If I go there will be trouble. If I stay it will be doubled.

[New Troll]

I want to thank everyone for thier inputs in this matter. I realize none of you know every detail and are giving the best advice you can and appreciate all of it.

The number one response seems to be just to walk away. And depending on how the visit goes, this truly might end up being my only option. And it kills me. I feel I've already lost one son, so to lose another is not really in me to do. But I do have to put the child's life first and living amongst all the spite she's eminating can't be good. And in the end, it will destroy me.

The other common response of filing for custody feels highly pointless. I feel all I'm going to recieve from that is a set child support that the mother can use however she likes instead of me personally making sure that money goes towards my son. I still might get counceling from a lawyer to see what he/she thinks, but from every article I've read, every story I've heard, and every other person who's gone through something similar, the father always loses. And usually he loses bigger than he can afford to.

And again, just because I know I can better support and raise the child, doesn't mean she's a bad mother by any means. Sure with me he'd be in a better environment and would have more parental time and more one-on-one time and more loving family around, but she does already have one child she's taken good care of for over five years now, mostly on her own. And yeah, there are dirty little things I could dig up and bring public, but I'm not after hurting her. Fact of the matter, I still do care for her. I just don't want to have anything to do with her due to the way she's behaving. So stressing.

Again, thank you everyone for your inputs. The weather is actually pretty stormy right now so I might put this off another day. Heh, makes a good excuse at any rate. Don't want to be moving boxes and stuff in the rain after all. Really I'm just scared. Feels even the best of outcomes is not going to be very pleasant. And mostly it just feels like I'm going to lose it all. All hope for a future with my son. Damn, I need breakfast or something. Off to think...

edit: answering the age question, I will be 32 in a few weeks. My mid-twenties were spent married to my ex-wife. Another messed up situation I'm trying to forget, even though my ex still considers us friends.

 

[Daveman]

Please write a book.

 

[The_Deleted]

Sounds to me like she'll use the kids as a weapon.
She had it good while she was with you and now she's fucking with your head by letting all go to waste. And if the law where you are is anything like the UK, you won't get automatic rights to your child. Especially if she won't allow you to sign the birth certificate.
Use your head, not your heart.
And don't do anything that she can use as ammunition down the line.
Good luck, geezer.

 

[Rigs83]

No offense man but you seem co-dependant to me. You are not seriously messed up but you cling to messed up people and get burned by it. Get your stuff, change your number and concentrate on your life. It's tragic that you don't have the relationship with your children that you want but the mother's are the roadblock so you will have to either get a lawyer and sue for custody or visiting rights or wait till they are older and hope time has healed old wounds.

The best thing to do is get your life in order and build a base for yourself.

 

[crypt-creature]

My advice is: Leave her, leave them all. Start over fresh in a new place and just ignore her. If the kid is the only reason she wanted to be with you, then it would just be a miserable existence.

Oh I'm not with her and never will be. But I do want to be a father to my child. I believe every child has a right to know his father, even if he's a slimeball, and every father has a right to be one to his child if he's willing. That's why I tried so hard to form a relationship between my son and his biological father.

But as for the starting over fresh in a new place... I think about that constantly. I have several places I could easily go and am not afraid to go somewhere new. Actually kind of like that idea, as long as I have a stable job there waiting for me. Or something even better waiting for me.

A man I dated was in a situation somewhat like this (although with just one child), and it ended badly for him. He was not married to the woman either.
He too, was trying to be there for his son, with the mother of their child denying him contact and only taking child support from him. He fought for years, but eventually signed custody over to the new step-father in the mothers life. It became too much for him, knowing she would never allow him to see his son and having to pay child support in addition to that. We are both fairly certain she will never tell the child about his biological father.

You might want to keep your biological son in your life, as well as the son you've basically adopted as your own, but there might become a time when it is better if you just leave.
Keep all her emails, and yours. If she ever tries to take you to court, you have evidence of offering to help her and pay for bills, yet she declined it all. I wouldn't trust her, even if you did see her as a close friend.
Say your piece to her, but with the two families starting to come at you, together no less, it doesn't seem like this is going to be good for you.

 

[tic-tank]

Regardless of what you decide to do it won't be an easy choice to make, look at it years from now, where are you? who is there?
Will you be regretting leaving it all behind, or will you be glad you fought hard to keep your son in you life.

 

[-Orgasmatron-]

So, are any of these kids actually yours?

You should make some names for the girls up so it's easier to follow, I got lost. Sorry.

 

[megalomania]

*SNIP*

I know this isn't going to help you feel much better right now, but maybe it will later: At some point both of these ladies are going to realise that
1) This other guy is a deadbeat dad
2) You are not a deadbeat dad
3) That they were stupid to drive you out of their lives

Of course by this stage I hope you will have followed some of the advice here and got out of there entirely, they will be left kicking themselves.

 

[dodo1331]

One of my fellow Escapees, BonsaiK, wrote this in another thread where I posted your issue (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.117161?page=6#2240025).

Let me be the first to say that you've made it this far so you're obviously one tough nut to crack.

Meeting her face to face is the only way you're going to resolve anything. I think she's using the distance to her advantage. Although to be honest, I think the most you can hope for is some of your stuff back, I doubt she'll give you much in the way of child access. If this (second) girl plays hardball and says "i'm keeping the son" and ALSO "you must pay support" AND you're not allowed to see him" you could take it to court and trying to get all the access you can. I guess it depends on how much you care for the child, and how much you want to continue to have her in your life. If she chose not to have the child that would simplify things a lot for you and it would be a clean(ish) break but it may be a little late for that, and also that's a decision which you (or her) may find morally questionable.

