Hating Dark Souls?

[hazabaza1]

Like how all grab attacks pretty much have an insta-kill effect. That's bullshit.

Wear the ring that ups defense when HP is below 30%. You won't die from grabs. Or dodge them since they are very clearly telegraphed.

...
Why the fuck didn't I think of that? God, I feel so stupid.
And my dodging skills just suck so that's why I get grabbed. It's not too often though.

 

[godofallu]

My first playthough I died on like every boss 5 times at least. My second playthrough I only died occasionally to the harder bosses.

Getting from creation -> second bell took me like 40 hours my first time. Now I can do it in 2.

Each enemy, each boss, each trap, each area requires a different win condition. Some enemies you circle strafe with a shield up. Some enemies you parry. Some enemies you stay far away from and use ranged. Some you have to run imbetween their legs at the correct time. If you can survive long enough to learn the tricks you can adapt and overcome. If you die before getting those notes you better pay attention next time school is in session or you will never pass.

 

[DoctorObviously]

Another human being who doesn't like Demon's or Dark Souls? What the hell!

Some faith in humanity has been restored.

You had lost faith in humanity because people like a game you don't like?

Get along with the meme. I lost faith in humanity for much more than a game people falsely claim that it is fair while it is not.

 

[Lordmurdalot]

Now before you all flip a lid thinking this is a rage thread, your only half right.

Dark Souls is a decent game. But i dont think it requires half the praise it gets. Dont say "oh, its because you suck at it" or "its because you dont like a hard game", let me tell you, ive played Monster Hunter from start to finish since the first one. G-Rank and all.

Dark Souls isnt a game about difficulty. Its a game about beating your face against a brick wall until you find something that works.

Glad you mentioned these two points. lets me prove something to you.

For starters the vast majority of games nowadays are MUCH easier than they once were. I'm 17 but was raised with a snes and sega. Monster Hunter is no exception. Im not here to whine on that though (love monster hunter but all you do is time your attacks. absoloutly ZERO challenge just timing thats it. still love the game though)

Dark souls does offer a challenge as adament as you are to the contrary. I KNOW when something has been made hard lazily and dark souls in my total 70+ hours of gameplay has never shown that once.

(read till end starts of insulting (I apoligies) but becomes praise)

You'll only think it offers no challenge if your a close minded twat who whines at every oppurtunity, which by the way how your presenting your arguements your obviously not so you must be doing something majorly wrong or RPG's just aren't for you. Every part of dark souls you can learn from and get better from it. I myself have only played Demon's souls for 30 mins- to an hour because I don't have a ps3 so imagine the shock a hardcore gamer whos has been getting rusty from all these piss easy but sometimes fun games then going back to hardcore hell. At first I was shocked that they actually made a hard game then I went back to my old ways and have been having the time of my life. You need to learn and accept that you WILL die and once you find a way that suits you stick to it but learn a backup plan just incase.

As a final thought I think you will love this game when you get into the right mind set, just dont't claim its being unfair because no matter which way you put it, it is fair. You just sound like a whiney ***** whenever you say that as well as the lazy game design thing.

I think the best way for you to approach melee is treat every enemy like a monster from monster hunter with using the magic for the hairyer situation

 

[Scars Unseen]

Another human being who doesn't like Demon's or Dark Souls? What the hell!

Some faith in humanity has been restored.

You had lost faith in humanity because people like a game you don't like?

Get along with the meme. I lost faith in humanity for much more than a game people falsely claim that it is fair while it is not.

Not fair? Assuming that the catchphrase "Prepare to die" didn't tell you what you were getting into, the only moment in the game I'd truly call unfair (PvP aside) is that first trap in the tutorial. Getting instajibbed by a nigh unavoidable boulder pretty much told me that caution was the key to avoiding frustrating repeat deaths. Once I realized what the tone of the game was (never having played Demon Souls), I found the game to be far more fair than most games I've played. You're given all the tools you need to succeed (Deprived class aside) and the mechanics just work. I've died. Oh, how I've died. But every death was avoidable, and the death penalty is far less harsh than that of -say- Everquest.

By the way, I am in no way a hardcore gamer. I've never maxed out a character's level on any MMO I've played (yes, including WoW) and I can count the number of games I've played on greater than normal difficulty on one hand. Dark Souls is hard, but it isn't on the level of games like the old Megaman games or Super Ghouls'n Ghosts. Now those games are hard (and I've never beaten either of them).

