How gaming will die and why it is our fault

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wordsmith

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May 1, 2008
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Onyx has a point... You can't even call some of the stuff on the Wii a "game".

On my own point, it's fairly predictable that games will begin to lose originality. It's like music for the dance scene. Back in the 60's and 70's, there where new disco hits coming out, new ways of using synths. Now? Now we just recycle the old ideas because most of the good ones have gone. Mirrors edge was a good idea. A little short, but a good concept. The problem with this? When a good game with a good storyline (of a good length) comes along, there is now one less original core game mechanic for it to make use of.

Good games survive to produce sequels, bad games die. It's evolution.
 

matsugawa

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Mar 18, 2009
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The herald of the death of videogames was, is, and will always be the casual gamer, the Mediocre Masses, the people who will knock Psychonauts or Rez to the ground as they scramble to get their thumb-less, hairy paws on GTA-Clone #857-B or Tetris-Cash-In #3000-and-a-half. Mainstream interest in games has come and gone in the past, and there's at least one crash associated with it, along with about a dozen dead genres like Text-Adventures and Vertical-Scrolling Shooters.
 

XJ-0461

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Mar 9, 2009
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Large amounts of sequels will kill gaming. A trilogy of games is all right, but when you reach the Tomb Raider stage, you have a problem.
 

Onyx Oblivion

Borderlands Addict. Again.
Sep 9, 2008
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Oddly enough, one of the series that many accuse of being a cash-out, is one that I find to be continually evolving in the right direction, at least for the main RPG series, and that is the Pokemon games. They keep making it deeper with every generation for the truly hardcore, while still keeping the main game easy enough for nearly anyone to pick up and play. A fantastic mixture for both the hardcore and the casual gamers alike. You don't need to know what EVs, IVs, Psuedohazing, SRing, and all those fancy terms are to have a good time. Although without that knowledge, you have a serious handicap against some of the competitive players.
 

Pennyy9

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Feb 8, 2009
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Prepare for the counter wall


I see your point my friend. Graphics have been the major improvement on the market, and you are angry about the fact that most of the money is being spent there, and not elsewhere in a game. you're angry because game consumers buy whatever looks good to them, and I'm not talking graphics, I am talking about what they are familiar with. They see it as a huge jump in value, same price, same game, better graphics, win! It's not, but i'm here to tell you that no matter what you think, the gaming industry is not fueled by how good games are. Why should companies make more innovative games when they get just as much sales by making fricking NHL 2k9. you cannot affect them, even if you stop buying the games.

It's comparable to the ecology problems we have. Sure, you can start driving a Hybrid, thats not going to save the planet. Blowing up GMC might, but thats not something practical(I'm not a terrorist, don't have a hissy) . the only way to get results is to do something that isn't practical in a economic sense. As long as games sell, they will keep going. the best you can do is to not buy the games, that way you don't get reminded how you can count the number of people who can do anything about the current situation on your fingers.

Penny
 

Vanguard_Ex

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Mar 19, 2008
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bernthalbob616 said:
Large amounts of sequels will kill gaming. A trilogy of games is all right, but when you reach the Tomb Raider stage, you have a problem.
Or the Final Fantasy stage, FF perhaps being the most ironically named franchise of all time. When do you think they'll actually stop?
 

TheGreenManalishi

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Onyx Oblivion said:
After reading that, I must say that you don't seem to mention the Wii as a factor in the death of gaming. And it is killing it, with its constant stream of shovelware.
I think the Wii is, unfortunately, the future of video and virtual reality gaming. We the 'hardcore' game consumers, we who took games away from the arcade and the QWERTY keyboard onto the joypad, will also kill it with our unchanging tastes and wants and dissatisfaction with the direction the industry has and will continue to take.
 

FallenRainbows

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CoziestPigeon said:
holy fucking wall of text.
^ that

I read a bit and i think your on about graphics and the death of originality and if you are, i agree originality is dieing and It the fanboys fault, but L4D was hardly trampled it sstill going strong and survival mode looks amazing.
 

Onyx Oblivion

Borderlands Addict. Again.
Sep 9, 2008
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Pennyy9 said:
It's comparable to the ecology problems we have. Sure, you can start driving a Hybrid, thats not going to save the planet. Blowing up GMC might, but thats not something practical(I'm not a terrorist, don't have a hissy)

Penny
Terrorist.

