Imperfect Characters in Stories

[Luminous_Umbra]

In a recent discussion with a friend about the characters of Doctor Who, he talked about how he thought several of the female characters had their lives "revolve around the Doctor." I brought up the question of whether it was wrong for there to be such characters, at which point he claimed it was sexist.

I understand how it could be seen as sexist, (especially given how some shows, books, etc are sexist in many other ways in addition to the characters) but is it so wrong to have characters of either gender that are this way or that are flawed in some other way? I realize that this is the sort of thing that should be judged more on a case-by-case basis, but this isn't the first time I have run into someone claiming that characters in a story need to be held to some sort of high standard.

 

[Zhukov]

It isn't the single cases that bother people about this sort of thing, it's the trend.

Having a female character whose entire existence revolves around the nearest dominant male? Fine. After all, some people are like that and there's nothing wrong with creating a fictional character of that type.

Having most female character's entire existence revolve around the nearest dominant male? Not so fine.

 

[FalloutJack]

In all fairnness, it's a time traveling alien genius and it's fiction AND it's been lampooned and lampshaded, so I fail to see the problem.

 

[wolf thing]

In a recent discussion with a friend about the characters of Doctor Who, he talked about how he thought several of the female characters had their lives "revolve around the Doctor." I brought up the question of whether it was wrong for there to be such characters, at which point he claimed it was sexist.

I understand how it could be seen as sexist, (especially given how some shows, books, etc are sexist in many other ways in addition to the characters) but is it so wrong to have characters of either gender that are this way or that are flawed in some other way? I realize that this is the sort of thing that should be judged more on a case-by-case basis, but this isn't the first time I have run into someone claiming that characters in a story need to be held to some sort of high standard.

characters need to be flawed, a flawless character is a terrible character, they teach this in writing course and such. there is nothing wrong with a character reliing around another, it cant make good storys, the problem is that this is a character type which is most often found in women, and not just some time it happen a lot in mainstream media. the problem is when that become the main way of depicting women it is sexist and also dull and lazy. it wouldnt be a problem is there was a wide verity of female character, and i feel movie, game and such are getting better, but there isnt, it is this and maybbe a few other which are still very poor reprstions of women. ofcousre containing deption of women like this doesnt mean its a bad movie or any thing just that when pulled back form it and see all the other doing it, it is very bad indeed.
Many writters may be doing this without even noticing so its good to bring it up and talk about it, especially in thing like computer games were we have very few good female character going about, and very few women in the industry.

as for doctor who, it can sometimes be bad, because there so many shitty writter working on doctor who, but its usally okay as the doctor relys more on them and they do on him.

 

[Thaluikhain]

It isn't the single cases that bother people about this sort of thing, it's the trend.

Having a female character whose entire existence revolves around the nearest dominant male? Fine. After all, some people are like that and there's nothing wrong with creating a fictional character of that type.

Having most female character's entire existence revolve around the nearest dominant male? Not so fine.

Very much this. There is a definite trend, it's all very well to say it's alright for "just this one" character to be like that, but it's very often "just this once".

 

[KriticalKiwi]

I'm speaking out of ignorance here to a large extent, but it seems to me that a character whose existence revolves entirely around the protagonist reeks of poor writing. I agree that a character should be flawed, but not so flawed that their entire motivation needs to fall back on the nearest character who the writer actually bothered fleshing out.

 

[floppylobster]

People who like to write these sorts of stories should write these stories and people who like to watch them should watch them. If you start writing to please an audience you've never engaged with then your writing suffer and end up feeling hollow and you won't even like it yourself. Basically, if your friend wants what they see as a non-sexist character portrayal then they should write it themselves.

If I'm honest, (and when shouldn't we be), I like stories with a little bit of sexism from both sides in them. I like the differences in the sexes to be pointed out and exploited in a story. That's not to say I am sexist in my day to day life, I just enjoy stories where everyone is not the same, or even likable. Because that's how I find life to be as well.

As for Doctor Who, I grew up watching it and when I was much younger often had a 'crush' on a few of his companions. But I think I've outgrown the series now so seeing it have fairly shallow characterizations is no surprise to me. However, if they brought in a female doctor somehow that might rejuvenate my interest in the show. I don't see why they couldn't write it in. Although I'm sure fanboys somewhere would have a fit (seeing as they cried over James Bond being blonde and Link being cartoonish yet both of those things turned out to be quite good).

 

[Combustion Kevin]

In games it is often a case of protagonist syndrome, where the player would indeed have to do everything or there would simply be no game for him to play, or at least no sidequests to explore, which would be a waste.

"Hey, Jack, you need help with your troubled past and the people that wronged you?".

"nah, thanks shep, but I got it covered.".

I also sometimes come across characters that seem to have flaws picked at random, almost as if to say "no, he's not perfect, see?!", alcoholism comes up often, but without any explanation as to why they took to drinking, or anger issues.

What I'd rather see is where one's virtuous aspects can also harm others, for example, being very protective of your loved ones is a good thing, but what if that preferential treatment may hurt others?