 

[Darkbladex96]

Dark souls is downright cheap at times though, and you cant dismiss that.

Enemies dont always follow the same laws of the universe as you. IE no hit detection between walls and thier weapons.........happens way too often.

Homing arrows...

Stun lock patterns

and attack tracking....Dear lord some enemies will rare back a thrust and pivot 180 degrees with 1 leg in the air and stab you..

There is but 1 cheap ledge in the game, the bon fire on the otherside of that wall before moonlight butterfly.....devs need to face desk for the positioning of that

Homing arrows? Use a shield, or dodge roll. Or rush the archer directly.

Stun lock patterns? That's a problem with your Poise stat. use a Wolf ring or wear heavier armor. If you got stun locked it's because your armor is too light. And in light armor, you generally want to avoid being hit anyway.

Attack Tracking? Again, nothing a good shield can't solve. learn the attack patterns of monsters and you can walk through the game untouched by just about everything.


About the only truely hellish spot I've seen is Anor Londo, the 2 Black Knight archers with Dragonbows, on the stupidly narrow ledges. That spot is hell, but there's still ways around it.

I love how people read so much into things that that head immediately flies up their ass because they just have to tell you how to play the game.

Look dude, stick to what typed, not what you assume and youll sound less like a douche(and less like the comments on this thread in general).

The whole damn post went over head...the whole thing

 

[garjian]

A short comment isnt going to stand out here, but im gonna type it anyway.

When youre doing well on Dark Souls, it feels neutral
When youre doing badly, it feels negative.

There is no positive aspect to this game and no reason to play it.

I play it when im bored, with literally nothing else to keep me occupied, and a few hours later when it eventually starts pissing me off again, i put it down, and wait 'til im bored again the next day.

Ive only used melee so far though, it might be more rewarding with other classes, but so far...
Baiting enemies, waiting for an opening, hitting them and doing next to nothing (against the mini-bosses and such) is boring.
Not know where im going or why im doing any of it, is boring.
Not getting loot from a NON-REPEATABLE BOSS in a SINGLE PLAYER GAME, is bull shit.
Taking advantage of poor AI with a bow, is boring.

The only fun i ever had on this game is during the large bosses, when i get a slight hint of Monster Hunter fun. ...if i was only playing the game for that, why wouldnt i just play Monster Hunter instead?

 

[Exius Xavarus]

Another human being who doesn't like Demon's or Dark Souls? What the hell!

Some faith in humanity has been restored.

You had lost faith in humanity because people like a game you don't like?

Get along with the meme. I lost faith in humanity for much more than a game people falsely claim that it is fair while it is not.

Oh look, another person saying Dark Souls isn't fair, because they can't rush through it like a mindless chicken. .___.

 

[Olikunmissile]

Snip

If you didn't spend all this time whining you might have gotten to the next area.

It's difficult. You only pass an area once you become it's master. I enjoy it, I like a challange. Something that doesn't hold my hand and give me the same shit over and over. Learn. Grow. Win.

Your excuses are nothing but tears that the game licks from your cheeks as it tells you to bite the pillow because he's going in dry. The more noise you make, the better it feels for him.

Pro tip for Taurus Demon? Use a plunging attack from the tower you walk in through.

 

[Pearwood]

1: Melee is something you can always rely on to be at least functional, magic can vary massively between either extremely good or bloody awful. On normal enemies you can blow through your spells and they'll be easy but if you do that then you probably won't have enough to take down the boss.

2: Ditch the halberd. It's a situational weapon, use it when you have a lot of space and need to clear a whole crowd. There's a rather nice sword you can get by shooting the tail of the dragon on the bridge.

3: The taurus demon is best faught by getting really close to him and staying there, you can be pushed back a bit and not fall if you position yourself right and he's far less annoying close up than at range. Poise on your armour is what dictates whether you can take the hit or if you stagger, robes don't have it but metal armour does.

4: The price of an open world game is this sadly, you run into enemies you can't possibly kill the first time you see them. You'll be going back to that area a bit later on to open the locked door you saw on your way to taurus.

Really your last two points are the ones I agree with most, if you think ledges are a pain now just wait til a certain zone much later in the game. Really the idea is to just position yourself so even if you do take a hit your poise won't save you from you won't die. Or just sprint to somewhere safe, enemies can't catch up to your sprint speed and most of the time if they swing at you while you're sprinting they'll miss.