TheGreenManalishi said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
After reading that, I must say that you don't seem to mention the Wii as a factor in the death of gaming. And it is killing it, with its constant stream of shovelware.
I think the Wii is, unfortunately, the future of video and virtual reality gaming. We the 'hardcore' game consumers, we who took games away from the arcade and the QWERTY keyboard onto the joypad, will also kill it with our unchanging tastes and wants and dissatisfaction with the direction the industry has and will continue to take.
Hey, I'm open to new ideas. I'm a huge supporter of "Great concept, poor execution."
 

Duh

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Feb 19, 2009
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well, i'll just say its not my fault gaming is dying because i hate realistic graphic games with a passion and have verry little hope that any of them will be good

first reason is that i know that it will be most likely about some dude jumping into a pool of boobs and blood

second reason is that they have no real story, as great as the gameplay could be i do not forgive lack of a decent story

i say fuck realistic graphics i want charming and fun
 

NeutralDrow

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Mar 23, 2009
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I'm afraid your "controversial conclusion" is preaching to the choir, here. For my part, even with an obsession with improving graphics, the "death of gaming" is something I can't see happening.
 

Deacon Cole

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Jan 10, 2009
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I thought that in the year of the video game crash sales were actually up from the previous year, just that there was a glut of competitors in the market so everyone got a smaller piece of a larger pie.

There are probably lots of reasons why the crash happened. Consumer leeriness may be one of them. But I'm not so sure if it's as big a factor as most think. I mean, look at the Atari's launch titles:

* Air-Sea Battle
* Basic Math
* Blackjack
* Combat
* Indy 500
* Star Ship
* Street Racer
* Surround
* Video Olympics

I mean, wow. What great games, huh? Later releases weren't much better. My parents bought Maze Craze because Pac-Man was popular and that was the only maze game they had. It is not like Pac-man. Not at all. So bad games were nothing new. I don't think it was as big a factor.

Anyway, I've rambled on about that irrelevant tangent enough, don't you?

You main thesis is that the general same-iness of games these days will lead to consumers going elsewhere. I can't say for sure if that holds water not not. But I will say that it's pretty much true for me. I do not own any of the three current consoles and aside from the Wii, I do not want them. What could they possibly offer that my mostly-unplayed-it's-just-a-DVD-player PlayStation 2 couldn't?

Yeah, that's what I thought.

Thing is, I don't know how much of a problem the lack of originality in gaming is, and if it is a problem, I have no solutions. Aside from sending a powerful electrical pulse through the X Box Live network to electrocute all the users so that stupid war FPS's and sports titles will stop selling and the developers could turn toward new ideas.
 

teh_gunslinger

S.T.A.L.K.E.R. did it better.
Dec 6, 2007
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CoziestPigeon said:
holy fucking wall of text.
ae86gamer said:
I didn't read the wall of text. It was too long :/
Vanguard_Ex said:
Why I will never know what you said in that post and why it is your fault:
TOO
MUCH
TEEEEXT D:
WittyName said:
CoziestPigeon said:
holy fucking wall of text.
lol

IT NEVER ENDS!!!!

Any chance of a summary?
Simriel said:
I cant read this, its a HUGE wall of text.
Why post if you can't be bothered to actually read the post? It never fails to amaze me.

Lord_Jaroh said:
You forgot the true evil of gaming right now and that is advertisers and marketers, who with their pie charts and demographics should all be flogged and then sent to a special hell where they can't touch the world of video games anymore.

Advertising and its ilk will kill gaming.
OP has some good points about sequels and graphics and the like, but advertising and target demographics also play a huge part. The broader the audience the more bland the games will be. (Not a 100% rule, but close enough for jazz)
Games loose quality because they are becomming more "mainstream" and by that I mean that more people play them. And by that it sounds like I'm taking a swing at casual gamers. I'm not quite sure that I am, but I may be. *Runs off to the Thinking Dome*
 

Lord_Ascendant

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Jan 14, 2008
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wall o' text commands me to read....and read I did

Logic see I do not

you say its our fault companies make bad games?

