hue

[frehls]

hue

 

[WoW Killer]

No. Gamers are not acting entitled enough. They are spending money on a product that they are dissatisfied with. Gamers need to understand that they are the consumers, the consumers are always right, and that the way to change an industry is to vote with your wallet. Shame on anybody who complained about a product but still bought it.

 

[dreadedcandiru99]

Basically what we have here are refutations of the "entitlement" bullshit gaming media and devs/publishers are slinging around like howling monkeys.

Total Biscuit on entitlement (starts at 10:49): "Stop thinking you can't make demands. This is how capitalism works." [http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=0sYp-eggD1Q#t=649s]

 

[Lucem712]

I see a-lot of people adopting the 'it's their art, they can do as they please' but I can't really agree with that. Once you put something up for public sale as a product, it ceases to be just art. Your consumers have a right to criticize your product and ask for changes. It's up to you to give it to them, but they have a right.

If I were say the artist/writer of a popular graphic novel and I decided to kill off the main character in a chapter, sure it's my art and I have the right to do that. The people that purchase the graphic novel have the right to be upset and criticize my choices and even ask me to re-write it or non-canonize it.

Because in the end, I'm not making this graphic novel for myself, I'm making it to entertain and give pleasure. If I'm not doing that, what's the point?

 

[BloatedGuppy]

I see a-lot of people adopting the 'it's their art, they can do as they please' but I can't really agree with that. Once you put something up for public sale as a product, it ceases to be just art. Your consumers have a right to criticize your product and ask for changes. It's up to you to give it to them, but they have a right.

If I were say the artist/writer of a popular graphic novel and I decided to kill off the main character in a chapter, sure it's my art and I have the right to do that. The people that purchase the graphic novel have the right to be upset and criticize my choices and even ask me to re-write it or non-canonize it.

Because in the end, I'm not making this graphic novel for myself, I'm making it to entertain and give pleasure. If I'm not doing that, what's the point?

Tycho from Penny Arcade on the concept of the artist's vision being sacrosanct:

There?s a countercharge now, in response to anger about the endings, that describes Bioware?s output as sacrosanct in some way - beyond criticism. This is fundamentally batshit, or as noted ?speculative fiction? author Harlan Ellison might say, bugfuck. I?m fine with the ending, which to my mind started as soon as I ran the executable - the whole game is denouement - but I revolt against the idea of Authorial Divinity almost at the molecular level. I bet Ken Levine would take a redo on Bioshock, for example. To hear them tell it, there is plenty about Deus Ex: Human Revolution the developer would change. Fallout?s ?Broken Steel? DLC actually does modify the ending considerably.

 

[Buzz Killington_v1legacy]

What do I think? This "entitlement" thing people are trying to spread is exactly what you said it is: bullshit. If I pay someone to paint a mural on my wall and 95% of it is, say, a tasteful and inspiring view of 1590s London and 5% is GIANT SPEWING DONGS, am I acting "entitled" if I complain?

Or if I have someone build me a house, and everything is absolutely perfect except for the fact that opening the bedroom door causes a spring-loaded boxing glove to punch me in the balls, am I being "entitled" if I think that part of the house needs some serious work before the whole thing is complete to my satisfaction?

 

[Lucem712]

Or if I have someone build me a house, and everything is absolutely perfect except for the fact that opening the bedroom door causes a spring-loaded boxing glove to punch me in the balls, am I being "entitled" if I think that part of the house needs some serious work before the whole thing is complete to my satisfaction?

As an aspiring architect, that's going into all my future designs.

 

[Vegosiux]

As I said many times, it seems it's easier to guilt trip your customers than it is to do actual work. But good luck keeping them with that attitude.

 

[WoW Killer]

Total Biscuit on entitlement (starts at 10:49): "Stop thinking you can't make demands. This is how capitalism works." [http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=0sYp-eggD1Q#t=649s]

You know I saw TBs original video calling a boycott on ME3, and I thought he missed the mark slightly (as in, we shouldn't be uniting in or against anything at all - the whole group think is half the problem - but rather we should be seriously considering individually our rights to not purchase). But watching that vid you just linked, I see he's got the right position firmly nailed down. Good for him; he's spot on.

