Is it racist to ban the N-word? I'm confused here.

[Parasondox]

Afternoon to you all,

Now, this seems a tad be strange to me but maybe when we discuss this, I may understand more. In recent news reporters, it was said that the NFL were looking to ban the would "******/nigga" being used on the field and many of the players were angry at this proposal and another African-american player saying it was racist to ban the word, "******". Here is one of the news report below in the spoiler;

Spoiler: NFL 'N-Word Ban - Is is right? Or Racist?

I would also like to make clear that those who are advocating the ban of the word, are doing it to encourage equality within the sport. I understand where they are coming from because that word has so many sides to it and is richly surrendered by racial hate. On one hand, it was used as a slur against a large group of people for many decades and centuries and has many who grew up with that would used against them, hate that word even being used today. One example, my father. Grew up during the problem and hate and just detest the word. Also on the other hand, it's a word used as a term of friendship, and closeness within that group or community where it was once used for hate and now "claimed" for something else.

And you see here is where my confusion comes in. If a word can cause to much trouble and problems for many people in different ways, why would it be racist to ban the word "******"? Is it to do with this unwritten rule about how, "This is now our word and others can't use it" type situation? Or people jumping the gun too quickly without actually looking into why they propose the idea? Or should other words that may also be deemed offensive be banned? Or even the matter of censorship?

Please feel free to discuss and thank you for reading.

 

[Queen Michael]

To me, the word "******" is like the word "fatso." It's been used as a slur in the past, so you shouldn't use it about people unless you're part of the group it refers to. Of course, mentioning the word when you're discussing it is different. So I, a white dude, wouldn't say "There's this ****** I know..." but I might say "The word '******' is pretty controversial..."

 

[Barbas]

Hmmmm...I remember watching the scene from The Boondocks defining a "Nigga moment" and laughing myself stupid over it. I wonder if that sort of thing will fade from television entirely in a few years' time? I think a lot of people nowadays see it as acceptable if black people use the word, but feel uncomfortable hearing it from white people. I'd like to know who first proposed the ban, I had no idea use of the word "******" ass an insult was so prevalent in American Football. Let the referees just punish people the way they would for other unsportsmanlike conduct.

I wouldn't have used the word "racist" to describe the proposed ban, that's for certain - it just doesn't feel like the best choice, but I can't think of anything better off the top of my head right now. Those who use the word "******" as an insult should be laughed off, because they are unwittingly making a joke of themselves. I don't personally care who uses it, it's not going to get me in a tantrum. Life's too short to allow yourself to be held hostage to a petty insult. If you react with violence and anger to it, all you do is give people free buttons to push to annoy you. Not to mention, it sounds ridiculous. Sometimes just spelling it in my head makes me crack up.

I can't take it very seriously. Banning a word? Nah. Judging from the report, it doesn't even sound like someone is trying to use the word as an insult. I get the impression that the committee are the people who feel the most uncomfortable about the word and are attempting to ban it primarily for that reason.

I also like the line from TYT regarding "Ese": "Do people even use that word any more?"
I imagine the same will be said about the word "******" before long.

 

[Weaver]

I feel like the NFL pays high enough to impose whatever rules they want.
I don't really see the point of it in all honesty, but whatever.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

In my experience Americans are a little too prudish around language. They think that by mangling it they can solve the bigger issues behind words. I don't know if it's racist to band the word "******" or not, all I know is you shouldn't. Either let people reveal themselves as racist or let them use the word for discussion value.

 

[Barbas]

Spoiler: (Snip).

In my experience Americans are a little too prudish around language. They think that by mangling it they can solve the bigger issues behind words. I don't know if it's racist to band the word "******" or not, all I know is you shouldn't. Either let people reveal themselves as racist or let them use the word for discussion value.

They get really offended by the word "****" a lot in the States as well. I don't understand that at all. Is it because they just can't give it the right panache[footnote]Don't Google this word for free lingerie.[/footnote]? It just seems so mean-spirited of them to leave us cunts out of the party.

