I don't get it...

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MysticSlayer

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BioShock Infinite. I still don't see what people see in the characters or story, even if I understand them on a descriptive or analytical level. I can see why people can like the first half of the game, because there is enough good in it to overlook most of the flaws. After that, though, I just don't get it at all.

I've also never gotten the Marvel movies or the Hunger Games movies. Then again, I don't get most movies, but those two in particular are ones everyone raves about yet I just can't seem to understand the appeal no matter how hard I try.

lacktheknack said:
And if anyone's going to reflexively link me to Gojira (again) or Meshuggah (again) to show me what I'm missing, I'm going to reflexively link you to Blank Banshee, Aphex Twin, Jon Hopkins, Avicii, Azealia Banks, Pharmakon, Brian Eno, and Lizst. Just so you're warned.

OK, I know they're not the same as Gojira and Meshuggah, but I couldn't let that opportunity pass.
 

Mahorfeus

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One Piece.

I get the impression that a lot of Weekly Shounen Jump's series are somewhat overrated, but I've always thought that One Piece was particularly so. It has consistently gotten top sales and ratings on WSJ's charts for years now. Its success has become an expectation of any new series that debuts in the magazine; at least a few have been canceled outright because they didn't roll in the ratings quickly enough.

I am not saying that the series is without merits or anything, but it has just never really tickled my fancy. Granted, I still keep up with it, because I make it a point to read all of the "Big Three." Especially since the other two are supposed to end relatively soon.
 

lacktheknack

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MysticSlayer said:
lacktheknack said:
And if anyone's going to reflexively link me to Gojira (again) or Meshuggah (again) to show me what I'm missing, I'm going to reflexively link you to Blank Banshee, Aphex Twin, Jon Hopkins, Avicii, Azealia Banks, Pharmakon, Brian Eno, and Lizst. Just so you're warned.

OK, I know they're not the same as Gojira and Meshuggah, but I couldn't let that opportunity pass.
I'm so tempted to flood you with Morgan Page, deadmau5, Skrillex, Boards of Canada, Jai Paul, Merzbow, Chopin and Macklemore.

Cheeky. :p
 

SKBPinkie

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Coppernerves said:
You know, the one leading to all the "special snowflake syndromes" and hipsters bodging bits of counter-culture to themselves in desperate, but lazy and thoughtless attempts to be more individual.
Boy, you missed the point so hard. Also, try not to be so cynical.

Watch the movie. It's pretty funny, got interesting characters, good music, an interesting twist on the standard Disney movie, etc. Plus, it's one of those things that is earnest and simple, and serves as a good break after watching something like Game of Thrones or the Walking Dead. Just non-stressful, old-fashioned fun.

OT: Bioshock Infinite and The Last of Us. Both have fantastic writing, but holy crap - their gameplay is flat out boring. I don't enjoy playing games where I need to slog through the game just to reach the next cutscene. That's not enough motivation for me, however good the story is.
 

Gorrath

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lacktheknack said:
>_>

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Metal.

I dun geddit. It's not as harsh as noise, it's not as melody-driven as classical, it's not as lyrically punchy as hip-hop, it's not as fun as pop, it's not as flowing as dance, it's not as technical as non-dance electronic, it's not as moody as ambient, and it's not as interesting as experimental stuff. It's the ultimate in "middling everything", with the only thing making it stand out is its volume.

That's not to say I don't appreciate metal or respect it as a decent music genre, but the sheer number of "metal or die" metalheads truly baffles me. Just... why? Electroheads and hip-hop addicts makes sense to me. Classical elitists make sense. I even get ravers. But metalheads? I dun geddit.

And if anyone's going to reflexively link me to Gojira (again) or Meshuggah (again) to show me what I'm missing, I'm going to reflexively link you to Blank Banshee, Aphex Twin, Jon Hopkins, Avicii, Azealia Banks, Pharmakon, Brian Eno, and Lizst. Just so you're warned.
I enjoy music from every genre you've mentioned, including metal. But I'm not going to expect to convert you to liking something you don't get, that's just silly. All I can say is that I enjoy the themes and movements used by some metal bands.

