France Accuses Scientologists of Fraud

[klarr]

ahh aside from smelling like feet and butt, france may be nice to live in.

 

[Cliff_m85]

Hahaha... Good on France. And the Anonymous Army.

I don't care for Anonymous. If you're going to make a stand, grow some balls and do it out in the open. Imagine if everyone during the Equal Rights movement wore masks (besides the bad guys).

 

[Hunde Des Krieg]

I have gained new respect for the French.

Ditto.

 

[Flap Jack452]

I find fraud very plausible in a scientologist environment, considering all the money they move around.

 

[Jursa]

So I guess Tom Cruise will be at the one handing out the masks then?

 

[JMeganSnow]

Governments making religions (even crazy cult religions) illegal = bad, very very bad.

Everyone's religion looks like a cult to someone. This is why freedom of religion is important. Mormons tithe 10% of their income to their church. Are they next?

 

[Hunde Des Krieg]

I have gained new respect for the French.

You can always trust the french to take to the streets and kick up a fuss when the rest of the west can't be arsed.

In France the govt fears the people, in Britain and USA we have it the other way around, worth respecting imo.

Well, in the USA the government fears us, but they try to make us fear them at the same time.

 

[Radelaide]

That's over hundreds of years!

Yes, they have been doing it for that long. Precisely.

And that would be my point. Scientologists are worth something like <a href=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_Scientology#Finances> US$500 million and that's all from "revenue". Them charging hundreds and thousands of dollars for their services. They're a company, not a religion.

There is tonnes of differences between Christianity and Scientology. I don't believe in Christianity, but at least there is some theoretical evidence of Christianity's origins.

Actually, there is some factual evidence of Christianity's origins.
We know or estimate how and when it roughly birthed and bloomed.
Now, considering that Scientology is fairly recent, there's technically far more facts about it than about Christianity.
That's probably also why it's less mystic, esoteric in its roots, and doesn't feel like a religion, but a grotesque and pretentious simile that lacks the divine element in it.
There's truth in that. But religion per se doesn't require a god.

Actually, there is some factual evidence of Christianity's origins.

There's factual evidence of Scientology's origins.
"I'd like to start a religion. That's where the money is!" - L.Ron Hubbard (1949)

Pretty much what Root said. L. Ron Hubbard was a money-making scam artist, good to know his legend lives on!

There are serious flaws in Scientology and it's beliefs.

Like in any, no? Christianity has come a long way, I suppose, but its fundamentalists are no better than the Scientology's. The difference being that as a mainstream religion which is actually broken down into many variants, there's a lot of moderate faith going on.
A cult, before going large, cannot survive if its core is moderate.
Christianity couldn't survive if its own core was moderate. If it did, if it was watered down, it would not be seen as the strong leading and luminous tower that shines faith all over the world anymore. The former moderates would lose confidence in this current, feel the weakness, and probably shift faith or just drop it all at once.
Of course for me, absolutely all is BS.

Yes, every religion has it's flaws, and I'm not denying that. What I'm saying is that religion is meant to bring you closer to your respective God and to your family, not to throw money at it and refuse a relationship with anyone who isn't a part of your religion.

 

[Arbre]

Actually, there is some factual evidence of Christianity's origins.

There's factual evidence of Scientology's origins.
"I'd like to start a religion. That's where the money is!" - L.Ron Hubbard (1949)

Oh sure, the was no secret about it. But it appears that the message, I suppose, has moved on its own beyond its original intent.
The point is, many people believe so. Belief, faith... religion.
You know, I could argue that the Romans let the Christians grow and treated them as scapegoats for some political reason (an enemy -infidels?- to unite the Empire against, for example).
The point is, the origins are there, but many people treat it as religion now (sigh), and considering the amount of bullshit found in all of religions, I just don't see why this one would have less rights to live, for all its flaws.
I find it highly humourous that in societies of ultra-capitalism and religious bigotry, one of the the less hypocritical models is treated like a witch by some.

 

[Arbre]

And that would be my point. Scientologists are worth something like <a href=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_Scientology#Finances> US$500 million and that's all from "revenue". Them charging hundreds and thousands of dollars for their services. They're a company, not a religion.