Not getting loot from a NON-REPEATABLE BOSS in a SINGLE PLAYER GAME, is bull shit.

So true. I'm hoping if I cut Priscilla's tail off while being summoned I still get the dagger but that's still annoying since I'll have to go through the most annoying zone ever.

Your excuses are nothing but tears that the game licks from your cheeks as it tells you to bite the pillow because he's going in dry. The more noise you make, the better it feels for him.

Don't be a dick. The game is hard, some people are going to find it frustrating.

 

[DoctorObviously]

Another human being who doesn't like Demon's or Dark Souls? What the hell!

Some faith in humanity has been restored.

You had lost faith in humanity because people like a game you don't like?

Get along with the meme. I lost faith in humanity for much more than a game people falsely claim that it is fair while it is not.

Message

Doesn't matter. A game should be accessible by anybody, no matter what skill level. Ever heard of a great mechanic good developers deploy such as a difficulty level?

Devil May Cry handled this really great. You started off at the normal difficulty level (or the level the game in question is meant to be played), when you die enough times, you should be able to choose an easier setting, but with less rewards, which is for me a fair trade. Now, the DMC series haven't really done the latter, but I would like to see it in games. Then, instead of trying to break a concrete wall with your head starting right off at the hardest difficulty level like Demon's and Dark Souls do, you will now be an experienced player and will be able to be a more skilled player after that moment when you realize you got to the end credits.

The thing that makes me mad about Demon's and Dark Souls is that, I want to like it, I want to support the developers by buying the game. I want to play and enjoy it. I want to be immersed in both the atmosphere and the story. But I can't do that since the game is closed off for lesser skilled players than me.

Your turn.

 

[Darkbladex96]

Another human being who doesn't like Demon's or Dark Souls? What the hell!

Some faith in humanity has been restored.

You had lost faith in humanity because people like a game you don't like?

Get along with the meme. I lost faith in humanity for much more than a game people falsely claim that it is fair while it is not.

Message

Doesn't matter. A game should be accessible by anybody, no matter what skill level. Ever heard of a great mechanic good developers deploy such as a difficulty level?

Devil May Cry handled this really great. You started off at the normal difficulty level (or the level the game in question is meant to be played), when you die enough times, you should be able to choose an easier setting, but with less rewards, which is for me a fair trade. Now, the DMC series haven't really done the latter, but I would like to see it in games. Then, instead of trying to break a concrete wall with your head starting right off at the hardest difficulty level like Demon's and Dark Souls do, you will now be an experienced player and will be able to be a more skilled player after that moment when you realize you got to the end credits.

The thing that makes me mad about Demon's and Dark Souls is that, I want to like it, I want to support the developers by buying the game. I want to play and enjoy it. I want to be immersed in both the atmosphere and the story. But I can't do that since the game is closed off for lesser skilled players than me.

Your turn.

The problem is people who play demon/dark souls and then their head goes up their ass because they got really far. Notice how many even the response to my post was learn to play even though i didnt even imply i had a problem with any mechanic.

 

[Jack Rascal]

The problem is people who play demon/dark souls and then their head goes up their ass because they got really far. Notice how many even the response to my post was learn to play even though i didnt even imply i had a problem with any mechanic.

I don't think peoples heads go up their arse. What they are trying to say is that implying the game mechanics are flawed or the design is crap is not correct.

Demon's and Dark Souls have both been very upfront about what the game is like. It's hard and you will most likely die a lot, not necessarily, but likely. It was designed to punish for carelessness and ignorance.

The game is not trying to cheat on anything. Most games I have played have had similar "problems" as you have listed. Enemies are not affected by the terrain as you are, their aim is better and most likely their level is higher than yours. Monsters are immune to elements and they are generally an acrobatic lot. Are these cheats? No, I don't think so. Many shooters have snipers that can shoot you with ridiculous accuracy, they can throw grenades that have a larger range than yours. Or so people believe when they get frustrated with the game.

I think the biggest problem people are having with Dark Souls is that they are trying to rush through. The game is very punishing when you try that. If you advance steadily, for some reason, most of the "problems" go away.

But not every game is designed for every gamer. I will not touch racing or sports games, because I couldn't care less of those. They can keep making them until the world ends, but not one of them will be found on my shelf. Well I have one, but it came with my console and I'm almost ashamed of having it. I would suck at NHL 12, but I would not call it cheap because my tackles don't hit home as often than the other team's does. Most likely the reason why my tackles fail, is because I suck at the game.

