Has Morrowind aged well?
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OK, apparently I'm a retro gaming god because I'm playing the console. game of the year edition and still having fun with it. My advice is to go for a warrior esque character because mage is broken to hell stealth is ok but extremely hard pull off. but It's still fun, I did not grow up with it. I also went from oblivion to morrowind and it was still pretty good although it sounds like it probably would be better to get the pc version and mod the hell out of it. But still it's a good game nonetheless.
Noooooooooooooooo.
Morrowind is one of my favorite WRPGs, but playing it now is really, really difficult. It's aged about as well as Final Fantasy VII. That is to say, it's aged not like wine, but like bottled milk.
If you ever end up with a better computer, I recommend either Morroblivion (a mod that ports Morrowind in its entirety into Oblivion's engine), or the currently in-development Skywind (the same thing, but in Skyrim's engine).
Morrowind is one of my favorite WRPGs, but playing it now is really, really difficult. It's aged about as well as Final Fantasy VII. That is to say, it's aged not like wine, but like bottled milk.
If you ever end up with a better computer, I recommend either Morroblivion (a mod that ports Morrowind in its entirety into Oblivion's engine), or the currently in-development Skywind (the same thing, but in Skyrim's engine).
A crappy laptop might still be able to run it. A friend of mine has a PC from 2002 or 2003 that he uses for business stuff and he can still run it fine so you might be able to run it fine.
Morrowind as a stock game IMO isnt that great. Mods make it infinitely better because theres a mod for just about everything from HD graphics to full expansions. That said IMO you should get it for PC or not get it at all because the Xbox version (thats original xbox not xbox 360) is a lot worse then its PC counterpart
Morrowind as a stock game IMO isnt that great. Mods make it infinitely better because theres a mod for just about everything from HD graphics to full expansions. That said IMO you should get it for PC or not get it at all because the Xbox version (thats original xbox not xbox 360) is a lot worse then its PC counterpart
Well... I'm a bit biased. I have played Oblivion a total of four hours. It just didn't and hasn't grabbed me. Boring environments, boring plot, boring mechanics. I played Skyrim religiously for some 150 hours, and loved it to death for about six months. That was five months ago, and I've never been back, nor felt the need. But Morrowind... I played it first, bought it two years ago, finished the main plot and nearly every guild quest eight or nine times... and I just played it again today, and will again tomorrow. I love it that much. I count it as my personal favorite game of all time.
I will fully admit that some aspects have aged poorly; a few wonky or outright broken mechanics are present, some rampant balance issues, and engine glitches are usually hallmarks of the older RPG genre, and they're all present and accounted for here. But Morrowind is the rare game that is more than the sum of its parts.
Morrowind has a richness and a depth to it that I just haven't been able to find anywhere else. Many people malign the game for its lack of fully voiced dialogue and its large amount of reading, but I actually hold this to be one of its greatest strengths. This allows for it to show you an incredibly deep and interesting story to its lore, and its main quest could easily hold up as a series of novels in its own right. All of which set in a unique and interesting culture that, unlike Skyrim and Cyrodiil, is not an easy equivalent to a real-world culture in history. And it's all set on a huge volcanic island where Dunmer live in ancient crabshells and build giant mushroom cities. It has an utterly unique atmosphere that you're just not going to get anywhere else. And unlike Oblivion, the world is actually static and its places interesting, making it worth exploring. Especially without any glowing arrows and compasses nagging you to go a certain way; the only way to know what's over the next hill it to go look for yourself. I simply cannot overstate this enough; Morrowind is unlike any place you've ever explored before.
Another aspect usually talked about with disdain is the combat. While I can see the reasoning, I also very much enjoy it for reasons that most people forget; it's an RPG. This is a sad side-effect of the game moving to a first-person perspective and not making use of a party. Nobody maligns Baldur's Gate or even Dragon Age for not being able to feel the shock of impact traveling up your arm as you execute an acrobatic flip and bury your blade into an enemy skull. If that's your thing, I can recommend a couple good hack-and-slash games. But this is an RPG, and that means numbers, dice-rolls, armor-class, skillpoints, hit chance, damage tables, weapon degradation, and strategy. All things that many gamers forget. Yes, balance issues exist, and yes, it is not as involved as some. But the combat in Morrowind was a lot more successful at making me feel like a warrior than Skyrim ever did.
