How is the American War for Independance taught in the UK?

[Agayek]

similar with second world war, where the american role was greatly exaggerated. it was taught as if america came to the rescue of the poor world under the jackboot of the nazis. while in reality when the u.s. quit sitting on their thumbs and landed in france in mid 44 the war already pretty much over and the soviet troops had already done the vast majority of the fighting

While it's true that the US was basically out of the war until Pearl Harbor, we most certainly were not uninvolved until '44. For example, Patton was active in North African by 1942 fighting against Rommel. We were also basically the only people fighting on the Pacific front, and that's where most of our troops ended up after Pearl Harbor.

The primary advantage the US brought to the war was the single largest production facilities of any country involved in the war, and FDR was sending as much as he could get away with to the Allies well before we officially got involved in the war.

You're definitely right, insofar as American history books are skewed towards patriotism for some god-awful reason, but it's not quite as bad as you make it out to be.

 

[googleback]

I think it's the Japanese lack of interest in the history of WW2 that's sorta creepy. The only war crime the poms committed was wearing red and walking in a straight line. BTW the red coats were because some paragon of the British officer class thought it'd stop the men freaking out over the wounded, as you'd hardly notice the bleeding and screaming over the loudness of their jackets

Kind of makes you wonder if unit 731 is mentioned at all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731

Stuff of nightmares.

Yeah and then there's HOLY FUCKSHIT BATMAN BUBONIC WHAT NOW???

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_war_crimes

some truly horrifying things. that i didn't even know about...

Hur hurrr... "Pinus"

 

[mrF00bar]

I think it's the Japanese lack of interest in the history of WW2 that's sorta creepy. The only war crime the poms committed was wearing red and walking in a straight line. BTW the red coats were because some paragon of the British officer class thought it'd stop the men freaking out over the wounded, as you'd hardly notice the bleeding and screaming over the loudness of their jackets

I thought red dye was just a lot cheaper?

 

[Timmey]

If the English hadn't been fighting the French, Spanish and Dutch its unlikely that you'd have won.

Britain's wars with its former colonies were considered a bit of a sideshow.

Yes, but you lost the war of American Revolution. A rag-tag band of revolutionaries from a 150 year old set of sparsely populated colonies beat a global, highly-developed empire. We are aware of your country's prestigious position during that time period. We are also aware that you lost, and should probably stop appearing butt hurt about it, especially considering how much the tables have turned in the modern day.

Well that's a wee bit rich if I may say so, lets not forget the massive French involvement, it was hardly a rag-tag band of revolutionaries that defeated us, more one of our closest rivals that chose the war of independence as a stage to fight us.

 

[Byere]

Far as I remember, the only thing they ever taught my classes in history was about world war 1 & 2... nothing before or after. 8 years of History work... all on the same subject...

And they wonder why I dropped it in lieu of taking Geography for my GSCEs...

 

[electric_warrior]

It isn't really, but then why should it be? We weren't even taught about Communist Russia or Vietnam, both of which are far more relevant to the world we live in now, so the American war of Independence seems all too remote and unimportant. I mean, now we're small, but we used to control a quarter of the world and America didn't used to be the big superpower it is now. Ultimately, in terms of our loss of empire, losing the USA wasn't at all significant and isn't nearly as significant to us as it is to you. In short, while it may be a big part of your history, its a minor incident in ours so we don't teach it. This isn't intended to sound arrogant, but as a country that's existed in more or less an unchanged form for nearly 1000 years, had kings, civil wars, an empire (then lost it), was a key player in both world wars and has been a major player in world politics for most of that time, we just have too much history to fit everything in.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

I think it's the Japanese lack of interest in the history of WW2 that's sorta creepy. The only war crime the poms committed was wearing red and walking in a straight line. BTW the red coats were because some paragon of the British officer class thought it'd stop the men freaking out over the wounded, as you'd hardly notice the bleeding and screaming over the loudness of their jackets

I thought red dye was just a lot cheaper?

I love the way his upper class logic completely jumped over the fact that they would be easier to shoot at...

 

[TheGuyWithThatHair]

First off i'm British, and since we lost that particular war its not covered in great detail (i'm doing a GSCE in history and its never been mentioned). Mainly because there are to many stuck up pricks in this country.

 

[googleback]

If the English hadn't been fighting the French, Spanish and Dutch its unlikely that you'd have won.

Britain's wars with its former colonies were considered a bit of a sideshow.

Yes, but you lost the war of American Revolution. A rag-tag band of revolutionaries from a 150 year old set of sparsely populated colonies beat a global, highly-developed empire. We are aware of your country's prestigious position during that time period. We are also aware that you lost, and should probably stop appearing butt hurt about it, especially considering how much the tables have turned in the modern day.

