Gamers hate diversity? Bull****.

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Batou667

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Right, this is basically a rant against the "witty" observation made in this demotivational image:



Frankly, I'm sick of seeing this whenever a thread about diversity or representation in games crops up. Firstly because despite being a gamer for the past 20 years I can't name half of the characters in it, and secondly because I strongly suspect it's a cherry-picked selection of protagonists which doesn't particularly reflect the most popular games or characters.

So, I went on a quick and dirty reconnaissance mission to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_games[footnote]In descending order - Mario Bros.: 40 million sold, Pokemon Red/Blue: 24 million, Sonic the Hedgehog: 15 million, etc.[/footnote]) to get a more accurate idea of the most popular characters (as defined by sales of the games they star in[footnote]Possibly I should have done this by franchise rather than peak sales for individual games, but the result is very similar - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_game_franchises[/footnote]).

Here's the revised image:



Suddenly, the state of gaming doesn't look quite so gloomy and homogenised, does it? Yes, the "brown-haired, 30-something male" is still represented, but to imply that this archetype is a requirement to sell a game, or that "gamers won't buy a game whose protagonist isn't a male power fantasy!", is bunk.

As an aside, what about the wimminz? Yeah, I'm not going to pretend there's anything approaching an even split here. There are plenty of female characters in gaming, but typically they're support characters - like most if the females in Final Fantasy - or else user-created avatars, as in The Sims and Wii Sports (two absolutely huge franchises that I didn't include in my revised image, as they can't be said to have a real protagonist).

So in closing, the "brown-haired 30-something male" protagonist exists, but it's just a trope. A lazy one and not even a particularly successful one, it mostly a hallmark of an averagely successful, "safe", not particularly loved or memorable franchise. Gamers are already voting with their wallets. So what's the problem?
 

PanYue

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Dec 3, 2011
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I remember someone saying that some character designers like making the protagonists males with brown hair since that makes them easier to project yourself onto, something about a middle ground between all hair styles and ages. Gender not included obviously. But they could be wrong. :p

But I agree. That's a well made image, and I like your use of sources for that. Good job. I like it when research is done (I checked to make sure you didn't pull a fast one too! :p) But I think it's just because gamers are evil, apparently. So we have to have somethings against us as much as possible. :D j/k
 

Zhukov

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Dec 29, 2009
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The point of that image is not that all video game protagonists are brown haired white makes, but that that particular type is overrepresented.

Can't say I'm particularly cheered up by your image. Can't see a single interesting character on there. Maybe Kratos and Snake could sneak a pass if I was feeling generous.

Also, notice that there's only one female in twenty characters.
 

Batou667

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PanYue said:
Good job.
Thanks!

Zhukov said:
Also, notice that there's only one female in twenty characters.
Yeah, I noticed.

I have a theory that may explain some of that. Most games with an identifiable "protagonist" - a single or main character who is pre-defined as opposed to user-created - tend to be action/adventure or FPS games, genres that are traditionally marketed towards men. There are exceptions of course - Bayonetta (sales: approx 2 million across 360 and PS3), Mirror's Edge (2 mill), Perfect Dark (1.3 mill), and of course Tomb Raider, which is the only franchise to break into the top 20.

If we took account of MMOs, RPGs, party games and simulations then suddenly the ratio would be a lot more favourable, as we'd be including huge franchises like The Sims, Wii Sports, WoW, Diablo, etc. But since the scope of this particular discussion is recognisable single characters, it's reasonable to omit them. (Using the same criteria I didn't include FIFA, NFL, or most of the CoD/Battlefield/BlOps/MoH genres).

Is it a problem? Maybe. Would it hurt to have more strong and identifiable female protagonists? No, not an iota. Is it a gamble developers are currently willing to take? Apparently not...
 

DoPo

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Jan 30, 2012
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Zhukov said:
The point of that image is not that all video game protagonists are brown haired white makes, but that that particular type is overrepresented.
Yes, precisely - it's not saying that brown haired 30 somethings are the only characters, just that there is too many of them.

