Guns need to go...or do they?

[spartan231490]

studies have shown there is no real connection between gun control and violent crime rate. A couple of years ago, finland had one of the lowest crime rates in Europe adn it has some of the least gun control. I did a paper on this topic 2 years ago, don't remember much except that gun control isn't really shown to decrease crime rates. as a side note, as dathwampeer said, guns are meerly a tool, you can kill a man with a feather if you try hard enough, and with your bare hands surprisingly easily. as to thier being more gun deaths in the us than the uk, the us also has a higher population, and a higher suicide rate.

 

[Talshere]

I support the no guns policy of the UK. It prohibits the possession of ALL handguns, as the only reason for a hand gun is to point it at people. It prohibits the possession of automatic weapons, which again are only really designed to be pointed at people. The possession of rifles and shotguns is regulated for the use of game hunting and pest control.

It takes more balls to mug someone with a knife or your fists than it does with a gun.

The only thing I will say, each police force should have easier access to guns in an emergency. Otherwise you get situations like that idiot a few months back who drove around for an hour shooting at people with the police having no real means to stop him. But with only a shotgun and single shot rifle you can only do limited damage.

I dont believe this policy is valid for the US do to the prevalence of gun's and large swaths of uninhabited coast. It would be almost impossible to remove guna from the US at this point. As such its just safer to keep things as they are. Maybe tighter regulation. But thats all.

 

[Jack_Uzi]

I don't think any form of harm is good (unless self defence) but guns are a bit more of a 'humane' way to turn out the lights for someone than a stick with a spike trough it, for example. Here in Holland, luckally, guns are forbidden but sometimes gunfights do occure. But then again, most of the people gunned down here are probably scum themself.
If I was in a place where guns were mandatory to carry, I would try to get the hell out of there.

 

[octafish]

I have no problem with guns, my problem is with people who use them irresponsibly(is that a word?). People seem to forget that guns are a weapon, and i'm sick of hearing stories where a child has found daddies loaded gun and shot themselves in the head. There is no excuse for that. People need to be educated at least a little about guns if they want one, at least so they know how to maintain the things properly.

I'm lucky that where i live (Australia) anyone who wants a gun has to take a test to prove they are not completely brain-dead on the subject (One of the true of false questions was as follows. 'Is loading and firing a rifle and effective way of clearing a barrel that is blocked with mud?' Because people will try this sadly.)

Yes, I think Australia's laws are pretty sound, sporting shooters can still have guns but they have to be sensible about their use and storage. Also no semi-automatic rifles or shotguns, you just have to be a better hunter. One shot, one kill. It is the only thing Howard did that was decent, and even then he fucked it royally. In Australia you can still use a target pistol at a range, and there are special dispenations for collectors but really what do you need a handgun for anyway? Protection? From whom?

It's a matter of escalation, I know a guy who worked two jobs, as a rent-a-cop on armoured cars and as an orderly in a psychiatric hospital. He much prefered the hospital where he was spat on, bitten and had shit thrown at him over the armoured car job. Why? because he had to carry a pistol on the armoured car and if anyone wanted what was in the truck they would have guns and he was much more likely to be killed.

In Australia our convenience stores are robbed at knife point, and while it is no fun, you are much more likely to be accidentaly shot by a junkie than accidentaly stabbed or cut.

 

[Jedoro]

I hate the fact I can't get a gun here in the UK.

Guns are not alive. Do not add human qualities to them. i.e. being evil or killing people. They're a tool. A bloody drill can be used to kill someone. Should we make them illegal?

Shit, I could kill someone with a few feet of rope in a few seconds, if I got the jump on them, but rope's not going to be illegal anytime soon. People who want to kill, will, so those of us who don't feel like being victims should be allowed to defend ourselves, not have to wait for the police to come save us... or put a tag on our toe.

 

[Gilhelmi]

I hate the fact I can't get a gun here in the UK.

Guns are not alive. Do not add human qualities to them. i.e. being evil or killing people. They're a tool. A bloody drill can be used to kill someone. Should we make them illegal?

I like the aesthetics of guns. Smith & Wesson magnums are a piece of art as far as I'm concerned. I respect the engineering and design behind them and love the power.

Problem is I can't own one because my country is a *****.

It's done nothing for our crime levels.

Dosen't the UK have like 200 gun deaths a year, and the US has like 11,000? Seems like a big difference to me.

