Internet Outside of America

[Vie]

My worry isn't the immediate threat, It's that America might pressure Britain into passing similar laws.

That is a scary thought. I wouldn't put it past them, but Cameron has proven willing to stand up for Britain against the EU, so all we can do is hope he does the same against the US. Still, chances of that are on the grim side of small.

The guy Cameron put in charge of IT has already said he wants to implement laws exactly like SOPA, and has Cameron's backing.

Don't forget that the conservative party gets most of its funding from big corps, particularly Rupert Murdoch's, who are all in favour of SOPA and similar regulations.

Cameron will bend over backwards to do what he's told by the corporations who fund his party.

 

[GrindBass]

Vaguely related to my last post - an image of all city to city connections in 2007 from http://www.chrisharrison.net/index.php/Visualizations/InternetMap:

All those lines that don't start/end in the US would still be available to communicate across so the rest of the world would be able to use the internet fine.

 

[Flames66]

In Europe we would not be affected (in a way you describe at least) by strange US internet regulation. Though a fear is that when one western country passes internet restrictions like SOPA more might follow. Better to immediately root it out.

I am afraid that I must disagree with you here. Many businesses in the wider world rely on services based in America. For example, there are companies whose entire online presence are hosted by social networking sights or who rely on YouTube for revenue/advertising. So, while the infrastructure would still be fully functional, many businesses would no longer be able to operate.

 

[OldNewNewOld]

Well, first of all, I find it adorable how you think that the USA made the internet. (quote "I know the web was basically born here in the states").
The internet was created in and for CERN - the European Organization for Nuclear Research.
You know, Europe, the continent (not country)? CERN? Between France and Switzerland.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CERN

Second of all, almost every country has it's own infrastructure and almost every non-NA country could survive without the USA. It's just a matter if it would be profitable. Google, Facebook, Twitter... just 3 names of big companies which are located in the USA and could be shut down. But, they could easily move all their stuff somewhere else.

 

[Saladfork]

I am extremely annoyed by the fact that I'm so heavily affected by a government I have no say in by this (being Canadian), but on the other hand, I suppose we only really have ourselves and geography to blame for allowing ourselves to become so dependant on the US for internet. If we really had to, we could try running some lines to Russia, maybe...?

 

[Frungy]

This will be directed to all Escapists who aren't Americans. With all this controversy going around about SOPA/PIPA, it gets me wondering exactly HOW reliant on the US's internet is your respective countries?

First a quick correction on terminology. There is no "US's internet". I think you meant "US based websites".

The problem is pretty simple and easily demonstrated by that most popular of internet passtimes, porn. Globally the average age of consent is around 16, however the U.S. (despite most states in the U.S. having ages of consent below 18) has pushed for legislation to make anything below 18 "pedo", and now it is the accepted standard pretty much globally, resulting in the silly situation that in the majority of countries a 16 year old girl can have sex with her boyfriend in her bedroom legally, but if she's lonely at 1am and powers up her webcam to chat to her boyfriend and happens to reveal some boob then she's technically committed a criminal offence, and both her and her boyfriend could be arrested.

My point is that the U.S. is a global leader in policy setting, and no matter how idiotic the U.S. policies may be they seem to quickly become globally accepted (except miles and fahrenheit, no-one wants those back thank you!).

This is the core problem with SOPA/PIPA and why I'm opposing it.

 

[Daverson]

Well, first of all, I find it adorable how you think that the USA made the internet. (quote "I know the web was basically born here in the states").
The internet was created in and for CERN - the European Organization for Nuclear Research.
You know, Europe, the continent (not country)? CERN? Between France and Switzerland.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CERN

Second of all, almost every country has it's own infrastructure and every country could survive without the USA. It's just a matter if it would be profitable. Google, Facebook, Twitter... just 3 names of big companies which are located in the USA and could be shut down. But, they could easily move all their stuff somewhere else.

Actually, that's a common misconception. CERN brought the net together as it is today, but the first proper incarnations of the internet was ARPANET [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANET].

 

[Kathinka]

In Europe we would not be affected (in a way you describe at least) by strange US internet regulation. Though a fear is that when one western country passes internet restrictions like SOPA more might follow. Better to immediately root it out.

I am afraid that I must disagree with you here. Many businesses in the wider world rely on services based in America. For example, there are companies whose entire online presence are hosted by social networking sights or who rely on YouTube for revenue/advertising. So, while the infrastructure would still be fully functional, many businesses would no longer be able to operate.

it's not like there are no similar services avaiable elsewhere. buiseneses in question would just have to turn away from us-american service providers. of course there would be chaos and hitches and difficulties in the transit, but all in all the rest of the world would not really be affected.