Why so many metal heads? Same reason for any other genre of music that heavily influences personal identity. It's all about theme. You seem to understand this part based on what you say about Electroheads ect. so why would it be so different for metal? It's just affectation and personal identity appropriated by youths (though not exclusively) looking for who they are. It's all about art speaking to people and influencing them culturally. Out of curiosity, why do you understand this with other genres and not metal specifically?
 

Dandark

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I cannot understand why Flappy bird got so popular. Its not that fun a game and there are lots of similar games like it yet it somehow became this insane money making hit despite being even worse than the crappy free flash games you find on the internet.
 

Raikas

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I don't get most popular TV shows. Even if it's something I ought to enjoy (or would enjoy if it was a book/movie/comic/game) I have a hard time watching any of them.


Fox12 said:
Still, I don't think it's fair to compare Frozen to The Lion King, Beauty and the Beast, or even recent films like UP, which I do think were fairly brilliant, whereas Frozen felt somewhat average.
Kids seem to love it though. I know my nieces (and the younger nephews) are all watching it on repeat - god knows little kids will watch any crap over and over, but even the 10+ ones seem to be into this one. And the toys are selling out like mad - I made the mistake of taking my niece into a Disney Store the other day and ended up hearing way too many adults whinging about their inability to find the Elsa dolls that their daughters were begging for.

Maybe it's winning awards for political messages, but I think it's mostly popular because of smart marketing to kids while also being palatable for adults.
 

lacktheknack

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Gorrath said:
lacktheknack said:
>_>

<_____>

<_________>

<______<

Metal.

I dun geddit. It's not as harsh as noise, it's not as melody-driven as classical, it's not as lyrically punchy as hip-hop, it's not as fun as pop, it's not as flowing as dance, it's not as technical as non-dance electronic, it's not as moody as ambient, and it's not as interesting as experimental stuff. It's the ultimate in "middling everything", with the only thing making it stand out is its volume.

That's not to say I don't appreciate metal or respect it as a decent music genre, but the sheer number of "metal or die" metalheads truly baffles me. Just... why? Electroheads and hip-hop addicts makes sense to me. Classical elitists make sense. I even get ravers. But metalheads? I dun geddit.

And if anyone's going to reflexively link me to Gojira (again) or Meshuggah (again) to show me what I'm missing, I'm going to reflexively link you to Blank Banshee, Aphex Twin, Jon Hopkins, Avicii, Azealia Banks, Pharmakon, Brian Eno, and Lizst. Just so you're warned.
I enjoy music from every genre you've mentioned, including metal. But I'm not going to expect to convert you to liking something you don't get, that's just silly. All I can say is that I enjoy the themes and movements used by some metal bands.

Why so many metal heads? Same reason for any other genre of music that heavily influences personal identity. It's all about theme. You seem to understand this part based on what you say about Electroheads ect. so why would it be so different for metal? It's just affectation and personal identity appropriated by youths (though not exclusively) looking for who they are. It's all about art speaking to people and influencing them culturally. Out of curiosity, why do you understand this with other genres and not metal specifically?
It may be silly, but there are silly people on this site. I remember seeing one guy saying he straight up disliked the bass-heaviness, volume, themes and intensity of metal... and then someone linked him Gojira to "prove him wrong". Because that'll work.

Anyways, I also don't get the idea of "personal identity heavily linked with choice of music", especially to the exclusion of other genres. Music seems like a weak thing to tie your identity to so heavily.

Ravers make sense to me because rave music is heavily tied with the rave scene and all its trappings, including drugs, socializing and party-til-you-puke all-nighters (which is desirable, apparently). Electroheads and classical elitists tend to focus on technical aspects, which makes music a bit like a giant puzzle or complex painting, and it's a visceral thrill to tease the artist's decisions apart. Hip-hop is more obviously about message and social commentary, so I can see people flocking to it for those reasons. None of these factor in the identity aspect.