Stats
Population of Great Britain
61,414,062 - 2008
Source: World Bank, World Development Indicators
Disclaimer
www.google.com/publicdata

Population of USA
307,006,550 - Jul 2009
Source: U.S. Census Bureau, Population Division
Disclaimer
www.google.com/publicdata

307,006,550 divided by 11,000 = 27,910 to one odds of being in a gun related death in the US
61,414,062 divided by 200 = 307,070 to one odds of being in a gun related death in Britain

300,000 divided by 28,000 (rounded, sue me) is about 10.7 times greater to be in a gun related death then in the US than the UK. BUT if we factor in crime related death (not just gun crime) we get(sorry I need to get to bed so I will just link to an article from a news sight, it is gallup so I trust them. I know not crime related deaths but I will do more investigating tomorrow)
http://www.gallup.com/poll/21346/crime-rate-lower-united-states-canada-than-britain.aspx

Admittedly, the difference is not that much higher in Britain, but anti-gun laws would not reduce violent crime in either country. Read the stats it is a bit interesting that violent crime is about the same in all three countries (25%-Britain, 21%-Canada, 21%- America).

I do like to do the math but I need to bed down.

I am still in favor of having my Smith&Wesson 1911PD 8+1 on my hip (I live in Kansas and have my Conceal Carry Handgun Permit). So yes, I like being able to own a weapon, it makes me safer.

 

[Gilhelmi]

I support the no guns policy of the UK. It prohibits the possession of ALL handguns, as the only reason for a hand gun is to point it at people. It prohibits the possession of automatic weapons, which again are only really designed to be pointed at people. The possession of rifles and shotguns is regulated for the use of game hunting and pest control.

It takes more balls to mug someone with a knife or your fists than it does with a gun.

The only thing I will say, each police force should have easier access to guns in an emergency. Otherwise you get situations like that idiot a few months back who drove around for an hour shooting at people with the police having no real means to stop him. But with only a shotgun and single shot rifle you can only do limited damage.

I dont believe this policy is valid for the US do to the prevalence of gun's and large swaths of uninhabited coast. It would be almost impossible to remove guna from the US at this point. As such its just safer to keep things as they are. Maybe tighter regulation. But thats all.

That does make good sense. Thank you

 

[Gilhelmi]

I love my guns, and I love the Second Amendment. As Charlton Heston once said, "I'll give up my gun when they pry it from my cold dead hands"

When you take away guns, only criminals will have them. I'm a total gun nut, and my life would be empty without guns.

Spoiler: 2nd Amendment Baby!

I like NRA (National Rifle Association) supporters. We should start a group here on the Escapist for us Gun Nuts.

 

[GenericAmerican]

I love guns. And the criminals will always be able to find them, so if citizens aren't allowed to own them...well only the criminals have them now.

Guns/fireamrs, are the greatest things on God's green Earth; if you don't think so, you probably have never fired one before...either that or you are a hippy-liberal-communist-#*@&@*%#^-who deserves to burn in hell.

A thought. If 100 percent of people in a town owned guns, if I was a criminal I would never ever ever want to try anything there. Since every time I committed a crime, there is and incredibly large chance you would get shot or shot at.

If there was a town where not a single person owned a gun, and I was a criminal, its like Christmas; Im a criminal, I can find a way to get a weapon. Now I am in a place where I have the only weapon(besides the police force). It's basically rob whoever you want, its 'unarmed them' against 'armed you'.

 

[Macgyvercas]

I love my guns, and I love the Second Amendment. As Charlton Heston once said, "I'll give up my gun when they pry it from my cold dead hands"

When you take away guns, only criminals will have them. I'm a total gun nut, and my life would be empty without guns.

Spoiler: 2nd Amendment Baby!

I like NRA (National Rifle Association) supporters. We should start a group here on the Escapist for us Gun Nuts.

Great idea! I'll get right on that!

How about "The Escapist Gun Owner's Club"?

EDIT: Made it. Here. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/invite_member.php?g=The-Escapist-Gun-Owners-Club]

 

[Altorin]

Are you for or against gun?

Now as you may or may not know the uk has been de-guned you can own a gun but only after jumping a huge hurdle, and even then you can only get a few certain types of guns.

