Ha ha! Racist.

[Windcaler]

I don't know if you've seen it yet, but the new trailer for Far Cry 3 is now out and it is...well, a little problematic. See here (NSFW):

I'm one of the few people who actually liked Far Cry 2, and this one seems to be shaping up quite nicely. One of the things I liked about FC2 was the Heart of Darkness references, but the content of that novel seems to have been utterly forgotten in the making of FC3. This trailer is an amalgamation every exploitation, pulp fiction and colonialist cliche possible.

Let me get this straight: a sexy "exotic" priestess asks you (a white westerner who only turned up the other day) to use her magic and lead her tribe of chanting natives (the kind with tattoos, bones and loincloths, naturally) against some evil, modernised corperate types? Oh yes indeed. It's only a trailer, so perhaps this won't turn out to be Dances with the Last Avatar 2.

But then again... discuss.

I dont really see whats so racist about this. I would call it stereotypical but not racist. However to be fair there are still tribes all over the world that currently practice cannibalism, shamanism, and tattooing like whats shown in the trailer.

Some cultures have a firm belief in things being decided by the gods. When I was in Africa many years ago I caught a tiger fish and people swore it was a blessing from the gods. Seeing as it fed an entire village and how the fish is seen as more of a spirit then an animal I can see why catching one would be seen as a miracle to them. Its also a fact that European explorers were first seen as gods among most African tribes when people first started exploring Africa.

All that said, I dont see how this is racist or how this is uncharacteristic given past history

 

[Valanthe]

THe only thing wrong with this trailer is it seems to be falling on the Mighty Whitey [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MightyWhitey]* trope, but it certainly isn't racist, or even that offensive.

* Yeah, I TVtroped you, that's what you get for having such a misleading and inflammatory title.

You don't find that trope to be racist?

When the trope is used poorly or overdone, yes. In the case presented, the main character is white, yes, but nowhere in that trailer is it ever implied that he was chosen or he will succeed -because- he's white. He was simply chosen by the 'chief' of tribe to be their avatar, even though he is an outsider, as a convenient plot mechanic.

And actually in many cases elsewhere, the "Mighty Whitey" trope is used to subvert the idea of racism by painting the 'native' culture as a utopia, where the foreigner comes not only to learn their ways, but actually despise his old ways. Granted this is most often done as a preventative measure so people won't start screaming 'racism' at something before they actually know the intent of the author.

 

[chadachada123]

I think a lot of people are missing the point I was making. I don't have a problem with the game featuring tribes in the first place (I would have said so, if that were the case). I take issue with the way the game depicts the tribe, and the way the game seems to be using them in the story.

There are good and bad ways to handle tribal cultures, and I think that depicting them as manic, chanting cannibals who treat a random white guys as their saviour counts as a bad.

But at least several tribes have done pretty much exactly that towards random white guys:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult

(Just a random info dump, relevant to this discussion)

I just don't see it as racism, personally. It doesn't at all seem to be suggesting that these people are inherently stupid/illogical because of their race, considering the BROTHER of the tribal girl appears to be the greedy pro-modernization-ish bad guy. There's nothing *racial* about it at all, from what I see.

I feel others have said this much better, though.

 

[Something Amyss]

You know, while this is dumb, racist may be going a bit far.

 

[Something Amyss]

Or, in this case, don't blame on racism what can be blamed on lazyness.

The flaw in that is that most racism, malicious or otherwise, is based upon laziness.

 

[Simon Pettersson]

I did not see anything I would call racism, though it is riddled with cliches...
Still seems that it could be a good game.

 

[Aaron Sylvester]

Urgh, I didn't find that priestess "sexy" in any manner : /

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Shamefully, racist and sexist seem to be thrown around a lot lately. The Hitman Absolution trailer was not sexist, and this trailer is not racist. They are not specifically portraying a culture, it is nonspecific tribal. It is rather lazy story-telling, maybe a bit ignorant of that general area if it indeed is supposed to be a general area of the world, but still nonspecific.