 

[Exius Xavarus]

Another human being who doesn't like Demon's or Dark Souls? What the hell!

Some faith in humanity has been restored.

You had lost faith in humanity because people like a game you don't like?

Get along with the meme. I lost faith in humanity for much more than a game people falsely claim that it is fair while it is not.

Message

Doesn't matter. A game should be accessible by anybody, no matter what skill level. Ever heard of a great mechanic good developers deploy such as a difficulty level?

Devil May Cry handled this really great. You started off at the normal difficulty level (or the level the game in question is meant to be played), when you die enough times, you should be able to choose an easier setting, but with less rewards, which is for me a fair trade. Now, the DMC series haven't really done the latter, but I would like to see it in games. Then, instead of trying to break a concrete wall with your head starting right off at the hardest difficulty level like Demon's and Dark Souls do, you will now be an experienced player and will be able to be a more skilled player after that moment when you realize you got to the end credits.

The thing that makes me mad about Demon's and Dark Souls is that, I want to like it, I want to support the developers by buying the game. I want to play and enjoy it. I want to be immersed in both the atmosphere and the story. But I can't do that since the game is closed off for lesser skilled players than me.

Your turn.

"Accessible to anybody" is the typical way to market a game. From Software did not want to make Dark Souls into an easy game. They wanted to make the game they wanted to make. The trick to Demon's Souls and Dark Souls is paying attention to the enemy and your surroundings. You get better by learning in Demon's/Dark Souls. If you're going to bullrush through Dark Souls, then needless to say: You're going to get your ass whipped.

This game is not for those who believe you can get by, simply swinging your sword at whatever moves without a thought in the world, and that's just not how this game plays. And quite frankly, anyone who actually cares to take notice of the small things going on around them, all of us will tell you that Dark Souls really is not that difficult at all. From my standpoint, Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 is harder than Dark Souls is. Catherine is harder than Dark Souls. If you're having trouble, think for a moment to assess the situation, figure out what went wrong, and change up the strategy. Or, if you like, you can think of Dark Souls like a science experiment. Attempting to perform the same thing again and again and again, is going to yield the same results.

Making an "easy mode" defeats the entire purpose of what Dark Souls is, which is a challenging game that gets you to think, Okay, what did I do wrong? Why did I get killed this way? How do I avoid letting that happen again? The game gives deeper meaning to simple mechanics, and if you're incapable of learning from your mistakes and taking a different approach to a problem, then suffice it to say: Dark Souls is simply not for you.

To end, I leave you with this:

Skill alone does not lead to power, but knowledge as well. Skill without knowledge is a babe that can merely swing a sword. However, skill and knowledge, together, will make for a truly powerful player.

snip

Thank you!

 

[Jack Rascal]

Making an "easy mode" defeats the entire purpose of what Dark Souls is, which is a challenging game that gets you to think, Okay, what did I do wrong? Why did I get killed this way? How do I avoid letting that happen again? The game gives deeper meaning to simple mechanics, and if you're incapable of learning from your mistakes and taking a different approach to a problem, then suffice it to say: Dark Souls is simply not for you.

I would have felt cheated if Dark Souls had implemented an easy mode. It would mean they had sold their soul

I bought Demon's Souls quite late, so I don't know, but did it receive as much crap as Dark Souls have? Or was it accepted as it was when it came out. I'm sure it received some, but was it called cheap?

I really believe Dark Souls is getting unfounded criticism here, don't know about other forums. From Software made a difficult game that forgives no mistakes and told about it before release. I think you can only blame yourself if you bought a game fully knowing what's coming and then don't even bother learning it. The shield you carry is there for a reason...

 

[NamesAreHardToPick]

Devil May Cry handled this really great. You started off at the normal difficulty level (or the level the game in question is meant to be played), when you die enough times, you should be able to choose an easier setting

I remember that. I've never been so insulted.

DMC3: "Loser. Here's easy mode since you clearly need it lolololol"
Me: "gtfo"
DMC3: *lies down at bottom of trash can*

At least Dark Souls kills you like it's all business... die and try again as long as you like at whatever you want to do and it won't make any comment.

