I know what Asperger's is. The only defining trait/symptom I share with someone who has Asperger's is lack of "normal" social ability. I don't have any of the other traits/symptoms, like inappropriate affect, for example.
Forever Alone (And Why Therapy Doesn't Seem to Get It)
- Thread starter Paragon Fury
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There will always be some shizzle that we won't understand about other people. Whether that's your problem or their problem is down to you. It's difficult because if you don't build your interpersonal skills when you're younger, it's harder to do it when you're in your late teens or adulthood.
Talking helps figure out who you are, what you know, and how to help you as a person. You have to figure out what you want to get from seeing your therapist, tell them, and make sure they do what they can to help you achieve that. Do you want to think of normal girls as pretty? Do you want to be attracted to the girls from your college? Do you just want to fit in?
You are not alone. You may feel lonely, but that's different. Everyone struggles with connecting to people, and figuring out what they want from them. It's a part of growing up, and discovering who you are. Not everyone finds girls sexually attractive. Not everyone is out to hurt you or beat you up (despite how much this has happened in the past).
Well done for getting help, anyways
I hope everything works out okay! Hang out at comic-cons and expos and stuff to meet people with similar interests. Find a girl who you think in time you might call her a friend. Friends are better anyhow, but you don't always know who exactly is your friend straight off the bat.
[Insert concluding statement with a heart-warming tone]
Good luck
Talking helps figure out who you are, what you know, and how to help you as a person. You have to figure out what you want to get from seeing your therapist, tell them, and make sure they do what they can to help you achieve that. Do you want to think of normal girls as pretty? Do you want to be attracted to the girls from your college? Do you just want to fit in?
You are not alone. You may feel lonely, but that's different. Everyone struggles with connecting to people, and figuring out what they want from them. It's a part of growing up, and discovering who you are. Not everyone finds girls sexually attractive. Not everyone is out to hurt you or beat you up (despite how much this has happened in the past).
Well done for getting help, anyways
I hope everything works out okay! Hang out at comic-cons and expos and stuff to meet people with similar interests. Find a girl who you think in time you might call her a friend. Friends are better anyhow, but you don't always know who exactly is your friend straight off the bat.[Insert concluding statement with a heart-warming tone]
Good luck
Perhaps you give off the desperate and angry at the world vibe which may keep others at bay. Many self equated nice guys tend to end up looking clingy and desperate due to low self esteem. Also there is an attitude of being better than everyone else which is probably a self defense mechanism (maybe the game club things wasn't about you winning all the time but people thinking not a good sport). Also the focus on anime is probably you trying to save yourself from potential hurt of interacting with others. I don't mean to sound like I'm being antagonistic, because in some ways we are similar (I'm the girl version).
I've moved around so much growing up and being transgender, I had a hard time making friends and dealt with a lot of bullying even from some teachers. I was terrified of speaking in front of ten people, but I worked through that by doing things that put me in front of crowds (was a ddr tournament player in high school, played piano at my dorms lounge area, was on a cast for a college vagina memoir like event in front of over a hundred people and cameras). Learning to not care what others may think is a big step. I'm now teaching English in Asia which is something I would never have been able to do if I didn't realize that you need to step out of your comfort zone to expand it.
I also (still working on this) need to improve my self esteem because I was a lot like shinji keeping others away and miring in my self pity. My first reaction to a compliment is to say something horrible about myself. This reinforces the belief which then becomes my reality. So if your self worth is low then it makes it harder to meet others, because you are a) driving people off b)may even sabotage something good unknowingly to preserve the familiar depressive norm c)predict only bad so never even try d)not notice opportunities.
Someone earlier mentioned quirks and interesting traits are important to set yourself apart and to just celebrate those quirks. I only had one non net relationship prior to finishing college and that was in 8th grade. Now I have a caring bf of 3 years (even nerd girls struggling with being lonely). He, previous gfs (I'm bi), and friends crushing on me adore me for all my odd little quirks and mannerisms because I don't try to curtail myself to be like everyone else.
It might help to find a therapist you connect with. Though it requires work on your part. I can explain in detail the workings of cbt therapy, but doesn't matter if it's not put into practice. It took my a long time to find one, but it helped immensely. A few other things that might help. This might sound silly but try dating websites (how I met my bf) or making female friends online maybe through games to get you comfortable to talk to girls. Drink water if you usually don't... lol I know sounds silly but some of my life long depression and anxiety is connected to never drinking water and relying on caffeine which is an endless cycle of crashes that are connected to mood disorders.