Metal, rock, pop, noise, etc... I don't understand why those attract large numbers of exclusionaries (metal has the largest exclusionary group). But of course, I also don't get why people would tie their identity to ANY genre, so...
 

bartholen_v1legacy

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I don't get being a die hard fan of anything in general. It just seems odd to me that something could be so utterly perfect to someone that they also decide to buy every single piece of merchandising related to it, fawn over tweets of their favorite actors/musicians/celebrities etc. or feverishly defend it to their dying breath when someone says they don't care for it so much. It just seems so one-sided and to be honest, a little ignorant. Star Wars fans who continue to weep about Phantom Menace to this day are a perfect example of this.
 

TKhanman

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Let it go. I just didn't enjoy the tune of that one. I guess the idea of be yourself is a nice message but i just didn't enjoy it. Do You Want to Build a Snowman however I found more enjoyable.
 

Pickles

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lacktheknack said:
>_>

<_____>

<_________>

<______<

Metal.

I dun geddit. It's not as harsh as noise, it's not as melody-driven as classical, it's not as lyrically punchy as hip-hop, it's not as fun as pop, it's not as flowing as dance, it's not as technical as non-dance electronic, it's not as moody as ambient, and it's not as interesting as experimental stuff. It's the ultimate in "middling everything", with the only thing making it stand out is its volume.

That's not to say I don't appreciate metal or respect it as a decent music genre, but the sheer number of "metal or die" metalheads truly baffles me. Just... why? Electroheads and hip-hop addicts makes sense to me. Classical elitists make sense. I even get ravers. But metalheads? I dun geddit. I have to be in a very specific mood to really enjoy metal.

And if anyone's going to reflexively link me to Gojira (again) or Meshuggah (again) to show me what I'm missing, I'm going to reflexively link you to Blank Banshee, Aphex Twin, Jon Hopkins, Avicii, Azealia Banks, Pharmakon, Brian Eno, and Lizst. Just so you're warned.
Im a big fan of a lot of metal stuff but It's definitely not the only genre I like. That said Im not hugely into bands like Gojira and Meshuggah.
I'll resist the urge to link you something here, but one of my favourite metal (a lot of people would kill me for that, I guess its hardcore) albums is travels by defeater. Its a concept album that tells a story which I don't think would come across as strongly in any other genre. Turns out screaming your lungs out can be a pretty good way to convey emotion. If you can be bothered to check it out I'd highly recommend it.

Edit: Typo, and I know you weren't looking for recs or anything, but thought I'd recommend something that doesn't purely rely on volume in case you're curious. also because I feel this most certainly falls under the category of 'lyrically punchy'
 

Hero of Lime

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To me, it just seemed like one of those things the internet latched on and made extremely popular. The same thing sort of happened with the Lego Movie, I can't attest to its quality, but according to people I know who saw it, it was not anything special. Go on the internet, and you would think the Lego Movie was the best thing ever. It's the same deal with Frozen,, however being a Disney movie, it got more exposure.

I won't comment on Frozen's quality, but I can tell if I ever see it, I'll be mildly disappointed. The same thing happened when I saw the Avengers, it was a good movie, but I am a bit surprised it was such an incredible success.
 

lacktheknack

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gianttalkingpickle said:
I'll resist the urge to link you something here, but one of my favourite metal (a lot of people would kill me for that, I guess its hardcore) albums is travels by defeater. Its a concept album that tells a story which I don't think would come across as strongly in any other genre. Turns out screaming your lungs out can be a pretty good way to convey emotion. If you can be bothered to check it out I'd highly recommend it.

Edit: Typo
Duly noted, may look into it. That said, when it comes to screaming conveying emotion, <link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2S_LWdwI1c>noise still wins.
 

Pickles

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lacktheknack said:
gianttalkingpickle said:
I'll resist the urge to link you something here, but one of my favourite metal (a lot of people would kill me for that, I guess its hardcore) albums is travels by defeater. Its a concept album that tells a story which I don't think would come across as strongly in any other genre. Turns out screaming your lungs out can be a pretty good way to convey emotion. If you can be bothered to check it out I'd highly recommend it.