 

[ED-Tw0 ZeRo N9nE]

Man, I'm getting trolled here. Guys I realise It's NOT a series of tubes. I also realise that Europe IS a Continent, I was speaking to MORE than just Europe (you know, made up of smaller Countries) here. I may have a sub-par education by your standards, but I'm not a complete idiot. I can handle a good ribbing, but wouldn't it be better to enlighten a few (dumb) Americans who are actually willing to learn?

PS. I'm not sure if you guys have skipped over the particular post or not, but this thread is no longer about the infrastructure of the net. It's now more along the lines of could your businesses survive without our massive consumer base?

 

[miketehmage]

I find these questions hard to answer. I think anything happening to american internet would affect us all. But like others have said, it will not take us offline, because the internet isn't a physical thing in a single location in the USA that we all connect to. It is the network between all of the computers all around the world. So if you guys go down, you can't connect to us, and we can't connect to you, but we can still connect to everyone else. So no, our internet isn't affected. However many english webpages are hosted in the US and so I for one don't like the idea of your government being able to bring them down for the slightest thing.

 

[Gunner 51]

I don't think the world at large needs America to keep the internet on it's own - as a structure. However, it is dependent on the content, opinions, input and contribution in terms of media from America. If this makes sense to you.

I guess it's like saying locally made television, but most of the programs on it are American to put it simply.

If something like SOPA or even a derititive of it were to become US Law this can have a very nasty side effect on the rest of the world. And it all resembles a cyber-punk world - or at least that's the impression I get.

The Immediate Effects...
Firstly, major domestic media pirates will be the first to feel the sting like Youtube. They'll be almost entired emasculated by being forced to remove a very high number of videos. However, those outside the US will not have access to these videos either.

SOPA - 5 Years Later...
European pirate sites get a hold of bootleg American media, the bigwigs at SOPA go into a right lather rather than trying to block them, they will try (successfully) to have the pirates extradited as an example to others. This causes a major diplomatic shitstorm. In an effort to curtail this European governments - keen to keep on America's good side - initiate their own versions of SOPA ultimately answering to American Entertainment and Media Corporations. Corporations now have more say in the running of a nation state that the state itself does.

SOPA - 10 Years Later...
Cyber-punks around the world will unite and destroy the corporate stranglehold on the media.

But as to what happens next, I have no idea. But one thing's for sure, I've really got to stop going on Cyberpunk Review.

 

[MrTub]

Man, I'm getting trolled here. Guys I realise It's NOT a series of tubes. I also realise that Europe IS a Continent, I was speaking to MORE than just Europe (you know, made up of smaller Countries) here. I may have a sub-par education by your standards, but I'm not a complete idiot. I can handle a good ribbing, but wouldn't it be better to enlighten a few (dumb) Americans who are actually willing to learn?

PS. I'm not sure if you guys have skipped over the particular post or not, but this thread is no longer about the infrastructure of the net. It's now more along the lines of could your businesses survive without our massive consumer base?

It would depend on a lot of things, one example would be if the company was focusing on selling in Sweden/europe/asia or it was focusing on selling in US.

I guess that most Swedish companies would be able to survive without the US market but I can imagine that it would be a drop in sale for a company that sells international.

And I would have to say that some companies in US would go bankrupt or having to relocate.

 

[ED-Tw0 ZeRo N9nE]

Thanks for all the feedback guys, I think you've more or less answered all the questions I have. So, if anyone else would like to get their's answered, then feel free to speak up.

 

[Formica Archonis]

This will be directed to all Escapists who aren't Americans. With all this controversy going around about SOPA/PIPA, it gets me wondering exactly HOW reliant on the US's internet is your respective countries?

Does it matter? PIPA declares Canada and the Caribbean to be part of the United States [http://www.michaelgeist.ca/content/view/6249/159/] for purposes of the law.

Read the article. It gets worse. SOPA gives the US government jurisdiction over EVERYTHING. If they have domestic juridiction, great! If not, they give it to themselves so they can make the entire Internet local if need be. If the US government claims they own the Internet, then as far as anyone in the US or a nation that they can bully needs to know, they DO.

And then there's the problem of foreign policy. The US has written copyright law for other nations in the past, and their pals in the entertainment industry use not only the US embassies but also things like the Transpacific Partnership as bludgeons on countries they think are lax on copyright.

If the US Internet breaks over copyright, then they ALL break, maybe not just right away. I imagine darknets will get popular fast.

 

[VladG]

Don't really know about infrastructure, seems Europe and Asia are pretty self contained but web content? We're screwed. Most of the good stuff is hosted in the U.S.

As for local stuff... the internet is very underused here.

 

[darksuccubus]

Well, I'm in Europe and this wouldn't really hurt us. However, I am afraid that if SOPA passes, other countries will follow USA's example (although now it seems unlikely). Also, my country is near Russia, so if anything fails, I'll go there, Russia never bothers to control it's Interenet xD
EDIT: I hope SOPA never passes, so many awesome reviewers will lose their jobs...