Health regen VS health pack pickup

[webkilla]

I just had an idea

Would it be possible to design an FPS or even 3rd person action game where both auto-health regen and health pickups were built in, as different levels of difficulty?

On easy you'd have the usual CoD-style health regen where you sit still for five seconds and suck on your passifier and suddenly you're back to full health, versus normal and harder difficulties where you'd have to seek out health packs and whatnot?

For game-design purposes health-regen is easy-mode, since it means that a level designer can always expect that if a player survives an enemy encounter, then he'll be at full health for the next encounter - making it a no-brainer.

With limited health a level designer has to be concious about health packs, possibly add in some scavenging/exploration reward elements - but in turn it can be all the more satisfying and challenging for players as well

Do any of you lot know of any games that have tried this already?

 

[KarmaTheAlligator]

From what I saw, Farcry 3 had something similar yet different, with players carrying a personal medkit they can use when the going gets really tough (and I think takes a while to recharge after use), and health regen at the same time (although the regen probably only works well outside of battle). Never heard of a game where the two mechanics were made for different difficulties, though.

 

[Ickorus]

I don't know of any games that do it as you suggest but I have seen some successfully marry the two and I honestly think that is where the future lies, I've seen two methods of doing this and I will give some examples:

Regenerating health blocks - Player has health 'blocks', when one is depleted it won't regenerate until you use a medkit but if it isn't depleted it will regenerate up to the top of that block and no further.

Regenerating shields - You have two bars, one shield and one health, shield will regenerate but health will not without a medkit, typically the shield needs to deplete before you take health damage.

I prefer the former to the latter, myself; it feels closer to traditional games but prevents a player being stuck on 1 health with the nearest medkit behind a wall of enemies basically making the game impossible if you don't have a backup save or checkpoint to fall back on.

 

[Strazdas]

I just had an idea

Would it be possible to design an FPS or even 3rd person action game where both auto-health regen and health pickups were built in, as different levels of difficulty?

It was already done. It was called Red Faction 2. IT had a healthpacks, you coudl carry up to maximum of 3. IF you stoll for a while (10 secs or so) and were not being attacked, your health would regenerate (around 10 seconeds from 0 to full). In combat you did not have time to regenerate, so you had to use medpacks. but if you just finished a fight and are mildly injured, you just waited to regen.
this lead to some regen cheating in boss fights but they usually didnt allow much of it (you had to headshot endless wave of zombies and nto get hit by their fire (zombies use pistols, seriuosly) for 20 seconds to regen, which was a challenge to some anyway).

 

[Guy from the 80's]

Am I alone in thinking health regen is god awful? It removes tactical elements and it prevents you from being punished by bad choices. Games like STALKER where you can bleed to death and has no regen is great, the typical HALO/COD etc ad nauseam not so much.

 

[Shpongled]

Personally i thought Halo 1 had it down, don't know why they changed it for the rest.

Bunch of health blocks, which can only be replenished with health packs, and a shield which regens after a moment or two out of combat. Meant you still had to be careful how you played because at 1 health block left you had no leeway once the shield had gone and die as soon as the shield dropped. But you still had some room to manouevre as long you were careful.

This avoided the annoying forced constant reloading of games with no shield, where on higher difficulties you have no health for a while due to lack of health packs, and die all the time to unavoidable shit because your character is bowled over by the force of a violent sneeze. Higher difficulties were so much more fun in Halo than other FPS, where it basically became a process of dying enough times to learn where all the enemies are. Pure static health without regen may be harder, but it can make for some damn tedious gameplay. Throwing a shield on top gives the advantages of both forms of health. and the removes the disadvantages of both.

Honestly i can't fathom why they removed the health aspect from Halo.

 

[Shpongled]

Am I alone in thinking health regen is god awful? It removes tactical elements and it prevents you from being punished by bad choices. Games like STALKER where you can bleed to death and has no regen is great, the typical HALO/COD etc ad nauseam not so much.

You're not alone in thinking that, but pure static health with no regen isn't all roses either. I don't really remember looking back on playing through the higher difficulty settings of many older FPS's because all it was was trial and error gameplay.

"Can i go round this corner? Oh, i got shot in the face. Ok, reload, but i didn't see where he was, so i'll have to have a another look. Oh, i got shot in the face again, luckily i managed to see where he was, great. Reload, shoot him, awesome, now i can progr-oh, i got shot in the face, reload.

Shields give you a little bit of leeway in looking round the corner to see where that guy is so you can shoot him, without having to reload the game. Also allows you to have a little fun and take a risk once in a while, knowing you won't have gimped yourself for the entire rest of the level if things don't go strictly to plan.