Edit: Typo
Duly noted, may look into it. That said, when it comes to screaming conveying emotion, <link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2S_LWdwI1c>noise still wins.
touche. This will haunt me when I try to go sleep tonight.
Well played indeed sir.
 

Gorrath

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lacktheknack said:
It may be silly, but there are silly people on this site. I remember seeing one guy saying he straight up disliked the bass-heaviness, volume, themes and intensity of metal... and then someone linked him Gojira to "prove him wrong". Because that'll work.
Well, I'm not here to prove anyone wrong about what they should like. I find the notion hilariously absurd. It'd be like someone trying to prove to me cherries taste good when I hate the taste of cherries, by telling me how much they like cherries. So we both agree on that for sure.

Anyways, I also don't get the idea of "personal identity heavily linked with choice of music", especially to the exclusion of other genres. Music seems like a weak thing to tie your identity to so heavily.
I wouldn't call it a weak thing for personal identity to be tied to. Without writing an essay on personal identity vs. culture, I might not be able to write a convincing argument here, but the short hand is that art impacts culture; culture impacts personal identity; music is a pervasive and influential medium of art in western culture; therefore musical themes inform personal identity through that process. It's not the only medium that people use to form parts of their personal identity (see: bronies, furries, ect.) but it is a common one due to the popularity and pervasive nature of music in the west (and arguably almost everywhere these days).

Ravers make sense to me because rave music is heavily tied with the rave scene and all its trappings, including drugs, socializing and party-til-you-puke all-nighters (which is desirable, apparently). Electroheads and classical elitists tend to focus on technical aspects, which makes music a bit like a giant puzzle or complex painting, and it's a visceral thrill to tease the artist's decisions apart. Hip-hop is more obviously about message and social commentary, so I can see people flocking to it for those reasons. None of these factor in the identity aspect.
The rave scene and all of it's trappings absolutely factor into personal identity for those who are into the scene. Any scene is filled with people who link their personal identity to the art they are enjoying. Self-described movie snobs? Metal-heads? Poetry jam artists? Trekkies? All of them to some degree or another form part of their identity around the genres they enjoy, that's why we label them, and they label themselves, after these things. All of it factors into identity, especially for the youthful who may still be wrestling with their personal identity vs the culture at large. This is why many (not all) go through phases in their teen years of strongly identifying with music sub-cultures before giving up that identity later in life.

Metal, rock, pop, noise, etc... I don't understand why those attract large numbers of exclusionaries (metal has the largest exclusionary group). But of course, I also don't get why people would tie their identity to ANY genre, so...
I don't know if metal does have the largest exclusionary group. I grew up with Hip Hop/Rap because of the areas I lived in and it was easily the most influential medium for a huge number of people. The themes in hip hop are derived from the culture and the culture is affected by the changes in style and theme of hip hop. The same can be said for any influential genre of music, of which metal is one. I do hope I'm understanding your thoughts correctly and answering you effectively.
 

Someone Depressing

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Frozen gets to me too. I haven't seen much of it; but I've heard the songs and I've looked at some snippets of thes tory, and while Tangled was Disney's attempt as saying they're young and cool and hip, yo, it at least had a great art direction and soundtrack. Oh, and it didn't have an annoying, animate snowman.

What really gets me, though, is a little game called OFF. So, it's a video game adaption of The Wizard of Oz and Earthbound smooshed together made by a French crack addict, with a whole lot of philosophical stuff and it leaves itself very open to interpreation. No, seriously. Go play it. Now. It's a pretty short game. Go.

So, naturally, Tumblr's gonna be all over this shit (yaoi included). It wasn't until the game was actually getting some media attention that Tumblr pulled a "fuck you this is our thing" and started effectively murdering the game's hype and popularity. Though many fan games exist, such as Home or Reset, the game's... well, outside of the groups that first heard about it and the abysmal Tumblr shippers (don't mind, say, shippers with any talent at writing/drawing romance. They're ok in my book) causing anyone not acquainted with the game to back the fuck away from it.