My post seems to focus a lot on personal improvement.. and you know what? That's the key. Focusing on getting a gf will only have the opposite effect. If you feel confident about youself, be passionate about a particular hobby esp one that revolves around self expression/creation then it attracts people. Also you will need to do stuff that feels out of your safety zone and thus uncomfortable/unnatural like talk to people more especially girls, go to events/places with a friend (doesn't need to be a bar, maybe check out a ren fair those are pretty cool^^).
I've moved around so much growing up and being transgender, I had a hard time making friends and dealt with a lot of bullying even from some teachers. I was terrified of speaking in front of ten people, but I worked through that by doing things that put me in front of crowds (was a ddr tournament player in high school, played piano at my dorms lounge area, was on a cast for a college vagina memoir like event in front of over a hundred people and cameras). Learning to not care what others may think is a big step. I'm now teaching English in Asia which is something I would never have been able to do if I didn't realize that you need to step out of your comfort zone to expand it.
I also (still working on this) need to improve my self esteem because I was a lot like shinji keeping others away and miring in my self pity. My first reaction to a compliment is to say something horrible about myself. This reinforces the belief which then becomes my reality. So if your self worth is low then it makes it harder to meet others, because you are a) driving people off b)may even sabotage something good unknowingly to preserve the familiar depressive norm c)predict only bad so never even try d)not notice opportunities.
Someone earlier mentioned quirks and interesting traits are important to set yourself apart and to just celebrate those quirks. I only had one non net relationship prior to finishing college and that was in 8th grade. Now I have a caring bf of 3 years (even nerd girls struggling with being lonely). He, previous gfs (I'm bi), and friends crushing on me adore me for all my odd little quirks and mannerisms because I don't try to curtail myself to be like everyone else.
It might help to find a therapist you connect with. Though it requires work on your part. I can explain in detail the workings of cbt therapy, but doesn't matter if it's not put into practice. It took my a long time to find one, but it helped immensely. A few other things that might help. This might sound silly but try dating websites (how I met my bf) or making female friends online maybe through games to get you comfortable to talk to girls. Drink water if you usually don't... lol I know sounds silly but some of my life long depression and anxiety is connected to never drinking water and relying on caffeine which is an endless cycle of crashes that are connected to mood disorders.
My post seems to focus a lot on personal improvement.. and you know what? That's the key. Focusing on getting a gf will only have the opposite effect. If you feel confident about youself, be passionate about a particular hobby esp one that revolves around self expression/creation then it attracts people. Also you will need to do stuff that feels out of your safety zone and thus uncomfortable/unnatural like talk to people more especially girls, go to events/places with a friend (doesn't need to be a bar, maybe check out a ren fair those are pretty cool^^).
Yeah. I used to have some pretty nerdy pastimes and was probably in a similar boat with women etc.
I still have my nerdy pastimes but I am getting married this autumn and am so much less messed up than I was in my 20's. I suppose at some point I would have thought something similar which is why I am posting.
First thing I'll say is it's premature to think of yourself as "forever" anything at this point. Life is really unpredictable. You're probably still going to change a bunch (some people don't, but that's their problem) from this point on so don't be thinking anything about you now is "final".
Also I have to say, I don't think spending all your time immersed in pretend animu ladies is at all healthy. If that's your only contact with women you need to get as far away from that stuff as possible because it's made for Japanese nerds with even less healthy attitudes than you towards women than you.
Women in those things are basically designed to appeal to really sad otaku. Given that those guys are kind of human lady repellent I worry that it could become a bit of a vicious circle. Get the stench off you before you too own body pillows and mouse-mats with boobs.
I'd suggest you need some hobbies that engage you with other people more.
Maybe you could join an animu club but I'll only permit this if there are girls there (girls do like animu, possibly even more than dudes).
Is there anything else you like that would get you interacting with people a bit more? Anything you could get into? Photography? Music? A sport?
I think having to go out into the wonderful world of gainful employment did me a lot of good too because however much of a unique snowflake you might think you are, you kind of have to fit in with society at large in an office or wherever it is you might work. Can you get a job?
Hats off to you for not self diagnosing ass burgers over the internet. There's probably hope for you.
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Er... am I allowed to swear in here? I forget.
edit of edit
I've really seen therapy work for one of my friends. He had not dissimilar issues to yours. He really had to commit in a big way though.
I still have my nerdy pastimes but I am getting married this autumn and am so much less messed up than I was in my 20's. I suppose at some point I would have thought something similar which is why I am posting.
First thing I'll say is it's premature to think of yourself as "forever" anything at this point. Life is really unpredictable. You're probably still going to change a bunch (some people don't, but that's their problem) from this point on so don't be thinking anything about you now is "final".
Also I have to say, I don't think spending all your time immersed in pretend animu ladies is at all healthy. If that's your only contact with women you need to get as far away from that stuff as possible because it's made for Japanese nerds with even less healthy attitudes than you towards women than you.