 

[DoPo]

If I remember correctly, Serious Sam did that if you played on toruist - it would regenerate your health slowly if you're not hit up to 100, I think (max was 200 if you play on lower difficulties, above normal you only have 100 health max). Other games have also done variation of that - can't remember names but some do regenerate you up to something like 30-40% of your total HP. And as was pointed out, Halo has regenerating shields, which is also an option - gives you replenishing survival resource while you're still very vulnerable.

 

[OneCatch]

From what I saw, Farcry 3 had something similar yet different, with players carrying a personal medkit they can use when the going gets really tough (and I think takes a while to recharge after use), and health regen at the same time (although the regen probably only works well outside of battle). Never heard of a game where the two mechanics were made for different difficulties, though.

In FC3 the health meter is split into several bars. Each bar will regenerate, but you need to heal to fill up the bars above it again. You can heal by doing DIY in the field [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66qGf66BTFs] which is time consuming, or you can use stims to regain health. The number of bars and how many are healed at a time by stims/first aid depends on the skills you upgrade.

It's actually a pretty good compromise, though you're a bit too much of a bullet sponge unless you're playing on harder difficulties. Another game did a similar thing, but I can't remember what it is for the life of me...

 

[Tom_green_day]

Far Cry 3 has been mentioned, but I personally thought it was done better in 2. It was the same, but health injecters were less abundant and you could only heal when you had them, not just half heal without.

 

[tilmoph]

I wouldn't mind a combat; slow health regen when wandering around, with inventory health kits for more rapid healing during combat. Off the top of my head, I remember champions of norrath had a class (warrior or barbarian or something, it has been years since I played it) which had a health regen ability, but you still had potions.

As far as shooter type games, health packs all the way. I don't mind what Halo and Alpha Protocol did, with a regenerating shield but a health pickup life bar, but the modern shooter, suck your thumb til your Wolverine powers kick in thing is kind of dumb.

 

[WouldYouKindly]

I favor a split method, a la Bioshock Infinite. A portion of your health regenerates but the other part requires pickups... or eating 20 apples.

It lets you get away with taking a few risks(you know, the fun part), but it's not completely hand holding, especially on higher difficulties.

I do like the option of NO health regeneration at all. It suits well to tactical shooters or stealth games where the tension is the main source of engagement, though I feel that's the wrong word. All survival horror games shouldn't have regenerative health because you should be terrified of turning that next corner.

 

[CrimsonBlaze]

I favor a split method, a la Bioshock Infinite. A portion of your health regenerates but the other part requires pickups... or eating 20 apples.

It lets you get away with taking a few risks(you know, the fun part), but it's not completely hand holding, especially on higher difficulties.

I do like the option of NO health regeneration at all. It suits well to tactical shooters or stealth games where the tension is the main source of engagement, though I feel that's the wrong word. All survival horror games shouldn't have regenerative health because you should be terrified of turning that next corner.

I agree. Bioshock Infinite does have the best of both worlds in terms of a small regenerative shield while still having a refillable health bar. It's also particularly helpful when you are ambushed by snipers and a single hit could have meant agonizing death, prompting you to start over.

In terms of horror survival shooters, none comes to mind better than Dead Space 2. Your RIG allows you always have a constant watch on your health and when you go down to the red zone, it usually spells panic, as there is a slight possibility that, despite having like 30-40 HP left, many enemies can instantly kill you if you are in the red.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Dead Island did this. Your health regenerates up to 20% I think, the rest you have to use medkits or small health items like apples and soda.

 

[Aircross]

Health packs are best used with excellent level designs, so I guess difficulty is directly proportional to how well the levels are designed?

Easy: Corridor shooter with health regeneration.
Medium: Mostly open levels with both health packs and health regeneration.
Hard: Maze-like level with health packs and secret areas.

 

[krazykidd]

Health packs are best used with excellent level designs, so I guess difficulty is directly proportional to how well the levels are designed?

Easy: Corridor shooter with health regeneration.
Medium: Mostly open levels with both health packs and health regeneration.
Hard: Maze-like level with health packs and secret areas.

If one game did all of that , i would never need another FPS . But alas , too much work . Lazy ass developpers

 

[XMark]

I think the best compromise is like in Doom 3, where your health only regenerates up to a certain low level (I think 15%?), and for anything above that you need health packs. That way, you'll want to preserve your health and find health kits, but you never end up stuck dying over and over again because you got caught at a checkpoint with 1% health.

 

[rasputin0009]

See: Battlefield 3

On normal, health regen and health packs.

On hardcore, health packs only.

Probably the best example of it working very well.