So it's link on the Derp Fish page on Wikipedia will forever be in bold red. :( Honestly, while Tumblr gobbles this shit up and throws it back into the garbage bin like what a four year old does to gum that's effectively become part of the table, I honestly do not it how, somehow, they managed to kill the game off quicker than normal.. much quicker than normal.
 

lacktheknack

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Gorrath said:
Anyways, I also don't get the idea of "personal identity heavily linked with choice of music", especially to the exclusion of other genres. Music seems like a weak thing to tie your identity to so heavily.
I wouldn't call it a weak thing for personal identity to be tied to. Without writing an essay on personal identity vs. culture, I might not be able to write a convincing argument here, but the short hand is that art impacts culture; culture impacts personal identity; music is a pervasive and influential medium of art in western culture; therefore musical themes inform personal identity through that process. It's not the only medium that people use to form parts of their personal identity (see: bronies, furries, ect.) but it is a common one due to the popularity and pervasive nature of music in the west (and arguably almost everywhere these days).

Oh, I have no doubt that it informs your identity, but I'm scared and confused by people who treat it like THE THING that defines them. That's why I'm focusing on exclusionaries. It doesn't confuse me at all that people should listen to metal, like it and even identify with it, but I see and know lots of people who won't listen to anything that ISN'T metal, and that's what I'm confused by.

Ravers make sense to me because rave music is heavily tied with the rave scene and all its trappings, including drugs, socializing and party-til-you-puke all-nighters (which is desirable, apparently). Electroheads and classical elitists tend to focus on technical aspects, which makes music a bit like a giant puzzle or complex painting, and it's a visceral thrill to tease the artist's decisions apart. Hip-hop is more obviously about message and social commentary, so I can see people flocking to it for those reasons. None of these factor in the identity aspect.
The rave scene and all of it's trappings absolutely factor into personal identity for those who are into the scene. Any scene is filled with people who link their personal identity to the art they are enjoying. Self-described movie snobs? Metal-heads? Poetry jam artists? Trekkies? All of them to some degree or another form part of their identity around the genres they enjoy, that's why we label them, and they label themselves, after these things. All of it factors into identity, especially for the youthful who may still be wrestling with their personal identity vs the culture at large. This is why many (not all) go through phases in their teen years of strongly identifying with music sub-cultures before giving up that identity later in life.

I didn't communicate this clearly enough.

The rave scene has a hook to it beyond identity: Addiction. Rave music is a crazy rush, usually played in a crazy environment, often supplemented with drugs. I know ravers who won't listen to anything else other than jacked up dance music, because it "doesn't make them feel". It's messed up, but I understand rave exclusionaries.

Classical and technical electro teases the brain in ways that other genres do not (I was an exclusive electrohead myself for a while, even though I didn't know the scene or what the subculture I was supposed to identify with was). The exclusionaries in this group also makes sense to me, because I was one, and it was because the involved music actually appeals to one's nitpicking and intellectual analysis.

Lastly, hip-hop is so message driven that I've met people who listen to exclusively hip-hop because "no other music has anything good to say". Again, makes sense to me.

Other genres do not have these "other hooks", so aside from identity ties, I don't get why one would be exclusively attached to them.

Again, I'm not trying to say that the above genres are "better", just that I can come up with reasons that people might tie to them and ignore all other genres. Imagine a Trekkie that only watched episodes with Data in them, or a movie snob that only watched comedies.

Also, I never went through that stage of "I identify with this music and its subculture", but that's probably just my problem. :p

Metal, rock, pop, noise, etc... I don't understand why those attract large numbers of exclusionaries (metal has the largest exclusionary group). But of course, I also don't get why people would tie their identity to ANY genre, so...
I don't know if metal does have the largest exclusionary group. I grew up with Hip Hop/Rap because of the areas I lived in and it was easily the most influential medium for a huge number of people. The themes in hip hop are derived from the culture and the culture is affected by the changes in style and theme of hip hop. The same can be said for any influential genre of music, of which metal is one. I do hope I'm understanding your thoughts correctly and answering you effectively.
Close enough, I just wasn't saying my thoughts thoroughly enough.
 

