you dont like them then dont camp in corners or rooms as thats normally where you will get them. Your complaints make about as much sense to me as saying you dont like shotguns because they fire bullets and kill you.

I don't know what game your playing, but it isn't MW2, because you DEFINITLEY get flashed through the back of your head in that. Also, the alternative to clearing out a room of campers is to leave them in there to rot with no kills to feed off of and move on.

Also, while it's true you don't often get flashed full on, when you get a stun which prevents you from turning properly, it's always infuriating to be shot by an enemy you can see but can't turn to fast enough.

Also, I never camp. If i did i can see why my complains would make no sense. In fact it's always simply because people throw them around the map like retards and hope to get lucky that they are particularily annoying. Using them tactically to remove campers makes sense, although personally i'd just use a semtex.

 

[TheEndlessSleep]

Well, skill is also taken out of the equation when someone snipes you to the face. You cannot prevent it, if you are in the line of fire. Same goes for flashes and stuns. I don't really see the difference. Sure they can be annoying (especially when surviving an impossible firefight just to be killed by a random spec nade to the face) but using them requires atleast some skill and timing.

You're right, sniping could be classed as unskillful, but much less in MW2 because they give all the other guns so much more accuracy that you really have to be fast on that trigger.

The number of times i've seen a sniper get taken out at ridiculous range by an SMG (UMP... grr) is really perplexing.

Equally, if you get popped by a bullet at the right moment, the camera will jump as you flinch, and your sniper shot may miss, leaving you open for a split second to the somehow pinpoint accurate second and third shots.

Of course they could always miss, but then we're back to luck again aren't we

 

[TheEndlessSleep]

Welcome to war. It's not always about skill: Luck HUGELY factors into the equation.

It's not war though, it's a GAME, and that exactly the point I'm making.

 

[Gigaguy64]

Well....that's what they are made for.
To give anyone the upper hand, especially against a group.

And its not like a player has an endless supply, once you use them both up your out until you die or you have the Scavenger Perk.

 

[Apocalypse Tank]

People still get kills while flashed or stunned.
An educated guess by the opponent gets transformed into a disadvantage for the player, what's wrong with that?

If I suspect a room contains an enemy, of course I will make my chance of survival as high as I can. Does it take skill? No. Is it luck that I tossed in a stun/flash? very rarely.

successful stuns and flashes are the results of caution and common sense.

 

[Sniper Team 4]

Wait, we have so many people complaining about how Call of Duty is unbalanced and broken, and now someone's upset about "a massive playing field leveler"? Is there no pleasing anyone?

Personally I love flashbangs. Helps storming a room with friends, covering a retreat, or tossing on into the bushes and scrubs to see if anyone's there. Stun grenades seem a little odd to me, but I don't use them so oh well.