And finally, graphics. Many people malign Morrowind's graphics, but this one I don't understand. Certainly they are not photo-realistic by the ridiculous standards of today, but Morrowind is the best kind of old games; the graphics may be dated, but they look beautiful in their own right. For me, Skyrim looks like everything from the trees to the character's hair follicles are hewn out of stone; cold, hard, and static. For me, everything in Morrowind is crafted out of folded paper; warm, soft, skillfully made, and beautiful. And as I said before, the atmosphere is unlike any other fantasy world I can think of. It's a place with its own history, and its own identity. Playing the game feels like coming home.
A word on mods. To be honest, I probably wouldn't say half these things without the game's modding community, but there it is. This game has one of the oldest, most well-established, most dedicated modding communities for any game in history. The game is very easy to mod, and there are thousands of mods that either fix or enhance the game. And more are being made to this very day, as a testament to how much the game is loved even now. There are several even add entire continents, something you'll see maybe once or twice for Oblivion and Skyrim. The Morrowind modding community builds on what is already an excellent foundation and builds things that must be seen to be believed.
Seriously, I could go on for hours on the superlative awesomeness of this game. I recognize that the appeal is not for everyone, however. But I heartily recommend you give it a chance.
I will fully admit that some aspects have aged poorly; a few wonky or outright broken mechanics are present, some rampant balance issues, and engine glitches are usually hallmarks of the older RPG genre, and they're all present and accounted for here. But Morrowind is the rare game that is more than the sum of its parts.
Morrowind has a richness and a depth to it that I just haven't been able to find anywhere else. Many people malign the game for its lack of fully voiced dialogue and its large amount of reading, but I actually hold this to be one of its greatest strengths. This allows for it to show you an incredibly deep and interesting story to its lore, and its main quest could easily hold up as a series of novels in its own right. All of which set in a unique and interesting culture that, unlike Skyrim and Cyrodiil, is not an easy equivalent to a real-world culture in history. And it's all set on a huge volcanic island where Dunmer live in ancient crabshells and build giant mushroom cities. It has an utterly unique atmosphere that you're just not going to get anywhere else. And unlike Oblivion, the world is actually static and its places interesting, making it worth exploring. Especially without any glowing arrows and compasses nagging you to go a certain way; the only way to know what's over the next hill it to go look for yourself. I simply cannot overstate this enough; Morrowind is unlike any place you've ever explored before.
Another aspect usually talked about with disdain is the combat. While I can see the reasoning, I also very much enjoy it for reasons that most people forget; it's an RPG. This is a sad side-effect of the game moving to a first-person perspective and not making use of a party. Nobody maligns Baldur's Gate or even Dragon Age for not being able to feel the shock of impact traveling up your arm as you execute an acrobatic flip and bury your blade into an enemy skull. If that's your thing, I can recommend a couple good hack-and-slash games. But this is an RPG, and that means numbers, dice-rolls, armor-class, skillpoints, hit chance, damage tables, weapon degradation, and strategy. All things that many gamers forget. Yes, balance issues exist, and yes, it is not as involved as some. But the combat in Morrowind was a lot more successful at making me feel like a warrior than Skyrim ever did.
And finally, graphics. Many people malign Morrowind's graphics, but this one I don't understand. Certainly they are not photo-realistic by the ridiculous standards of today, but Morrowind is the best kind of old games; the graphics may be dated, but they look beautiful in their own right. For me, Skyrim looks like everything from the trees to the character's hair follicles are hewn out of stone; cold, hard, and static. For me, everything in Morrowind is crafted out of folded paper; warm, soft, skillfully made, and beautiful. And as I said before, the atmosphere is unlike any other fantasy world I can think of. It's a place with its own history, and its own identity. Playing the game feels like coming home.
A word on mods. To be honest, I probably wouldn't say half these things without the game's modding community, but there it is. This game has one of the oldest, most well-established, most dedicated modding communities for any game in history. The game is very easy to mod, and there are thousands of mods that either fix or enhance the game. And more are being made to this very day, as a testament to how much the game is loved even now. There are several even add entire continents, something you'll see maybe once or twice for Oblivion and Skyrim. The Morrowind modding community builds on what is already an excellent foundation and builds things that must be seen to be believed.
Seriously, I could go on for hours on the superlative awesomeness of this game. I recognize that the appeal is not for everyone, however. But I heartily recommend you give it a chance.
Except OP is expressing an interest in purchasing the game in question. It's perfectly reasonable to mention that mods would make a certain version of the game significantly superior to another one, or might help keep the interest of someone looking on it with new eyes.Elberik said:
Ehhh... I won't say Final Fantasy VII has aged particularly well, particularly in pacing and visuals, but it's a hell of a lot easier to pick up and play than the likes of Morrowind. I don't disagree with the conclusion, but the comparison itself is a bit flimsy in my opinion.cnaltman62 said:
OT: Personally, I couldn't get into it. I hated the combat system; If I'm going to be manually swinging my weapons around, I'd like my actual aim to judge whether I hit or miss, not some arbitrary statistic. If it were turn-based, I probably wouldn't have had any issues with it. But coming into it both before and after Skyrim, without any sort of nostalgia goggles to help me along, it just wasn't all that enjoyable of an experience.