 

[Harb]

There is nothing wrong with the word "entitled", which probably has as much negative background as "morning". I am (personally) entitled to demand certain quality and certain level of treatment and if I don't get it, I simply move somewhere else. If gamers don't act like entitled customers they are just hurting the industry and probably have no clue what that word means.

I'm a fking entitled customer and I'm proud of it! It's my money, deal with it. May sound arrogant, but that's the market's reality. If I don't pursue my demands (through wallet decisions) the companies will just sweep the floor with me.

Also I don't believe gamers are entitled enough and the current climate (where people who act as entitled are being shown in negative fashion) only proves that gamers as a whole aren't mature enough and deserve what they are getting from companies like EA or Activision.
You require a clean dish, fork and knife when you go to a restaurant (because you pay). Same principal.

 

[Fr]anc[is]

Entitlement doesn't mean anything in the context of this ME3 debate anymore. There isn't even a debate anymore. It's just pissed off gamers and annoyed trolls parroting the same three or four arguments and the same half a dozen keywords.

 

[Black Arrow Officer]

Holy shit, Forbes guys know what they're talking about. And yes, I am entitled to complain. You can't just ignore your paying customers and plug your ears going "lalalala I can't hear you!". Too often, well thought out posts with deeply explained criticisms are shut out by the "stfu dud its there game n they can do wath dey wan" posts. And not listening to your fans has consequences, look at what happened to TOR. The failure of Bioware to listen to their fans caused a huge exodus of players.

 

[GonzoGamer]

No. Gamers are not acting entitled enough. They are spending money on a product that they are dissatisfied with. Gamers need to understand that they are the consumers, the consumers are always right, and that the way to change an industry is to vote with your wallet. Shame on anybody who complained about a product but still bought it.

So much of this.

There are many gamers who need to realize that paying $60 for a product does actually "entitle" you to a few things.
I am very glad to see that others are starting to get tired of the rampant misuse of the term which has plagued gamers lately. Some like to use it because they think it wins their argument but they don't understand that in the proper context, they're just making themselves look like idiots.

 

[applesandoranges]

edit

 

[Chemical Alia]

I don't play games that I don't like or don't think are worth my money. It's worked great for years.

 

[Smiley Face]

Gamers aren't 'acting entitled', by which I mean that they are ACTUALLY entitled to do what they're doing and there's nothing wrong with that. They're seeing something that is of evidently poor quality, and they are pointing that out. They may go a little far at times, but they're criticizing something for being bad, and shouting at the top of their lungs that it sucks, in the hopes that someone will take the hint and put a little effort into making something that doesn't suck that way. People do it with all sorts of other things, why make games any different? Would you PREFER that there was a universally enforced ban on criticizing anything, ever? Imagine the problems that would cause, not to mention how monumentally stupid of an idea it is.

 

[spectrenihlus]

I don't play games that I don't like or don't think are worth my money. It's worked great for years.

But we did think it was worth it and except for the last 5 minutes it was. If they just change the ending the majority of us will be happy.

 

[TheOtter]

I firmly believe we as consumers have a right to ask the creator of a product to change something we don't like. Then those creators have the right to decline our request. However, by us expressing our dislike of something we are letting those companies know that whatever they did was something we did not like and we would like it if they changed it.

Sure, it is their product but they are expecting to sell it and the best way to do that is to keep your consumer base happy. Just tossing out some "it's our product, we will do what we want" just doesn't cut it for me. Sure, it is your product but that doesn't mean I have to buy it from you or support future things.



Also, Forbes as a source for gaming news? Amazing. I've been sort of not liking this site too much recently (just come to support LRR mostly) so maybe that is a good alternative...


Plus maybe I can catch up on some stocks!

 

[ResonanceSD]

Basically what we have here are refutations of the "entitlement" bullshit gaming media and devs/publishers are slinging around like howling monkeys.

Total Biscuit on entitlement (starts at 10:49): "Stop thinking you can't make demands. This is how capitalism works." [http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=0sYp-eggD1Q#t=649s]

I <3 Cynical Brit. ^_^

Also yes, gamers are entitled, to an extent. But at the same time, we're consumers of a product. And beyond all expectations, keep buying utter garbage. Stop buying crap, people, and crap will cease to be made.