I find the lack of intelligence depressing

[PhiMed]

That's not really a part of day to day equations. Not even cashiers deal with anything more than two-character equations. And even then, there's usually only addition and subtraction.

CAPTCHA:
must ecialli

"Cashier" is not a job that requires math skills, intelligence, or education.

A monkey could do it.

Many companies have eliminated the position entirely and have people check themselves out with a camera pointed at them to prevent theft.

The fact that you used the phrase "not even cashiers", as if they are somehow the epitome of real-life mathematics application, makes me wonder what, exactly, you think the "real world" is.

Oh, I'm sorry, were we arguing semantics? Because that was just an example of the top of my head. Also, "cashier" isn't a real-life job? Oh, so you must be that one person who's just plain better than all the cashiers out there. I didn't mean to impose upon your greatness, your majesty.

No, we're not arguing semantics, and I'm not saying I'm better than a cashier. I'm saying my job is better than a cashier's, and everyone who has anything resembling financial security's job is better than a cashier's. I've been a cashier before. Trust me. Cashiers agree with me.

Cashiers don't apply mathematics. Engineers, biologists, physicians, financiers, physicists, accountants, nurses, architects, etc. (I could continue for pages) do. The first example off the top of your head was a poor example. Some people would say that your example was notoriously bad. Comedians have been making jokes about how bad cashiers have become at math since the advent of computerized registers for at least two and a half decades, but you said, "even cashiers" as if they were an example of someone whom everyone recognizes as using math a lot. You said something that makes no sense, and someone else pointed it out. Breathe. Calm down. No need to get so upset.

You're arguing that math is stupid. I'm arguing that any productive job that pays a comfortable wage (outside the arts) requires it. I'm arguing on behalf of knowledge. You're arguing on behalf of ignorance. I'm not positively sure, but I think I'm on the right side here.

 

[AdumbroDeus]

Ok, I realise facebook isn't the place to go for intelligence but seriously...

This is one those vote quiz things that goes around. If you look the answer 0 is winning on almost a million. This means almost a million people since this stared, a week ago, cannot do simple maths.

What's more is this is just those on facebook who've seen this and bothered to answer. This is a seriously depressing realisation of what humanity is becoming.

Edited to remove typo in title.

You do realise that people are going to glance at this, see the 1x0, and assume the answer is 0. Facebook quizzes arent particularly important, and theres no real reason to try get it right.

Regardless of the importance of it, it's still incorrect, and people when presented with quixxes generally give an honest attempt to 'get it correct' for the reason of comparing it to other people. We're competitive that way.

That doesn't change the fact that it is wrong, and hardly advanced math to understand order of operations.

Either youre underestimating how lazy people are or im underestimating how ignorant they can be.

Doesn't matter if they are lazy or ignorant... either way they're doing basic math badly. Neither of them show intelligence or ability to do simple math.

But it doesn't show the lack thereof, which is the point. Being selectively lazy on a facebook quiz of all things probably doesn't have a negative correlation with IQ, and frankly it's such a basic question that I doubt getting a correct answer would have much of a positive one.

Everyone defending this is terrible. This thread has lowered my faith in humanity a lot less than the facebook part.

Somebody has a LOT to learn about statistical relevance. This question has self-selection bias before even getting into the poor formatting of the question for any sort of reliable measure of intelligence. Please take a statistics course ASAP.

 

[Haelium]

Everyone defending this is terrible. This thread has lowered my faith in humanity a lot less than the facebook part.

I don't think that anybody is defending that the answer given by most people is wrong, but saying that people are stupid for getting the wrong answer is in itself stupid.

It's ignorance of mathematical convention, not lack of intelligence.

 

[Gobmech]

So what your telling me is you dont know the difference, so you use the wikipedia definition of maths and the definition of convention with maths chucked in it.

Mathematical convention IS Maths.

... using a source makes his argument less valid?

What?!

 

[SenseOfTumour]

I'm more surprised by the number of people who voted 14,16,17.

I haven't even bothered to count the number of 1s, but the zero answer is a simple enough error, it's what I'd assume if I glanced at it, with the simple rule of 'anything times zero is zero'.

14,16 and 17 all getting votes shows that people can't even count up to 14.

(EDIT: bothered to look and they've slipped a minus in too, so ok, it's not AS simple, but still basic adding and taking away 1's is far more basic than the whole PEMBAC thing.

I'm just kinda tired of people posting these equations just to go 'ha ha - you are thick!' at people. It seems some people were taught different rules too, which doesn't help. Maybe there IS one concrete rule to these things, but if so, not all teachers seem to know about it.

 

[JokerCrowe]

Double post. yay... -_-

 

[AdumbroDeus]

Everyone defending this is terrible. This thread has lowered my faith in humanity a lot less than the facebook part.

I don't think that anybody is defending that the answer given by most people is wrong, but saying that people are stupid for getting the wrong answer is in itself stupid.

It's ignorance of mathematical convention, not lack of intelligence.