Maybe I should turn the Psychic Beacon on and get a new idea cooked up
 

Murian

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Nov 23, 2007
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That was a loooooong negative read.

I think most of what you've said here could be applied to the movie and tv industries too - either way when industry/commerce meets creativity one always seems to suffer for the sake of the other.
 

More Fun To Compute

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Nov 18, 2008
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Gaming isn't going to die. Just avoid the ones with mould growing on them, keep your expectations in check and you will be fine.

A lot of people say that they don't really care all that much about HD or Online but would like more compelling games. This is why Wii is so popular as it offers games that a lot of people who buy it find to be new and compelling. People can be "stupid" but that doesn't mean that the games industry can sell them anything and convince them to enjoy it.

The biggest thing is that people mostly don't care that much about the things that we think they should care about and in our society it can take a lot of advertising and media exposure to change people's habits. Sony can spend money convincing people that they need a Blu-Ray player. All some of us can do for Shadow of the Colossus is to shower praise on it in every other forum post and hope that someone new happens to read it. Sony are not going to spend as much money promoting SotC as Blu-Ray.
 

Therumancer

Citation Needed
Nov 28, 2007
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Well, I have mixed opinions on all of that. I think there are more culprits than mentioned. I think one of the biggest ones is MMOs. I think the Computer RPG genere has taken such a massive hit in the last 10 years or so because for a similar amount of effort to make a good single player RPG, one can simply put things online, worry less about the storyline and the need for writing (half the people who play these things know nothing about the game lore or even read the quests) and nail both an initial software sale, and a monthly fee. Even if the game dies in six months more money has probably been made than a single player RPG would have netted.

The problem with other kinds of games is that producers have realized that it's cheaper to buy/rent someone's engine(s) than it is to have an in-house team create a new one. Games lack innovation because they are almost literally all the same. People will use things like the "GRAW" engine or the "Unreal" engine or "Havoc Physix Engine" to develop their game and all they are really doing is modifying the same engine as half the other games out there and putting in their own graphics.

I think that truthfully a lot of game designers would LIKE to make other games, but basically they have to do what the producers want, and producers by their nature are simply looking to make more money than they invest in a project as quickly as possible. Very few producers are in it for the love of gaming, or have much in the way of opinions about it. They look at something like WoW and the amount of profits it makes and then hire codemonkeys to make them a version of it, hoping to do the same thing. Without the budget or people it would take to recreate a success of that level (World Of Warcraft was developed on a massive budget by a highly skilled team that was given a totally free hand to do what they needed to, something you rarely see nowadays).

To be fair though, I can't complain too much about the lack of radical innovation. I'd much rather see more design time, better writing, and more playability within the framework of what is there.

I for one see nothing fundementally wrong with the WoW style interface for MMOs, Turn based combat for SRPGS/Party RPGs, or even how games like "Dynasty Warriors" or even the sports franchises play. I mean there is no real reason to change what isn't broken, and most attempts to do so result in complete garbage. The guys who complain about lack of innovation are oftentimes the first to cruicify a game for trying to innovate and failing.

I think what is "hurting" gaming is simply bad writing and too many people all trying to retread the same junk as before without bothering to invest any soul in it.

That said, I kind of feel that things go in cycles, and the game industry is no exception. You see a period of a lot of good stuff coming out, followed by a creative slump. Look at it this way, for a while we had a major cycle of decent TV sci-fi and fantasy TV programs like "Buffy The Vampire Slayer". Now that stuff has died out and been replaced with an endless slew of banal cop shows and sit coms. However given enough time it will swing around again and you'll see some decent stuff once more. I mean we went through a period of massive science fiction programming (Trek Vs. B5 was a defining era of TV) and then there was a slump, then we had the "Whedon Era" that produced Buffy, Charmed, etc... now we're in a slump again.

The game industry is the same way. Right now we're in the midst of a bad cycle where everything is sequel after sequel. Eventually that will fail, and the industry will again go out hunting for new blood to start new franchises and such. You'll see good writing again (even if the same interfaces probably, I think some of them are fairly ideal), and then another slump as they literally squeeze every drop of blood out of those creations.

I think the game industry is fairly recession proof, and I don't think there is any chance of it dying.


>>>----Therumancer--->