Is there any REASON gay marriage is wrong?

[thelastgentleman]

http://www.springerlink.com/content/q6q2180250341315/

I'm just going to leave this here...Doesnt really have to do with marriage but does explain alot

Just going to put this out there...if your gay blame your mom. SCIENCE DOES NOT LIE!!! (often)
A buddy of mine is actually heading this up at a local University its really interesting. Basically stress hormones mostly IGg are passed from a mother's placenta to her child. Depending on her environment this could alter the child's codon structure to either A. Alter Phenotype, but keep Genotype (i.e look like a girl but really be a man) or B. Change the chemical structure of the brain to well...like men. Most data comes from the U.S and Ireland during drought and famine times, but it consists of statistics stating that when food and supply shortages are prevelant more gay individuals are produced therefore lightening up the population. Sooo...yeah this might make a few people rage but, meh read it for yourselves. There is a lot more to it but unless someone asks ill just leave it at this.

Just from reading the abstract of that paper your argument seems flawed

For males, neither between-family nor within-family analyses revealed a maternal stress effect for either sexual orientation or childhood gender nonconformity

There are also a few problems with the methodology; self-report is not the best way to measure stress, and the stress reported for the heterosexual sibling were done from memory, which is even less accurate

OT: Can't think of any feasible reason why gay marriage wouldn't be ok

First the article is not the exact research its only a sample there are plenty of other papers out right now (in know the medical journal just recently published one) I just dont feel like finding them. Second it wasnt an argument? I wasn't putting a counterpoint to anyone's statement soo....ummm im sorry you disagree?? Its just a recent breakthrough in science and is being taught in neuro classes all across the states. If you feel it is wrong then i suggest you do your own research to oppose it.

 

[Dorkamongus]

Dont tell the Mormons its not legal. There's still ones out in Carson City that like to do that.

Wow, I came into this thread expecting to learn more about what people think about gay marriage, not have to defend my religion... anyways, I'd at least like to point out, that the ones you speak of in Carson City are Fundamentalist Mormons, who are a break-off religion. They are NOT Latter Day Saints (Mormons). Modern Latter Day Saints do NOT practice or preach polygamy.

 

[Stevepinto3]

It goes against science, nature, God, the works. It's not just religious people who thinks it's wrong.

That's not necessarily the case.
There was a research done that said lesbian parents provide the best support for their child.
and that living together in a committed relationship, prolongs the lifespan.(regardless of orientation)

And please define "nature", animals have polygamous relationships or eat their spouses. Shouldn't we be doing it as well?

Plus if it's against nature an impotent man and woman should not be able to marry.

Every single study I have EVER read has stated that a child develops best emotionally and mentally by having both parents (assuming they are healthy in those ways themselves).

Umm, "both parents" could mean two guys, gals or a mixture.

Unless you want to follow the "Bullet storm = rapists" woman, I'm going to need citation of these so-called studies.

I think it's fairly obvious that I mean a mother and father, you know, the archetypal "parents"?

http://www.narth.com/docs/gendercomplementarity.html
http://www.ankerberg.com/Articles/_PDFArchives/social-issues/2SI0804G.pdf
http://www.narth.com/docs/optimal.html
http://www.upf.org/component/content/article/3571-gender-complementarity-relationships-and-the-family
http://www.gendermatters.org.au/Home_files/21%20Reasons%20Why%20Gender%20Matters%28low%20res%29.pdf

These are primarily hypothesis and assumptions of why you would need a male and female parent. Actually evidence when studying children raised by same-sex parents shows that the kids turn out fine.

http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/news/20051012/study-same-sex-parents-raise-well-adjusted-kids
http://psycnet.apa.org/psycinfo/2002-04521-007
http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content~db=all~content=a904829598

And a bunch more can be found just by googling "children homosexual parents studies". I don't have time to post much more because I'm currently running late to class. Try posting some actual data instead of rhetoric that supports your assumptions.

 

[orangeban]

Dont tell the Mormons its not legal. There's still ones out in Carson City that like to do that.