Well that's a wee bit rich if I may say so, lets not forget the massive French involvement, it was hardly a rag-tag band of revolutionaries that defeated us, more one of our closest rivals that chose the war of independence as a stage to fight us.

Seriously guys? Seriosuly?

I've never understood why people who weren't even alive at the time try to take credit for things... as if any of it is somehow relevant to who we are now.

NEITHER OF YOU DID ANYTHING. It's HISTORY.

 

[Agayek]

Well that's a wee bit rich if I may say so, lets not forget the massive French involvement, it was hardly a rag-tag band of revolutionaries that defeated us, more one of our closest rivals that chose the war of independence as a stage to fight us.

Lies! Lies and slander! The French couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag, Napoleon hadn't even grabbed power yet! They most certainly had nothing to do with the siege of Yorktown or the defeat of Cornwallis. No siree.

 

[comadorcrack]

They are at A-Level history, and in A LOT of detail, as well as other aspects of poor relief during that period.

I am aware of this as I took A-Level history.
Let me clarify what I meant. The subject should be taught when history is compulsory, its a very important part of British history, and frankly isn't that what history is all about, Learning from your mistakes?

 

[Doclector]

It isn't. I wish it was, though, it sounds fascinating, although, of course, terrible.

I don't need your civil war...

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

First off i'm British, and since we lost that particular war its not covered in great detail (i'm doing a GSCE in history and its never been mentioned). Mainly because there are to many stuck up pricks in this country.

When I was at school it was covered in the American West module. That was a long time ago mind (cries at being old) It is possible that they don't want to disrupt this nice relationship we have going on with America atm. British historians seem eager enough to bring up our mistakes. A level History uses books by American authors on the American War of Independance as far as I remember.

 

[Robert Ewing]

The Indian independence is taught more in the UK because it was more important than American Independence. But even the Indian revolution isn't taught THAT much. American history isn't considered important enough. We CAN learn about the 'wild west' on some courses. And we learn a lot about JFK. But thats the absolute extent of American subjects.

 

[Agayek]

I love the way his upper class logic completely jumped over the fact that they would be easier to shoot at...

Back when they designed the uniforms, war had "rules". These rules generally were agreed to be:

-Stand in a line
-Shoot at each other
-The dude with the most dudes left wins

It was a very, very silly way to conduct war (not to mention one of the primary reasons the US actually won in the revolution). Thankfully, they've wised up since then.

 

[googleback]

They are at A-Level history, and in A LOT of detail, as well as other aspects of poor relief during that period.

I am aware of this as I took A-Level history.
Let me clarify what I meant. The subject should be taught when history is compulsory, its a very important part of British history, and frankly isn't that what history is all about, Learning from your mistakes?

One thing I wasn't really taught about was Vietnam, is that covered much in America?

 

[Kathinka]

it was taught as if america came to the rescue of the poor world under the jackboot of the nazis. while in reality when the u.s. quit sitting on their thumbs and landed in france in mid 44 the war already pretty much over and the soviet troops had already done the vast majority of the fighting

Wait wait, so Americans are the only ignorant people on earth?

Here's your history lesson.

December 7th, 1941 was the beginning of full U.S. involvement. We single-handedly (with some very poorly executed, basically ineffective help from our European allies) defeated the Empire of Japan. Four days after the Pearl Harbor attack, we declared war on Germany and Italy.

In addition to our war against the Japanese, who happened to have a very powerful and experienced Navy at the time, we conducted operations in North Africa, and continued a steady stream of materiel shipments to Britain.

It didn't take long for America to roll into Italy and put an end to their involvement in the war. A mostly American force swept Sicily in 1943 and worked its way up Italy quite handily.

And of course, upon the D-day invasion, America became the majority of the allied fighting power in the western front.

There's a hell of a lot more, but I likely already lost you.

i didn't say that the u.s. did nothing. if you would be able/ready to read what i wrote properly, you would not have missed that. it's just that the role of america is grossely overestimated in american classrooms (in connection with the soviet contribution greatly downplayed. leftovers from the cold war i suppose).

talking strictly about the european theatre of course. don't know too much about the pacific.

 

[Tallim]

I think if our Prime Minister and President are down with having barbecues in the back of Number 10 we can all leave that behind us right?

Spoiler: Nothing is on fire so not a real British BBQ

LOL. That's so true. It also isn't pouring with rain and having to be cooked under the grill in the kitchen.

 

[Agayek]

The Indian independence is taught more in the UK because it was more important than American Independence. But even the Indian revolution isn't taught THAT much. American history isn't considered important enough. We CAN learn about the 'wild west' on some courses. And we learn a lot about JFK. But thats the absolute extent of American subjects.

Just out of curiousity, do they ever touch on the Great Depression? I'm not terribly well-informed on the foreign impacts of it, aside from the effect it had on Germany and the consequences thereof (ie, Hitler), so I'm just curious if it's deemed "important".