 

[JupiterBase]

As an organization they can do whatever they want within their own group, banning any word from use as a whole would be utterly asinine. I think Trey Parker and Matt Stone touched on that subject in one of the episodes of South Park.

edit: Seriously, i imagine this was proposed by some who doesn't understand either side as something they were offended by. It wasn't a problem until someone made it a problem type of thing.

 

[kurupt87]

I imagine it'd be like banning the word "mate" for British white guys. Black guys use it like we use bro, mate, pal etc. Banning it fucks up their way of talking.

It'd also reduce the amount of interracial smack talking, which is bad.

 

[MysticSlayer]

Well, I can sort of see how it can be racist. There's a white NFL commissioner who wants to place a ban on a word used predominantly by black players simply because of the off chance that if a white player uses it it would be considered racist. Essentially, you have white people dictating to black people what they are and aren't allowed to say based entirely on the standards of white people. I'm rather certain that that falls under the category of "racism".

I mean, aren't there already rules dictating that you aren't allowed to harass players? Why should they go after this word when it would already get flagged for harassment if that was the obvious intention of the player? I don't doubt that the NFL has good intentions with going after the word, but I'm not entirely sure it is the best thing to do.

 

[Coakle]

Words take on different meanings based on who's saying it and how. It's acceptable for a husband and wife to call each other "Sweetie", but it's uncouth when a boss calls his secretary "Sweetie." No one suggests that we ban that word because we recognize that relationships and context affect their meaning.

There are black athletes in the NFL who feel comfortable and rely on the word "******" when talking. This rule dictates that these black athletes are wrong for using this word, and they need to use the word in the same way white people do. It's ignorant and a bit racist.

The NFL already has rules to deal with unsportsmanlike conduct.

Black guys use it like we use bro, mate, pal etc. Banning it fucks up their way of talking.

Oh, well that was my entire point summed up in two sentences.

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

The issue here a that one group believes the word to be offensive and another does not. It's amusing that it's white people who think "******" is offensive, while black people apparently have no issue with it.

If it is offensive and a racial slur, it should be banned and I applaud any move to keep racism out of sport.
If it is not offensive, then no action needs to be taken.

The issue is that people cannot decide if "******" is offensive or okay to use in common parlance.

In the UK, we have John Terry, captain of Chelsea and formerly captain of the national team. He is a racist and a philanderer, cheats with his teammates wives and got only a metaphorical slap on the wrist. The FA are so dirty that Premiereship players can get away with this sort of behaviour and still hold multi-million pound contracts and adorn the bedrooms of 12 year old boys who look up to them.

Also, this topic probably ought to be in R&P.

 

[CrazyCapnMorgan]

Well, seeing as how Louis C.K. was already used, let's bring out two more heavy hitters on this topic:

Spoiler: Heavy hitter number one

Spoiler: Heavy hitter number two

Let it be known for all of time: there are no words, none whatsoever, that are racist. Period. Words are, and forever will be, completely neutral of all concepts. People, on the other hand, are not neutral of concepts and hatreds, and some of the more unpleasant ones need to be introduced to a speeding bus.

 

[Parasondox]

The issue here a that one group believes the word to be offensive and another does not. It's amusing that it's white people who think "******" is offensive, while black people apparently have no issue with it.

If it is offensive and a racial slur, it should be banned and I applaud any move to keep racism out of sport.
If it is not offensive, then no action needs to be taken.

The issue is that people cannot decide if "******" is offensive or okay to use in common parlance.

Actually, I know many black people who hate the word "******" and deem it offensive not matter which way you use it because of the historical context behind. They do not like a word that was once used as something to insult black, now used as something to me "okay " about. However as many pointed out, as did I in the OP, it can simply be used and seen in a different light.

But then again you have the confederate flag that means so much different things to different people.