Wow, I came into this thread expecting to learn more about what people think about gay marriage, not have to defend my religion... anyways, I'd at least like to point out, that the ones you speak of in Carson City are Fundamentalist Mormons, who are a break-off religion. They are NOT Latter Day Saints (Mormons). Modern Latter Day Saints do NOT practice or preach polygamy.

Apoligies if you can't be bothered to answer this, but is Mormon the religion branch which believes you become angels if your good enough after death? Because if so, you are definetly one of the most awesome religions I've heard of.

My captcha included an accent on a letter, that's not fair

 

[Ciaran Lunt]

because aragorn said..
oh wait no the easter bunny said...
someone said it was wrong
God that's the one (sorry I get my fictional beings mixed up all the time)

 

[Blind Sight]

The reason I usually hear is that it 'destroys the moral virtues of society and the establishment of marriage'. This is the only non-religious or bigoted argument I've really ever heard, and there's a couple problems with it. One, marriage has never been sacred, up until the past century we mostly married for political or economic alliances between families, not for 'love'. Two, what exactly are these 'moral virtues of society'? I've heard an argument from my dad that basically can be summed up as 'homosexuality uncuts the moral fabric of society and leads to stagnation, I mean, look at Rome.' I've heard this from other people as well, so let's just clear this up: Rome did not fall because of homosexuality. Read a goddamn book. Secondly, by that logic, the Greeks regularly had all kinds of man sex and what did it get them? The beginnings of science, Western culture, and philosophy.

 

[ikimevol]

there is no reason. if two people love each other then they have the right to be married. people are just stupid and insecure.

 

[orangeban]

The reason I usually hear is that it 'destroys the moral virtues of society and the establishment of marriage'. This is the only non-religious or bigoted argument I've really ever heard, and there's a couple problems with it. One, marriage has never been sacred, up until the past century we mostly married for political or economic alliances between families, not for 'love'. Two, what exactly are these 'moral virtues of society'? I've heard an argument from my dad that basically can be summed up as 'homosexuality uncuts the moral fabric of society and leads to stagnation, I mean, look at Rome.' I've heard this from other people as well, so let's just clear this up: Rome did not fall because of homosexuality. Read a goddamn book. Secondly, by that logic, the Greeks regularly had all kinds of man sex and what did it get them? The beginnings of science, Western culture, and philosophy.

The barbarian hoards who destroyed Rome were actually pure homosexuality that had radiated out of Rome in such high amounts that it developed life. Why else would the barbarians be burly, half-naked dudes?

 

[The Rockerfly]

there is no reason. if two people love each other then they have the right to be married. people are just stupid and insecure.

I am all for gay marriage but how on earth did you come to the conclusion of insecurity? it's not insecurity of their sexuality because most people who are homophobic are perfectly straight. I have never heard of one who is bi or gay so what on earth do you mean?

 

[Biodeamon]

Oh dear...this just isn't the thing you ask people, like abortion...it just starts a massive flamewar between the smart right people and ignoratly wrong people...

 

[orangeban]

Oh dear...this just isn't the thing you ask people, like abortion...it just starts a massive flamewar between the smart right people and ignoratly wrong people...

Heheh, I agree but perhaps "right" people isn't quite the best word to use when describing the smart ones in this debate.

Disclaimer: And in case someone didn't get my joke, no I don't mean the smart people aren't correct, that'd be stupid.

 

[b3nn3tt]

http://www.springerlink.com/content/q6q2180250341315/

I'm just going to leave this here...Doesnt really have to do with marriage but does explain alot

Just going to put this out there...if your gay blame your mom. SCIENCE DOES NOT LIE!!! (often)
A buddy of mine is actually heading this up at a local University its really interesting. Basically stress hormones mostly IGg are passed from a mother's placenta to her child. Depending on her environment this could alter the child's codon structure to either A. Alter Phenotype, but keep Genotype (i.e look like a girl but really be a man) or B. Change the chemical structure of the brain to well...like men. Most data comes from the U.S and Ireland during drought and famine times, but it consists of statistics stating that when food and supply shortages are prevelant more gay individuals are produced therefore lightening up the population. Sooo...yeah this might make a few people rage but, meh read it for yourselves. There is a lot more to it but unless someone asks ill just leave it at this.