Women in those things are basically designed to appeal to really sad otaku. Given that those guys are kind of human lady repellent I worry that it could become a bit of a vicious circle. Get the stench off you before you too own body pillows and mouse-mats with boobs.
I'd suggest you need some hobbies that engage you with other people more.
Maybe you could join an animu club but I'll only permit this if there are girls there (girls do like animu, possibly even more than dudes).
Is there anything else you like that would get you interacting with people a bit more? Anything you could get into? Photography? Music? A sport?
I think having to go out into the wonderful world of gainful employment did me a lot of good too because however much of a unique snowflake you might think you are, you kind of have to fit in with society at large in an office or wherever it is you might work. Can you get a job?
Hats off to you for not self diagnosing ass burgers over the internet. There's probably hope for you.
edit
Er... am I allowed to swear in here? I forget.
edit of edit
I've really seen therapy work for one of my friends. He had not dissimilar issues to yours. He really had to commit in a big way though.
Yeah.....about the mousepad and pillow.......
I swear, they came with Record of Agarest War. I don't actually use them either; I had to get them out of the box and packing to take that picture.
I swear, they came with Record of Agarest War. I don't actually use them either; I had to get them out of the box and packing to take that picture.
Errr....no?spm1138 said:LOL. Oh dear. Well, ebay them quick. Burn them. Put them in a sack with a brick and toss em in a river.
And as far as other things are concerned, I have no musical talent at all (or artistic talent for that matter), and the only sport I'm good enough to play is paintball, but that is hella expensive to constantly play.
Like I said, there is also no anime club or anything like that at my college for me to get into.
Like I said, there is also no anime club or anything like that at my college for me to get into.
You sure about that? Even some of the smallest schools in my state have at least a few outlets for geek congregations.Paragon Fury said:
Honestly, and I don't want to sound like a douche for saying this but... judging by some of the interests you have expressed and photos you have linked I think it is fair to assume that you are what the average college age (American) girl would consider "weird". Now that's not entirely a bad thing, however it gives you a disadvantage and limits your options a bit.
I'm a pretty strange person myself and I have a lot of advice to give, but I feel I need a better understanding of how your social encounters occur. What is your average conversation like with a girl you know? How about a girl you don't know well?
You kind of had me until you posted pictures of two retarded looking anime characters. I'd suggest that you just need to meet better and more interesting people, but if your ideal girl is some passive, childish stereotype out of an anime then I honestly don't know what to think. If a guy told me this, I'd honestly be a little creeped out. Most people simply don't act like this, and the ones that do probably have tons of their own issues.
Well the world is a gigantic crapper on everybody, not everyone can be anime freaks and own friggin love pillows for it. Your obviously not helping yourself in any shape or form, which is what it comes down to. Your incredibly useless therapist is only gonna get you so far. I mean you could start with getting a male therapist and maybe thinking completely differently.
Just so you know, it has nothing to do with the fact you like anime or whatever. There are bigger freaks than you that have much more of a social life than you and are probably getting more pussy too.
You could think of it like getting a job, its not just gonna come to you and how much you involve yourself in this quest for change is simply not enough. You gotta have the balls to make the change, to get out there, to realise you haven't got much more left to lose if you didnt even have it. The change is in the mindset, peace out.
Just so you know, it has nothing to do with the fact you like anime or whatever. There are bigger freaks than you that have much more of a social life than you and are probably getting more pussy too.
You could think of it like getting a job, its not just gonna come to you and how much you involve yourself in this quest for change is simply not enough. You gotta have the balls to make the change, to get out there, to realise you haven't got much more left to lose if you didnt even have it. The change is in the mindset, peace out.
man this discussion has hit my sore spot quite hard; its because of experiences like these (which i have experienced) that caused me to leave higher education; My desire to learn about my fields as well as be a more serious player in sports (boxing and rugby at the time), and the simple fact that i genuinely detest the clubbing and going out and getting hammered way of spending an evening made me a social pariah.
All i can honestly say to you is: get another therapist you can open up to (the first step is letting others understand you), Try your hardest to find some like minded people; even where im from (with the most minuscule looking video game and anime culture), i've still been shocked to go from strolling the section (anime), into a full on discussion about scott pilgrim and web-comics (best day ever), they exist, and the female anime fans i've seen are pretty cute.
Finally, the most important one... you need to get yourself to a place where you believe and are confidant in yourself to the degree where you do not put yourself in the firing line; I know this from experience, that the world is a cynical place, and it'll take any opportunity to grab your insecurity and take it on a joyride. The day i focused on bettering myself as a person and living for others with self confidence was when people take notice of you. You're intelligent person by what you've written here, don't force these things through, people can see the difference between a forced effort and a someone taking part of their own volition.