What this person said. It's gotten to the point that if you try telling a story and inc. any characters that are not white and/or male you're either racist or sexist or both, and if you don't inc. any characters that aren't white and/or male you're either racist or sexist or both. So in other words if you try telling a story these days, you're fucked.

Racism is a buzzword people use when they can't think of a compelling argument as to whether or not a game is good.

Also that. The word "racism" has become so ubiquitous that it doesn't even mean anything anymore.

Can't we just stop taking everything so goddamn damn fucking serious every damn time.

Yes please! Can we? Can we? Huh? Can we? Pleeeeeeeeeeeeease!!

 

[maninahat]

Oh God, I didn't reply in the other thread, but seriously, get off your PC high-horse. There's no racism there, at all. Did you notice the evil military bastards are all white? NO? That's probably because you're just so desperate to be offended at the depiction of tribals as, well, tribal and primitive.

Which they are by definition.

Tribes aren't primitive by definition. A tribe is simply a small, close knit group of people, bound by family ties or distinct cultural practises. The vast majority of tribes aren't primitive at all, having been subsumed by developed civilizations. You're much more likely to see them running casinos or doing Hakas at a rugby match. There are still primitive tribes, but they only exist in some of the most remote parts of the world, with distant civilizations having a very limited influence on them. This game has an old fashioned tribe only a stones throw away from a developed civilization and a tourist spot. That doesn't tend to happen in real life, as the natives would simply move into the developed society.

Okay, they're unrealistic, so what? The thing is, writers only ever put tribes or natives into a story so that they can be oppressed, or be "one with nature". Natives apparently aren't concerned with mundane things, or have their own interests or opinions. They are always primitive, always childishly naive, and always in need of a chaperone. That's when racism gets written in: natives aren't people, they are "the people".

 

[Blood Brain Barrier]

Hey how bout we get some white tribal guys instead of always black/indian backwater tribes that are less solhisticated that anyone else? I mean show some originality people .

Like a game set in the Ukraine? Sign me up!

 

[maninahat]

Tribes aren't primitive by definition. A tribe is simply a small, close knit group of people, bound by family ties or distinct cultural practises. The vast majority of tribes aren't primitive at all, having been subsumed by developed civilizations.

I'm going to stop you here, you've contradicted yourself. If they're been subsumed, they're no longer a tribe are they? They're part of whatever culture enveloped them. If to you tribal just means "black people from certain islands regardless of the society in which they live or their cultural practices" then I'm going to have to disagree with you.

You can join a developed society and still remain connected to a tribe via family relations and cultural traditions. Hence why Maori and native Indians still exist, despite having jobs and taking part in broader governments.

Okay, they're unrealistic, so what? The thing is, writers only ever put tribes or natives into a story so that they can be oppressed, or be "one with nature". Natives apparently aren't concerned with mundane things, or have their own interests or opinions. They are always primitive, always childishly naive, and always in need of a chaperone. That's when racism gets written in: natives aren't people, they are "the people".

Actually, tribals are generally written as purer and, like you said, "one with nature". These are good things. And yeah, childishly naive; you know, due to isolation. What do you expect? Seriously?

The "noble savage" stereotype is still a stereotype, and its still a condescending and dishonest depiction of tribal cultures. There is nothing implicitly honourable about living in treehouses and worshipping the forest - that's just the fanciful thinking of idealists who want to get away from our "terrible, materialistic" society. Writers like to think that they're being positive with such portrayals, but they're simply creating an illusion that tribes people are mindlessly content with their "simple, harmonious" existence. Nevermind that tribes people are people, not hippy poster children, and they tend to like the idea of electric lighting and living to see 40, as much as anyone else.

Isolated tribesmen are not naive. Usually they are xenophobic and jaded. They're certainly not keen on making strangers their leader. They're much more likely to take the piss out of you.

 

[soh45400]

Oh you do love to be offended don't you, well we can hardly stop you in your daily pleasures.

Oh, did I say I was offended? I don't need to be offended to see something is wrong.

What exactly was supposed to be racist here? The island tribe stereotype?