Of course, my point of view might not mean much anyway, since I didn't like Oblivion either and the only reason I really cared about Skyrim enough to play for 100 hours was because it actually had a halfway decent third-person mode.
This is pretty much it. Basing on graphics, it looks like shit. Base it on an RPG where in which combat is determined on luck rather than visual sword/arrow/spell hitting a body causing damage, it's pretty damn decent. The depth of the characters is about the same as Skyrim except npcs will basically say the exact same thing with only some npcs actually having a "character" to speak of.Signa said:
Personally, I would not suggest going for it after having played Oblivion and then Skyrim, they're much more different than Morrowind and you would find it to be much more of a chore than a game. Actually, a good thing to do is to get all the DLC for Skyrim, play on harder difficulties, grind your way up to level 80 and fight the Ebony Warrior. The 20 level gap from level 60 - 80 will give you a good idea of how slowly it will take for you to get into Morrowind and the Ebony Warrior will give you an idea on how tough enemies are.
Hm. Hard to say. I mean, most of its massive issues have nothing to do with its age. Forcing you to walk everywhere if you want to keep your stamina up, making the walking speed and even the running speed painfully slow, rolling a die to see if your attacks hit even if they actually did hit (logical on paper, but in practice it makes combat even more slap-fight-y than the other TES games), poor journal organization, really bad maps, CLIFF RACERS, no effort whatsoever put into balance, etc.
As a note, I like TES (well, at least, Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim). It's just that Bethesda has this weird tendency to completely screw SOMETHING up with each new TES release, and bizarrely never make the exact same mistakes in two of them.
As a note, I like TES (well, at least, Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim). It's just that Bethesda has this weird tendency to completely screw SOMETHING up with each new TES release, and bizarrely never make the exact same mistakes in two of them.
I disliked it, couldn't get into it. Combat was jarring with hits determined on dice rolls - being woken up in the night by an assassin is cool, but being unable to move past them or defeat them wasn't. It happened about four or five times before the game decided it wouldn't play that random event.
Perhaps I was supposed to build my character some specific way that I missed, but pteradactyl-like vultures would mess me up in the wilderness and I'd be unable to hit them and unable to run away. Got coralled into the only place I could go: a crypt with a ghost in that my weapons did nothing against, and with so little hp that I could maybe throw one spell then die.
Graphically it hasn't aged well... I'm a purist and prefer to judge a game on its own without mods, but I'm sure you can overlook the graphics if you're happy to use some of the mods out there.
So basically the combat was what drove me off. The writen dialogue and story might be amazing, but I didn't get far enough into the game to make a judgement. I'm glad to see though that other people are commenting on the combat, otherwise I would have wondered if I had just built my character poorly.
Perhaps I was supposed to build my character some specific way that I missed, but pteradactyl-like vultures would mess me up in the wilderness and I'd be unable to hit them and unable to run away. Got coralled into the only place I could go: a crypt with a ghost in that my weapons did nothing against, and with so little hp that I could maybe throw one spell then die.
Graphically it hasn't aged well... I'm a purist and prefer to judge a game on its own without mods, but I'm sure you can overlook the graphics if you're happy to use some of the mods out there.
So basically the combat was what drove me off. The writen dialogue and story might be amazing, but I didn't get far enough into the game to make a judgement. I'm glad to see though that other people are commenting on the combat, otherwise I would have wondered if I had just built my character poorly.
Even though it's one of my favourite games of all time, it hasn't aged well at all.
The RPG side of things is timeless though. The actual game design will last forever, given that you're a fan of more hardcore RPGs. If you're not a fan of more vanilla, closer-to-pen-and-paper RPGs, then you may want to stick with Skyrim and Oblivion.
The RPG side of things is timeless though. The actual game design will last forever, given that you're a fan of more hardcore RPGs. If you're not a fan of more vanilla, closer-to-pen-and-paper RPGs, then you may want to stick with Skyrim and Oblivion.
Will you be disappointed? It's hard to say. It all depends on your expectations. Predominately, if you enjoyed Skyrim and go in expecting Skyrim? You absolutely will be disappointed.Jedamethis said:
They are vastly different games, and a lot of the handholding, subtle or otherwise, that is present in Skyrim simply doesn't exist in Morrowind.