And you think Vatican got its money from... the Sky?

Yes, every religion has it's flaws, and I'm not denying that. What I'm saying is that religion is meant to bring you closer to your respective God and to your family, not to throw money at it and refuse a relationship with anyone who isn't a part of your religion.

Not if the religion doesn't hinge around the premise of a one true God.

 

[Beefcakes]

I suddenly *less than three* France just that little bit more
Now lets here from Australia
"Nah, were just chillen, a-banning your games and interwebzlol"
Grr, sometimes I wish I never taught Australia leet-speak, or how to use the internet...

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

The point is, the origins are there, but many people treat it as religion now (sigh), and considering the amount of bullshit found in all of religions, I just don't see why this one would have less rights to live, for all its flaws.
I find it highly humourous that in societies of ultra-capitalism and religious bigotry, one of the the less hypocritical models is treated like a witch by some.

Even if we are looking at Christianity and Scientology as equals (which is a REAL sleight to Christians), I don't believe that Christianity teaches that for money you can learn powers, specifically indoctrinates the famous, channels illegal funds, preaches that anyone who condemns the religion is to be disgraced or eliminated, targets any reporters who want to know about the religion & ostracises non-members without performing any charitable acts.

Last I heard, even an Atheist may sit in on a sermon without being threatened. And that applies to Islam, Buddhism and most other "true" religions, but not Scientology.

 

[Arbre]

Even if we are looking at Christianity and Scientology as equals (which is a REAL sleight to Christians), I don't believe that Christianity teaches that for money you can learn powers, specifically indoctrinates the famous, channels illegal funds, preaches that anyone who condemns the religion is to be disgraced or eliminated, targets any reporters who want to know about the religion & ostracises non-members without performing any charitable acts.

Last I heard, even an Atheist may sit in on a sermon without being threatened. And that applies to Islam, Buddhism and most other "true" religions, but not Scientology.

Like I said, these religions are old and mainstream. The larger the people they cover, the more variants and leeway you find. Mind you, considering the stuff Ratsinger sprouts these days, you wonder which one is worst, if his words are the cream of the sanctified stuff, a notch below God.

 

[Seanchaidh]

ok im not a scientologist.
But, uh, isnt the whole point of tolarence to not say these kinds of things. I mean any scientologist who saw this relentless stream of bull crap would have left the escapist community.

Tolerance is a scheme to get ignorant bigots to be quiet without telling them that they are wrong; it is not a coherent general practice that should apply to every belief.

Scientology ruins peoples' lives. It abuses the legal system. It abuses the press. It amasses money and converts through blackmail. It breaks up families. It does things which we should allow no religion or cult or organization of any kind to do. You might think Christianity is bad: fine. But Scientology is very, very much worse. Christianity threatens you with a fantasy of hell after death. Scientology threatens you with a reality of your own personal hell on earth*. There is a world of difference between the two. If you disbelieve Christianity the threat is gone. If you disbelieve Scientology, they try to destroy you.

*Although what the Pope has said in Africa about contraception is helping to create a sort of hell on earth, that's beside the point. He doesn't think that's what he's doing and it is questionable just how much of an impact his statements will make.

 

[FinalGamer]

Wow France, nice one. Now all we need is Spain to make them revoke their church status and Europe is set.

I didn't know the protests were still running either. Used to attend a few myself back last year and the year before.

 

[Knight Templar]

France is off the list.
I find it odd people are protecting Scientology, it is not their beliefs on trial but their actions. That they belive in doing bad things is a side note.

Vous avez des mensonges, nous avons le gâteau!

Le gâteau est un mensonge!

Oun Crasaunt Le popular falar!
[sup]I have no idea what I just said.[/sup]

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

France is off the list.
I find it odd people are protecting Scientology, it is not their beliefs on trial but their actions. That they belive in doing bad things is a side note.

Vous avez des mensonges, nous avons le gâteau!

Le gâteau est un mensonge!

Oun Crasaunt Le popular falar!
[sup]I have no idea what I just said.[/sup]

C'est un triomphe, je fais note ici : "succès énorme"