 

[NamesAreHardToPick]

Also, where the fuck do i find weapons in this game? The only good ones i found are the drake sword and the black knight greatsword. But the drake sword feels cheap and i dont have the strength for the greatsword. Ideally i would want to find a curved sword because i really love the moveset. (No i won't kill the merchant for a katana).

Tough it out, or suck it up and use the drake sword for now. Undead Parish has a blacksmith and you can get him to beat your scimitar into something decent.

 

[bpm195]

Also, where the fuck do i find weapons in this game? The only good ones i found are the drake sword and the black knight greatsword. But the drake sword feels cheap and i dont have the strength for the greatsword. Ideally i would want to find a curved sword because i really love the moveset. (No i won't kill the merchant for a katana).

Tough it out, or suck it up and use the drake sword for now. Undead Parish has a blacksmith and you can get him to beat your scimitar into something decent.

The Drake sword actually encapsulates a good chunk of what I dislike about Dark Souls. For one, it's a weapon that completely overshadows every other weapon available when you first unlock it. If you choose not to take it, and you're using melee, you're choosing to less that half damage. Even once you get to the Black Smith, you're not going to take one of the base weapons and make it comparable. Until you get an ember you're not getting any weapon above +5 which is a 50% damage increase, and therefore until you find a one handed weapon has deals 132 damage. Now I could be wrong about the math, but that brings me to my second problem: it doesn't explain the numbers. It never tells you how much damage reduction your armor gives you or whether that +x to damage beside your weapon is the bonus from stats or the bonus from it's secondary type attack. If you want to build your character well you're forced to meta game, which brings me two my third problem. To play effectively you're either banging your head against walls until you find something that works, or you have to meta game. The Drake Sword comes from attacking an enemy in an obscure but risk free way. It's like they don't want you to just play the game and learn from it, they want you go hit the forums and copy it.

Dark Souls has a lot going for it, but it's intentionally inacessible and an overall pain in the ass.

 

[Exius Xavarus]

Making an "easy mode" defeats the entire purpose of what Dark Souls is, which is a challenging game that gets you to think, Okay, what did I do wrong? Why did I get killed this way? How do I avoid letting that happen again? The game gives deeper meaning to simple mechanics, and if you're incapable of learning from your mistakes and taking a different approach to a problem, then suffice it to say: Dark Souls is simply not for you.

I would have felt cheated if Dark Souls had implemented an easy mode. It would mean they had sold their soul

I bought Demon's Souls quite late, so I don't know, but did it receive as much crap as Dark Souls have? Or was it accepted as it was when it came out. I'm sure it received some, but was it called cheap?

I really believe Dark Souls is getting unfounded criticism here, don't know about other forums. From Software made a difficult game that forgives no mistakes and told about it before release. I think you can only blame yourself if you bought a game fully knowing what's coming and then don't even bother learning it. The shield you carry is there for a reason...

I got Demon's Souls really late, as well, since I didn't get my PS3 until Christmas 2010. But from what I understand, Demon's Souls wasn't at all expected to be as much of a success as it was. And the people giving Dark Souls flak about being "cheap" or "unfair" are the ones that just aren't good enough to take this monster down. So they blame the game for their own inadequacy.

 

[Scars Unseen]

Another human being who doesn't like Demon's or Dark Souls? What the hell!

Some faith in humanity has been restored.

You had lost faith in humanity because people like a game you don't like?

Get along with the meme. I lost faith in humanity for much more than a game people falsely claim that it is fair while it is not.

Message

Doesn't matter. A game should be accessible by anybody, no matter what skill level. Ever heard of a great mechanic good developers deploy such as a difficulty level?

On this, I highly disagree. Some games should be accessible by anybody. Other games should be developed with a target audience in mind, and skill level is only one of many considerations that must be taken into account. I like turn-based RPGs. Some people don't. Must every game then be designed to accommodate both turn-based and real-time models then? The answer is no.

When you design a game to take into account multiple audiences you have to make compromises. After enough compromises have been made the game becomes watered down. Additionally, every game has a budget, and most games have deadlines. Focusing on a targeted audience allows you to deepen and refine a game rather than broaden it. Such is the case with Dark Souls. The game does not have broad appeal. No one's trying to say it does. But it stands out among similar games, and I bought it because of this. How many JRPGs (or Action RPGs)are there out there that you can just breeze through without really trying. How many of those are getting half the attention that Dark Souls is? For those that this game is designed for, Dark Souls isn't good; it's outstanding.