Besides the stereotyping (which is a by the numbers caricature of tribals), there is also the whole colonial aspect of a westerner coming along and appropriating someone else's culture, becoming their leader/savior because they are apparently too primitive/weak to fend for themselves. That's when a stereotype moves from being silly, to being a form of cultural condescension, carrying an accidental, pro-colonialist message.

Hence why I bring up the Heart of Darkness references from the previous game. Far Cry 2 was very clear on the evils of foreigners coming along, trying to dominate a local culture for their own gain. That message seems to have been forgotten though - as far as the trailer shows, you become some kind of champion of the locals in Far Cry 3, a "warrior to defeat them all". That's really the worst part of all of this.

I completely agree with what you are saying but I think the game developers agree with this too. If their insistence on Far Cry 3 being different and story-focused is true then they will do the Spec Ops thing and let you think you are the good guy and the 'chosen one' and then turn around and say it was all drugs and your own mind and the influence of movies/games(remember the trailer where they show the main character posing with an AK47 as if it was a toy and then someone yanks it out of his hands).
I have seen some of the other stuff about this game and I have to say this game is not what you think it is.

 

[Smithburg]

I think a lot of people are missing the point I was making. I don't have a problem with the game featuring tribes in the first place (I would have said so, if that were the case). I take issue with the way the game depicts the tribe, and the way the game seems to be using them in the story.

There are good and bad ways to handle tribal cultures, and I think that depicting them as manic, chanting cannibals who treat a random white guys as their saviour counts as a bad.

Except there are plenty of white guys in the tribe. And there are other people that help other than the lone white guy. You took a short video and went nuts over it, wait for the game to come out to make a judgement. There are tons of parts in the game which have nothing to do with the tribe. Theres an old crazy white guy who does nothing but drugs, you could say thats racist almost, but I see you giving no issue to that.

 

[maninahat]

I think a lot of people are missing the point I was making. I don't have a problem with the game featuring tribes in the first place (I would have said so, if that were the case). I take issue with the way the game depicts the tribe, and the way the game seems to be using them in the story.

There are good and bad ways to handle tribal cultures, and I think that depicting them as manic, chanting cannibals who treat a random white guys as their saviour counts as a bad.

Except there are plenty of white guys in the tribe. And there are other people that help other than the lone white guy. You took a short video and went nuts over it, wait for the game to come out to make a judgement. There are tons of parts in the game which have nothing to do with the tribe. Theres an old crazy white guy who does nothing but drugs, you could say thats racist almost, but I see you giving no issue to that.

Why would I find a white man taking drugs to be racist? Perhaps I didn't find an issue there because there isn't one. I found one with the way the tribe is depicted, and I made my reasons for that quite clear. I'm not actually trying to look for racism, contrary to what some people might think.

 

[Denamic]

My god, they're not the exact right shade of black!
That's the reacistest thing I've ever seen.

 

[StBishop]

Oh you do love to be offended don't you, well we can hardly stop you in your daily pleasures.

Oh, did I say I was offended? I don't need to be offended to see something is wrong.

What exactly was supposed to be racist here? The island tribe stereotype?

Besides the stereotyping (which is a by the numbers caricature of tribals), there is also the whole colonial aspect of a westerner coming along and appropriating someone else's culture, becoming their leader/savior because they are apparently too primitive/weak to fend for themselves. That's when a stereotype moves from being silly, to being a form of cultural condescension, carrying an accidental, pro-colonialist message.

Hence why I bring up the Heart of Darkness references from the previous game. Far Cry 2 was very clear on the evils of foreigners coming along, trying to dominate a local culture for their own gain. That message seems to have been forgotten though - as far as the trailer shows, you become some kind of champion of the locals in Far Cry 3, a "warrior to defeat them all". That's really the worst part of all of this.

You did come across pretty offended. Just sayin'.

Do we know the PC is white? It could be that he's not. Would that change anything?

I didn't see any racism there personally, but that doesn't mean it's not there.

Also, were the invaders white? I don't know if that matters but I thought they were white and your post implied that you thought the PC was coming to dominate the locals. (See bolded part above).

 

[Canadamus Prime]

That priestess is not sexy, and the trailer is not racist. So failure all around 0/10

When in doubt assume stupid.