Now are you for or against this sort of thing, I have been thinking. You reduce the amount of guns so there is less gun crime that makes sence less guns less crime.
In the perfect world that is the case, but If those who do gun crime get guns though the black market or get them in other ways by-passing the laws then what happens when regular people with good intentions can no longer have guns...Who has the guns.

If you were going to rob a bookies at gun point would you be more questionable about doing so if the bookie had a gun itself to defend the store?

Does that sound about right to you or are guns still a bad thing.

if you could reasonably get rid of every gun on earth at the exact same time, then yeah, they can go.

but in the real world, no, we need guns to protect us from morons and evil people who won't think twice about using a gun against us.

 

[Cheery Lunatic]

Guns are a deterrent for crime. Would you go rob a house where you know they own a gun? Of course not. You'll go two houses down where you know they don't.

Gun laws really, in the end, only hurt honest citizens.

Think about it. Criminals break the law. If they want a gun, you better believe they'll find a way to get one.

The great thing about conceal carry laws is that a criminal now has no idea who may have a gun on their person.

This to a T.

Seriously. Criminals will just continue to smuggle guns if you ban 'em.
We'd be having another Prohibition on our hands except way more deadly.

 

[cocoadog]

People don't kill people with giant boulders! They will if you take away their assault rifles.

 

[emeraldrafael]

I think they should go, but then again, i've always been one to be up close and personal. Swords, knives, spears, all my weapons of choice. A gun just feels like cheating. Besides, if someone is going to rob me, and i'm forced to fight, then when they get a limb chopped off, i'm pretty sure they're not going to try that again, against anyone. Nothing serves as a reminder better then a stub limb.

That, and when you kill something, its always nice that you're the last thing its sees before it dies. So it can go into that great beyond knowing who sent it there.

and no, i havent murdered anyone. or killed anything (unless you want to count bugs). however, i'm just old school like that.

 

[lostzombies.com]

Well in the UK there is basically no gun crime, there is nowhere I wouldn't feel safe walking at night and the only gang culture you run across is a badly dressed teens so yes it works.

 

[deadxero]

Beliefe that gun laws prevent crime is baseless. In order for this to be true, criminals would have to obey the gun laws... see the problem there?

 

[WanderingFool]

In a perfect world, we wouldnt need guns... so we need guns, cause this isnt a perfect fucking world. And as it has been said by many other people, many other times, gun laws are useless when the criminal doesnt need a permit to buy a street piece.

 

[Wadders]

I hate the fact I can't get a gun here in the UK.

Guns are not alive. Do not add human qualities to them. i.e. being evil or killing people. They're a tool. A bloody drill can be used to kill someone. Should we make them illegal?

I like the aesthetics of guns. Smith & Wesson magnums are a piece of art as far as I'm concerned. I respect the engineering and design behind them and love the power.

Problem is I can't own one because my country is a *****.

It's done nothing for our crime levels.

I will not rest untill I have informed every member of this damn forum who is a Brit and wants a gun, that they can buy guns legally in the UK!

Guns have not been banned here!

Anyways, I will now leave this thread. Gun control debates/ arguments are a waste of time. Suffice to say that I like using guns, I own guns, but I think tight gun control is a good idea. Perhaps not as tight as we have in the UK, but it's there for a reason.

It would be nigh impossible for me to get a licence for a gun.

Not everyone is lucky enough to live on a farm or near a gun range.

As long as you have a gun safe or security cord to secure the gun, and are of sound mental health, there is no real reason why the Police should deny an application for a shotgun certificate as far as I'm aware.

Admittedly Firearms certificate (for rifles) are harder to obtain, and thats where the elitist side of UK gun law comes into play. It is (as you said) a lot easier for richer people or landowners to get a FAC that it is for commoners such as you or I. Shotguns shouldnt be a problem though

You forgot to factor in intent.

I would have to convince my local police station that I have a genuine reason to own a gun. i.e. pest control or clay pigeon shooting. I live no where near a range and I live on a street with no safe place to shoot. I have an air rifle and that is probably pushing it.

So even if I could convince my local police station to give me a licence. What would I do with it?

If there was a gun range within reasonable driving distance from me I would have applied for a licence in a heartbeat.

Ahh yeah fair point. I was asked what I'd be using mine for, but it's only really with rifles you have to provide an actual reason for ownership. With shotguns the question is more of a formality but I can see how in your case it would be difficult. Where I live the police grant shotgun certificates without any real problems as it's very rural.