Is it piracy if you already own the product you are pirating?

[Squilookle]

Yes, it's another bloody piracy-related thread. Yay. Aren't you sick of these? >_<

Well no, but I think you'll find that there are lots of threads already around that are asking the same question you have- they're just a quick search away.

OT: No, I wouldn't consider that piracy at all. The devs get their money and you aren't spreading copies to others. Everybody wins.

 

[Dandark]

Morally it's fine. It's the own developers fault for putting stupid useless DRM into their product, however legally it's still illegal piracy no matter what your excuse is.
I don't mean to go off topic or anything but the fact this discussion comes up at all kinda shows how crappy DRM is.

Although you could argue that since you are downloading from pirates that you are supporting them which is a perfectly fine thing to do IMO since they offer a better product, but yeah from the developers standpoint they probably won't even bother to tell the difference between you who bought a legal copy and someone who just couldn't be bothered to pay.

 

[Yureina]

Grr.... bollocks. I've gotten plenty of answers and yet I am annoyed rather than feeling satisfied.

My intention was to acquire this game legally without spending money (aka, as a gift), and then to use a form of the game that did not have the abusive spyware that is required to play said game. Also, since I wouldn't theoretically be buying this game, it would also have the same effect of not giving any money to the abusive publisher, and thus satisfying my own principles. I will not support this DRM, but I want the game, and so have been trying to find a way to work around this little problem.

Seems like it's not going to fly, since I will not load this game with this DRM and I won't just simply pirate it without owning it because I see that as wrong.

Being forced to download spyware just to play a game simply isn't right. I wish there was some way to challenge this, since a "boycott" won't work since nobody notices or cares, least of all the publishers.

Isn't there something that makes this sort of thing illegal? My first thought went to the Sherman Anti-Trust Act, but I don't really think that would fly. I certainly think it qualifies as tying [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tying_(commerce)], but... I really wouldn't know just how illegal that is. It certainly is an anti-competitive practice, but... are there actually laws against this sort of thing?

Bleh... this is giving me a headache. ;_;

Wish I had some money so I could actually ask a lawyer about this stuff. >_<

 

[Aurgelmir]

pirating a game is and will always be a crime regardless of logic

He isn't pirating it though. I know some people view all illegal downloading as Piracy, but if he isn't distributing the copy he acquired 8which he will if he is using torrents) then he is just acquiring a repair to the broken product he bought and paid for.

And you can't argue that that is an "excuse" for piracy in my opinion. And it is black and white thinking like that which is hurting the industry the way I see it.

 

[Vegosiux]

If you buy the game legally then you are saying that you agree to the game and the DRM.

No, you don't. Not unless you actually agree to the EULA and terms of use upon purchase, which would actually be quite a good practice, but it'd hurt sales so guess why publishers are never going to agree with it. I bet they'd love people going "Oh, really? That's what I have to agree to? Uh no, they can keep their damn game."

But no, you do not "agree to" anything until you hit the "I agree" button in the installation process, that's the thing.

Legally yes it is still piracy as when you buy a game nowadays you are only buying a licence for 1 product according to EULA.

Do you benefit from having 2 copies of the same game? I mean, what do you gain by having 2 instead of 1? You can't do anything you couldn't do with 1. You're not buying "the license to play this particular copy of the game", you're buying "the license to play this particular game".

 

[Yureina]

I think the only time people can be excused from any form of any form of piracy is when they are a titled man, such as a Lord or a Duke. In that case and only that case can a man be excised from bringing piracy into his life, but otherwise I think that everyone should be dealt with equally all the time, and that taking a floating file out of the network is the same as doing the same in Germany. This is why we need to show ourselves as united against the evil that is the internet.

The "evil that is the internet"?

Why have you come to this "evil" place then? O_O

 

[Yureina]

The "evil that is the internet"?

Why have you come to this "evil" place then? O_O

Because you don't know you're the internet yet. You still use type, and pictures, but the real internet is made through sound.

I'm a bit confused by this. What do you mean? x_x

 

[darksakul]

You are allowed by law to have back up copies of your own Media.
I do not think PC games should be any different.

Technically breaking some anti-copy protections can be considered illegal; and if not illegal at least a offense that you can be sued in civil court.

But this is getting in to a grey area of the law here

 

[Pontifex]

Legally, doing this would violate the DMCA's Anti-Circumvention clause, which prevents you from removing or getting around any form of copy protection included with the product (also making it technically illegal to rip DVDs, incidentally). Morally, however, I'd say there was nothing wrong with it, particularly if you either only downloaded the crack, or adjusted your torrent client's settings to not upload that particular file (possible with some clients, I believe).