Gorrath

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lacktheknack said:
snipping for space
Didn't want the quote trail to get too long, but I think we can focus on the exclusionary part you brought up since that seems the most bizarre bit in all of this (humans are strange beasts). I'd lead off by saying that I don't think people are as exclusionary as they like to pretend. Indeed, this exclusionary taste in things seems to be more pretentiousness than anything. It's amazing how people, when around a like-minded crowd, talk about how their preferred genre is the one to be listened to because "reasons". It's a way of seeming more "into" the culture surrounding the music than anyone else. This seems to apply whether you're talking about who can be the most metal, the most goth, have all the right trappings to look like you stepped off the cover of a hip hop album or argue about who can name the most obscure emo band. It's not so much about being exclusionary as seeming exclusionary. When alone, or around other people who aren't into the "scene" they may drop this act entirely and indulge in all sorts of other genres.

Now I'm not foolish enough to think it's mere pretentiousness for everyone. Some take their like of a specific thing to extremes. You mention trekkies and Data, which seems like it would be absurd, but I have witnessed certain individuals arguing vehemently that all the "best" episodes of any beloved TV series always contain "X" character (specifically, Rarity from MLP:FIM). Some may do this simply to pretend to be more into their preferred medium/genre/show than even their peers in order to gain credibility and appear sophisticated while others might emphasize or even internalize the feeling of superiority they get from being this exclusionary.

In short, being or seeming exclusionary may often be confused with having "taste", especially when around others with similar tastes. They may also internalize the feeling of superiority they get from acting in this exclusionary fashion and convince themselves that they really are "better" than other people because they are exclusionary. This particular aspect of human behavior doesn't even need a full on scene like what ravers have, it can emerge from nearly any preference in anything. I LOVE wine, but fuck me if the "scene" isn't full of pretentious jackasses.
 

VoidOfOne

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I want to go on record by saying that there are many things out there that I don't like or appreciate, but I can understand why many people do. That Lego movie, for example: I don't feel like seeing it, ever, but I know why people like it. The GTA series: I understand that people love to just go crazy in such a fictional setting; not my cup of tea. The horror genre: I can't stand it, in any way, shape, or form, but I understand why many people do (I just leave the room whenever it's talked about).

So I can understand for everything why there are people who like it, even when others, especially myself, do not.

Except one: beans in chili.

Let me clarify: there are people out there who think that a necessary, NECESSARY, ingredient for chili is beans. Not just that they like the taste (which I can understand) but that it's not chili if it doesn't have beans in it. And that is something I can't rap my head around.

Especially since I can't stand beans. Especially in chili.
 

Gorrath

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VoidOfOne said:
I want to go on record by saying that there are many things out there that I don't like or appreciate, but I can understand why many people do. That Lego movie, for example: I don't feel like seeing it, ever, but I know why people like it. The GTA series: I understand that people love to just go crazy in such a fictional setting; not my cup of tea. The horror genre: I can't stand it, in any way, shape, or form, but I understand why many people do (I just leave the room whenever it's talked about).

So I can understand for everything why there are people who like it, even when others, especially myself, do not.

Except one: beans in chili.

Let me clarify: there are people out there who think that a necessary, NECESSARY, ingredient for chili is beans. Not just that they like the taste (which I can understand) but that it's not chili if it doesn't have beans in it. And that is something I can't rap my head around.

Especially since I can't stand beans. Especially in chili.
The most amusing part of the beans in chili bit is that, as far as I understand, chili with beans is technically not chili at all. I'm not sure what arcane rules surround this dish that the inclusion or exclusion of legumes is somehow a crime against humanity, but the argument surrounding chili reaches levels of hostility usually reserved for important issues like sports teams. Personally, I love beans, especially in my chili, and I'll hunt you to the ends of the Earth for suggesting that anyone could consume the dish without them, personal taste be damned.