For example, it is entirely possible to accidentally murder person or persons of necessity for a quest to prevail, and there's no way to get them back without loading previous saves (I'm not even 100% certain it's possible through console commands, though I'd be very surprised if it wasn't). You just have to accept that their dead and that the quest cannot continue.
There's also no quest locator arrow or whatever to help you find dungeons/quest items/etc. You need to read the quest log (which is in and of itself something of a journey. It's sorted very strangely IIRC) then use the clues in the text to figure out where everything is, then when you get there, start actively looking. At times, it feels like they go out of their way to hide shit from you and it can get really frustrating. Especially since there's no fast travel except between fixed points and never in the field, so if you fuck up, you need to hoof it back.
That makes little practical sense from any standpoint other than "don't buy it for the XBox." I would argue that post-release support -official or otherwise- plays a large role in how a game ages. CD Projekt updated the Witcher games post release to improve graphics. Does that also not count?Elberik said:
The Temple of Elemental Evil was pretty broken at release, but thanks to fan patches, I'd recommend it as the best CRPG representation of D&D to date. The game has aged well. Similarly, Arcanum and Vampire: The Masquerade - Redemption are far better games than they were at release thanks to modders.
When I recommend a game to someone, I do so based on what it is now, not what it was on release day. If someone asks me how a game has aged, I'll answer on the same basis. "Play Morrowind vanilla before adding mods" was good advice in 2002. I wouldn't give the same advice today.
Now as for my opinion goes, I don't think that the game has aged that well mechanically even with mods. It's too action-based to be a traditional RPG(which the TES series never was in any case), but it's tied too heavily to traditional RPG math concepts to be a great ARPG. That said, there are elements that will always stand out above what came after, and I would certainly recommend it -with a selection of mods that help it fit more with your preferred play style- at least for one play through.
You're going to want to mod the shit out of it. There's a mod pack that included a lot of the best graphical mods out there, to make the graphics look less hideous (though it doesnt fix the animations or character models. You will want to play in first person. As someone who hates the Skyrim combat, I actually didnt mind it as much in Morrowind. In Skyrim you could hit everything right from the start and skill just determined the damage you did. In Morrowind, you will start out not knowing which side is the pointy end of the sword and will be missing like crazy. You gradually get more accurate and really get more of a sense that you're improving. I'm currently playing through it myself and I'd say that with the graphical mods installed, it holds up fairly well (and that's from someone who has no nostalgia for the game)Jedamethis said:
I just wrote up a whole essay on how Morrowind has certainly aged, but in good and bad ways.
I wish you could have read it, it was a perfect description of what Morrowind is.
Reasonably unbiased weighing of all its flaws and strengths. Comparison to later Elder Scrolls games.
I am so angry right now, I'm sure everyone has had it happen where you go to edit a part, your mouse slips and highlights the entire post and any stray key will replace the whole thing. :'(
I'll put the important parts of the lost post in quick points. (All below points previously had a sentence or two explaining in detail)
+ Pro
- Con
Graphics, Look and Feel:
- Old looking
+ Consistent and beautiful
- Dodgy animation
- Premade character faces and hair
+ Faces actually look like faces and not balloons (Oblivion)
+ Dark and foreboding atmosphere
Mechanics:
- Percentage based combat
+ More options for character builds (than Skyrim/Oblivion)
- Magic is difficult to use effectively (I used a well suggested guide for a mage and even then I struggled)
+ Spells and Enchantments are fully customizable through guild services. (Oblivon and Skyrim place heavy restrictions of spell making and enchanting)
Exploration and World:
+ Massive Island with total freedom (Zero invisible walls and you can fly)
+ Lots to discover (exploration required)
+ Cities and Wilderness are well designed
+ Can actually get lost in the wilderness
- Can get lost for days
- No in map fast travel
+ Plenty of in game fast travel options
- No Oblivion/Skyrim style GPS compass, useless minimap instead
+ Means you actually have to explore to find things
Story and other stuff.
- Little spoken dialog (conversation is done trough dialog text)
+ The story is excellent (better than Skyrim and Oblivion's generic-O-thon)
- Guilds are long and tedious
+ Expansions packs are some of the best products Bethesda have put out. (Bloodmoon especially)
- Difficulty and Learning curve are the same (you need to learn the game to get good at it)
+ It shouldn't take long to figure out what's what in Morrowind.
- The game does not hold your hand
+ The game does not hold your hand
To wrap up, Morrowind is a shock to the system if you hop in straight after playing skyrim and expect the same experience, you're jumping 10 years or so back in time.
Morrowind is an awesome game if you have the patience to learn it and adapt to it's rules.