What in the dataset suggests a correlation between any given answer and lack of knowledge of mathematical convention?

 

[Haelium]

Everyone defending this is terrible. This thread has lowered my faith in humanity a lot less than the facebook part.

I don't think that anybody is defending that the answer given by most people is wrong, but saying that people are stupid for getting the wrong answer is in itself stupid.

It's ignorance of mathematical convention, not lack of intelligence.

What in the dataset suggests a correlation between any given answer and lack of knowledge of mathematical convention?

The 0 answer? I asumed that was the one that most people were arguing about, seeing as answering 16 is just not seeing the - signs, and 17 is just not thinking it through fully.

 

[Quellist]

Agree 100% this is more about reading equations than ability with actual math.

In order to read math equations, you must know _____ (Hint: it starts with "m" ;D)
But seriously, while people dont do it mentally, I am sure you do it subliminally for the easy things. If you say you have 1 orange and 2 apples, you have 1*y+2*x. Yes its easier to do it with names, but its there.

Way to totally misread my post. To read equations you need to know math however to do math you don't necessarily need to be able to read equations...

Personally when i am doing math in my head i strip out the items entirely so its more like 1+2 and if i had 1 apple, 2 oranges and 0 strawberries i wouldn't add a zero in my head. Split hairs all you like that equation isn't about the ability to do math

...But that equation is asking how much fruit you have, not how many apples and oranges you have. I am saying when you say you have 1 orange and 2 apples, you are representing them mathematically. (1 orange and 2 apples) = (1*orange + 2*apples). You cant say (1*orange + 2*apples) = ((1*orange + 2)*apples), because that is very different. But i digress.

I stand by my point. Maths is reading equations, and reading equations is maths. Mathematically represented:
Math = (Reading Equations)
where (Reading Equations) is one term.

You will struggle to find a math concept that doesnt include equations.

Guess we will have to disagree on that then, i think most people in their daily life use maths without equations all the time.

BTW condescending statements like '(Hint: it starts with "m" ;D)' really just cheapen your argument by showing how smug you are.

 

[aDuck]

Mathematics is the study of quantity, structure, space, and change.
Mathematical convention is just how we present mathematical statements at this time.

So what your telling me is you dont know the difference, so you use the wikipedia definition of maths and the definition of convention with maths chucked in it.
Mathematical convention IS Maths.

Oh no, you caught me quoting somewhere else for an accurate description. You have thoroughly pwned me my good sir. Saying that they're the same is like saying that a keyboard layout is the same as English. Mathamatical convention is a way of presenting it, it can change, maths cannot. Is this getting through to you? I know it isn't, but no harm in asking anyway.

Different cultures can change how maths is read, but they cannot change maths itself.

Sigh again... so you're saying that Mathematical convention (how we represent Maths) is not the same as Maths (the study of quantity, etc etc). Think of Grammar (how we present a language) as mathematical convention , and Language (the study of how people communicate) as Maths. Can you see how they relate? English grammar is a set of rules on how to apply the English language. Mathematical conventions give us rules on how to apply different forms of Mathematics.

The keyboard analogy doesn't hold because the keyboard doesnt have any rules to it. Someone presses something and it goes through a black box to find an end result. For a computer analogy, you could say that Maths is the computer, while the inside of the computer (M/B, CPU, RAM, HDD,etc) is the convention (the set of rules on how the computer runs). The keyboard and other inputs could be inputs to an algebraic equation.

 

[quantumsoul]

A lot of people forget that anything multiplied by zero is zero or they don't notice it if they're trying to do it quickly. I honestly think some people just eyeball it and guess. Just be glad that the correct answer has the most votes.

 

[Alon Shechter]

I don't really decide who intelligent someone is based on their mathematical skills.
But yeah, anyone beyond the third grade should know this.

 

[aDuck]

...But that equation is asking how much fruit you have, not how many apples and oranges you have. I am saying when you say you have 1 orange and 2 apples, you are representing them mathematically. (1 orange and 2 apples) = (1*orange + 2*apples). You cant say (1*orange + 2*apples) = ((1*orange + 2)*apples), because that is very different. But i digress.

I stand by my point. Maths is reading equations, and reading equations is maths. Mathematically represented:
Math = (Reading Equations)
where (Reading Equations) is one term.

You will struggle to find a math concept that doesnt include equations.

Guess we will have to disagree on that then, i think most people in their daily life use maths without equations all the time.

BTW condescending statements like '(Hint: it starts with "m" ;D)' really just cheapen your argument by showing how smug you are.

As I said before, you will struggle to use maths without equations in daily life. Using your previous example, where you added 1 orange, 2 apples and 0 strawberries, that works out to be:
1+2+0=3.
Wheither you think about it like that or not, thats how it works. Just thinking 2 and 1 is 3 is an equation, with swapping and and is for mathematical symbols (+ and = respectively).

And sorry if the statement offended you. It was meant to be a joke, however you did not take it that way.

 

[AdumbroDeus]

Everyone defending this is terrible. This thread has lowered my faith in humanity a lot less than the facebook part.