I think the question is, can something that originated from hate and suppression, be changed over time into a symbol of something good and positively productive? It may work the other way round for example the Swastika, originated as a symbol of good luck in the Hindu and Buddhist culture but now seen, and once used, as something else negative and hateful thanks to the rise and influences of the Nazi party.

In the UK, we have John Terry, captain of Chelsea and formerly captain of the national team. He is a racist and a philanderer, cheats with his teammates wives and got only a metaphorical slap on the wrist. The FA are so dirty that Premiereship players can get away with this sort of behaviour and still hold multi-million pound contracts and adorn the bedrooms of 12 year old boys who look up to them.

Also, this topic probably ought to be in R&P.

Don't get me started on the FA and their love of money to turn a blind eye to everything for the heck of it. I remember Luis Suarez round about the same time (same season), also got caught saying a racist slur in his native tongue and got several match ban, a large fine and of course the new "Villain of Football" title added to his name. John Terry on the other hand, well maybe it's because he is an english footballer, but the FA barely even did anything and even when it went to court, he was fine really and many of the fans welcomed him back with open arms. Luis Suarez, well took him a while for the booing to stop.

I do not advocate what these players did but with these two cases, being no different from the other, all I say was double standards from the FA and Premier League as a whole. I agree with you that it sends the wrong message to the young kids who aspire to be like them.

 

[Agayek]

They get really offended by the word "****" a lot in the States as well. I don't understand that at all. Is it because they just can't give it the right panache[footnote]Don't Google this word for free lingerie.[/footnote]? It just seems so mean-spirited of them to leave us cunts out of the party.

It's just a language thing. "****" has different connotations on this side of the pond. Here, it actually has a fairly specific meaning, and that is specifically insulting a woman's moral standing and sexual proclivities. From what I understand, it's just a general insult in the UK. It's kinda like the word "trunk". In the US, anyone and everyone that hears "Yea, it's in my trunk" is going to immediately think "It's in that guy's car" (the boot to be more specific, in case you didn't already know), while in the UK, the assumption is (as far as I know) going to be "it's in that guy's luggage".

It's a case of the same word coming to have two wildly divergent meanings. I'm not familiar enough with British slang to know what the reverse-equivalent of "****" would be, but I'm sure there's a word or two you guys generally find offensive that's an everyday thing over here.

 

[kurupt87]

The issue here a that one group believes the word to be offensive and another does not. It's amusing that it's white people who think "******" is offensive, while black people apparently have no issue with it.

If it is offensive and a racial slur, it should be banned and I applaud any move to keep racism out of sport.
If it is not offensive, then no action needs to be taken.

The issue is that people cannot decide if "******" is offensive or okay to use in common parlance.

It can be both, words can have multiple meanings. It means "black brother" and it means "you're worthless because you're black". Who you are and how you say it decides the meaning.

In the UK, we have John Terry, captain of Chelsea and formerly captain of the national team. He is a racist and a philanderer, cheats with his teammates wives and got only a metaphorical slap on the wrist. The FA are so dirty that Premiereship players can get away with this sort of behaviour and still hold multi-million pound contracts and adorn the bedrooms of 12 year old boys who look up to them.

And this is totally off topic and just derp.

1. She was Bridge's ex, they weren't together when Terry and her bumped uglies.

2.
a) Vis-a-vis Terry and Ferdinand, the inquiry found that Ferdinand started the verbal abuse.

b) You tailor your insults to the person you are insulting. If it's a woman you're arguing with you call her a *****, the insult is sexist but the world doesn't end when you say it. If it's a racial minority person you go racist with your insults.

c) The point of insults is to anger the other person after all.

d) If a black guy has pissed me off I would drop the N bomb, that doesn't make me racist. It's just a word.

 

[VanQ]

The issue here a that one group believes the word to be offensive and another does not. It's amusing that it's white people who think "******" is offensive, while black people apparently have no issue with it.