It can be a harsh mistress, but the experience from Morrowind has not been matched by a game since. While they have many similarities, Oblivion and Skyrim differ just enough to make them completely different experiences to Morrowind.
Morrowind is a very unique game, any fan of the elder scrolls should play it.
Anyone looking for a deep and engaging story should play it.
Anyone looking for an oldschool challenge will be pleased.
Every RPG gamer should play it at least once.
But thats just my opinion.
Also, providing you bought your laptop within the last 100 years, Morrowind should work. PC is the ideal route to take with a game like this.
However, I got myself hooked on Morrowind by playing it on the Xbox when the Game of the Year edition came out. Years later, (2008 I think) I bought it on PC for £9 and enjoyed it even more. Watch out for load times on Xbox though, they can take the piss a bit.
I wish you could have read it, it was a perfect description of what Morrowind is.
Reasonably unbiased weighing of all its flaws and strengths. Comparison to later Elder Scrolls games.
I am so angry right now, I'm sure everyone has had it happen where you go to edit a part, your mouse slips and highlights the entire post and any stray key will replace the whole thing. :'(
I'll put the important parts of the lost post in quick points. (All below points previously had a sentence or two explaining in detail)
+ Pro
- Con
Graphics, Look and Feel:
- Old looking
+ Consistent and beautiful
- Dodgy animation
- Premade character faces and hair
+ Faces actually look like faces and not balloons (Oblivion)
+ Dark and foreboding atmosphere
Mechanics:
- Percentage based combat
+ More options for character builds (than Skyrim/Oblivion)
- Magic is difficult to use effectively (I used a well suggested guide for a mage and even then I struggled)
+ Spells and Enchantments are fully customizable through guild services. (Oblivon and Skyrim place heavy restrictions of spell making and enchanting)
Exploration and World:
+ Massive Island with total freedom (Zero invisible walls and you can fly)
+ Lots to discover (exploration required)
+ Cities and Wilderness are well designed
+ Can actually get lost in the wilderness
- Can get lost for days
- No in map fast travel
+ Plenty of in game fast travel options
- No Oblivion/Skyrim style GPS compass, useless minimap instead
+ Means you actually have to explore to find things
Story and other stuff.
- Little spoken dialog (conversation is done trough dialog text)
+ The story is excellent (better than Skyrim and Oblivion's generic-O-thon)
- Guilds are long and tedious
+ Expansions packs are some of the best products Bethesda have put out. (Bloodmoon especially)
- Difficulty and Learning curve are the same (you need to learn the game to get good at it)
+ It shouldn't take long to figure out what's what in Morrowind.
- The game does not hold your hand
+ The game does not hold your hand
To wrap up, Morrowind is a shock to the system if you hop in straight after playing skyrim and expect the same experience, you're jumping 10 years or so back in time.
Morrowind is an awesome game if you have the patience to learn it and adapt to it's rules.
It can be a harsh mistress, but the experience from Morrowind has not been matched by a game since. While they have many similarities, Oblivion and Skyrim differ just enough to make them completely different experiences to Morrowind.
Morrowind is a very unique game, any fan of the elder scrolls should play it.
Anyone looking for a deep and engaging story should play it.
Anyone looking for an oldschool challenge will be pleased.
Every RPG gamer should play it at least once.
But thats just my opinion.
Also, providing you bought your laptop within the last 100 years, Morrowind should work. PC is the ideal route to take with a game like this.
However, I got myself hooked on Morrowind by playing it on the Xbox when the Game of the Year edition came out. Years later, (2008 I think) I bought it on PC for £9 and enjoyed it even more. Watch out for load times on Xbox though, they can take the piss a bit.
Morrowind has not aged well. Certainly it was and is a good game but the modern newcomer will likely not be able to enjoy the game without heavily modding
Don't see how fairness comes into play? 2 games released in ten years ago. One has been modded to improve graphics, sound, writing, mechanics, etc. The other has had no work on it. It is unfair because one has been given more attention than the other. You cannot count mods because those are aftermarket alterations that not everyone will have access too. It's like saying the Prequels were great because some guy made a fan-edit.Doom972 said:
Mods are a very important part of the elder scrolls, the PC version of the game comes with the exact damn tool the game was built with. The developers actively encouraged you to mod and build upon the game. Loads of fan sites are dedicated to the sharing of this free user created content, or "after market alterations" as you call it.Elberik said:
Besides, this isn't the Olympics, you are not a judge, no guidelines have been put in place to determine what is a fair or unfair way to talk about the game. What exactly gives you the right to blow the whistle on these posts and tell them they're wrong?