Hulk liked the ME3 ending

[tautologico]

So, Film Critic Hulk (for those who are not familiar with him, he's a incredibly insightful critic of movies, especially considering he writes in all caps in Hulk-speak; he commented on games on occasion) liked the ending of ME3, even the original ending, and wrote an essay defending it. As always, it's a very interesting read even if you don't agree with him. Well, maybe not for people who can't appreciate good arguments unless they agree with them. Here it is:

Film Crit Hulk Smash: A Few Words On The Ending Of MASS EFFECT 3 [http://badassdigest.com/2012/08/06/film-crit-hulk-smash-a-few-words-on-the-ending-of-mass-effect-3/]

 

[Aerosteam]

I don't know why, but when I'm reading this I'm imagining it's the actual Hulk talking. >_<

Just to save me from excessive reading, is Hulk taking into account the plot-holes and lack of closure? Is he familiar with the series?

 

[tippy2k2]

Sweet zombie Jesus, why in the hell does he capitalize everything (yes, I get he's "The Hulk" but it's mildly annoying to me)?

Anyway, it sounds like his reasoning and my reasoning for enjoying the ending are pretty well in sync ((I haven't bothered to write down my reasons in one post; it's scattered in this thread [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.354725-Mass-Effect-3s-ending-wasnt-that-bad?page=1]. I suppose if someone REALLY wants me to put down my own big post with my reasoning for liking the ending I can).

I did only skim through the article so maybe he said stuff I'd disagree with but his analysis on the cycles (I called it fate in my posts) is the exact reason why I liked the endings.

*Also note: I have not played the Extended Cut

 

[SeeIn2D]

I don't know why, but when I'm reading this I'm imagining it's the actual Hulk talking.

I did the exact same thing, you sir, are not alone.

 

[crazyrabbits]

I don't know why, but when I'm reading this I'm imagining it's the actual Hulk talking. >_<

Just to save me from excessive reading, is Hulk taking into account the plot-holes and lack of closure? Is he familiar with the series?

Seems like a "no" on either case. He makes the assumption that if you don't like the ending, you don't like art (which has been bashed to death over the past few months).

 

[tautologico]

There are good, balanced rebuttals in the comments. I don't agree completely with him either, but I do think the ending has more merit than it's generally given. And he has been very critical of video game writing in the past, talking in general but using ME1 as an example (especifically about rehashing the Hero journey, if I remember correctly).

 

[tautologico]

I don't know why, but when I'm reading this I'm imagining it's the actual Hulk talking. >_<

Yeah, that's one of the fun things about reading him

 

[Andrewtheeviscerator]

Huh, well now I have the perfect thing to send to people who try to tell me that the Mass Effect ending was the worst thing ever.

I also enjoyed how he told that drooling retard in the video to shut the fuck up and then proceed to rip him and his argument apart.

 

[Savo]

He clearly thought about his position and presented it well. I enjoyed reading a well-thought out differing opinion for once. Honestly, this is one of the VERY few defenses of the ending I've read that made any sense at all.

But I can't agree on most of it. He talks about art, but how was ME3's ending artistic expression? It was slammed together at the end of production (possibly by one writer shutting out the rest of the team, we'll probably never know for sure). Also, why would you lie about art? Casey Hudson and co. kept misleading the fans about how the series would end all the way up to release day, which pretty much eliminates any artistic standing they would have had.

I'm not even going to go into them whipping out the ultimate deus ex machina at the last possible second...

I did like his point about the characters though. Although I felt that we should have seen more of what happened to them (how they lived their lives after all that happened), I can dig how we really were letting go of them throughout the game and particularly right at the end where you have heart to heart conversations with your crew. I had shivers going down my spine when I talked to Garrus for the last time.

So yeah, interesting article. I did think he got too antagonistic about the whole "if you don't like ME3's ending, you don't like art" thing.

 

[Vanitas likes Bubbles]

When I read the title, I was like "Wow!.... Edward Norton plays Mass Effect? Respect points to him." Then I was disappointed by the fact it was another random internet person.

 

[Gethsemani_v1legacy]

I'd be more inclined to agree with Hulk's assessment if the ME games had actually given me some clues that they were about these "cycles" from the start. The first two games doesn't reflect this kind of analysis at all and are in fact dedicated to the theme of shaping ones own fate. Then the third game comes along and starts vaguely suggesting that maybe Shephard has no choice. In the end, we are not being given any indications about "cycles" or "the choices of life", we (as the players) are being set up for what we assume will be a standard, but satisfying, Final Epic Battle. But we are denied even that.

Whatever or not the ending is art, I'd still argue that it breaks the most basic foundation of storytelling: the trust of the listener in the storyteller. The ME3 ending comes out of the blue completely unannounced, breaks all the major thematic threads of the game up until that point and starts a new thematic thread literarly 5 minutes before the end. We never get to explore this theme either, because we are instantly forced to make a choice based on it. And then the game ends.

Add to this the fact that we have an entire game mechanic that has no real purporse (the warscore) because it is just a red herring and that the ending invalidates everything that the player has done up until that point in the game and you'll see that I am not pissed the game didn't end the way I wanted. I am annoyed because the game (as the storyteller) seems to go out of its' way to deliver a curveball ending that isn't necessary and feels out of place compared to the rest of the game. It is a complete break in tone, theme and mood and it comes completely unannounced. That's why I am annoyed with it, because it isn't telegraphed properly and isn't supported by the rest of the game.