 

[lacktheknack]

Technically yes.

In essence... I still wouldn't do it. The publisher thinks it was a straight-up illegal copy, and it does bad things to stats.

A better alternative is to download a completely separate crack, as you would need the game in the first place to use it. It sends a better message to publishers.

Unless cracks are straight-up illegal where you are, then obviously I can't condone it.

 

[Yureina]

I hope I can make myself clear. I totally believe in the physical internet, but unfortunately the internet is rapidly being replaced by what we would conventionally call transparent material (eg. wind, sound), unfortunately this is a bit of an oversimplification, but in essence, we can now transport our most precious thoughts between actual physical distances because they're not actually real, but the Escapist is still caught up in the actual physical world. Lol, so 2005!

Umm... yeah. Still confusing me here. Are you talking about Skype? x_x

Technically yes.

In essence... I still wouldn't do it. The publisher thinks it was a straight-up illegal copy, and it does bad things to stats.

A better alternative is to download a completely separate crack, as you would need the game in the first place to use it. It sends a better message to publishers.

Unless cracks are straight-up illegal where you are, then obviously I can't condone it.

I'm in Washington state. Would you happen to know if cracks are illegal here?

 

[Steinar Valsson]

In some countries, downloading is legal, it's the sharing (Torrent) that is the illegal part. It's like with CD's. You can have a old record, put it on a CD, put the CD in the computer, from computer to MP3 player/laptop/phone/touchscreencomputerthing or all. Then you have up to 7+ copies that are all legal. As long as you don't distribute them.
The record could have been given to you, bought it, found it in a dumpster...
Same with the files, if you found it on the internet, there is no licence stuck to it, you don't know if it was licenced. That's why, in the case of the mega-sites, only the hosts of the links were prosecuted, not the viewers. The viewers "had the files" while they watched them, but didn't share them.
So if you use torrent to download the file, owning it or not, it is illegal since you shared it. But using rapidshare, DC++ (upload off), megafile or other direct downloads, you are in the green.

That's what I can gather, atleast.
(One of my friends is a lawyer and I have asked him the same thing, this was also his conclusion)

 

[BishopofAges]

You know, I had a similar question, but more about rediculously old games than DRM, honestly no DRM has actually stopped me right as I was about to throw down some epic ass-kicking and asked "Hey you the guy who purchased this?" So I have no problem with DRM.

No, more about when I used to have multiple copies of an old game because of wear and tear that made all the disks unuseable. The software is out of print, and I don't feel like spending 200 dollars on eBay for "Mint-condition in box with original blah blah blah" just to get it back. Is it okay to find an online disk-rip copy then? (this game was made before online marketing so theres no online copy for offical market by the company)

 

[lacktheknack]

I hope I can make myself clear. I totally believe in the physical internet, but unfortunately the internet is rapidly being replaced by what we would conventionally call transparent material (eg. wind, sound), unfortunately this is a bit of an oversimplification, but in essence, we can now transport our most precious thoughts between actual physical distances because they're not actually real, but the Escapist is still caught up in the actual physical world. Lol, so 2005!

Umm... yeah. Still confusing me here. Are you talking about Skype? x_x

Technically yes.

In essence... I still wouldn't do it. The publisher thinks it was a straight-up illegal copy, and it does bad things to stats.

A better alternative is to download a completely separate crack, as you would need the game in the first place to use it. It sends a better message to publishers.

Unless cracks are straight-up illegal where you are, then obviously I can't condone it.

I'm in Washington state. Would you happen to know if cracks are illegal here?

No, sadly... I doubt it, though.

Also, I wouldn't pay too much attention to "I Can Help You". He's been acting really weird today.

 

[KrossBillNye]

This whole discussion is flawed. Everything you do will be concidered "pirating".

Watched a TV show and you wanted to record it using your VHS/DVD/PVR? Sorry thats Pirating and Pirating is bad.

Listening to that music you really like on your radio? Record the song using your Tape recorder/CD/MP3? Sorry Pirating again.

You have a music/DVD movie that you love to watch and you don't want to damage it so you make copies? Pirating.

What is Pirating?

1.
a. One who robs at sea or plunders the land from the sea without commission from a sovereign nation.
b. A ship used for this purpose.
2. One who preys on others; a plunderer.
3. One who makes use of or reproduces the work of another without authorization.
4. One that operates an unlicensed, illegal television or radio station.

I am guessing 3 would apply to all this.

Frankly, if you buy a CD or DVD you should be allowed to make copies ONLY for keeping the original in good condition or for personal use.

But by all logic what you are doing is illegal.