Just from reading the abstract of that paper your argument seems flawed

For males, neither between-family nor within-family analyses revealed a maternal stress effect for either sexual orientation or childhood gender nonconformity

There are also a few problems with the methodology; self-report is not the best way to measure stress, and the stress reported for the heterosexual sibling were done from memory, which is even less accurate

OT: Can't think of any feasible reason why gay marriage wouldn't be ok

First the article is not the exact research its only a sample there are plenty of other papers out right now (in know the medical journal just recently published one) I just dont feel like finding them. Second it wasnt an argument? I wasn't putting a counterpoint to anyone's statement soo....ummm im sorry you disagree?? Its just a recent breakthrough in science and is being taught in neuro classes all across the states. If you feel it is wrong then i suggest you do your own research to oppose it.

Seemed like you were putting forward an argument, sorry if I misunderstood you. I was just pointing out methodological flaws in that study. There may well be more that are investigating the same thing, but if they're employing the same methodology then there will be flaws in those studies too

 

[Dorkamongus]

Apoligies if you can't be bothered to answer this, but is Mormon the religion branch which believes you become angels if your good enough after death? Because if so, you are definetly one of the most awesome religions I've heard of.

My captcha included an accent on a letter, that's not fair

Short answer is yes. If you are good enough, you can indeed become angels after death. I'm not really comfortable discussing religion in a public setting. However, if you want me to explain further, I will try my best.

 

[Blind Sight]

The reason I usually hear is that it 'destroys the moral virtues of society and the establishment of marriage'. This is the only non-religious or bigoted argument I've really ever heard, and there's a couple problems with it. One, marriage has never been sacred, up until the past century we mostly married for political or economic alliances between families, not for 'love'. Two, what exactly are these 'moral virtues of society'? I've heard an argument from my dad that basically can be summed up as 'homosexuality uncuts the moral fabric of society and leads to stagnation, I mean, look at Rome.' I've heard this from other people as well, so let's just clear this up: Rome did not fall because of homosexuality. Read a goddamn book. Secondly, by that logic, the Greeks regularly had all kinds of man sex and what did it get them? The beginnings of science, Western culture, and philosophy.

The barbarian hoards who destroyed Rome were actually pure homosexuality that had radiated out of Rome in such high amounts that it developed life. Why else would the barbarians be burly, half-naked dudes?

They couldn't afford shirts?

I'm actually of the opinion that it was Christianity that caused Rome to collapse due to inter social conflicts that left them vulnerable to barbarian invasion, but try explaining that to someone who thought that orgies were the problem haha.

 

[Fetzenfisch]

Do you really need 24 pages for a two-letter answer? "No"

 

[orangeban]

Apoligies if you can't be bothered to answer this, but is Mormon the religion branch which believes you become angels if your good enough after death? Because if so, you are definetly one of the most awesome religions I've heard of.

My captcha included an accent on a letter, that's not fair

Short answer is yes. If you are good enough, you can indeed become angels after death. I'm not really comfortable discussing religion in a public setting. However, if you want me to explain further, I will try my best.

No, it's fine, don't do anything you don't want to. Just saying your religion sounds pretty cool. If I had to choose religion from a "who gives the best rewards" policy yours sounds pretty nice.

 

[interspark]

Gay people cannot reproduce, therefore they shouldn't get married or have sex ever.

oh dear god i hope you're kidding, well in case you're not just think about what you're saying! the number of humans on the planet is steadily increasing and the way things are going, we will very soon run out of resources and die, gay people getting married and adopting are a significant factor in slowing the population increase

OT: no, in all my life i have never heard any reason with so much as a hint of logic or reason behind it