 

[Frission]

I thought the problem on M3 was over.

My feelings? He's a bit too melodramatic when it comes to the controversy. I mean "death of storytelling"? Really? I disagree with some things he says,but a fan underneath it says it in a better fashion than I ever could.

"As for your comments about those who dislike the endings, I understand that many sounded entitled and immature. But disliking the endings is not a rejection of artistry in games, it is a rejection of the specific artistic choices that the artists who created Mass Effect made in crafting the ending of their wonderful series. Just like people who disliked Lost?s ending or Battlestar Galactica?s ending."

 

[bafrali]

H&#305;s most glaring mistake was to compare movies to games.

Otherwise he is late to the pretentious writers bandwagon. If he was writing his opinions, i could respect that but then he decided to bash on other's opinions for something that isn't even worth discussing anymore. Caps didn't help either

 

[thethird0611]

I don't know why, but when I'm reading this I'm imagining it's the actual Hulk talking. >_<

Just to save me from excessive reading, is Hulk taking into account the plot-holes and lack of closure? Is he familiar with the series?

Dont listen to the other guy, he did lay it out extremly well. If I were to tell you exactly why I liked the ending and why I think most of the complaints are stupid, this would be it. It was WELL thought out.

 

[Frission]

I'd be more inclined to agree with Hulk's assessment if the ME games had actually given me some clues that they were about these "cycles" from the start. The first two games doesn't reflect this kind of analysis at all and are in fact dedicated to the theme of shaping ones own fate. Then the third game comes along and starts vaguely suggesting that maybe Shephard has no choice. In the end, we are not being given any indications about "cycles" or "the choices of life", we (as the players) are being set up for what we assume will be a standard, but satisfying, Final Epic Battle. But we are denied even that.

Whatever or not the ending is art, I'd still argue that it breaks the most basic foundation of storytelling: the trust of the listener in the storyteller. The ME3 ending comes out of the blue completely unannounced, breaks all the major thematic threads of the game up until that point and starts a new thematic thread literarly 5 minutes before the end. We never get to explore this theme either, because we are instantly forced to make a choice based on it. And then the game ends.

Add to this the fact that we have an entire game mechanic that has no real purporse (the warscore) because it is just a red herring and that the ending invalidates everything that the player has done up until that point in the game and you'll see that I am not pissed the game didn't end the way I wanted. I am annoyed because the game (as the storyteller) seems to go out of its' way to deliver a curveball ending that isn't necessary and feels out of place compared to the rest of the game. It is a complete break in tone, theme and mood and it comes completely unannounced. That's why I am annoyed with it, because it isn't telegraphed properly and isn't supported by the rest of the game.

My main problem with it was that it was badly implemented. More than anything else I would have been pleased with a good twist. The ending wasn't, it was just badly made overall.

I mean, I didn't expect the catalyst to just blow all the reapers away. That would have been too easy. They could have picked a better theme altogether though.

In response to his declaration that it's all about cycles, I can say that there were several different themes. He just cherry picked the one that suited him.

What about letting go of old grudges to work together? Or the fact that sometimes you to sacrifice something to get something else?

The fact that he straw man's his opposition does not make it a good article.

(Although he had a point about the fact that the whole game is saying goodbye to all the characters.)

 

[Unsilenced]

I'd say that if an ending makes a huge part of the fanbase shit incoherent rage for months, it probably wasn't great overall. I mean, that didn't just happen because of a planetary alignment or something, and don't even give me that "nobody would have liked it no matter what." Series have actually ended in the past without their fanbase going hulk. It can happen.

If you liked it, that's great and all, but art is a place where popular opinion matters. Say all you want about your reasons for why you did or did not like it, if someone had a genuinely negative reaction to it, you can't really say that that reaction was objectively wrong.


I hate to re-hash old arguments, but after having played through both the extended cut and the normal ending, my biggest problem basically comes down to presentation. The entire game builds up how big of a battle this is going to be, and how it's the last, best hope for all life. Billions will die, thousands of ships will be destroyed, families will be torn apart, but it will all be worth it because, through pure force of conviction and steel-hearted courage we can...


We can...



We can...


...


Convince a glowing Anakin Skywalker to let us win.

Um... yay?

Now I know what you're going to say, there was a whole lot more to it to that. And you're right. In the end, Shepard defied the very laws of nature, spat in the face of mortal restrictions and won a duel with the gods.

...but it all happens in a cutscene with a glowy podracer kid who seems kind of ambivalent about the whole thing.

Fuck that.

 

[Zaik]

Is he just trolling like moviebob does?

A majority of his argument seems to be "you're wrong because I say so".

 

[Deadyawn]

Eh, I'd read this but generally speaking I don't pay attention to game critiques from film critics.

 

[johnnnny guitar]

Whatever I'm over the ending it was shit, original and extended in my eyes the last thing we need to do is start opening old wounds.

Not to mention the story is full of plot holes the game is just an action game instead of character focused and the game suc........
See I'm already starting to get my nerdrage hat on.