How Hard Is Too Hard?
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Too Hard? I Wanna Be The Guy. It's the sort of "memorize this shit or you die instantly" kind of hard. First you need to dodge falling apples from trees that kill you if they touch you. Then, once you've gotten past the trees and onto a high platform, you have to jump back over the trees. The apples that are remaining will FALL UP and kill you. Reflexes and skill alone are good for nothing.
I also hate times when dying at one hard part takes you way too far back, and then you have to redo a bunch of crap that isn't even hard. I like Mega Man's difficulty. The bosses are tough, but you start off each level with 3 lives, the levels are relatively short, and you have infinite continues.
I also hate times when dying at one hard part takes you way too far back, and then you have to redo a bunch of crap that isn't even hard. I like Mega Man's difficulty. The bosses are tough, but you start off each level with 3 lives, the levels are relatively short, and you have infinite continues.
No, it's a bit more than frustration.huntedannoyed said:
Team Ninja deliberately amped up the difficulty of Ninja Gaiden, and admitted to doing as such. They only allowed a lower difficulty level on the later re-releases of the game [Black and Sigma], and in Black you had to die to get to the 'easy' difficulty. The developers liked to make the game challenging, but it's far too challenging for your average gamer.
I could beat it if I wanted to, but I'd have to restart the game a third time which I'm not willing to do. A game in which you'll inevitably have to restart the game, unless you consort with GameFaqs or other strategy guides which I dislike using, more than once in order to finish it isn't looking at a good difficulty curve. Challenging the players is one thing, but drowning most of the players in difficulty is another thing entirely.
The difficulty curve for Ninja Gaiden would best be diagrammed as a cliff, really.
You think the remake is hard, stay the hell away from the NES Ninja Gaiden. There are gamers who have been trying to beat that game off and on for 19 years and still haven't succeeded.
On-topic, if a game is hard because of bad design choices like crappy controls, delayed jumping or bad camera angles, it is too hard. If a game is cheap (for prime examples, every entry under these two links: The Computer is a Cheating Bastard [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheComputerIsACheatingBastard] and SNK Boss Syndrome [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SNKBoss]) it is too hard. Otherwise, I'm usually fine with difficulty, because I feel proud of myself for victoly!
On-topic, if a game is hard because of bad design choices like crappy controls, delayed jumping or bad camera angles, it is too hard. If a game is cheap (for prime examples, every entry under these two links: The Computer is a Cheating Bastard [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheComputerIsACheatingBastard] and SNK Boss Syndrome [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SNKBoss]) it is too hard. Otherwise, I'm usually fine with difficulty, because I feel proud of myself for victoly!
I'm amazed that anyone had made it that far without mentioning I Wanna Be The Guy.OnlyWonderBoy said:
On the other hand, the whole point of the game is to be 'SO GODDAMN HARD'. So maybe dissing it for being too hard is wrong.
For... normal... games, the TVTropes on "The Computer is a Cheating Bastard" sums it up nicely.
COD 4: The TV station pissed me off more than the ending of "One Shot, One Kill". Why? Respawning enemies. Watching endless streams of enemies pour out of a room the size of a goddamn closet sets off the bullshit alarms more than watching streams of them come hungering for blood from behind buildings and airlifted in. I never even tried for Mile High Club yet.
It varies with different games. COD 4, for example is perfect because you don't have to play on veteran and if you do, it's skill that will determine your survival. Also for those that want to, can just play on recruit. Everyone is happy. Ninja Gaiden 2 on the other hand (from what I've been hearing) is so frustratingly hard that people stop playing it. Now that's is just cheap.
Shinobi for the PS2. Basically, the only way the game "challenged" me was to throw me up against mobs of enemies that could block every attack except for the right moment, when you had a split-second to do something or you'd take a wakizashi to the throat. That's too hard. When a game basically can't challenge you in any way other than saying "OK, this enemy is absolutely impossible to damage except right before his attack, at which point you press X to hurt him, or else he takes away half your life bar." Sure, some people may argue "reflexes" or "learning curve," but every game, in my opinion, ought to be able to challenge you without tossing invulnerable badguys out of the walls.
"EDIT: Oh yeah, I almost forgot. This recharging health bullshit has to stop"
I love regenerating health; I've always found that when you have a health pickup, that all too often you're dead before you know it because you HAVE to take damage to get more health.