I don't think that anybody is defending that the answer given by most people is wrong, but saying that people are stupid for getting the wrong answer is in itself stupid.

It's ignorance of mathematical convention, not lack of intelligence.

What in the dataset suggests a correlation between any given answer and lack of knowledge of mathematical convention?

The 0 answer? I asumed that was the one that most people were arguing about, seeing as answering 16 is just not seeing the - signs, and 17 is just not thinking it through fully.

Your answer assumes that adequate attention is being paid to a question designed to discourage it on a question with no incentive for attention to be paid with self-selection bias in play.

With those factors in mind please justify that there is a statistically significant correlation between lack of knowledge of mathematical convention and answering any of the answers in that problem.

 

[ntw3001]

BEDMAS itself has nothing to do with math, it's an arbitrary system, math is logical.

I don't really know what you mean by that. The point of the Facebook question is to capitalise on the fact that applying functions in the wrong order results in different answers to the same question.

I mean that math is a constant. 1+1x3 will always be 4 But BEDMAS tells us how we write it. If we added before multiplying we'd have to write 1+(1x3) but the math would still be the same. Yes, there is logic to why BEDMAS is in that order, but it has nothing to do with math, per se.

Edit: To simplify. A basket with one egg and a basket with three eggs always equals four eggs, but if we write it 1+1x3 or 1+(1x3) is arbitrary. We could change it without making the actual math wrong.

I thought you might mean that. I was going to say 'it's only arbitrary insofar as that mathematical notation as a whole is arbitrary', but I decided not to. I probably should have done.

Anyhow, I wouldn't agree that 'arbitrary' is quite the correct term. While mathematical truths may exist independently of their notation, the nature of that notation is governed by the necessary logic of its subject, not by some arcane tradition or ancient decision.

And in the example you've given, while there are infinite ways to correctly write a single number, that doesn't seem relevant. Altering the notation can also produce infinite different answers. The difference between writing 1+1x3 and 1+(1x3) is arbitrary, but the difference between those and (1+1)x3 is not. The only purpose of brackets in mathematical notation is to alter the order of functions, and by moving them it is possible to change the solution to an equation.

I think we're on the same page but different paragraphs
In my example 1+(1x3) I was writing under the assumption that we used addition before multiplication, just as an example of how BEDMAS is arbirary. I guess the best example would have been one where the results would be clearly different from BEDMAS. Sorry if I'm a bit hazy on the details, I've never studied math outside the basics, and English is my second language so phrasing myself does not come as easy as I would like. I
BEDMAS is arbitrary in much the same way that a yellow circle with lines stretching out from it is an arbitrary representation of the sun. It's logical to use what we have, but it's not necessary that the symbol look in a specific way, just that it's recognized by all.

Okay yeah, that's fair enough. The mathematical truths remain constant, but the exact method of representation is a matter of convention.

 

[Bigsmith]

1+1+1+1+1 etc x0 = 0 as well as:

urgh, no.

1+1+1+1+1 etc +(1x0) = 0

If you state that Multiplying something by 0 is always zero, then how does adding it?

Spoiler: What actually happens here

1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1-1+1+1+1+1+(1*0) =/= 0

1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1-1+1+1+1+1+0 (still) =/= 0

1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+0-1 (still) =/= 0

15-1 = 14

14 = 14

Spoiler: Math stuff

The way I was taught in school, was to use:

Spoiler: BODMAS

Brackets
Operation
Division
Multiplication
Addition
Subtraction

So, in this case.

1+1+1+1+1+1+1-1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1x0

Using the order I provided above, we start with the Multiplication.

1x0 = 0

Then, the addition..

1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1 = 15

This leaves us with.

15-1 = 14

Maths aside, it's really easy to answer something like this incorrectly, a good 50% of the the people in your maths class stopped paying attention after the teacher started writing on the board. And hence will only skim this, and answer with "0" because of the "x0" at the end. Trust me, my little brother who seems to have a thing about me being good at math comes up and shouts some stupid sum in my face and then ends it with a "x0", I always respond with, "Do you know the answer, oh? you this it's 0? Come back to me when you know the actual answer."... good times.

Spoiler: For it to actually equal 0 it would have to be...

(1+1+1+1+1+1-1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1)*0 = 0
In case you were wondering. :3

I'm horribly sorry about this, but maths was one of my Favourite subjects despite me not taking it any further then GCSE and I hate seeing such silly mistakes.

 

[Suijen]

It looks like a lot of people forgot to multiply before adding. Mistakes happen.

 

[Lilani]

-snip-

Gauging the intelligence of people through an informal poll on Facebook (which can easily be exploited and trolled for the sake of messing with those who made the poll) is like measuring the deep end of a pool with a Popsicle stick. It's not very accurate, and sort of a dumb thing to do in the first place.

Also, in that post alone you misspelled "realize" and "realization." And apparently before folks pointed it out to you, you managed to misspell "intelligence." Hypocritical, much?