Zhukov said:
Also, notice that there's only one female in twenty characters.
Hey, we're not sure about the bird. You're being sexist assuming it's male! ;P

Hmm...still, let me try naming as many characters as the first image. I'll go by row and position



Dunno

Dunno

Dunno

Dunno but at least seems familiar

Dunno




Dunno

Dunno but he looks bored

Dunno but I know I've seen him.

default MaleShep from Mass Effect! Woot first hit

Dunno



Dunno

Dunno

Dunno

Dunno

Dunno. Erm...maybe the guy from Space Marine?



Dunno

Dunno

Dunno

Niko or whatever his name was from GTA 4

Dunno


 

Schadrach

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Regarding your note 2 -- if you did it by franchise it would mean you'd have to fold Cloud and Tidus into one box, and could have used Lightning to represent Final Fantasy if you'd felt like it. Also, once you weed out the ones for whom there is no protagonist (or no clear protagonist) such as the Sims and the Wii series games (Wii Fit, Wii Sports, etc) you might have gotten far enough down to hit Kirby, who is totally a white, brown haired, 30 something male.

Zhukov said:
The point of that image is not that all video game protagonists are brown haired white makes, but that that particular type is overrepresented.

Can't say I'm particularly cheered up by your image. Can't see a single interesting character on there. Maybe Kratos and Snake could sneak a pass if I was feeling generous.

Also, notice that there's only one female in twenty characters.
It's worth noting that instead of cherry picking "generic soldier guy" type protagonists (which are, yes, mostly white, brown haired, 30ish males -- much like a handful of actors played the leads in basically every action blockbuster in the 80s) that this image used the protagonists of the top 20 best selling games that have specific protagonists. Hence Mario, Ash, and Sonic having top billing.

If the same cherry picking used in the original demotivator was used, it wouldn't be too hard to make one of only female protagonists, or only nonhuman protagonists.
 

Requia

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Zhukov said:
The point of that image is not that all video game protagonists are brown haired white makes, but that that particular type is overrepresented.

Can't say I'm particularly cheered up by your image. Can't see a single interesting character on there. Maybe Kratos and Snake could sneak a pass if I was feeling generous.

Also, notice that there's only one female in twenty characters.
There's Steve? (the minecraft avatar). Technically he's both. (no really, look at how animal breeding in Minecraft works, Notch said this applies to everything there).
 

FreakofNatur

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May 13, 2013
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Well, take it in any way you want, but your observations are warranted, similar to how feminists view gaming tropes. It's funny. When I was much younger I knew of stereotypes and thought that was it, then tropes came in, seemingly to validate and make less important stereotypes.

I think serious words warrant their use because well, it's serious isn't it? Most of us are seriously aware of the ridiculousness and self-invalidating stereotype-fulfillment, but some of us, particularly some of the more vocal activists or even representatives of certain movements, are not. These loud voices, like how the OP presented, often look into whatever seems to misrepresent or even represent with much disdain certain stereotypes, or "tropes".

The problem is stereotypes and similarly tropes is that not everyone knows or even recognizes them. The safe assumption is that for every avid gamer, there are a large portion that didn't realize what the original demotivational poster meant or from what contexts the characters came from.

Yes, the rant at face-value behind the demotivational poster is entirely invalid. I agree. But this poster, created with the knowledge of video game feminism, in a time where the "hero" trope is excessively being used to death; is one which merits some respect, even if the creator meant no such thing. I would call it an accidental flash of genius in this case.
The poster very effectively deals with ideas of "stereotyped sexualized women(supporting characters)" by showing the same happens for male protagonists as well as the lack of diversity in video-game character representation as a whole. The part about the kids is the part to let us know that the demotivational poster is entirely satirical, and I really hope the OP doesn't treat the demotivational poster seriously as a stilted representation of video game protagonists.

Most people use this poster without knowing the real meaning behind it. Perhaps those that do are ironically showcasing their ignorance towards representation, and we can safely ignore their wallowing while we march onto a better place for video games.
 

britishpanda

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i dont think the original poster is trying to paint gamers in a bad light, which is what OP seems to think, what with the defensive reaction to it. i think the point is that the poster is trying to say that the gaming industry is not diverse enough and relies on cliches - no matter how cherry picked the original picture is, you cant deny that is a lot of 30 something white guys who pretty much look the same.
 

Andy Shandy

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Jun 7, 2010
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DoPo said:
Zhukov said:
The point of that image is not that all video game protagonists are brown haired white makes, but that that particular type is overrepresented.
Yes, precisely - it's not saying that brown haired 30 somethings are the only characters, just that there is too many of them.