What would be very interesting to know is WHY did she turn from this great girl into someone not interested? Sure, she had a second chance with an ex, but why did she take that chance? Also the fact that she is talking to your other ex and partner is NOT GOOD.

The ultimate solution to your problems is this: you're obviously attracting (or seeking) a specific type of woman to you. Have a good look at the personalities of both your ex partners - what do they have in common? Once you identify a few shared traits, you're going to want to learn how to identify those things early so you can steer clear of them in future. Not every woman is like these two. I'm also not quite that clear on why they both shot through... did they ever complain you were unsatisfactory as a partner in any way? If so, did those complaints have any truth in them (honestly)? It's worth being a little introspective here because you don't want this happening to you a third time.

Oh and lastly, are you SURE the second kid is yours?

 

[Zombie_Fish]

Drop all connections. You have the right to be a father but if it's that problematic is it really worth it?

Just drop all connections and start again somewhere else.

 

[BonsaiK]

Goddamnit.

I wish people would post these relationship problems in the proper, already-existing thread.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.117161

I have replied in the linked thread if you're interested.

 

[hypothetical fact]

Everyone I hope you are learning a valuable lesson from this man. Relationships don't work.
Give up on women and just live the life of a neckbeard; fools say it is no life but look at what having a life has gotten you.
Also move on and forget your potential sons, for all you know the women could coddle them into being assholes.

 

[slevin8989]

The only piece of advise i can give you is to be there for you're child. The most important thing you can do in life is raise that kid as best you can. Even if you don't have a good relationship with his mother you can still be there for the kid.

 

[Teachingaddict]

Nice and short this one - cut and run. If the child is yours, and she does end up giving birth, support it. Other than that make a new life for yourself buddy, I have been constantly messed around by ex'es and have grown to learn just to let it fly above your head.

Everyone I hope you are learning a valuable lesson from this man. Relationships don't work.

Way to kick a man whilst he's down. Relationships CAN and DO often work, I used to thinklike you did, but over the past ten years I've been single approx 3 months, with 3 different GF's. Currently engaged to a beautiful young woman, and plan on being with her the rest of my life, as does she.

 

[BonsaiK]

One of my fellow Escapees, BonsaiK, wrote this in another thread where I posted your issue (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.117161?page=6#2240025).

Let me be the first to say that you've made it this far so you're obviously one tough nut to crack.

Meeting her face to face is the only way you're going to resolve anything. I think she's using the distance to her advantage. Although to be honest, I think the most you can hope for is some of your stuff back, I doubt she'll give you much in the way of child access. If this (second) girl plays hardball and says "i'm keeping the son" and ALSO "you must pay support" AND you're not allowed to see him" you could take it to court and trying to get all the access you can. I guess it depends on how much you care for the child, and how much you want to continue to have her in your life. If she chose not to have the child that would simplify things a lot for you and it would be a clean(ish) break but it may be a little late for that, and also that's a decision which you (or her) may find morally questionable.

What would be very interesting to know is WHY did she turn from this great girl into someone not interested? Sure, she had a second chance with an ex, but why did she take that chance? Also the fact that she is talking to your other ex and partner is NOT GOOD.

The ultimate solution to your problems is this: you're obviously attracting (or seeking) a specific type of woman to you. Have a good look at the personalities of both your ex partners - what do they have in common? Once you identify a few shared traits, you're going to want to learn how to identify those things early so you can steer clear of them in future. Not every woman is like these two. I'm also not quite that clear on why they both shot through... did they ever complain you were unsatisfactory as a partner in any way? If so, did those complaints have any truth in them (honestly)? It's worth being a little introspective here because you don't want this happening to you a third time.

Oh and lastly, are you SURE the second kid is yours?

That's very thoughtful of you. I wish though that people wouldn't start new threads for relationship problems. It's making my job in this thread ---> http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.117161 <--- a lot harder and more confusing.

 

[Fingerprint]

Wow... well what can I say?

Firstly your patience and understanding are truly god-like. Secondly I think you should get a DNA test to determine whether the baby is yours or not. If not (and its obvious you care about the child) then all I can suggest is that you try to talk face to face with this girl to see if you can help look after this baby. If the child isn't yours and the girl doesn't even want to see you then just forget her and try to forget the baby.

If the baby is yours then you have rights and therefore you should get (at least some) custody over it.

Whatever the outcome is I hope you can come out on the other side smiling.

 

[dirk45]

I would leave the women and try to keep in regular contact with your son(s). I wouldn't stand losing contact to MY kids.

 

[Chipperz]

I hate to say this (talking as a guy who was raised without a father), but fuck it. Run. Run away. This woman is evil, and the guy she's with is a sadist. You sound like too much of a nice guy to even be involved with the child of these people.

Also, I'm gonna put money on the kid not being yours. Try again with the woman you're with, but get married (and a prenup) BEFORE you have kids.

 

[hypothetical fact]

Nice and short this one - cut and run. If the child is yours, and she does end up giving birth, support it. Other than that make a new life for yourself buddy, I have been constantly messed around by ex'es and have grown to learn just to let it fly above your head.

Everyone I hope you are learning a valuable lesson from this man. Relationships don't work.

Way to kick a man whilst he's down. Relationships CAN and DO often work, I used to thinklike you did, but over the past ten years I've been single approx 3 months, with 3 different GF's. Currently engaged to a beautiful young woman, and plan on being with her the rest of my life, as does she.

Just make sure you get a prenup and remember 60% of marriages fail.