Games better on tube T.V.'s?

Recommended Videos

Grond Strong

New member
Mar 16, 2011
134
0
0
Ah, the technology that is at our fingertips now is beautiful. Huge T.V.'s that are only an inch thin, tablets and phones which will get you surfing on the web faster than a Hawaiian regular, and video games which disturbingly shatter the line of reality. But is it all working together? I believe that in at least one area of my knowledge, the answer is no.

This may be old news and observed before but it seems to me that my (Xbox 360) games function better on an archaic, cathode-ray tube T.V. than a flat-screen, state-of-the-art LCD T.V. How do I make such a preposterous suggestion? Well, I have both types, a 40", brand spanking new, 1080p, LCD, 120Hz T.V. in one room, and an old massive dinosaur 20" tuby in another room. Well, after playing on my tube T.V., the games on the bigger, and much more expensive 40" seem wooden and less responsive. (I have the opportunity to test both almost simultaneously because we have two 360's on both T.V.'s) The difference is small but when accuracy and precision is necessary, the tube T.V. wins every time hands down. Also, the controls seem laggy, and less interactive, like you're playing with a brick instead of a controller. The actions can be jerky and one finds themselves course-correcting more often than the fluid game-play on my tuby. Perhaps it's just the way they are and I will have to eventually let go of my nostalgia and tweak my playing for the future of flat-screens.

I may be criticized for a limited testing field of only my house. But I have tested my theory at friend's houses who also have LCD's and Tube's. I am correct every time. And don't even get me started on split screen, the lag is horrible and even though it is tangible on a tube as well, it is much less apparent. I also have all the equipment needed for such things that might also botch such an experiment like HD cables/internet connection/ etc. In a space vacuum of equal attributes, the Tube T.V. will always be the T.V. of choice for gaming in my opinion.

What are your thoughts? Agree? Disagree? I'd like to know. And so would the other millions of Wookies that I write on behalf of.
 

Signa

Noisy Lurker
Legacy
Jul 16, 2008
4,749
6
43
Country
USA
One of two explanations could be a result of what you are seeing. First, your tube TVs are running at 480i, so there is far less work for the console to do to make its visuals. That can translate into a feeling of more responsiveness. The other explanation is that a lot of newer TVs have some sort of post-processing built in (like the 120hz up-scaling) which actually causes lag. While watching a TV show, that lag will be invisible, because all they have to do is shift the audio a few milliseconds with the video delay, and there is no way you can tell that the feed you are seeing isn't 100% live. This is a problem with games though, because the screen changes and reacts to the commands you put into the controller. When the controller tells the console to change the screen, and then the screen takes a moment to change, you perceive this lag.

I think you are right about tubes being better than LCDs though. Not enough that I'd want to go back, but a tube will have a far clearer picture because it doesn't have physical pixels built into the screen that need to be lit up. On a tube, those pixels are drawn in while the screen is running. You ultimately have a better picture as a result.
 

Neverhoodian

New member
Apr 2, 2008
3,832
0
0
To be honest, I haven't had many opportunities to try games on newer TV sets. I've been using a cathode-ray TV exclusively for my gaming needs, and it hasn't let me down yet.

I do know that old "light gun" peripherals like the NES Zapper don't work on modern LCD or Plasma TV's. You need the old cathode-ray model for the gun to register hits properly.
 

Jack and Calumon

Digimon are cool.
Dec 29, 2008
4,190
0
41
You may hear this if you work in TV companies that CRT sets have better quality. This WAS true. The quality was better, allegedly, but when it was tested on The Gadget Show, they said that the LED TV they had was better than the CRT, but the amount that they said that CRT TVs (They had a HD model CRT with them) had better quality makes me thing it might hold water.

On the other hand, A painting looks better when further away.

Calumon: Like some the pictures Jack drew. I had to be in another room before they looked good!
 

number2301

New member
Apr 27, 2008
836
0
0
I can't give a conclusive answer, but it sounds a lot like the arguments between digital and analogue music, with terms like warmth being used a lot. In terms of music the analogue side of the argument is nonsense as it clearly gives an inferior sounds quality (technical sound quality), whereas with TVs I can see you having a point.

I don't know how quick CRTs are but LCDs are still pretty laggy so maybe there's something in what you're saying. However, it's a pretty moot point, as LCDs have well and truly taken over due to fashion and them being massively more convenient. I wouldn't fancy having a 32" CRT in in living room, or moving the bloody thing!
 

Grond Strong

New member
Mar 16, 2011
134
0
0
@Signa: The other explanation is that a lot of newer TVs have some sort of post-processing built in (like the 120hz up-scaling) which actually causes lag. While watching a TV show, that lag will be invisible, because all they have to do is shift the audio a few milliseconds with the video delay, and there is no way you can tell that the feed you are seeing isn't 100% live.

Hm, you know I've heard about this before now that you mention it. (Very good thinking by the way) What a shame that the raw information can't be processed. It would make for a nice, smooth action. It's a wonder why Sony/Vizio/LG/Samsung/ any other type of T.V. making company doesn't design a flat-screen specifically for gamers. There'd be a huge market there.
 

Grond Strong

New member
Mar 16, 2011
134
0
0
number2301 said:
I can't give a conclusive answer, but it sounds a lot like the arguments between digital and analogue music, with terms like warmth being used a lot. In terms of music the analogue side of the argument is nonsense as it clearly gives an inferior sounds quality (technical sound quality), whereas with TVs I can see you having a point.