Zhukov said:
Also, notice that there's only one female in twenty characters.
Hey, we're not sure about the bird. You're being sexist assuming it's male! ;P

Hmm...still, let me try naming as many characters as the first image. I'll go by row and position



Dunno

Dunno

Dunno

Dunno but at least seems familiar

Dunno




Dunno

Dunno but he looks bored

Dunno but I know I've seen him.

default MaleShep from Mass Effect! Woot first hit

Dunno



Dunno

Dunno

Dunno

Dunno

Dunno. Erm...maybe the guy from Space Marine?



Dunno

Dunno

Dunno

Niko or whatever his name was from GTA 4

Dunno
I'll play this game too!



Dunno

Snake

Nathan Drake

Chris Redfield

Think it might be Alpha Protocol guy Mike Thornton?




Not a clue

Norman something Heavy Rain detective guy

Sam Fisher

Default MaleShep

Starkiller from The Force Unleashed



Cole from Infamous, I think

No idea

No idea

No idea

No idea



Alan Wake

Alec Mason from Red Faction: Guerilla

Painkiller guy? Or Dead To Rights perhaps?

Niko Bellic

Frank West



That was quite fun ^_^
 

DoPo

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Jan 30, 2012
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j-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
What as the last game that let you play a black lead character, without going down the character creation route?
Isn't the main character of The Walking Dead black? So that would make...two games. WAIT! If you in include the 50 Cent games, that's 4 in total. Come on, isn't that diversity? :p
 

Legion

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Oct 2, 2008
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I always looked at that image as a joke. Mocking developers for being unoriginal.

Bear in mind that while there are many white, thirty something male protagonists, you will see almost none of them appear in anybodies list of favourite characters.

No idea - Solid Snake - Nathan Drake - Chris Redfield - No idea

No idea - No idea - The guy from Deadlight? - Default Shepard - No idea

No idea - No idea - No idea - No idea - No idea

Alan Wake - No idea - No idea - Niko Bellic - No idea

j-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
And if you think the game industry is great for diversity, let me ask you a simple question:

What as the last game that let you play a black lead character, without going down the character creation route?

Because try as I might, I cannot think of a game since San Andreas that did that. And that was a fucking PS2 game.
Not as somebody who thinks it is great for diversity, but The Walking Dead and Prototype 2. If side characters who are also playable count then Gears of War. If games with no story count then Left 4 Dead 1/2 and Team Fortress 2.

Not a large selection.
 

Requia

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j-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
What as the last game that let you play a black lead character, without going down the character creation route?

Because try as I might, I cannot think of a game since San Andreas that did that. And that was a fucking PS2 game.
Dead Space. Though they hid that from the player so...
 

Disturbed-Hell

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Mar 18, 2010
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DoPo said:
Ok, I'll play!


dunno

someone from MGS?

Nathan Drake

that watermellon smuggler from RE5?

no idea




dunno

some guy who looks like he's about to fall asleep

the protagonist from that dark splinter cell?

John Shepard

dunno



Some guy that looks kinda like a phallus

no idea

lol, that face!

not a clue

ditto



Alan Wake

That guy from Red Faction: Chimpanzee?

Max Payne?

Niko Bellend

derp...


 

Zhukov

The Laughing Arsehole
Dec 29, 2009
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j-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
What as the last game that let you play a black lead character, without going down the character creation route?

Because try as I might, I cannot think of a game since San Andreas that did that. And that was a fucking PS2 game.
In addition to the ones mentioned by DoPo there was also the 2010 Aliens Vs Predator game.

He was a silent blank slate, but he was a black slate damn it!

Diversity, ho!
 

Zhukov

The Laughing Arsehole
Dec 29, 2009
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(Double post. Oh the horror.)

Batou667 said:
Zhukov said:
Also, notice that there's only one female in twenty characters.
Yeah, I noticed.

I have a theory that may explain some of that. Most games with an identifiable "protagonist" - a single or main character who is pre-defined as opposed to user-created - tend to be action/adventure or FPS games, genres that are traditionally marketed towards men.
Yeah... I have a much simpler theory.

Video games in general are mostly made by males and aimed at males, so when making a game the protagonists is made male because the average male prefers entertainment starring males.