Err... as for the girl issue im not one to give advice on this because i am hopeless with women because im just not interested; and its not to do with anime, i find anime women to be 2 dimensional, but what i can say is that the opposite sex provides the ultimate challenge; simply because what they lack in anime perfection, they make up for with a vibrant personality and an interesting conversation (most of them anyway).
Apologies for the wall of text (most of which will probably make no sense, and i'll get told im full of crap for writing)
I dont know how to post pictures...
All i can honestly say to you is: get another therapist you can open up to (the first step is letting others understand you), Try your hardest to find some like minded people; even where im from (with the most minuscule looking video game and anime culture), i've still been shocked to go from strolling the section (anime), into a full on discussion about scott pilgrim and web-comics (best day ever), they exist, and the female anime fans i've seen are pretty cute
.Finally, the most important one... you need to get yourself to a place where you believe and are confidant in yourself to the degree where you do not put yourself in the firing line; I know this from experience, that the world is a cynical place, and it'll take any opportunity to grab your insecurity and take it on a joyride. The day i focused on bettering myself as a person and living for others with self confidence was when people take notice of you. You're intelligent person by what you've written here, don't force these things through, people can see the difference between a forced effort and a someone taking part of their own volition.
Err... as for the girl issue im not one to give advice on this because i am hopeless with women because im just not interested; and its not to do with anime, i find anime women to be 2 dimensional, but what i can say is that the opposite sex provides the ultimate challenge; simply because what they lack in anime perfection, they make up for with a vibrant personality and an interesting conversation (most of them anyway).
Apologies for the wall of text (most of which will probably make no sense, and i'll get told im full of crap for writing)
I dont know how to post pictures...
Admittedly, that isn't the most flattering picture of Tskuimi I could find, but the other pictures I did find came from sites flagged as "Unsafe", so I avoided them.Chemical Alia said:
But if you describe Yoko and Tskuimi as "childish", it just shows you've never watched Sekirei or Gurren.
Its a school of 2000 people. I know the Residence and Campus Life office well. If a club exists on campus, I'd know about it. there is a Game Club, Ski Club, Paintball Club, etc.....even a Cigar Club, but no Anime Club.Fappy said:
I don't really "know" any women. What conversation I do have with them are limited to them asking to borrow my textbooks, or if I remember when and what a quiz or a test is about, or in an adversarial setting during a class debate.
Are you involved with any activities on campus (besides ROTC if you are still in it)? This is a great way to meet them considering how women tend to care more about such things (in my experience anyway), and even if you don't like any of them they might introduce you to others.Paragon Fury said:
No, I don't do ROTC anymore.
There are no women in the Paintball Club.
I stopped skiing after I got banned from a mountain in high school because I was so bad at it I was a danger to other people.
I'm not allowed at the video game club anymore; they don't like me there because I'm too good compared to them. And there aren't any women there anyways. The other clubs I really don't have any interest in for one reason or another.
There are no women in the Paintball Club.
I stopped skiing after I got banned from a mountain in high school because I was so bad at it I was a danger to other people.
I'm not allowed at the video game club anymore; they don't like me there because I'm too good compared to them. And there aren't any women there anyways. The other clubs I really don't have any interest in for one reason or another.
As far as relationships go, it sounds like you're counting yourself out before the game even starts. If you're so concerned about your physical appearance, start giving it some attention, go jogging first thing in the morning, exercise regularly.
You're smart, you've said so yourself, use that big ol' brain of yours, diagnose the problem, find a solution and put that solution into action.
You're smart, you've said so yourself, use that big ol' brain of yours, diagnose the problem, find a solution and put that solution into action.
Read it all (I was about to ADHD out on it, but then there was a picture of a cat that seemed awfully convincing), you have my sympathies man, I don't know what else to say. "To hell with therapists" maybe? I don't know. We all have problems, some more than others, some pass others don't, maybe in two years you'll look back at this thread and laugh, then again maybe you won't, life is messy like that. In the meantime, here's some The Smiths [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U5HpeA_WSo] for ya.
You seem to have missed the actual point I was trying to make. I don't think a "more flattering" image of the anime chick would help in this situation. :CParagon Fury said:
I remember I went to a therapist last semester too, the same kind: talking, that is.
I was in and out of depression, but I remember that no matter how sad I was, music made me a bit happier.
Anyways, right, like you the therapist accomplished nothing, they just sit their and ask you casual questions if my experience is any indicator...
About that woman problem, well you could always do what I did: switch to men. :3
I was in and out of depression, but I remember that no matter how sad I was, music made me a bit happier.
Anyways, right, like you the therapist accomplished nothing, they just sit their and ask you casual questions if my experience is any indicator...
About that woman problem, well you could always do what I did: switch to men. :3