If it is offensive and a racial slur, it should be banned and I applaud any move to keep racism out of sport.
If it is not offensive, then no action needs to be taken.

The issue is that people cannot decide if "******" is offensive or okay to use in common parlance.

In the UK, we have John Terry, captain of Chelsea and formerly captain of the national team. He is a racist and a philanderer, cheats with his teammates wives and got only a metaphorical slap on the wrist. The FA are so dirty that Premiereship players can get away with this sort of behaviour and still hold multi-million pound contracts and adorn the bedrooms of 12 year old boys who look up to them.

Also, this topic probably ought to be in R&P.

You're just a little bit off with that one there, I think. It's more than everyone thinks it's racist for a white person to say, but not racist for a black person to say.

If you don't believe me, and you're white, go ahead and say the word ****** around a black guy. I bet you $50 that he gets offended that you used the word. Because you're white.

EDIT: Edited for clarity.

 

[Saetha]

. Essentially, you have white people dictating to black people what they are and aren't allowed to say based entirely on the standards of white people. I'm rather certain that that falls under the category of "racism".

Uh... Don't black people ALREADY do this to white people? Don't most minorities make the "You can't use that, it's a slur against my group" claim whenever some one of the majority uses a word they deem offensive? Hell, I've seen people get chewed out for saying "Ladies and Gentlemen" because it "discriminates against the non-binary."

As a matter of fact, isn't that basically what started the debate in the first place, one group telling another what they can or cannot say? Black people saying white people can't use the n-word?

 

[Parasondox]

Well, seeing as how Louis C.K. was already used, let's bring out two more heavy hitters on this topic:

Spoiler: Heavy hitter number one

Spoiler: Heavy hitter number two

Let it be known for all of time: there are no words, none whatsoever, that are racist. Period. Words are, and forever will be, completely neutral of all concepts. People, on the other hand, are not neutral of concepts and hatreds, and some of the more unpleasant ones need to be introduced to a speeding bus.

Thank you for those examples and I also listened to and remembered Louis CK saying that also. The word "******" on it's own is just a word. However if used in a way where it forms a personal attack of hatred and deceit, then it's the person who said it, should be held accountable for that action. I hope you understand what I am saying.

Like a situation I heard here in the UK and to be honest, elsewhere too. The word "black" is something some people do not like saying because they think they may be seen as racist if they refer to someone as a black person. I honestly do not know here that came from but I have seen it. A friend in school did want to say "Blackhorse Road", because he thought he would have sounded racist and cause offensive if he said it. I told him, the he can say the word and that he weren't being racist at all because in that context, he was talking about a place in London where he lived and secondly, black is just a word. As I repeat again, "Black" is just a word. It's not racist, it's neutral, just like any other word. However if an individual wishes to incite hate and plan using that very word out of context for their own silly person gain, then... then the speeding bus idea will come in handy.

It's the intent of which the word is being used by the person who said it and not the word itself. Which is why I understand how "******" is used today as something different to what it was decades and centuries ago. Instead of anger and hate, more closeness, friendship and others.

After reading all these post, I am learning a few new additional things.

 

[Saltyk]

Well, here's my take on it.

It's fine to use any word in art. TV, movies, music, books, what have you. In fact, censoring that is something of a far greater sin than any word could be (I'm looking at you version of Huck Finn with "******" taken out). I've greatly enjoyed Boondocks, for example.

However, just like the NBA has the right to demand that players dress in suits or uniforms anytime they appear as a representative of the organization, I think they can demand that players not use certain language on the field. Sports are largely family friendly, playing during Prime Time on major channels. And these players are being paid millions of dollars to toss a ball around, I'm certain that their employers would like them to maintain certain standards.

No, I don't think enforcing this is racist, nor do I think it's wrong. It's wrong when the government does it. But if McDonald's tells their employees to not curse, that's fine (and expected), and this is no different.