I don't know how quick CRTs are but LCDs are still pretty laggy so maybe there's something in what you're saying. However, it's a pretty moot point, as LCDs have well and truly taken over due to fashion and them being massively more convenient. I wouldn't fancy having a 32" CRT in in living room, or moving the bloody thing!
Haha, very true! Moving a CRT is like movie a yacht, without water. But if it means better gaming... some people go to lengths like this. Heck, we used to have a 32" inch sitting in our entertainment unit and had to put a block of 2x4 to support the rest that was supposed to hold the behemoth so it didn't crush our precious xbox. Lol. But we were awesome at those games because of it, let me tell ya. The new LCD we have causes frustration from me to no end. My brothers don't seem to care, but I don't play on it anymore... Blasted tech advances..
 

number2301

New member
Apr 27, 2008
836
0
0
I used to be an IT Tech in the days of CRT monitors, and worked with CAD techs who always needed the biggest and best stuff. So fuck CRTs ;)

Aside from response time and blurring I've not had any problems with LCDs as long as I'm running them in native resolution. And the high end stuff now seems to have decent (2ms) response times so it shouldn't be much or an issue.
 

Hoplon

Jabbering Fool
Mar 31, 2010
1,839
0
0
The test was terrible.

your not testing like with like. if both where of similar size and refresh rates, then i could see it being a resonable test.

There are issues with the responce times of lcd tft screens, but the one you used is front loaded with issues.

part of the problem is the short cuts they take to make the screens afordable. In theroy a TFT doesn't have a refresh rate, only a responce time (how long it takes for each cell to go from black to full brightness to black) but in reality they probably do it in blocks meaning they do end up with one.

upscaling shouldn't have been an issue since the refresh rate has nothing to do with the resolution which is native to the screen.

most important thing to realist is the constant flicker of the screen on CRTs will damage your eyes. unless it happens to be a 100hz + refresh rate.
 

Grond Strong

New member
Mar 16, 2011
134
0
0
Hm, you're probably right about my "test" not being of the highest accuracy. I have simply taken the time to observe in multiple environments what may have been a trend and found similarities. I don't have a white lab coat on and a controller wrapped in sterile plastic wrap. I just have this issue with amazing tv's providing me with not-so-amazing gaming. But I have tried the same game on my 40" and my friend's CRT 50" (The thing is a monster) and found much smoother play, if not as vivid, on his TV. I took what you said into consideration though. With a more even playing field the difference may not be as large.

The flicker on CRT's hurts you? Probably explains a few things. Like why I have this third arm growing out of my chest.
 
Oct 2, 2010
282
0
0
As many have said, some modern TV's have sluggish responses that can't be eliminated even on game settings.

Furthermore, due to their means of displaying pixels, modern TV's usually handle interlaced video like crap; sometimes there's combing, sometimes it just looks all wonky. If you're dealing with a device that outputs over composite, I'd easily choose CRT.

//=====

With CRT's, you can count on a image that looks alright if the signal format is crappy, and you can also count on phenomenal response times.

But if you have a modern television that doesn't have sluggish response, and you're outputting progressive scan video to it, then that usually ends quite well too (and modern games often actually make use of a full 720 vertical lines worth of stuff; it's getting harder and harder to read text on 480-line formats).
 

thiosk

New member
Sep 18, 2008
5,410
0
0
Sometimes you have to calibrate these things to account for input\output delay.
 

Grond Strong

New member
Mar 16, 2011
134
0
0
Tupolev said:
As many have said, some modern TV's have sluggish responses that can't be eliminated even on game settings.

Furthermore, due to their means of displaying pixels, modern TV's usually handle interlaced video like crap; sometimes there's combing, sometimes it just looks all wonky. If you're dealing with a device that outputs over composite, I'd easily choose CRT.

//=====

With CRT's, you can count on a image that looks alright if the signal format is crappy, and you can also count on phenomenal response times.

But if you have a modern television that doesn't have sluggish response, and you're outputting progressive scan video to it, then that usually ends quite well too (and modern games often actually make use of a full 720 vertical lines worth of stuff; it's getting harder and harder to read text on 480-line formats).
It is immensely aggravating to me that I cannot read the text on some of the games that I buy. I do believe that the gaming industry assumes everyone to have theater-sized screens. It would be an accurate assumption based on the amount of money people dump into their game systems though. Sheesh, at least I've spent more than I should. :p
 

Grond Strong

New member
Mar 16, 2011
134
0
0
thiosk said:
Sometimes you have to calibrate these things to account for input\output delay.
True, we tried I believe... and although it made somewhat of a difference, it's still not the same. Thanks for the tip though!
 

zerooneeleven

New member
Apr 1, 2011
15
0
0
My friend called this HD lag. Are you using component or HDMI cables? Supposedly it shouldn't happen with HDMI.
 

Grond Strong

New member
Mar 16, 2011
134
0
0
zerooneeleven said:
My friend called this HD lag. Are you using component or HDMI cables? Supposedly it shouldn't happen with HDMI.
We are using HD component cords. I wasn't aware that a 360 was compatible with an HDMI cord. If they have them, it might help. You're right.
 

Grond Strong

New member
Mar 16, 2011
134
0
0
arragonder said:
CRTs have the best colors, the darkest blacks the best contrast and generally best picture. you can get HD CRT tvs, and the only reason we use the inferior LCDs is because CRTs are FUCKING HUGE. and weigh half a ton.
I agree with in every regard. And I see how a CRT might become unsightly or inconvenient due to its sheer size. But I'm not one to complain about the way my tv looks. It's for watching, not to decor the house... What I don't understand though is people who are concerned about its weight. It's not like you have to hold the darn thing up when you're watching it. People must re-organize their entertainment rooms a whole lot because weight seems to me like somethiing you'd have to deal with twice. Once to get it into the house, once to get it out.

I'm interested in getting one of these HD CRT's you speak of. They probably don't make 'em anymore though. And they are probably dirt cheap, at least, compared to a LCD.