Catch 22 much?
In any case, difficulty relies heavily on the genre. A FPS is easier to make a difficult game without cheating than a RTS...but there's still no excuse for games that are jaw dropingly easy due to bad AI.
I like my games easy-medium. Enough so that I can continue the action unhindered, but not so that it's a breeze.
I love regenerating health; I've always found that when you have a health pickup, that all too often you're dead before you know it because you HAVE to take damage to get more health.
Catch 22 much?
In any case, difficulty relies heavily on the genre. A FPS is easier to make a difficult game without cheating than a RTS...but there's still no excuse for games that are jaw dropingly easy due to bad AI.
I like my games easy-medium. Enough so that I can continue the action unhindered, but not so that it's a breeze.
Personally, if I find it hopeless, then it's too hard. If I feel like I could win if I tried again and did it a different way, that's hard enough.
People have mentioned Call of Duty 4 being too hard, and it was pretty damn challenging in places, but I loved "No fighting in the War Room" because it was just hard enough. I died tons, but every time I thought "If I use the grenade launcher, I should win this time" or "If I run through as quickly as possible, I should win this time" or something like that.
People have mentioned Call of Duty 4 being too hard, and it was pretty damn challenging in places, but I loved "No fighting in the War Room" because it was just hard enough. I died tons, but every time I thought "If I use the grenade launcher, I should win this time" or "If I run through as quickly as possible, I should win this time" or something like that.
as far as too hard games go, I have just generally given up on them entirely, and will never look back. Those games being Prince of Persia 2, the final boss battle is retarded hard that 20 attempts later and still no headway. Also, the final boss battle on expert in guitar hero 3, I barely passed slayer after about 400 attempts, only to find something even more hard to beat. Those are the only 2 games i have ever not finished in my life, but it is too frustrating to come to the end of game and find the learning/talent curve to not fit to the trend of the rest of the game.
I enjoy a challange, but it seems that every game that comes out nowadays demands that you play on "Crush your spirit, throw your controller, never play game again" diffaculty in order to feel like you accomplished something, the worst offender of this is GH3
I'm not sure a game can ever be too hard. As long as a game has a certain number of difficulty levels suitable for all potential players, then there is nothing wrong with putting a crazily hard mode for the players who choose to play it.
But if there isn't multiple difficulty levels and the game is Ninja-Gaiden like in it's gameplay, that's where you run into a problem.
Personally, I enjoy hard difficulty modes because of the extra replay value it provides. I'm fighting my way through RE4 Wii Edition on Professional mode and am really enjoying the difficulty of it. It depends on how you like your games.
But if there isn't multiple difficulty levels and the game is Ninja-Gaiden like in it's gameplay, that's where you run into a problem.
Personally, I enjoy hard difficulty modes because of the extra replay value it provides. I'm fighting my way through RE4 Wii Edition on Professional mode and am really enjoying the difficulty of it. It depends on how you like your games.
Any bit past the fifth level on MK2. I tried playing it yesterday and my megadrive barely survived the experience.
A bad example of being hard is IMO Burnout Paradise. I'm starting to play it again and now i remember why i put it down in the first place. The car's ass takes up most of your screen and the camera swivels around no matter where you want it to point, the map reading is horrible causing me to turn at a turn i didn't want to turn at, and on top of it all if you hit a car with even the slightest bump with your strongest car you have you crash and burn everywhere and the game takes the controls away from you for 10 seconds. It's a good game, but the flaws it has are just so frustrating that i don't know how i'll ever get 100% completion if it's even possible!
A good example IMHO of hard difficulty but still possible is MGS4. If you find yourself dieing on Big Boss Extreme mode a lot, just calm down and be patient and figure out your situation (assuming you're not trying to get the Big Boss Emblem). Since the game is all about patience and stealth, you're going to have to be patient and stealthy if you're going to succeed.
A good example IMHO of hard difficulty but still possible is MGS4. If you find yourself dieing on Big Boss Extreme mode a lot, just calm down and be patient and figure out your situation (assuming you're not trying to get the Big Boss Emblem). Since the game is all about patience and stealth, you're going to have to be patient and stealthy if you're going to succeed.